Poll

How Long do they wait?

Before the season starts
3 (10%)
A couple weeks into the season
0 (0%)
Right around trade deadline
15 (50%)
Next offseason
12 (40%)

Total Members Voted: 30

Author Topic: How long do they wait to use TPE?  (Read 6728 times)

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Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #30 on: January 21, 2021, 10:29:19 AM »

Offline RodyTur10

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Okay, I have come to the conclusion that the Celtics should use the TPE this season. Here are my reasons:

  • At the deadline most teams will know whether they can let go of their playoff aspirations (think of: Pistons, Magic, Knicks, Bulls, Cavaliers in the East and Timberwolves, Kings, Thunder, Rockets, Pelicans in the West)
  • Teams will be looking to clear capspace to prepare for the offseason and sign free agents
  • Boston can trade Thompson to make sure we can almost fully add TPE-level contract on our payroll without tax consequences
  • In the offseason GM's have 'false' hopes for their teams, which will make them reluctant to trade good role players even if they're overpaid
  • Wait until the offseason and there will be lot of pressure from fans and press on Ainge to make good use of that TPE, other teams will recognize that and may ask for unproportionate assets
  • Players that are on expiring contracts now will be free agents in the offseason and therefore unattainable (as a S+T is very unlikely, which would hardcap us) which makes the pond a lot smaller than it is now

Possible targets

Otto Porter Jr
(tough to stay below the tax, but a very interesting option as the Bulls have P. Williams and Markkanen)
DeMar DeRozan (Spurs are doing surprisingly well, will they have interest to trade him and build for the future?)
Nikola Vucevic (great player on a bad team, candidate for a trade though I believe a wing is a bigger need)
Buddy Hield (a buy-low candidate with Fox/Haliburton emerging, defensively poor, could work out fantastic as offball threat)
Draymond Green (don't think the Warriors will give up on their core and is Draymond washed?: he scores less than 5PPG...)
Harrison Barnes (good offensive player, defense isn't great, possibly best option available, but will he contribute to winning?)

Victor Oladipo (the Rockets probably won't to pay him, rumours were that Ainge had interest in him during the Hayward talks)
Gary Harris (he has been pretty terrible the last two seasons, could the Celtics get him back on track?, he's only 26)
Zach LaVine (I highly doubt a 27-5-5 player can be obtained, even if we offered Marcus Smart)
Jerami Grant (he has been great and the Pistons will probably not want to listen to trade offers)
Julius Randle (not sure he can bring defensively what's needed, hard fit, but a good player who should be available, I like him)
Terry Rozier (a comeback would be really funny, but a backcourt Walker/Rozier is too small for my taste)

Aaron Gordon (often mentioned and still a player who should be on the trading block, can he blossom in a different environment?)
Evan Fournier (I believe Nick has advocated for Fournier and I can see the appeal, probably won't cost much as he's expiring)
Eric Gordon (his spark this season is probably not going to last, we'd do the Rockets a big favor taking him on, we shouldn't)
Davis Bertans (the only thing he can do is shoot, but how much does an elite shooter open the court for our star players?)
Jonas Valanciunas (underrated player, add him with Winslow and we may get two birds with one stone, worthy of some assets)

Rudy Gay (Gay + Mills is a possibility, but too old I think as we need longterm help)
Kelly Oubre (talk about a buy-low candidate! he's definitely better than what he's showing now, unlikeable character though)
Thaddeus Young (unfortunately he's already 32, otherwise I'd find him a perfect fit for our team)
Terrence Ross (I'd prefer Fournier, although Ross can also really score the basketball, he's two years older but signed for 3 years)
Larry Nance Jr (good player, good fit, question is whether the Cavs would trade him for a reasonable price)

 


« Last Edit: January 22, 2021, 09:07:36 AM by RodyTur10 »

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #31 on: January 22, 2021, 10:25:14 AM »

Offline RodyTur10

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These are the guys I believe we should be looking at.

Nikola Vucevic: Getting a 'tier 2' All Star center/big (Tier 1: Jokic, Davis, Embiid; Tier 2: Towns, Vucevic, Gobert, Sabonis, Adebayo) would really change the Celtics playoffs perspectives. With his added 3-point shot (making 2.7 per game at 42%) and his playmaking he could be Horford's successor. In the bubble Vucevic averaged 27/11/4 in the playoffs against the Bucks. A player at that level is hard to get, but as the Montenegrin is underrated he may not cost a huge package.

Harrison Barnes: The Kings are a team who are not able to get into that playoff battle in the tough West. Barnes is a decent player though overpaid. The Kings are not deep at the wing, but they may be interested to cut some salary. You should expect Barnes to be a starting player who doesn't hurt you and able to make shots consistently when the defense collapses on Walker/Brown/Tatum.

Victor Oladipo: Not sure what the plan is of the Rockets with Oladipo. They really are afraid to committing too much salary, so why would they try to resign Oladipo? As a playmaker, defender and his ability to create his own offense he could be a good fit with the Celtics. However we'd have four 20+ scorers again, which is bound to make someone unhappy.

Julius Randle: The Knicks are a big surprise so far (the Celtics are not the only team that got torched by them), but I think we can all agree that's unlikely to last. Randle is averaging 22/11/6 and he's only 26. I wanted him last year. If the Knicks will become interested in trading him when their record plummets he could be the Celtics solution in the frontcourt. Randle would be a huge upgrade over Theis.

Aaron Gordon: Orlando basically has to trade someone of their core. Their net rating implies that they will not be making the playoffs this year and currently they're a luxury tax team. Next year they'll have Isaac back, so what's the need for Gordon? For the Celtics Gordon can be that switchable wing defender, who is an offball-threat as a cutter to the basket, can finish alley-oops and is a good passer. He's only 25 so he can be part of the Tatum/Brown/Smart/Timelord/Pritchard core.

Davis Bertans: The Wizards signed him longterm, but the addition of Westbrook has not brought them yet what they would have hoped. The Wizards score points easily but they give up even more. Unfortunately Bertans is pretty bad on the defensive end himself. The idea is that Bertans could be hidden in the Celtics system and really stretch the court by his ability to consistently hit contested deep threes. The Celtics needs a topnotch shooter.

Jonas Valanciunas + Justise Winslow: With Valanciunas the Celtics would get a big center who can hold his own against Embiid or Jokic. Valanciunas has been a strong playoff performer in the past, so I don't think we have to be afraid he'll be played off the court against smaller units. Not sure Memphis would give him up though, since with Morant they're looking to compete for those lower playoff spots again. Winslow would just be nice for Ainge to acquire and the Celtics can use some more wing depth.

Larry Nance Jr: Save the best for last perhaps. Nance Jr is a very good role player, who has been a bench player basically his whole career. Is he ready to step up and become a reliable starter on a playoff team? I think he is. Nance Jr is an excellent defender, low usage, good passer and his 3-point-shot is developing. The biggest question mark is whether Cleveland will want to trade him. They still have Love, so maybe they'll see that Nance Jr needs a bigger role elsewhere?

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #32 on: January 22, 2021, 11:16:59 AM »

Offline Moranis

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The Cavs aren't trading Larry Nance unless you make them an offer they can't refuse.  They love Nance.  He is clearly a guy they want to keep and they believe he can be their PF of the future.

In fact, the Cavs believe they have their long term starting 5 in Sexton, Garland, Okoro, Nance, and Allen.  And frankly, they may not be wrong.  Those 5 have the makings of being at least a very good team, if not a great one, in a few seasons.  Nance is obviously older than the other 4, but still young enough to be around for awhile in his prime.
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Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #33 on: January 22, 2021, 02:18:45 PM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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The Cavs aren't trading Larry Nance unless you make them an offer they can't refuse.  They love Nance.  He is clearly a guy they want to keep and they believe he can be their PF of the future.

In fact, the Cavs believe they have their long term starting 5 in Sexton, Garland, Okoro, Nance, and Allen.  And frankly, they may not be wrong.  Those 5 have the makings of being at least a very good team, if not a great one, in a few seasons.  Nance is obviously older than the other 4, but still young enough to be around for awhile in his prime.

If the Cavs are smart and have a plan, then you are right. That starting five could be really good. Whether or not the Cavs are that smart is another question altogether.

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #34 on: January 22, 2021, 02:30:58 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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The Cavs aren't trading Larry Nance unless you make them an offer they can't refuse.  They love Nance.  He is clearly a guy they want to keep and they believe he can be their PF of the future.

In fact, the Cavs believe they have their long term starting 5 in Sexton, Garland, Okoro, Nance, and Allen.  And frankly, they may not be wrong.  Those 5 have the makings of being at least a very good team, if not a great one, in a few seasons.  Nance is obviously older than the other 4, but still young enough to be around for awhile in his prime.
Great team? How do you define a great team? Is Milwaukee a great team? Philly? Boston?

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #35 on: January 22, 2021, 03:55:31 PM »

Offline JBcat

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I don’t know if this name has been mentioned anywhere, but I wanted to bring up Jeremi Grant of the Pistons.  I was very impressed with his game when we played the Pistons a couple times earlier in the season.  He is about to turn 27, and is signed for approximately 20 mil this season, and a couple more seasons.  Salary fits nicely in the TPE without going over the tax line.   The Pistons should probably strip everything down, and get whatever future assets they can get for most current players on their team.  I don’t know if he can play any small ball 5 which would be a bonus, but we could have 3 wing lineups with Tatum, Brown, and Grant and also stagger their minutes (which was the plan with a healthy Hayward). 

I don’t know if 2 lottery protected picks would work or something like that for the Pistons but Grant is someone I’m intrigued by.

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #36 on: January 22, 2021, 04:02:20 PM »

Offline NKY fan

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I don’t know if this name has been mentioned anywhere, but I wanted to bring up Jeremi Grant of the Pistons.  I was very impressed with his game when we played the Pistons a couple times earlier in the season.  He is about to turn 27, and is signed for approximately 20 mil this season, and a couple more seasons.  Salary fits nicely in the TPE without going over the tax line.   The Pistons should probably strip everything down, and get whatever future assets they can get for most current players on their team.  I don’t know if he can play any small ball 5 which would be a bonus, but we could have 3 wing lineups with Tatum, Brown, and Grant and also stagger their minutes (which was the plan with a healthy Hayward). 

I don’t know if 2 lottery protected picks would work or something like that for the Pistons but Grant is someone I’m intrigued by.
2 lottery protected picks? Lol why not 4 second rounders and some cash 😬.
On a serious note - Grant like Christian Wood chose his own team to play themselves to a max contract. They don’t want to be third banana. This is the reason he did not stay with the nuggets who were contenders. He wanted his own team and to be #1 option.
Now ask any pundit after last season whether Grant was delusional and they would say yes. However he is proving every one wrong.
Anyway we can probably acquire him for a very significant collection of picks and young players but he won’t be happy here so there is no point in trying.

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #37 on: January 22, 2021, 04:12:42 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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I don’t know if this name has been mentioned anywhere, but I wanted to bring up Jeremi Grant of the Pistons.  I was very impressed with his game when we played the Pistons a couple times earlier in the season.  He is about to turn 27, and is signed for approximately 20 mil this season, and a couple more seasons.  Salary fits nicely in the TPE without going over the tax line.   The Pistons should probably strip everything down, and get whatever future assets they can get for most current players on their team.  I don’t know if he can play any small ball 5 which would be a bonus, but we could have 3 wing lineups with Tatum, Brown, and Grant and also stagger their minutes (which was the plan with a healthy Hayward). 

I don’t know if 2 lottery protected picks would work or something like that for the Pistons but Grant is someone I’m intrigued by.
This is the equivalent of the Celtics trading Al Horford 20 games after signing him. Why would Boston have done that?

Teams don't target free agents, make commitments to them, sign them and then decide to trade them after a few games. Detroit isn't trading Grant. He is not available.

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #38 on: January 22, 2021, 04:19:04 PM »

Offline NKY fan

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I don’t know if this name has been mentioned anywhere, but I wanted to bring up Jeremi Grant of the Pistons.  I was very impressed with his game when we played the Pistons a couple times earlier in the season.  He is about to turn 27, and is signed for approximately 20 mil this season, and a couple more seasons.  Salary fits nicely in the TPE without going over the tax line.   The Pistons should probably strip everything down, and get whatever future assets they can get for most current players on their team.  I don’t know if he can play any small ball 5 which would be a bonus, but we could have 3 wing lineups with Tatum, Brown, and Grant and also stagger their minutes (which was the plan with a healthy Hayward). 

I don’t know if 2 lottery protected picks would work or something like that for the Pistons but Grant is someone I’m intrigued by.
This is the equivalent of the Celtics trading Al Horford 20 games after signing him. Why would Boston have done that?

Teams don't target free agents, make commitments to them, sign them and then decide to trade them after a few games. Detroit isn't trading Grant. He is not available.
It can be done elegantly but it’s not easy. Knicks of all teams did it last year with our friend Marcus Morris. But they had that “agreement” they would ship him to a contender for a draft pick. Not exactly the same situation but they did trade him after 20 games pretty much.

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #39 on: January 22, 2021, 04:20:56 PM »

Offline JBcat

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I don’t know if this name has been mentioned anywhere, but I wanted to bring up Jeremi Grant of the Pistons.  I was very impressed with his game when we played the Pistons a couple times earlier in the season.  He is about to turn 27, and is signed for approximately 20 mil this season, and a couple more seasons.  Salary fits nicely in the TPE without going over the tax line.   The Pistons should probably strip everything down, and get whatever future assets they can get for most current players on their team.  I don’t know if he can play any small ball 5 which would be a bonus, but we could have 3 wing lineups with Tatum, Brown, and Grant and also stagger their minutes (which was the plan with a healthy Hayward). 

I don’t know if 2 lottery protected picks would work or something like that for the Pistons but Grant is someone I’m intrigued by.
2 lottery protected picks? Lol why not 4 second rounders and some cash 😬.
On a serious note - Grant like Christian Wood chose his own team to play themselves to a max contract. They don’t want to be third banana. This is the reason he did not stay with the nuggets who were contenders. He wanted his own team and to be #1 option.
Now ask any pundit after last season whether Grant was delusional and they would say yes. However he is proving every one wrong.
Anyway we can probably acquire him for a very significant collection of picks and young players but he won’t be happy here so there is no point in trying.


Well if that is in fact true that he said he wanted to be the number 1 option then we should stay away then. That’s all you really needed to say instead of drilling me on the idea.  It doesn’t take away that I was still very impressed with how he played against us. 

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #40 on: January 22, 2021, 04:28:20 PM »

Offline liam

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I don’t know if this name has been mentioned anywhere, but I wanted to bring up Jeremi Grant of the Pistons.  I was very impressed with his game when we played the Pistons a couple times earlier in the season.  He is about to turn 27, and is signed for approximately 20 mil this season, and a couple more seasons.  Salary fits nicely in the TPE without going over the tax line.   The Pistons should probably strip everything down, and get whatever future assets they can get for most current players on their team.  I don’t know if he can play any small ball 5 which would be a bonus, but we could have 3 wing lineups with Tatum, Brown, and Grant and also stagger their minutes (which was the plan with a healthy Hayward). 

I don’t know if 2 lottery protected picks would work or something like that for the Pistons but Grant is someone I’m intrigued by.
This is the equivalent of the Celtics trading Al Horford 20 games after signing him. Why would Boston have done that?

Teams don't target free agents, make commitments to them, sign them and then decide to trade them after a few games. Detroit isn't trading Grant. He is not available.

Yeah, he's Detroit's best player and he chose to go there.

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #41 on: January 22, 2021, 04:28:57 PM »

Offline JBcat

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I don’t know if this name has been mentioned anywhere, but I wanted to bring up Jeremi Grant of the Pistons.  I was very impressed with his game when we played the Pistons a couple times earlier in the season.  He is about to turn 27, and is signed for approximately 20 mil this season, and a couple more seasons.  Salary fits nicely in the TPE without going over the tax line.   The Pistons should probably strip everything down, and get whatever future assets they can get for most current players on their team.  I don’t know if he can play any small ball 5 which would be a bonus, but we could have 3 wing lineups with Tatum, Brown, and Grant and also stagger their minutes (which was the plan with a healthy Hayward). 

I don’t know if 2 lottery protected picks would work or something like that for the Pistons but Grant is someone I’m intrigued by.
This is the equivalent of the Celtics trading Al Horford 20 games after signing him. Why would Boston have done that?

Teams don't target free agents, make commitments to them, sign them and then decide to trade them after a few games. Detroit isn't trading Grant. He is not available.

Apples to oranges comparison IMO.  With Horford we were trying to win now, and were winning at a very good clip as opposed to the Pistons.  With losing comes anything on the table.  With the Pistons I would have signed him with the understanding we are giving you money and minutes, but if we aren’t winning nobody is off the table for trades.  The Pistons with only 3 wins should be looking at whatever future picks they can get looking at a rebuild.

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #42 on: January 22, 2021, 04:44:37 PM »

Offline NKY fan

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I don’t know if this name has been mentioned anywhere, but I wanted to bring up Jeremi Grant of the Pistons.  I was very impressed with his game when we played the Pistons a couple times earlier in the season.  He is about to turn 27, and is signed for approximately 20 mil this season, and a couple more seasons.  Salary fits nicely in the TPE without going over the tax line.   The Pistons should probably strip everything down, and get whatever future assets they can get for most current players on their team.  I don’t know if he can play any small ball 5 which would be a bonus, but we could have 3 wing lineups with Tatum, Brown, and Grant and also stagger their minutes (which was the plan with a healthy Hayward). 

I don’t know if 2 lottery protected picks would work or something like that for the Pistons but Grant is someone I’m intrigued by.
2 lottery protected picks? Lol why not 4 second rounders and some cash 😬.
On a serious note - Grant like Christian Wood chose his own team to play themselves to a max contract. They don’t want to be third banana. This is the reason he did not stay with the nuggets who were contenders. He wanted his own team and to be #1 option.
Now ask any pundit after last season whether Grant was delusional and they would say yes. However he is proving every one wrong.
Anyway we can probably acquire him for a very significant collection of picks and young players but he won’t be happy here so there is no point in trying.


Well if that is in fact true that he said he wanted to be the number 1 option then we should stay away then. That’s all you really needed to say instead of drilling me on the idea.  It doesn’t take away that I was still very impressed with how he played against us.
I proposed trading for him a few weeks ago and got grilled too 😬. I was offering to trade more however.
Anyway there are a lot of posts where in proposed trades we get the best player of the other team while giving up basically nothing ... sorry I thought it’s one of those posts

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #43 on: January 22, 2021, 04:59:43 PM »

Offline JBcat

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I don’t know if this name has been mentioned anywhere, but I wanted to bring up Jeremi Grant of the Pistons.  I was very impressed with his game when we played the Pistons a couple times earlier in the season.  He is about to turn 27, and is signed for approximately 20 mil this season, and a couple more seasons.  Salary fits nicely in the TPE without going over the tax line.   The Pistons should probably strip everything down, and get whatever future assets they can get for most current players on their team.  I don’t know if he can play any small ball 5 which would be a bonus, but we could have 3 wing lineups with Tatum, Brown, and Grant and also stagger their minutes (which was the plan with a healthy Hayward). 

I don’t know if 2 lottery protected picks would work or something like that for the Pistons but Grant is someone I’m intrigued by.
2 lottery protected picks? Lol why not 4 second rounders and some cash 😬.
On a serious note - Grant like Christian Wood chose his own team to play themselves to a max contract. They don’t want to be third banana. This is the reason he did not stay with the nuggets who were contenders. He wanted his own team and to be #1 option.
Now ask any pundit after last season whether Grant was delusional and they would say yes. However he is proving every one wrong.
Anyway we can probably acquire him for a very significant collection of picks and young players but he won’t be happy here so there is no point in trying.


Well if that is in fact true that he said he wanted to be the number 1 option then we should stay away then. That’s all you really needed to say instead of drilling me on the idea.  It doesn’t take away that I was still very impressed with how he played against us.
I proposed trading for him a few weeks ago and got grilled too 😬. I was offering to trade more however.
Anyway there are a lot of posts where in proposed trades we get the best player of the other team while giving up basically nothing ... sorry I thought it’s one of those posts

No worries, thanks for responding.  Since you can’t combine players with TPE, maybe it could be 2 different transactions with other players involved, but if all he is looking for is to get his as the number 1 option I agree stat away then. 

Re: How long do they wait to use TPE?
« Reply #44 on: January 23, 2021, 04:32:45 PM »

Offline Moranis

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The Cavs aren't trading Larry Nance unless you make them an offer they can't refuse.  They love Nance.  He is clearly a guy they want to keep and they believe he can be their PF of the future.

In fact, the Cavs believe they have their long term starting 5 in Sexton, Garland, Okoro, Nance, and Allen.  And frankly, they may not be wrong.  Those 5 have the makings of being at least a very good team, if not a great one, in a few seasons.  Nance is obviously older than the other 4, but still young enough to be around for awhile in his prime.
Great team? How do you define a great team? Is Milwaukee a great team? Philly? Boston?
3 or 4 years down the line, I think they could be a contending team i.e. a great team.  I think winning playoff series and not being a true contender is far more likely, but they have a very nice young core built on top 10 draft picks.  There is clearly talent there. 
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