Marcus Smart RFA [Merged - finalizing 4 year deal]

[Beat LA]

Has there ever been a player this bad at offense but his defense and toughness is so good he can pass as a good bench player ?

Our old friend Tony Allen.

My main problem with this is that TA was really good at picking his spots with us. Around 48% from the field with very little 3’s attempted.

Marcus on the other hand has never averaged less than 4 3PA’s a game, while amazingly never shooting as well as he did in his rookie year (nailing a gruesome .301% this year).
If Marcus was efficient and knew his spots like TA I’d like him so much more

I think Tony Allen is a good comparison and honestly I was so glad to see him go. He was a total train wreck, I can still see him dribbling the ball off his foot to this day!

Same. Dude was a total bonehead. Ugh.

[Beat LA]

This may have been answered already here but I am curious about the tax issues.  Assuming the entire team came back, what is the number (in terms of dollars) that we can also have Smart on the team and avoid whatever tax situation we would prefer to avoid this year?  And is the number is not exact, what is the ballpark number?

Thanks.

There’s no exact number yet, because the tax line is not official.  The estimate going around is $123 million, but it could easily deviate +/- $1 million from that, which would obviously have an impact.  Another factor to consider is whether or not the Celtics would be willing to leave an open roster spot to avoid the tax.  They probably would, but given all the injuries they had last year, they might be a bit leery of that idea.

But let’s assume the following:

1) No trades are made
2) The luxury tax is $123 million on the nose
3) The salary cap is $101 million on the nose (this helps calculate the salary of our draft pick, because the slot value now increases proportionally with the cap)
4) We go with a 14-man roster
5) We sign Jabari Bird to an NBA deal at the rookie minimum in year 1
6) We let all free agents walk, and keep all the non-guaranteed or partially guaranteed guys (Theis, Nader, Ojeleye).

This would leave the Celtics with $12,928,129 of space before they hit the luxury tax.  With that, they could sign him to a 4-year deal that pays up to $57,918,286, or a 5-year deal that pays up to $74,983,495 and stay under the tax this season.

People can adjust the number accordingly as they see fit based on the above assumptions.  I think it will be a little lower, myself, as I think the luxury tax comes in closer to $122 million than $123 million.  But I think the above is a perfectly reasonable starting point for a maximum amount they could offer Smart while avoiding the tax.

I'm glad saltlover is back! No longer clueless about the cap sometimes

Saltlover back after Cs elimination from playoffs, Danny is that you?

Some may say it's a coincidence. I think not

Good thought.  Saltlover certainly has more GM acumen than most everyone on here.  However a quick search didn't show any posts defending taking Olynyk over Giannis or any posts expounding on the virtues of Chipotle.

I sold my stock in Chipotle a couple months ago.  Before then I didn’t feel it appropriate to extol its virtues in public without a disclaimer.

sigh. and here i had thought it was simply a matter of good taste. 

p.s. good to see you back. hope you are well.

Ditto, nice to see Saltlover the resident captologist back.

Same. Woot, woot! Welcome back!

[gouki88]

Has there ever been a player this bad at offense but his defense and toughness is so good he can pass as a good bench player ?

Our old friend Tony Allen.

My main problem with this is that TA was really good at picking his spots with us. Around 48% from the field with very little 3’s attempted.

Marcus on the other hand has never averaged less than 4 3PA’s a game, while amazingly never shooting as well as he did in his rookie year (nailing a gruesome .301% this year).
If Marcus was efficient and knew his spots like TA I’d like him so much more

I think Tony Allen is a good comparison and honestly I was so glad to see him go. He was a total train wreck, I can still see him dribbling the ball off his foot to this day!

Same. Dude was a total bonehead. Ugh.

Imagine if Smart ever shot 45+% from the field though makes TA look like a genius shot taker

[rondofan1255]

89.5% voted that 14 mil is too much. Rarely see a percentage this high. 

[Beat LA]

Has there ever been a player this bad at offense but his defense and toughness is so good he can pass as a good bench player ?

Our old friend Tony Allen.

My main problem with this is that TA was really good at picking his spots with us. Around 48% from the field with very little 3’s attempted.

Marcus on the other hand has never averaged less than 4 3PA’s a game, while amazingly never shooting as well as he did in his rookie year (nailing a gruesome .301% this year).
If Marcus was efficient and knew his spots like TA I’d like him so much more

I think Tony Allen is a good comparison and honestly I was so glad to see him go. He was a total train wreck, I can still see him dribbling the ball off his foot to this day!

Same. Dude was a total bonehead. Ugh.

Imagine if Smart ever shot 45+% from the field though makes TA look like a genius shot taker

Don't go there, man, lol .

[gouki88]

Has there ever been a player this bad at offense but his defense and toughness is so good he can pass as a good bench player ?

Our old friend Tony Allen.

My main problem with this is that TA was really good at picking his spots with us. Around 48% from the field with very little 3’s attempted.

Marcus on the other hand has never averaged less than 4 3PA’s a game, while amazingly never shooting as well as he did in his rookie year (nailing a gruesome .301% this year).
If Marcus was efficient and knew his spots like TA I’d like him so much more

I think Tony Allen is a good comparison and honestly I was so glad to see him go. He was a total train wreck, I can still see him dribbling the ball off his foot to this day!

Same. Dude was a total bonehead. Ugh.

Imagine if Smart ever shot 45+% from the field though makes TA look like a genius shot taker

Don't go there, man, lol .

These are the things I dream of at night

[rondofan1255]

Has there ever been a player this bad at offense but his defense and toughness is so good he can pass as a good bench player ?

Our old friend Tony Allen.

My main problem with this is that TA was really good at picking his spots with us. Around 48% from the field with very little 3’s attempted.

Marcus on the other hand has never averaged less than 4 3PA’s a game, while amazingly never shooting as well as he did in his rookie year (nailing a gruesome .301% this year).
If Marcus was efficient and knew his spots like TA I’d like him so much more

I think Tony Allen is a good comparison and honestly I was so glad to see him go. He was a total train wreck, I can still see him dribbling the ball off his foot to this day!

Same. Dude was a total bonehead. Ugh.

Imagine if Smart ever shot 45+% from the field though makes TA look like a genius shot taker

Don't go there, man, lol .

These are the things I dream of at night

not optimistic after last summer's rumored shooting improvement 

[SHAQATTACK]

Im a huge smart fan

but a mans jUST s gotta know his limits .

[MJohnnyboy]

Im a huge smart fan

but a mans jUST s gotta know his limits .

You're not the only one, but he's going to be very disappointed this summer.

[Alleyoopster]

Im a huge smart fan

but a mans jUST s gotta know his limits .

You're not the only one, but he's going to be very disappointed this summer.

Don't bet on it....never thought Evan Turner would get the contract he did. 

[MJohnnyboy]

Im a huge smart fan

but a mans jUST s gotta know his limits .

You're not the only one, but he's going to be very disappointed this summer.

Don't bet on it....never thought Evan Turner would get the contract he did.

The circumstances are much different now than they were in 2016. Everyone had money then. If you were a free agent two years ago, you essentially won the lottery. Now, hardly anyone will have money this summer, and most teams that do are re-building.

It's more than just the lack of money. What's really going hurt Smart is both his proneness to injury and his immaturity. Teams don't want to pay top dollar for guys who can't stay on the court and/or can't handle themselves off the court, and Smart proved himself to be one of those guys when he punched that picture frame which almost ended his season. If that had happened a few years ago, it wouldn't hold much water, but it happened just a few months prior to his free agency which isn't a good look for him. I'm anticipating that it will negatively impact his chances of a payday in free agency, but I've been wrong before.

If I were Marcus, I'd take the qualifying offer and bet on myself next year with the Celtics aiming for a more substantial playoff run.

[jambr380]

Im a huge smart fan

but a mans jUST s gotta know his limits .

You're not the only one, but he's going to be very disappointed this summer.

Don't bet on it....never thought Evan Turner would get the contract he did.

The circumstances are much different now than they were in 2016. Everyone had money then. If you were a free agent two years ago, you essentially won the lottery. Now, hardly anyone will have money this summer, and most teams that do are re-building.

It's more than just the lack of money. What's really going hurt Smart is both his proneness to injury and his immaturity. Teams don't want to pay top dollar for guys who can't stay on the court and/or can't handle themselves off the court, and Smart proved himself to be one of those guys when he punched that picture frame which almost ended his season. If that had happened a few years ago, it wouldn't hold much water, but it happened just a few months prior to his free agency which isn't a good look for him. I'm anticipating that it will negatively impact his chances of a payday in free agency, but I've been wrong before.

If I were Marcus, I'd take the qualifying offer and bet on myself next year with the Celtics aiming for a more substantial playoff run.

He definitely got lucky the Cs made a deep playoff run and was a key contributor. The picture frame incident and the other thumb injury seem like a distant memory.

I am not sure what kind of contract he will get. Announcers constantly praise his defensive ability and knack for making a big play; I am sure there are other teams who feel the same way. Whether or not one of those teams actually has more than the MLE to give him is another story.

[MJohnnyboy]

Im a huge smart fan

but a mans jUST s gotta know his limits .

You're not the only one, but he's going to be very disappointed this summer.

Don't bet on it....never thought Evan Turner would get the contract he did.

The circumstances are much different now than they were in 2016. Everyone had money then. If you were a free agent two years ago, you essentially won the lottery. Now, hardly anyone will have money this summer, and most teams that do are re-building.

It's more than just the lack of money. What's really going hurt Smart is both his proneness to injury and his immaturity. Teams don't want to pay top dollar for guys who can't stay on the court and/or can't handle themselves off the court, and Smart proved himself to be one of those guys when he punched that picture frame which almost ended his season. If that had happened a few years ago, it wouldn't hold much water, but it happened just a few months prior to his free agency which isn't a good look for him. I'm anticipating that it will negatively impact his chances of a payday in free agency, but I've been wrong before.

If I were Marcus, I'd take the qualifying offer and bet on myself next year with the Celtics aiming for a more substantial playoff run.

He definitely got lucky the Cs made a deep playoff run and was a key contributor. The picture frame incident and the other thumb injury seem like a distant memory.

I am not sure what kind of contract he will get. Announcers constantly praise his defensive ability and knack for making a big play; I am sure there are other teams who feel the same way. Whether or not one of those teams actually has more than the MLE to give him is another story.

TP, though I think the picture frame incident is going to hurt him big time on the open market. We as a fanbase have forgiven him, but I'm not so sure other teams will do the same.

I'm 100% sure Marcus will have plenty of interested suitors this summer. I believe that he's one of the few non-star glue guys in this league that practically every team would love to have. I just don't think any of those teams are going to offer anything the Celtics can't match.

[green_bballers13]

I know that the cap is changing and guard is a stacked position, etc, etc, etc

but I can't see how the Celtics are favored to sign Smart. There are other teams that have more cap space. Many of these teams will miss on the top free agents and move on to pay Marcus something like $14m per year. Unless Danny is intent on playing the luxury cap game, I can't see why they could pay him as much as a team like Dallas, OKC (when George heads to LA), or a bunch of others.

[MJohnnyboy]

I know that the cap is changing and guard is a stacked position, etc, etc, etc

but I can't see how the Celtics are favored to sign Smart. There are other teams that have more cap space. Many of these teams will miss on the top free agents and move on to pay Marcus something like $14m per year. Unless Danny is intent on playing the luxury cap game, I can't see why they could pay him as much as a team like Dallas, OKC (when George heads to LA), or a bunch of others.

OKC will most certainly not have cap room regardless of what happens with George. Just FYI.

And I'll believe it when I see it. I want to reiterate my other point that Smart's incident with the picture frame should really hurt him on the open market. Lou Williams took a 3-yr/$24 million extension with the Clippers. Smart should expect his market to be around there.

Last summer, not many bad contracts were handed out. The only ones that I can think of off the top of my head are the Tim Hardaway Jr contract with the Knicks and everything the Kings did, but that's a given with those teams. I really don't expect any team to spend unwisely this time.