Ime has got to go!

[SHAQATTACK]

I like Ime too.  He has been doing pretty good lately ,with a ruff start  Even Pop loses his share without the Duncan’s and Robinsons these days on his current team .  It’s not like we have Lebron and Irvin and top five players . 

I’m throwing any shade on GMBS …..it’s in his ball park to fix the player situation . Brown , Time lord and Tatum need a point guard .  Obviously Smart is never gonna be a real point guard .  He is a role player defensive specialist. 

I think the team would to the conference finals with an old CP3 or LeBron to lead em .  Or Lonzo Ball possibly.
Going to have to find an obvious  LEADER competitor offensive minded point guard .   

PP is a good backup for CP3

Personally, I’m ready to trade Smart and some young players to get us there.

[mr. dee]

Is it only hero ball when they fail?

The J’s need to learn how to finish, but if you don’t want the ball in your 2 best players hands in crunch time, who do you want to have the ball?

How many times did Giannis touch the ball in the last 2 minutes? How many times did The Truth have the ball and everybody else got out of the way? How many times did Lebron or Larry demand the ball? Once upon a time MJ passed the ball to Steve Kerr, who hit the game winning shot, but how many times did he play hero ball instead?

Isn’t the ball being in your best player’s hand when it matters exactly what you want?

If it’s only hero ball when it does not work, what is it called when it does? I think it’s usually called winning, but maybe I’m wrong

Jordan kicks out to Steve Kerr, Kobe to Horry. Even Lebron kicks it out to guys like Ray Allen and Mike Miller. Hero ball is also what killed our Finals hope in game 7 when Terry and Morris shot us out of the game.

That said, its only part of the problem.

[GreenlyGreeny]

Is it only hero ball when they fail?

The J’s need to learn how to finish, but if you don’t want the ball in your 2 best players hands in crunch time, who do you want to have the ball?

How many times did Giannis touch the ball in the last 2 minutes? How many times did The Truth have the ball and everybody else got out of the way? How many times did Lebron or Larry demand the ball? Once upon a time MJ passed the ball to Steve Kerr, who hit the game winning shot, but how many times did he play hero ball instead?

Isn’t the ball being in your best player’s hand when it matters exactly what you want?

If it’s only hero ball when it does not work, what is it called when it does? I think it’s usually called winning, but maybe I’m wrong

That’s not the hero ball crap we’re talking about. It’s this constant taking turns playing iso to see who can get the most points. All. Game. Long. It’s not conducive to winning championships. It’s .500 territory. It’s like having two Carmelo Anthony’s on this team.

Anybody watching can see that’s all that’s on the minds of JT and JB all game long: Who can score the most points in the game. No, everyone is supposed to be focused on: What can I do to ensure we are best positioned to make the best plays possible to best position our team to win?

Remember how great our team play was in the mid/late 2010s? There was team play, plenty of passing, no taking turns playing iso-man to see who gets the most PPGs. There was a lot more winning, too, and it actually felt like we were working towards a championship rather than being stuck on a .500 treadmill.

On the whole, clearly Tatum is better than Brown and more likely to attract a major player down the road, so clearly if we are to breakup this iso hero ball crap, Brown should be the one moved. Tatum will have the opportunity to save face by playing team ball while still being our undisputed team leader, like PP before him.

Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is the opposite of winning.

[GreenlyGreeny]

One can speculate as to why JB would be predominately focused on scoring more points than JT even if the behavior is making the team worse off: Wants to improve his earnings potential in the future, wants to be the number one guy, etc.

Whatever the reasoning, the behavior has to change. The pecking order is JT number one, JB number two. They both need to have chemistry playing team ball, making all of their teammates better. If this can’t happen, this duo needs to be broken up. That simple.

[Kiorrik]

One can speculate as to why JB would be predominately focused on scoring more points than JT even if the behavior is making the team worse off: Wants to improve his earnings potential in the future, wants to be the number one guy, etc.

Whatever the reasoning, the behavior has to change. The pecking order is JT number one, JB number two. They both need to have chemistry playing team ball, making all of their teammates better. If this can’t happen, this duo needs to be broken up. That simple.

Come on dude. Maybe he's just trying to do what he's best at. Maybe he's trying to do what is best for the team. Maybe coach tells him to just attack. Maybe his teammates do.

Why do you go to those excuses first and foremost? How come you only go for ones that make him look like an arrogant player?

Honestly wondering.

[GreenlyGreeny]

One can speculate as to why JB would be predominately focused on scoring more points than JT even if the behavior is making the team worse off: Wants to improve his earnings potential in the future, wants to be the number one guy, etc.

Whatever the reasoning, the behavior has to change. The pecking order is JT number one, JB number two. They both need to have chemistry playing team ball, making all of their teammates better. If this can’t happen, this duo needs to be broken up. That simple.

Come on dude. Maybe he's just trying to do what he's best at. Maybe he's trying to do what is best for the team. Maybe coach tells him to just attack. Maybe his teammates do.

Why do you go to those excuses first and foremost? How come you only go for ones that make him look like an arrogant player?

Honestly wondering.

Because he’s clearly never going to be better than Tatum, but it’s obvious he is not willing to accept the pecking order of JT #1, JB #2

There’s no way a coach is telling him to behave this way. Neither CBS or CIU.

[Kiorrik]

One can speculate as to why JB would be predominately focused on scoring more points than JT even if the behavior is making the team worse off: Wants to improve his earnings potential in the future, wants to be the number one guy, etc.

Whatever the reasoning, the behavior has to change. The pecking order is JT number one, JB number two. They both need to have chemistry playing team ball, making all of their teammates better. If this can’t happen, this duo needs to be broken up. That simple.

Come on dude. Maybe he's just trying to do what he's best at. Maybe he's trying to do what is best for the team. Maybe coach tells him to just attack. Maybe his teammates do.

Why do you go to those excuses first and foremost? How come you only go for ones that make him look like an arrogant player?

Honestly wondering.

Because he’s clearly never going to be better than Tatum, but it’s obvious he is not willing to accept the pecking order of JT #1, JB #2

There’s no way a coach is telling him to behave this way. Neither CBS or CIU.

As if we can't have 2 scorers.

Last game, they both had 25 points. JB on 18 shots, JT on 20.

Game before that, JB 34 on 22 shots, JT 18 on 19 shots.

Game before that, JB 30 on 22 shots, JT 17 on 14 shots.

Pretty clear JB ain't the problem here.

_{.edit: also, he takes fewer shots than Tatum every single game. Hits at a higher %. What's the problem.}

[footey]

I think Ime is trying to correct bad habits that are difficult to break. Team looked elite in first half, and recovered from the 3rd quarter shellacking. End of game miscues showed that Tatum should not be responsible to make the play, but to finish it, or be a decoy to create space for others. I’d rather see the ball in the hands of Pritchard. He’s best ball handler by far. Or even Smart.

[Ogaju]

One can speculate as to why JB would be predominately focused on scoring more points than JT even if the behavior is making the team worse off: Wants to improve his earnings potential in the future, wants to be the number one guy, etc.

Whatever the reasoning, the behavior has to change. The pecking order is JT number one, JB number two. They both need to have chemistry playing team ball, making all of their teammates better. If this can’t happen, this duo needs to be broken up. That simple.

Come on dude. Maybe he's just trying to do what he's best at. Maybe he's trying to do what is best for the team. Maybe coach tells him to just attack. Maybe his teammates do.

Why do you go to those excuses first and foremost? How come you only go for ones that make him look like an arrogant player?

Honestly wondering.

Because he’s clearly never going to be better than Tatum, but it’s obvious he is not willing to accept the pecking order of JT #1, JB #2

There’s no way a coach is telling him to behave this way. Neither CBS or CIU.

As if we can't have 2 scorers.

Last game, they both had 25 points. JB on 18 shots, JT on 20.

Game before that, JB 34 on 22 shots, JT 18 on 19 shots.

Game before that, JB 30 on 22 shots, JT 17 on 14 shots.

Pretty clear JB ain't the problem here.

_{.edit: also, he takes fewer shots than Tatum every single game. Hits at a higher %. What's the problem.}

Your whispered edit is either false or the stat you put up in your main post is false.

[Kiorrik]

One can speculate as to why JB would be predominately focused on scoring more points than JT even if the behavior is making the team worse off: Wants to improve his earnings potential in the future, wants to be the number one guy, etc.

Whatever the reasoning, the behavior has to change. The pecking order is JT number one, JB number two. They both need to have chemistry playing team ball, making all of their teammates better. If this can’t happen, this duo needs to be broken up. That simple.

Come on dude. Maybe he's just trying to do what he's best at. Maybe he's trying to do what is best for the team. Maybe coach tells him to just attack. Maybe his teammates do.

Why do you go to those excuses first and foremost? How come you only go for ones that make him look like an arrogant player?

Honestly wondering.

Because he’s clearly never going to be better than Tatum, but it’s obvious he is not willing to accept the pecking order of JT #1, JB #2

There’s no way a coach is telling him to behave this way. Neither CBS or CIU.

As if we can't have 2 scorers.

Last game, they both had 25 points. JB on 18 shots, JT on 20.

Game before that, JB 34 on 22 shots, JT 18 on 19 shots.

Game before that, JB 30 on 22 shots, JT 17 on 14 shots.

Pretty clear JB ain't the problem here.

_{.edit: also, he takes fewer shots than Tatum every single game. Hits at a higher %. What's the problem.}

Your whispered edit is either false or the stat you put up in your main post is false.

Let me rephrase; in the game's he's shot more than Tatum, he's been hitting at a higher clip.

Over the season though, he takes fewer shots per game than JT.

[pokeKingCurtis]

I think Ime is trying to correct bad habits that are difficult to break. Team looked elite in first half, and recovered from the 3rd quarter shellacking. End of game miscues showed that Tatum should not be responsible to make the play, but to finish it, or be a decoy to create space for others. I’d rather see the ball in the hands of Pritchard. He’s best ball handler by far. Or even Smart.

I didn't watch the Bucks game, but agree with the first sentence. Basically no coach's challenges this year makes it obvious to me - no more whining.

[GreenlyGreeny]

One can speculate as to why JB would be predominately focused on scoring more points than JT even if the behavior is making the team worse off: Wants to improve his earnings potential in the future, wants to be the number one guy, etc.

Whatever the reasoning, the behavior has to change. The pecking order is JT number one, JB number two. They both need to have chemistry playing team ball, making all of their teammates better. If this can’t happen, this duo needs to be broken up. That simple.

Come on dude. Maybe he's just trying to do what he's best at. Maybe he's trying to do what is best for the team. Maybe coach tells him to just attack. Maybe his teammates do.

Why do you go to those excuses first and foremost? How come you only go for ones that make him look like an arrogant player?

Honestly wondering.

Because he’s clearly never going to be better than Tatum, but it’s obvious he is not willing to accept the pecking order of JT #1, JB #2

There’s no way a coach is telling him to behave this way. Neither CBS or CIU.

As if we can't have 2 scorers.

Last game, they both had 25 points. JB on 18 shots, JT on 20.

Game before that, JB 34 on 22 shots, JT 18 on 19 shots.

Game before that, JB 30 on 22 shots, JT 17 on 14 shots.

Pretty clear JB ain't the problem here.

_{.edit: also, he takes fewer shots than Tatum every single game. Hits at a higher %. What's the problem.}

What’s the problem? We’ve been a .500 team for over 100 games. There’s no chemistry with this duo. They are not playing the type of team ball that got us to high horizons in 2016-2020, yet our roster definitely has better players than 2015-2016 at the very least. Unlike then, it no longer feels like we’re building towards a championship. My guess is that you could put Popovich in charge and we’d still be a .500 team because of JT/JB playing their hero ball crap. Brad could not get through to them, and now Ime is not getting through to them. Ime is a good coach and a disciple of the second or third best coach in history, behind Red and maybe Jackson. Brad was very thorough in finding his successor. This ongoing issue is not related to coaching, as we now know based on the change in coaching. The issue is JT/JB do not fit together as the leading duo, at least not with the way they’ve played together the past 100+ games. .500 is the problem. We’re the Celtics, not the Pacers or Hornets, and the .500 treadmill is just not acceptable. Boom or bust, baby. I’ve been waiting over 13 years and do not want to wait 13 more.

[ozgod]

I'm sure at the end of the season they will do a root cause analysis like they always do and work out who has the biggest share of the blame:

• Ime for having command responsibility, the players for failing to make shots and execute
• Tatum and Brown for not leading us to victory when they are All Stars and should have
• Tatum and Brown for being All Stars unable to make their teammates better
• the bench and support players for failing to make shots when the Jays pass them the ball
• the team for failing to defend cohesively
• specific players for not knowing what position to be in when they are put in rotation and giving up open shots
• Ime for failing to get the best out of the players and not punishing them if they make mistakes or give up 20 point leads
• Covid for affecting half the team
• the players for not taking enough precautions
• the fans for having too high expectations of what is in reality a mediocre .500 team that wins half the games and loses the other half
• the ball from being a different texture than it was last year

I'm sure I missed a few more reasons there but there's plenty of blame to go around...what we don't know is who the scapegoat will be and whose head/s will roll 

[GreenlyGreeny]

I'm sure at the end of the season they will do a root cause analysis like they always do and work out who has the biggest share of the blame:  …

• Covid for affecting half the team

…

This one is not going to fly this year. Am watching the Bulls right now on NBA TV and if we played team ball like they play team ball, we’d be number two in the East like they are…the primary difference  between us and them: Lavine/DeRozan are listening to Billy Donovan, with everyone on the team including DeRozan embracing that Lavine is the number one, whereas JT/JB are not listening to Ime, and JB is unwilling to accept JT as our number one…

[Kiorrik]

One can speculate as to why JB would be predominately focused on scoring more points than JT even if the behavior is making the team worse off: Wants to improve his earnings potential in the future, wants to be the number one guy, etc.

Whatever the reasoning, the behavior has to change. The pecking order is JT number one, JB number two. They both need to have chemistry playing team ball, making all of their teammates better. If this can’t happen, this duo needs to be broken up. That simple.

Come on dude. Maybe he's just trying to do what he's best at. Maybe he's trying to do what is best for the team. Maybe coach tells him to just attack. Maybe his teammates do.

Why do you go to those excuses first and foremost? How come you only go for ones that make him look like an arrogant player?

Honestly wondering.

Because he’s clearly never going to be better than Tatum, but it’s obvious he is not willing to accept the pecking order of JT #1, JB #2

There’s no way a coach is telling him to behave this way. Neither CBS or CIU.

As if we can't have 2 scorers.

Last game, they both had 25 points. JB on 18 shots, JT on 20.

Game before that, JB 34 on 22 shots, JT 18 on 19 shots.

Game before that, JB 30 on 22 shots, JT 17 on 14 shots.

Pretty clear JB ain't the problem here.

_{.edit: also, he takes fewer shots than Tatum every single game. Hits at a higher %. What's the problem.}

What’s the problem? We’ve been a .500 team for over 100 games. There’s no chemistry with this duo. They are not playing the type of team ball that got us to high horizons in 2016-2020, yet our roster definitely has better players than 2015-2016 at the very least. Unlike then, it no longer feels like we’re building towards a championship. My guess is that you could put Popovich in charge and we’d still be a .500 team because of JT/JB playing their hero ball crap. Brad could not get through to them, and now Ime is not getting through to them. Ime is a good coach and a disciple of the second or third best coach in history, behind Red and maybe Jackson. Brad was very thorough in finding his successor. This ongoing issue is not related to coaching, as we now know based on the change in coaching. The issue is JT/JB do not fit together as the leading duo, at least not with the way they’ve played together the past 100+ games. .500 is the problem. We’re the Celtics, not the Pacers or Hornets, and the .500 treadmill is just not acceptable. Boom or bust, baby. I’ve been waiting over 13 years and do not want to wait 13 more.

.500 team.

Solution: trade away our second best player and pray what comes back is worth.