Willie Cauley-Stein where does he go and can we get him.

[moiso]

I don't get the infatuation with this guy. The only thing that he has going for him as a basketball player is that he's an athletic and mobile big man. Beyond that he lacks intelligence, didn't show significant improvement during his time at UK, and is a sub-par rebounder and free throw shooter (see here: http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/61842/willie-cauley-stein).

He is grossly overrated simply because he played at a program that is a mill for NBA talent and is in a weak basketball conference, the SEC. The Celtics can do better, he will likely turn into a headcase and a bust.

All the reports that I've heard claim that he is a very smart guy.  That GM's would prefer him to be a little bit less intelligent so that he wouldn't have so many thoughts outside of basketball.

[D.o.s.]

That's the same criticism that gets lobbed at JaVale McGee.

[Celtics4ever]

Unless we trade up it is a moot thing.

[CelticGuardian]

I think Cauley-Stein could very well end up falling to the Kings.

I think his game is limited to jumping up and contesting a shot, or jumping up and grabbing a rebound, or jumping up and dunking the ball. But that is something we desperately need. If Danny ends up making a run for him on draft day it could be worth it. Though the price could be too steep. If we are going to move up we should at least just try to get into the lottery like we did the last time we had the 16th pick.

[Irish Stew]

It's very difficult and expensive in terms of draft picks and/or players to move that far up. I'm willing to take a chance on Robert Upshaw  at 16 while understanding that he has baggage. People believe that he will last until 28, but I doubt it once he starts working out for teams.

[konkmv]

Not a smart move to give up much for stein... with 16 and 2 future b picks we can get turner.. with 28 and 33 upshaw and dakari johnson will be available... 2 7footers

[saltlover]

I think Cauley-Stein could very well end up falling to the Kings.

I think his game is limited to jumping up and contesting a shot, or jumping up and grabbing a rebound, or jumping up and dunking the ball. But that is something we desperately need. If Danny ends up making a run for him on draft day it could be worth it. Though the price could be too steep. If we are going to move up we should at least just try to get into the lottery like we did the last time we had the 16th pick.

If you think his game is limited to jumping, you have it wrong.  He has great lateral quickness, which is why he can guard perimeter players when switching on the pick-and-roll, which creates a major defensive advantage.  He has a great steal rate for an interior defensive player as well, which is one of the skills that best translates to NBA defensive success, per research by basketball statisticians (I believe Kevin Pelton.)  On offense, he's shown improved ability while at school to set good picks to create room for his teammates to work in the half-court.  He's not going to back down opponents in the post, and right now doesn't have a reliable jump shot (although his free throw shooting is decent enough to suggest he could develop a decent foul line jumper on pick-and-pops).  But he's the most complete defensive player available at any position (because he can guard any position), and at 7 feet, you don't need to do more than set good screens and finish at the hoop to be useful on offense.

But I do think he'll slide to at least 6, and I wouldn't be surprised if he's around at 8-10, since there are a lot of players with two-way potential who could all reasonably go earlier.  But he has an elite NBA skill that plays immediately, and the size and athleticism that gives him a high ceiling.  There is some concern about his rebounding, but in my opinion it's very overblown, as he played on teams that always had a lot of great rebounders to lose opportunities to, and he often was defending the perimeter when the ball was shot, keeping him away from the boards.  His offensive rebounds are perfectly good, which makes sense as he's always near the basket on offense.  I would hope Ainge is willing to trade at least the Dallas and Minny picks to move up to get him.  He's the type of player who's not available every draft.

[BDeCosta26]

It's very difficult and expensive in terms of draft picks and/or players to move that far up. I'm willing to take a chance on Robert Upshaw  at 16 while understanding that he has baggage. People believe that he will last until 28, but I doubt it once he starts working out for teams.

That would be a GIANT reach. Right now, Upshaw has been projected as a early to middle 2nd round pick. And for good reason. Kicked out of two college programs, multiple failed drug tests and a general lack of caring are exactly why no one will want to give him the type of contract a 1st rounder gets. Don't get me wrong, I really like that kid as a player and he fits our needs quite well. Ainge is well known for targeting highly regarded prospects who fall for various reasons (See: Sullinger, Bradley, Gerald Green, Young) so I'm almost expecting us to take him later on if we don't use all our picks to move up, but you just can't take him at 16. Way too many red flags. Even if he just likes to smoke reef too much and that's his only issue, it was bad enough to destroy his college career. Too risky to give a 1st round contract too.

Honesty, I think Ainge will do everything in his power to move up as far as he can with this years picks, later 2nds and no more than one or max two player off the roster. OKC at 14 and every team before up to Detroit at 8 are realistic trade partners in that kind of scenario. If we do somehow get into the top 12, I think we need to go BPA but only because the best players possibly available there (Johnson, WCS, Mario, Porzingas, Turner) are guys that fit what we need. Personally, I feel that Johnson is the best target to fill our hole at the 3. WCS would be a great compliment to our current front court, but he doesn't have the highest ceiling. Mario reminds me a lot of the late, great Drazen Petrovic. Ainge doesn't often go for foreign guys but man, that kid looks good. If we traded Bradley to move up into the top-10, I'd be thrilled with him. Could see Porzongas busting more than the rest. Turner is a guy with a huge ceiling that is within close range of #16.

[I told you so]

Glad to see another Portis fan. He seems like the type of player that would fit well into Brad Stevens' system, a hard worker, good defender who can shoot, pass and defend. Plus he would render Sullinger into a redundant piece that could be used as a trade asset.

[Irish Stew]

It's very difficult and expensive in terms of draft picks and/or players to move that far up. I'm willing to take a chance on Robert Upshaw  at 16 while understanding that he has baggage. People believe that he will last until 28, but I doubt it once he starts working out for teams.

That would be a GIANT reach. Right now, Upshaw has been projected as a early to middle 2nd round pick. And for good reason. Kicked out of two college programs, multiple failed drug tests and a general lack of caring are exactly why no one will want to give him the type of contract a 1st rounder gets. Don't get me wrong, I really like that kid as a player and he fits our needs quite well. Ainge is well known for targeting highly regarded prospects who fall for various reasons (See: Sullinger, Bradley, Gerald Green, Young) so I'm almost expecting us to take him later on if we don't use all our picks to move up, but you just can't take him at 16. Way too many red flags. Even if he just likes to smoke reef too much and that's his only issue, it was bad enough to destroy his college career. Too risky to give a 1st round contract too.

Honesty, I think Ainge will do everything in his power to move up as far as he can with this years picks, later 2nds and no more than one or max two player off the roster. OKC at 14 and every team before up to Detroit at 8 are realistic trade partners in that kind of scenario. If we do somehow get into the top 12, I think we need to go BPA but only because the best players possibly available there (Johnson, WCS, Mario, Porzingas, Turner) are guys that fit what we need. Personally, I feel that Johnson is the best target to fill our hole at the 3. WCS would be a great compliment to our current front court, but he doesn't have the highest ceiling. Mario reminds me a lot of the late, great Drazen Petrovic. Ainge doesn't often go for foreign guys but man, that kid looks good. If we traded Bradley to move up into the top-10, I'd be thrilled with him. Could see Porzongas busting more than the rest. Turner is a guy with a huge ceiling that is within close range of #16.

I really am in general agreement that on May 11th, 2015 , Upshaw at 16 would be a reach, but by draft night it might not be out of line as teams work him out and really dig into the game tapes (his battle with Poeltl is fascinating). Maybe moving up from 28 to the low 20's using our second round draft choices might be enough to get him. I'm just in the belief that center prospects in the NBA draft are like quarterback prospects in the NFL draft. They go higher than we think they will because the payoff when you're right is so great.

[FreddieJ]

SAC at 6 has a center in Cousins a SF in Gay and a lot of needs at PG, SG, PF and bench. Also have a new HC and a meddlesome owner who wants to make a splash.

Trade our 4 2015 picks for theirs (about the same value per Tankathon) or get players involved on both. Anyone after 5 is also a viable trade partner.  ORL at 5 has a thing for guys with weak offensive games, so don't count them out of grabbing him first.

Collison is a good fit and McLemore has shown enough to be allowed another year I believe from their perspective

[colincb]

deleted

[BDeCosta26]

SAC at 6 has a center in Cousins a SF in Gay and a lot of needs at PG, SG, PF and bench. Also have a new HC and a meddlesome owner who wants to make a splash.

Trade our 4 2015 picks for theirs (about the same value per Tankathon) or get players involved on both. Anyone after 5 is also a viable trade partner.  ORL at 5 has a thing for guys with weak offensive games, so don't count them out of grabbing him first.

Collison is a good fit and McLemore has shown enough to be allowed another year I believe from their perspective

McLemore has shown enough to continue development for sure, Collison is a halfway decent fit, but they need more guys who create with the ball in their hands. The thing about Sacto is, if they're serious about building a competitive team around Cousins they need real, tangible upgrades just about everywhere besides the 3, 5 and possibly the 2 is McLemore makes a leap. Having one pick that's somewhere around 6 or 7 most likely won't do that for them, and without improvement Cousins will almost certainly force his way out next summer. Preferably you'd bring in a few guys that are proven NBA-caliber talents with upside remaining. Lucky for them, we have a bunch of those at positions of need. They also have a handful of bad contracts that they would like to get rid of, which can grease the wheels and lower the price in a possible trade with them.

So let's say they get #6. Cousins gives them one more chance to improve with their new regime. Danny calls up whoever is actually in charge over there and offers up the following..

Olynyk, Bradley, Turner, #16 and the 2016 MIN 1st for #6 and McLemore

Or something less complex, Sullinger OR KO, Turner, #16 and #45 for #6 and Carl Landry or D.Williams.

Would they consider it? It makes sense. That team needs a PF who can fit next to Cousins by drawing double teams away from his work in the post, and both Sullinger and Olynyk fit that bill quite well while still being on rookie deals with lots of remaining upside. They need a guy who can play multiple positions and is comfortable initiating offense with the ball in their hands. Turner can play the 1,2 and 3 and showed this year how effective he can be with the ball, plus he's just plain clutch which is something they could use, and lastly they need a top-tier perimeter defender. McLemore and Stauskus just aren't good defenders. Bradley would immediately be their best back-court player if such a trade went down. If you were SAC and you keeping Cousins is only going to happen of you put together a decent team, what's more appealing. I think ours is. We could immediately plug their holes, while getting two really nice assets in return.

[colincb]

SAC at 6 has a center in Cousins a SF in Gay and a lot of needs at PG, SG, PF and bench. Also have a new HC and a meddlesome owner who wants to make a splash.

Trade our 4 2015 picks for theirs (about the same value per Tankathon) or get players involved on both. Anyone after 5 is also a viable trade partner.  ORL at 5 has a thing for guys with weak offensive games, so don't count them out of grabbing him first.

Collison is a good fit and McLemore has shown enough to be allowed another year I believe from their perspective

Collison is passable, but the Kings are rumored to be very  interested in Lawson as a step up.  McLemore will survive another year because the Kings spent their last 2 first rounders on him and Staukas. Stauakas  turned out to be worse than McLemore who he was going to replace. McLemore had a 10.4 PER and was 350th in defensive +/- last year after a disaster rookie season.  Imperfect stats, but there’s not much support for him turning into much despite the love some CBloggers have for him. He's turned into a decent catch-and-shoot player, but isn't a shot creator and sucks defensively. Will stick in the NBA because he was a high draft pick and not a complete bust, but SAC fans aren't projecting stardom for him.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2015_advanced.html

http://www.sactownroyalty.com/2015/5/5/8556873/2014-15-recap-and-early-look-into-free-agency-and-possible-draft

[BDeCosta26]

It's very difficult and expensive in terms of draft picks and/or players to move that far up. I'm willing to take a chance on Robert Upshaw  at 16 while understanding that he has baggage. People believe that he will last until 28, but I doubt it once he starts working out for teams.

That would be a GIANT reach. Right now, Upshaw has been projected as a early to middle 2nd round pick. And for good reason. Kicked out of two college programs, multiple failed drug tests and a general lack of caring are exactly why no one will want to give him the type of contract a 1st rounder gets. Don't get me wrong, I really like that kid as a player and he fits our needs quite well. Ainge is well known for targeting highly regarded prospects who fall for various reasons (See: Sullinger, Bradley, Gerald Green, Young) so I'm almost expecting us to take him later on if we don't use all our picks to move up, but you just can't take him at 16. Way too many red flags. Even if he just likes to smoke reef too much and that's his only issue, it was bad enough to destroy his college career. Too risky to give a 1st round contract too.

Honesty, I think Ainge will do everything in his power to move up as far as he can with this years picks, later 2nds and no more than one or max two player off the roster. OKC at 14 and every team before up to Detroit at 8 are realistic trade partners in that kind of scenario. If we do somehow get into the top 12, I think we need to go BPA but only because the best players possibly available there (Johnson, WCS, Mario, Porzingas, Turner) are guys that fit what we need. Personally, I feel that Johnson is the best target to fill our hole at the 3. WCS would be a great compliment to our current front court, but he doesn't have the highest ceiling. Mario reminds me a lot of the late, great Drazen Petrovic. Ainge doesn't often go for foreign guys but man, that kid looks good. If we traded Bradley to move up into the top-10, I'd be thrilled with him. Could see Porzongas busting more than the rest. Turner is a guy with a huge ceiling that is within close range of #16.

I really am in general agreement that on May 11th, 2015 , Upshaw at 16 would be a reach, but by draft night it might not be out of line as teams work him out and really dig into the game tapes (his battle with Poeltl is fascinating). Maybe moving up from 28 to the low 20's using our second round draft choices might be enough to get him. I'm just in the belief that center prospects in the NBA draft are like quarterback prospects in the NFL draft. They go higher than we think they will because the payoff when you're right is so great.

I would certainly agree with you on that. Just about every great NBA team needs a viable big man who excels defensively to be a true contender. For that reason, a guy like WCS will go in the 5-10 range instead of the 14-20 range like an similarly flawed PG prospect (I.E. Tyus Jones) will. And sure, when it comes time for workouts and measurements Upshaw will probably get more attention because talent wise, he's a very good prospect. But the red flags are too concerning. The NBA has rules against marijuana use too, and there's a real good chance that wrecks his pro career the same way it did his college one.

Before the playoffs started, he was considered a guy you take a chance on in the middle of the 2nd round in the hope you can keep him in check mentally and let his talent develop. As we get closer to draft night, he probably will rise but I really doubt he goes in the 1st round. It's possible because he's got top-20 talent. But second round picks get far fewer guarantees given to them than 1st rounders. I think he'll end up being one of the first 5 or so guys taken in the 2nd and since we happen to have 28, 33 and 45, should Ainge keep a couple of those picks and we don't trade up for WCS or Turner I almost expect us to take a shot at him. Could pay off big. Just a bit too risky to do even at 28, and certainly so at 16.

Really like him though, if we can reign him in he could be a difference making kind of player.