All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)

[Ilikesports17]

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's obviously not true.

How is it obviously not true. This is what people have been saying for a long time (including 76ers fans) and you refuse to accept it.

The 76ers fans commenting that don't genuinely believe it.  And neither do you.   It's like someone here frustrated that Jaylen Brown doesn't get minutes and saying "he's probably not even worth a 2nd rounder at this point".

Okafor was was selected 1st-Team All-Rookie and his Per minute numbers this season actually show improvement.  If he could be had for a late 1st rounder, a team like Boston would already have him.  He's on the second year of a rookie contract and it's highly, highly improbable that the guy selected with the late 1st will be anywhere near the quality of prospect as Okafor.

Ya'll are just being hyperbolic.

Does per minute mean much though...when you are playing less?

His per 100 possessions show a downward trend...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/okafoja01.html


I would give up a non-top10 projected pick...but that's because I'm intrigued...not because I'm convinced he'd live up to being a top 3 pick.

What's interesting is that his averages this season of 10.7 points, 4.8 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 blocks in 22.4mpg (11.29EFF) statistically put him slightly ahead of Malcolm Brogdon this season (11.00 EFF).  As we all know, 24 year old Malcolm Brogdon is the darling of the 2016 draft and would be frontrunner for Rookie of the Year if it weren't for 2014 draftees Embiid and Saric.   

So in other words, Jahlil Okafor is arguably outperforming every single 2016 draftee this season.  That lends credibility to the draftniks suggestion that Okafor was a better prospect than anyone available at #3 this year.  If these were Okafor's rookie numbers, he'd be just a hair above Malcolm Brogdon for Rookie of the Year frontrunner despite the fact 21 year old Okafor literally 3 years younger than Brogdon.   Go figure.

Now of course, the DNP's hurt Okafor's hypothetical bid for 2016-17 Rookie of the Year, but there's obviously some extraordinary circumstances at play there.  He's currently playing behind the transcendent Joel Embiid and Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.  Philly is obviously trying to experiment right now with different rotations.

why are you like this?

It's a response to the idea that Philly couldn't get a late 1st for Okafor.  That's clearly not true.  This Summer many in the media called him better than any 2016 prospect available outside of Ben Simmons and maybe Brandon Ingram.  We're well into the season and despite having to share minutes with two other great centers, he's still outperforming every 2016 draftee this season.

Just offensively, right?

That team is a bad fit for him, but there's actually been some write-ups suggesting Okafor's defense has improved this year - as crazy as that sounds. 

I can't speak for the rest of the 2016 draft.  It's been pretty dreadful.  Have you noticed any Marcus Smarts who are impacting the game without stats?  I haven't noticed any.  I'm purely talking about basic statistical impact.  Okafor has outperformed everyone in the 2016 draft this season despite the limited minutes.

Honestly the level of statistical production from the 2016 draftees has been pretty pathetic so far. 

Okafor 11.26 EFF

2016 Draftee rankings

#1 - Malcolm Brogdon - 11.0 EFF
#2 - Brandon Ingram - 7.95 EFF
#3 - Buddy Hield - 7.50 EFF
#4 - Domantas Sabonis - 7.30 EFF
#5 - Pascal Siakam - 7.11 EFF
#6 - Cheick Diallo - 7.00 EFF
#7 - Jamal Murray - 6.97 EFF
#8 - Caris LeVert - 6.94 EFF
#9 - Marques Chriss - 6.90 EFF
#10 - Isaiah Whitehead - 6.84 EFF

Jaylen is outside the top 20 with an EFF of 4.50

So at least statistically, one could make the case that Okafor is outplaying everyone drafted this year.   Hence why i think the idea of him not being worth a late 1st completely laughable even if some folks here can't find humor in it.

you yourself have noted that this past years draft was pathetic. This years is supposed to be rather good.

Also, you have agreed that Eff doesnt accurately rank players because Isaiah Thomas comes in nearly 4 points above Al Horford and you say Horford is better.

So you rank players that arent relevant with a metric you know to be flawed. Nice.

Excellent point.  So if what we read about this draft is true and the guys who went 3-8 this year (Dunn, Murray, Hield, Jaylen, Bender, Chriss) would be more like the 11-16 picks in the 2017 draft... I could see you making a case that Okafor is only worth a late lotto pick in the 2017 draft.  But suggesting Philly can't get a late 1st for him is obviously ridiculous.

I think its within the realm of possibility that they cant get a 1st rounder. Id be shocked but DNPs on a bottom 3 team, his injury issues and some attitude questions, combined with his skillset being something of a "dinosaur" in todays game.

That said, Id have to imagine that you could find a team in the 10-20 range to give you a first for Jahlil. Anything less would surprise me, but not shock me.

[Ilikesports17]

you fell prey to a classic LarBrd misdirection, Granath.

In my post, I bolded this quote:

Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team

LarBrd unbolded the quote and responded as if Id questioned his entire post.

Actually, I didn't. This whole thing started with jpotter's post of:

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's what set him off and Lar responded directly to that. Then celticsclay tried to say that jpotter's post was true. That's what started this thing. And, in this case, Lar's right. Now when people started arguing about it, he (as usual) went off to the Funny Farm and what I call "minutia world" in where Lar misuses statistics to try to prove a point. That's to be expected. That's what he does.

But in response to the above absurd statement, Lar's right. Okafor is worth more than a late first and if he could be had for that he'd have been gobbled up already.

ah, so I have fallen prey to my own poor reading comprehension skills. I had thought you were defending Lar, from my "why are you like this" quote.

me you and lar (minus his stupid statistics) all generally agree.

[celticsclay]

you fell prey to a classic LarBrd misdirection, Granath.

In my post, I bolded this quote:

Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team

LarBrd unbolded the quote and responded as if Id questioned his entire post.

Actually, I didn't. This whole thing started with jpotter's post of:

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's what set him off and Lar responded directly to that. Then celticsclay tried to say that jpotter's post was true. That's what started this thing. And, in this case, Lar's right. Now when people started arguing about it, he (as usual) went off to the Funny Farm and what I call "minutia world" in where Lar misuses statistics to try to prove a point. That's to be expected. That's what he does.

But in response to the above absurd statement, Lar's right. Okafor is worth more than a late first and if he could be had for that he'd have been gobbled up already.

I am not trolling when I say that is what I feel like Okafor is worth. Potter shared a serious article that was also not an attempt at trolling.

There is a decent amount of players that have made the all-rookie team in the last few years that could not fetch more than a late first round pick at this time. Guys like Mirotic, Clarkson, MCW etc. Heck MCW was rookie of the year.

Everyone associated with the NBA that has commented on Okafor's value has been pretty negative including guys like Lowe and Pelton that most people highly regard. His advanced stats are awful. He has been absolutely roasted in games this year on the defensive end including a game where Utah ran like 6 pick and rolls against him straight and scored on every one.

I 100% believe people that think he is some sort of future star are being pretty ridiculous and ignoring a lot of evidence and respected minds of people that cover basketball.

If Okafor gets traded for a lottery pick I will be the first one to admit I was wrong on this, but I think people that keeping talking about people in Okafor in high esteem are ignoring a mountain of mounting evidence.

[jpotter33]

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's obviously not true.

How is it obviously not true. This is what people have been saying for a long time (including 76ers fans) and you refuse to accept it.

The 76ers fans commenting that don't genuinely believe it.  And neither do you.   It's like someone here frustrated that Jaylen Brown doesn't get minutes and saying "he's probably not even worth a 2nd rounder at this point".

Okafor was was selected 1st-Team All-Rookie and his Per minute numbers this season actually show improvement.  If he could be had for a late 1st rounder, a team like Boston would already have him.  He's on the second year of a rookie contract and it's highly, highly improbable that the guy selected with the late 1st will be anywhere near the quality of prospect as Okafor.

Ya'll are just being hyperbolic.

Does per minute mean much though...when you are playing less?

His per 100 possessions show a downward trend...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/okafoja01.html


I would give up a non-top10 projected pick...but that's because I'm intrigued...not because I'm convinced he'd live up to being a top 3 pick.

What's interesting is that his averages this season of 10.7 points, 4.8 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 blocks in 22.4mpg (11.29EFF) statistically put him slightly ahead of Malcolm Brogdon this season (11.00 EFF).  As we all know, 24 year old Malcolm Brogdon is the darling of the 2016 draft and would be frontrunner for Rookie of the Year if it weren't for 2014 draftees Embiid and Saric.   

So in other words, Jahlil Okafor is arguably outperforming every single 2016 draftee this season.  That lends credibility to the draftniks suggestion that Okafor was a better prospect than anyone available at #3 this year.  If these were Okafor's rookie numbers, he'd be just a hair above Malcolm Brogdon for Rookie of the Year frontrunner despite the fact 21 year old Okafor literally 3 years younger than Brogdon.   Go figure.

Now of course, the DNP's hurt Okafor's hypothetical bid for 2016-17 Rookie of the Year, but there's obviously some extraordinary circumstances at play there.  He's currently playing behind the transcendent Joel Embiid and Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.  Philly is obviously trying to experiment right now with different rotations.

why are you like this?

It's a response to the idea that Philly couldn't get a late 1st for Okafor.  That's clearly not true.  This Summer many in the media called him better than any 2016 prospect available outside of Ben Simmons and maybe Brandon Ingram.  We're well into the season and despite having to share minutes with two other great centers, he's still outperforming every 2016 draftee this season.

(I can't believe I'm saying this...)

I'm going to stick up for Lar on this one a bit. If someone claims that the 76ers couldn't get a late first for Okafor then I'm going to say they're trolling. That's absurd. So he's overreacting - as usual - to someone else's overreaction.

No, he's not as good as Lar claims. No Philadelphia player ever is. We all need to remember that Lar staked his claim that Hinkie was some kind of genius and Lar's simply not mentally able to admit that he's wrong. At the same time, telling him that Okafor is worth a 2nd rounder is just poking the bear and there's no use in complaining when it growls back.

you fell prey to a classic LarBrd misdirection, Granath.

In my post, I bolded this quote:

Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team

LarBrd unbolded the quote and responded as if Id questioned his entire post.

For what it's worth, it seems like most people here think Steve Kyler made a typo.  I don't know Steve Kyler personally and I don't know whether or not he made a typo or genuinely was saying Philly should use a sell high moment to trade Embiid and build around Noel and SImmons.   But either way, I think it's pretty clear this is an evolving situation that changes daily.   Today, Noel came out and said he's very pleased with his role on Philly right now.  A couple weeks ago, he seemed to be the odd man out.  Now it appears Okafor is the odd man out.   Philly has gone 4-1 in games Embiid played and Noel got at least 11 minutes.  Noel's trade value seemingly has rebounded after hitting rock bottom.   Meanwhile Okafor is getting DNP's.   That's where we are right now, but who knows how their trade value will fluctuate heading into the trade deadline.  It's very up in the air right now.

It is pretty amazing how you can consistently twist evidence to fit your narrative. Truly a unique skill, Lar.

[jpotter33]

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's obviously not true.

How is it obviously not true. This is what people have been saying for a long time (including 76ers fans) and you refuse to accept it.

The 76ers fans commenting that don't genuinely believe it.  And neither do you.   It's like someone here frustrated that Jaylen Brown doesn't get minutes and saying "he's probably not even worth a 2nd rounder at this point".

Okafor was was selected 1st-Team All-Rookie and his Per minute numbers this season actually show improvement.  If he could be had for a late 1st rounder, a team like Boston would already have him.  He's on the second year of a rookie contract and it's highly, highly improbable that the guy selected with the late 1st will be anywhere near the quality of prospect as Okafor.

Ya'll are just being hyperbolic.

Does per minute mean much though...when you are playing less?

His per 100 possessions show a downward trend...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/okafoja01.html


I would give up a non-top10 projected pick...but that's because I'm intrigued...not because I'm convinced he'd live up to being a top 3 pick.

What's interesting is that his averages this season of 10.7 points, 4.8 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 blocks in 22.4mpg (11.29EFF) statistically put him slightly ahead of Malcolm Brogdon this season (11.00 EFF).  As we all know, 24 year old Malcolm Brogdon is the darling of the 2016 draft and would be frontrunner for Rookie of the Year if it weren't for 2014 draftees Embiid and Saric.   

So in other words, Jahlil Okafor is arguably outperforming every single 2016 draftee this season.  That lends credibility to the draftniks suggestion that Okafor was a better prospect than anyone available at #3 this year.  If these were Okafor's rookie numbers, he'd be just a hair above Malcolm Brogdon for Rookie of the Year frontrunner despite the fact 21 year old Okafor literally 3 years younger than Brogdon.   Go figure.

Now of course, the DNP's hurt Okafor's hypothetical bid for 2016-17 Rookie of the Year, but there's obviously some extraordinary circumstances at play there.  He's currently playing behind the transcendent Joel Embiid and Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.  Philly is obviously trying to experiment right now with different rotations.

why are you like this?

It's a response to the idea that Philly couldn't get a late 1st for Okafor.  That's clearly not true.  He's outperforming every 2016 draftee this season.

I was clearly referring to the bolded text.

Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.

why did you write that in your post?

Because some people here seem to think very highly of Kyler's opinion and that's his most recent comments on this evolving situation:  https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819528715772329984

Speaking of "sell high moments', I interpreted Kyler's comments as follows...

You know how people here are willing to trade Smart + Jaylen + Both Brooklyn 1sts for Cousins?  Well given DeMarcus' reputation as a loose cannon and his upcoming 200 million dollar contract, you have to figure Joel Embiid has more trade value.   I may be wrong, but I think Kyler might have been suggesting that Philly should use this sell high moment to move Embiid for a giant package and build around Simmons and Noel.   It actually might not be a bad idea if you think Embiid's either going to regress or re-injure himself.  The Sixers have a sell high moment here.  Nobody would expect it.   Two questions.  #1 - What's your best offer for Embiid.  #2 - Should Philly surprise everyone by taking it?

Lol more classic LarBrd33 logic - ignore half a dozen tweets to focus on one that fits his narrative.

Seriously, this trolling or just blatant bias/terrible logic, whatever it is, is starting to get a bit ridiculous. You seriously can't ignore some of his tweets and take others out of context to try and argue your point. That's just juvenile.

EDIT: For the third time in the last couple of days, I will post the proper context for people so that you don't deceive them with your flawed logic.

I hope Ainge is calling the Sixers for Noel.

For reals. He'd help us so, so much, and we certainly need it with how terrible we've been defensively and on the boards.

I think we can really challenge Toronto in the playoffs with a Noel upgrade.

I'm sure teams including Boston have asked about Noel, but until someone makes a worthwhile offer, there's no incentive for Philly to trade him.

Sure, if you ignore reality and pretty much only listen to fans on LibertyBallers.

It's widely reported that Noel does not want to stay there outside of the max, which they're certainly not going to give to a backup player behind Embiid, because he's not a backup big and doesn't want to be one. And even if they would be willing to do something that stupid, which they aren't, mind you, it's clear that that's not a move that good organizations make.

Here's Kyler talking about it recently:

https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819303748384280577

I know people want to believe Nerlens would be OK staying, but barring a MAX deal from the 76ers, he wants to move on from my understanding

https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819304238748696576

Noel was told after his "I'm not a 8 minute player" rant to stay quiet and let the 76ers do what they need to do.

https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819312668830003201

Not any offer but I think they ultimately move him [Noel] before the deadline.

https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819313357920600066

As I tweeted a few times. I don't think either are in the grand scheme for the 76ers. They have more time with Okafor

https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819527588976726020

Clock is not ticking on Okafor as it is for Noel. 76ers have time on an Okafor deal. I don't think both are in long-term for the 76ers

https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819528335432843264

Maybe, but like I said, the vibe I got from the situation is 76ers will move Nerlens before the deadline.

https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819530228867485698

That is fine, but my understanding if neither party wants to stay together, so that is always bad when you hold a guy hostage.

So, yeah, it's pretty obvious that he's getting traded. Sure, they're not going to trade him for a bad contract like Mozgov or something, but they're clearly not going to get anywhere near what they want for him. They'll trade him at the deadline, even if it's for something as simple as a conditional first round pick, middling prospect, and salary filler.

[Eja117]

Nerlens Noel's trade value has doubled since this thread was created less than a week ago.  Those sell high windows come and go with 22 year olds.

Okafor's came completely crashing down. Plus Simmons looks healthier so not sure Noel's stock is as high as all that

[Celtics18]

If the Sixers can get a lottery pick for Jahlil Okafor, they should absolutely do it.  I have very little faith in him as a player.  Increasingly, it is starting to seem that more and more basketball observers share that opinion.

[LarBrd33]

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's obviously not true.

How is it obviously not true. This is what people have been saying for a long time (including 76ers fans) and you refuse to accept it.

The 76ers fans commenting that don't genuinely believe it.  And neither do you.   It's like someone here frustrated that Jaylen Brown doesn't get minutes and saying "he's probably not even worth a 2nd rounder at this point".

Okafor was was selected 1st-Team All-Rookie and his Per minute numbers this season actually show improvement.  If he could be had for a late 1st rounder, a team like Boston would already have him.  He's on the second year of a rookie contract and it's highly, highly improbable that the guy selected with the late 1st will be anywhere near the quality of prospect as Okafor.

Ya'll are just being hyperbolic.

Does per minute mean much though...when you are playing less?

His per 100 possessions show a downward trend...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/okafoja01.html


I would give up a non-top10 projected pick...but that's because I'm intrigued...not because I'm convinced he'd live up to being a top 3 pick.

What's interesting is that his averages this season of 10.7 points, 4.8 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 blocks in 22.4mpg (11.29EFF) statistically put him slightly ahead of Malcolm Brogdon this season (11.00 EFF).  As we all know, 24 year old Malcolm Brogdon is the darling of the 2016 draft and would be frontrunner for Rookie of the Year if it weren't for 2014 draftees Embiid and Saric.   

So in other words, Jahlil Okafor is arguably outperforming every single 2016 draftee this season.  That lends credibility to the draftniks suggestion that Okafor was a better prospect than anyone available at #3 this year.  If these were Okafor's rookie numbers, he'd be just a hair above Malcolm Brogdon for Rookie of the Year frontrunner despite the fact 21 year old Okafor literally 3 years younger than Brogdon.   Go figure.

Now of course, the DNP's hurt Okafor's hypothetical bid for 2016-17 Rookie of the Year, but there's obviously some extraordinary circumstances at play there.  He's currently playing behind the transcendent Joel Embiid and Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.  Philly is obviously trying to experiment right now with different rotations.

why are you like this?

It's a response to the idea that Philly couldn't get a late 1st for Okafor.  That's clearly not true.  He's outperforming every 2016 draftee this season.

I was clearly referring to the bolded text.

Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.

why did you write that in your post?

Because some people here seem to think very highly of Kyler's opinion and that's his most recent comments on this evolving situation:  https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819528715772329984

Speaking of "sell high moments', I interpreted Kyler's comments as follows...

You know how people here are willing to trade Smart + Jaylen + Both Brooklyn 1sts for Cousins?  Well given DeMarcus' reputation as a loose cannon and his upcoming 200 million dollar contract, you have to figure Joel Embiid has more trade value.   I may be wrong, but I think Kyler might have been suggesting that Philly should use this sell high moment to move Embiid for a giant package and build around Simmons and Noel.   It actually might not be a bad idea if you think Embiid's either going to regress or re-injure himself.  The Sixers have a sell high moment here.  Nobody would expect it.   Two questions.  #1 - What's your best offer for Embiid.  #2 - Should Philly surprise everyone by taking it?

Lol more classic LarBrd33 logic - ignore half a dozen tweets to focus on one that fits his narrative.

Seriously, this trolling or just blatant bias/terrible logic, whatever it is, is starting to get a bit ridiculous. You seriously can't ignore some of his tweets and take others out of context to try and argue your point. That's just juvenile.

EDIT: For the third time in the last couple of days, I will post the proper context for people so that you don't deceive them with your flawed logic.

I hope Ainge is calling the Sixers for Noel.

For reals. He'd help us so, so much, and we certainly need it with how terrible we've been defensively and on the boards.

I think we can really challenge Toronto in the playoffs with a Noel upgrade.

I'm sure teams including Boston have asked about Noel, but until someone makes a worthwhile offer, there's no incentive for Philly to trade him.

Sure, if you ignore reality and pretty much only listen to fans on LibertyBallers.

It's widely reported that Noel does not want to stay there outside of the max, which they're certainly not going to give to a backup player behind Embiid, because he's not a backup big and doesn't want to be one. And even if they would be willing to do something that stupid, which they aren't, mind you, it's clear that that's not a move that good organizations make.

Traditionally, I can't say anything on this forum without someone labeling it trolling.  Whether it's me saying Paul pierce isn't as good as LeBron, me saying Rondo isn't as good as Chris Paul, me saying Embiid and Jabari Parker are worth more than our 2016 Brooklyn pick, me saying it's in the best interest for the Celtics to tank in 2013-14, etc.  The word doesn't apply.  Half the time, people just genuinely don't understand my point of view until years later.   The other half of the time, a couple people can't tell when I'm very blatantly being tongue-in-cheek.   

What are we even talking about at this point? 

That Philly can't get a late 1st for Okafor?  THat's obviously false.

That Okafor has been terrible?  Statistically he's outperforming every single player drafted in 2016 this season - so there's that.

That Noel hates his situation and wants to be traded?   As of today he says he says he is "definitely satisfied" with his role and perhaps the happiest he's ever been in Philly:  http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/sixers/20170113_Noel__definitely_satisfied__with_role_on_Sixers.html

That some disgruntled bloggers who want the situation resolved yesterday are blindly speculating what their assets are worth?  Who cares.

That Steve Kyler thinks Noel and Simmons are the only two untradeable stars on Philly?   Take that up with Steve Kyler.  That's literally what he said.  Don't quote some rando's twitter as the word of god and then scoff when someone takes that same rando's twitter as the word of god.

That the Sixers missed their sell-high moment?   Truly debatable.   Noel's trade value presumably bottomed out a few weeks ago and has steadily increased.  If he proves capable of sharing the court with Embiid, proves that his newfound mid-range shot isn't a fluke, and if Philly keeps being relatively successful with him in the lineup - it's safe to say they will have a new "sell high" opportunity with the budding young center.    As for Okafor, he's down right now but he's still a 21 year old center who teams presumably think about as highly of as they did a year ago.  Whether or not they are willing to give up anything substantial and whether or not Philly is willing to take pennies on the dollar for a quality big man prospect with multiple years left on his rookie contract - that's up in the air right now. 

[celticsclay]

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's obviously not true.

How is it obviously not true. This is what people have been saying for a long time (including 76ers fans) and you refuse to accept it.

The 76ers fans commenting that don't genuinely believe it.  And neither do you.   It's like someone here frustrated that Jaylen Brown doesn't get minutes and saying "he's probably not even worth a 2nd rounder at this point".

Okafor was was selected 1st-Team All-Rookie and his Per minute numbers this season actually show improvement.  If he could be had for a late 1st rounder, a team like Boston would already have him.  He's on the second year of a rookie contract and it's highly, highly improbable that the guy selected with the late 1st will be anywhere near the quality of prospect as Okafor.

Ya'll are just being hyperbolic.

Does per minute mean much though...when you are playing less?

His per 100 possessions show a downward trend...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/okafoja01.html


I would give up a non-top10 projected pick...but that's because I'm intrigued...not because I'm convinced he'd live up to being a top 3 pick.

What's interesting is that his averages this season of 10.7 points, 4.8 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 blocks in 22.4mpg (11.29EFF) statistically put him slightly ahead of Malcolm Brogdon this season (11.00 EFF).  As we all know, 24 year old Malcolm Brogdon is the darling of the 2016 draft and would be frontrunner for Rookie of the Year if it weren't for 2014 draftees Embiid and Saric.   

So in other words, Jahlil Okafor is arguably outperforming every single 2016 draftee this season.  That lends credibility to the draftniks suggestion that Okafor was a better prospect than anyone available at #3 this year.  If these were Okafor's rookie numbers, he'd be just a hair above Malcolm Brogdon for Rookie of the Year frontrunner despite the fact 21 year old Okafor literally 3 years younger than Brogdon.   Go figure.

Now of course, the DNP's hurt Okafor's hypothetical bid for 2016-17 Rookie of the Year, but there's obviously some extraordinary circumstances at play there.  He's currently playing behind the transcendent Joel Embiid and Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.  Philly is obviously trying to experiment right now with different rotations.

why are you like this?

It's a response to the idea that Philly couldn't get a late 1st for Okafor.  That's clearly not true.  He's outperforming every 2016 draftee this season.

I was clearly referring to the bolded text.

Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.

why did you write that in your post?

Because some people here seem to think very highly of Kyler's opinion and that's his most recent comments on this evolving situation:  https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819528715772329984

Speaking of "sell high moments', I interpreted Kyler's comments as follows...

You know how people here are willing to trade Smart + Jaylen + Both Brooklyn 1sts for Cousins?  Well given DeMarcus' reputation as a loose cannon and his upcoming 200 million dollar contract, you have to figure Joel Embiid has more trade value.   I may be wrong, but I think Kyler might have been suggesting that Philly should use this sell high moment to move Embiid for a giant package and build around Simmons and Noel.   It actually might not be a bad idea if you think Embiid's either going to regress or re-injure himself.  The Sixers have a sell high moment here.  Nobody would expect it.   Two questions.  #1 - What's your best offer for Embiid.  #2 - Should Philly surprise everyone by taking it?

Lol more classic LarBrd33 logic - ignore half a dozen tweets to focus on one that fits his narrative.

Seriously, this trolling or just blatant bias/terrible logic, whatever it is, is starting to get a bit ridiculous. You seriously can't ignore some of his tweets and take others out of context to try and argue your point. That's just juvenile.

EDIT: For the third time in the last couple of days, I will post the proper context for people so that you don't deceive them with your flawed logic.

I hope Ainge is calling the Sixers for Noel.

For reals. He'd help us so, so much, and we certainly need it with how terrible we've been defensively and on the boards.

I think we can really challenge Toronto in the playoffs with a Noel upgrade.

I'm sure teams including Boston have asked about Noel, but until someone makes a worthwhile offer, there's no incentive for Philly to trade him.

Sure, if you ignore reality and pretty much only listen to fans on LibertyBallers.

It's widely reported that Noel does not want to stay there outside of the max, which they're certainly not going to give to a backup player behind Embiid, because he's not a backup big and doesn't want to be one. And even if they would be willing to do something that stupid, which they aren't, mind you, it's clear that that's not a move that good organizations make.

Traditionally, I can't say anything on this forum without someone labeling it trolling.  Whether it's me saying Paul pierce isn't as good as LeBron, me saying Rondo isn't as good as Chris Paul, me saying Embiid and Jabari Parker are worth more than our 2016 Brooklyn pick, me saying it's in the best interest for the Celtics to tank in 2013-14, etc.  The word doesn't apply.  Half the time, people just genuinely don't understand my point of view until years later.   The other half of the time, a couple people can't tell when I'm very blatantly being tongue-in-cheek.   

What are we even talking about at this point? 

That Philly can't get a late 1st for Okafor?  THat's obviously false.

That Okafor has been terrible?  Statistically he's outperforming every single player drafted in 2016 this season - so there's that.

That Noel hates his situation and wants to be traded?   As of today he says he says he is "definitely satisfied" with his role and perhaps the happiest he's ever been in Philly:  http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/sixers/20170113_Noel__definitely_satisfied__with_role_on_Sixers.html

That Steve Kyler thinks Noel and Simmons are the only two untradeable stars on Philly?   Take that up with Steve Kyler.  That's literally what he said.  Don't quote some rando's twitter as the word of god and then scoff when someone takes that same rando's twitter as the word of god.

That the Sixers missed their sell-high moment?   Truly debatable.   Noel's trade value presumably bottomed out a few weeks ago and has steadily increased.  If he proves capable of sharing the court with Embiid, proves that his newfound mid-range shot isn't a fluke, and if Philly keeps being relatively successful with him in the lineup - it's safe to say they will have a new "sell high" opportunity with the budding young center.    As for Okafor, he's down right now but he's still a 21 year old center who teams presumably think about as highly of as they did a year ago.  Whether or not they are willing to give up anything substantial and whether or not Philly is willing to take pennies on the dollar for a quality big man prospect with multiple years left on his rookie contract - that's up in the air right now.

This isn't obvious to me or a lot of a other people. A lot of people don't think he is good at basketball. He was ranked 9th by pelton and ford for future success in his rookie class last year. He presumably has fallen further since they did that ranking last spring. I don't get why it is so hard for you to believe there is a chance teams won't give up a top 20 picks in a loaded drafted for a guy that many call a disappointment and bust.

[LarBrd33]

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's obviously not true.

How is it obviously not true. This is what people have been saying for a long time (including 76ers fans) and you refuse to accept it.

The 76ers fans commenting that don't genuinely believe it.  And neither do you.   It's like someone here frustrated that Jaylen Brown doesn't get minutes and saying "he's probably not even worth a 2nd rounder at this point".

Okafor was was selected 1st-Team All-Rookie and his Per minute numbers this season actually show improvement.  If he could be had for a late 1st rounder, a team like Boston would already have him.  He's on the second year of a rookie contract and it's highly, highly improbable that the guy selected with the late 1st will be anywhere near the quality of prospect as Okafor.

Ya'll are just being hyperbolic.

Does per minute mean much though...when you are playing less?

His per 100 possessions show a downward trend...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/okafoja01.html


I would give up a non-top10 projected pick...but that's because I'm intrigued...not because I'm convinced he'd live up to being a top 3 pick.

What's interesting is that his averages this season of 10.7 points, 4.8 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 blocks in 22.4mpg (11.29EFF) statistically put him slightly ahead of Malcolm Brogdon this season (11.00 EFF).  As we all know, 24 year old Malcolm Brogdon is the darling of the 2016 draft and would be frontrunner for Rookie of the Year if it weren't for 2014 draftees Embiid and Saric.   

So in other words, Jahlil Okafor is arguably outperforming every single 2016 draftee this season.  That lends credibility to the draftniks suggestion that Okafor was a better prospect than anyone available at #3 this year.  If these were Okafor's rookie numbers, he'd be just a hair above Malcolm Brogdon for Rookie of the Year frontrunner despite the fact 21 year old Okafor literally 3 years younger than Brogdon.   Go figure.

Now of course, the DNP's hurt Okafor's hypothetical bid for 2016-17 Rookie of the Year, but there's obviously some extraordinary circumstances at play there.  He's currently playing behind the transcendent Joel Embiid and Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.  Philly is obviously trying to experiment right now with different rotations.

why are you like this?

It's a response to the idea that Philly couldn't get a late 1st for Okafor.  That's clearly not true.  He's outperforming every 2016 draftee this season.

I was clearly referring to the bolded text.

Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.

why did you write that in your post?

Because some people here seem to think very highly of Kyler's opinion and that's his most recent comments on this evolving situation:  https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819528715772329984

Speaking of "sell high moments', I interpreted Kyler's comments as follows...

You know how people here are willing to trade Smart + Jaylen + Both Brooklyn 1sts for Cousins?  Well given DeMarcus' reputation as a loose cannon and his upcoming 200 million dollar contract, you have to figure Joel Embiid has more trade value.   I may be wrong, but I think Kyler might have been suggesting that Philly should use this sell high moment to move Embiid for a giant package and build around Simmons and Noel.   It actually might not be a bad idea if you think Embiid's either going to regress or re-injure himself.  The Sixers have a sell high moment here.  Nobody would expect it.   Two questions.  #1 - What's your best offer for Embiid.  #2 - Should Philly surprise everyone by taking it?

Lol more classic LarBrd33 logic - ignore half a dozen tweets to focus on one that fits his narrative.

Seriously, this trolling or just blatant bias/terrible logic, whatever it is, is starting to get a bit ridiculous. You seriously can't ignore some of his tweets and take others out of context to try and argue your point. That's just juvenile.

EDIT: For the third time in the last couple of days, I will post the proper context for people so that you don't deceive them with your flawed logic.

I hope Ainge is calling the Sixers for Noel.

For reals. He'd help us so, so much, and we certainly need it with how terrible we've been defensively and on the boards.

I think we can really challenge Toronto in the playoffs with a Noel upgrade.

I'm sure teams including Boston have asked about Noel, but until someone makes a worthwhile offer, there's no incentive for Philly to trade him.

Sure, if you ignore reality and pretty much only listen to fans on LibertyBallers.

It's widely reported that Noel does not want to stay there outside of the max, which they're certainly not going to give to a backup player behind Embiid, because he's not a backup big and doesn't want to be one. And even if they would be willing to do something that stupid, which they aren't, mind you, it's clear that that's not a move that good organizations make.

Traditionally, I can't say anything on this forum without someone labeling it trolling.  Whether it's me saying Paul pierce isn't as good as LeBron, me saying Rondo isn't as good as Chris Paul, me saying Embiid and Jabari Parker are worth more than our 2016 Brooklyn pick, me saying it's in the best interest for the Celtics to tank in 2013-14, etc.  The word doesn't apply.  Half the time, people just genuinely don't understand my point of view until years later.   The other half of the time, a couple people can't tell when I'm very blatantly being tongue-in-cheek.   

What are we even talking about at this point? 

That Philly can't get a late 1st for Okafor?  THat's obviously false.

That Okafor has been terrible?  Statistically he's outperforming every single player drafted in 2016 this season - so there's that.

That Noel hates his situation and wants to be traded?   As of today he says he says he is "definitely satisfied" with his role and perhaps the happiest he's ever been in Philly:  http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/sixers/20170113_Noel__definitely_satisfied__with_role_on_Sixers.html

That Steve Kyler thinks Noel and Simmons are the only two untradeable stars on Philly?   Take that up with Steve Kyler.  That's literally what he said.  Don't quote some rando's twitter as the word of god and then scoff when someone takes that same rando's twitter as the word of god.

That the Sixers missed their sell-high moment?   Truly debatable.   Noel's trade value presumably bottomed out a few weeks ago and has steadily increased.  If he proves capable of sharing the court with Embiid, proves that his newfound mid-range shot isn't a fluke, and if Philly keeps being relatively successful with him in the lineup - it's safe to say they will have a new "sell high" opportunity with the budding young center.    As for Okafor, he's down right now but he's still a 21 year old center who teams presumably think about as highly of as they did a year ago.  Whether or not they are willing to give up anything substantial and whether or not Philly is willing to take pennies on the dollar for a quality big man prospect with multiple years left on his rookie contract - that's up in the air right now.

This isn't obvious to me or a lot of a other people

It really should be.  Unless you genuinely think the kid is a cancer who makes a basketball team worse and never has hope of improving, there's just no way that's true.  He's a 21 year old who was selected 1st Team All Rookie last year.  You're talking about him not being worth an RJ Hunter level draft pick.   That makes no sense. 

If Okafor could be had for a late 1st, Boston would have him already.  Widely reported by Bulpett that we offered the 2016 Brooklyn pick for him in February.  You don't go from offering an unprotected pick that could potentially end up #1 - to scoffing at the idea of adding a guy for a late 1st.  That's ridiculous.

[celticsclay]

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's obviously not true.

How is it obviously not true. This is what people have been saying for a long time (including 76ers fans) and you refuse to accept it.

The 76ers fans commenting that don't genuinely believe it.  And neither do you.   It's like someone here frustrated that Jaylen Brown doesn't get minutes and saying "he's probably not even worth a 2nd rounder at this point".

Okafor was was selected 1st-Team All-Rookie and his Per minute numbers this season actually show improvement.  If he could be had for a late 1st rounder, a team like Boston would already have him.  He's on the second year of a rookie contract and it's highly, highly improbable that the guy selected with the late 1st will be anywhere near the quality of prospect as Okafor.

Ya'll are just being hyperbolic.

Does per minute mean much though...when you are playing less?

His per 100 possessions show a downward trend...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/okafoja01.html


I would give up a non-top10 projected pick...but that's because I'm intrigued...not because I'm convinced he'd live up to being a top 3 pick.

What's interesting is that his averages this season of 10.7 points, 4.8 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 blocks in 22.4mpg (11.29EFF) statistically put him slightly ahead of Malcolm Brogdon this season (11.00 EFF).  As we all know, 24 year old Malcolm Brogdon is the darling of the 2016 draft and would be frontrunner for Rookie of the Year if it weren't for 2014 draftees Embiid and Saric.   

So in other words, Jahlil Okafor is arguably outperforming every single 2016 draftee this season.  That lends credibility to the draftniks suggestion that Okafor was a better prospect than anyone available at #3 this year.  If these were Okafor's rookie numbers, he'd be just a hair above Malcolm Brogdon for Rookie of the Year frontrunner despite the fact 21 year old Okafor literally 3 years younger than Brogdon.   Go figure.

Now of course, the DNP's hurt Okafor's hypothetical bid for 2016-17 Rookie of the Year, but there's obviously some extraordinary circumstances at play there.  He's currently playing behind the transcendent Joel Embiid and Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.  Philly is obviously trying to experiment right now with different rotations.

why are you like this?

It's a response to the idea that Philly couldn't get a late 1st for Okafor.  That's clearly not true.  He's outperforming every 2016 draftee this season.

I was clearly referring to the bolded text.

Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.

why did you write that in your post?

Because some people here seem to think very highly of Kyler's opinion and that's his most recent comments on this evolving situation:  https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819528715772329984

Speaking of "sell high moments', I interpreted Kyler's comments as follows...

You know how people here are willing to trade Smart + Jaylen + Both Brooklyn 1sts for Cousins?  Well given DeMarcus' reputation as a loose cannon and his upcoming 200 million dollar contract, you have to figure Joel Embiid has more trade value.   I may be wrong, but I think Kyler might have been suggesting that Philly should use this sell high moment to move Embiid for a giant package and build around Simmons and Noel.   It actually might not be a bad idea if you think Embiid's either going to regress or re-injure himself.  The Sixers have a sell high moment here.  Nobody would expect it.   Two questions.  #1 - What's your best offer for Embiid.  #2 - Should Philly surprise everyone by taking it?

Lol more classic LarBrd33 logic - ignore half a dozen tweets to focus on one that fits his narrative.

Seriously, this trolling or just blatant bias/terrible logic, whatever it is, is starting to get a bit ridiculous. You seriously can't ignore some of his tweets and take others out of context to try and argue your point. That's just juvenile.

EDIT: For the third time in the last couple of days, I will post the proper context for people so that you don't deceive them with your flawed logic.

I hope Ainge is calling the Sixers for Noel.

For reals. He'd help us so, so much, and we certainly need it with how terrible we've been defensively and on the boards.

I think we can really challenge Toronto in the playoffs with a Noel upgrade.

I'm sure teams including Boston have asked about Noel, but until someone makes a worthwhile offer, there's no incentive for Philly to trade him.

Sure, if you ignore reality and pretty much only listen to fans on LibertyBallers.

It's widely reported that Noel does not want to stay there outside of the max, which they're certainly not going to give to a backup player behind Embiid, because he's not a backup big and doesn't want to be one. And even if they would be willing to do something that stupid, which they aren't, mind you, it's clear that that's not a move that good organizations make.

Traditionally, I can't say anything on this forum without someone labeling it trolling.  Whether it's me saying Paul pierce isn't as good as LeBron, me saying Rondo isn't as good as Chris Paul, me saying Embiid and Jabari Parker are worth more than our 2016 Brooklyn pick, me saying it's in the best interest for the Celtics to tank in 2013-14, etc.  The word doesn't apply.  Half the time, people just genuinely don't understand my point of view until years later.   The other half of the time, a couple people can't tell when I'm very blatantly being tongue-in-cheek.   

What are we even talking about at this point? 

That Philly can't get a late 1st for Okafor?  THat's obviously false.

That Okafor has been terrible?  Statistically he's outperforming every single player drafted in 2016 this season - so there's that.

That Noel hates his situation and wants to be traded?   As of today he says he says he is "definitely satisfied" with his role and perhaps the happiest he's ever been in Philly:  http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/sixers/20170113_Noel__definitely_satisfied__with_role_on_Sixers.html

That Steve Kyler thinks Noel and Simmons are the only two untradeable stars on Philly?   Take that up with Steve Kyler.  That's literally what he said.  Don't quote some rando's twitter as the word of god and then scoff when someone takes that same rando's twitter as the word of god.

That the Sixers missed their sell-high moment?   Truly debatable.   Noel's trade value presumably bottomed out a few weeks ago and has steadily increased.  If he proves capable of sharing the court with Embiid, proves that his newfound mid-range shot isn't a fluke, and if Philly keeps being relatively successful with him in the lineup - it's safe to say they will have a new "sell high" opportunity with the budding young center.    As for Okafor, he's down right now but he's still a 21 year old center who teams presumably think about as highly of as they did a year ago.  Whether or not they are willing to give up anything substantial and whether or not Philly is willing to take pennies on the dollar for a quality big man prospect with multiple years left on his rookie contract - that's up in the air right now.

This isn't obvious to me or a lot of a other people

It really should be.  Unless you genuinely think the kid is a cancer who makes a basketball team worse and never has hope of improving, there's just no way that's true.  He's a 21 year old who was selected 1st Team All Rookie last year.  You're talking about him not being worth an RJ Hunter level draft pick.   That makes no sense. 

If Okafor could be had for a late 1st, Boston would have him already.

Would you give up a lottery or mid first for MCW?
Would you give one up for Trey Burke?
Jordan Clarkson?
Mirotic?

Heck Mason Plumlee WAS traded for a late first a year after being named to the all-rookie first team!

These are all guys that were named all-rookie first team in the last few drafts and I highly doubt anyone would give up more than a late round first for any of them. With the exception of Mirotic all of them are still young.

You are on the wrong side of this.

[Granath]

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's obviously not true.

How is it obviously not true. This is what people have been saying for a long time (including 76ers fans) and you refuse to accept it.

The 76ers fans commenting that don't genuinely believe it.  And neither do you.   It's like someone here frustrated that Jaylen Brown doesn't get minutes and saying "he's probably not even worth a 2nd rounder at this point".

Okafor was was selected 1st-Team All-Rookie and his Per minute numbers this season actually show improvement.  If he could be had for a late 1st rounder, a team like Boston would already have him.  He's on the second year of a rookie contract and it's highly, highly improbable that the guy selected with the late 1st will be anywhere near the quality of prospect as Okafor.

Ya'll are just being hyperbolic.

Does per minute mean much though...when you are playing less?

His per 100 possessions show a downward trend...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/okafoja01.html


I would give up a non-top10 projected pick...but that's because I'm intrigued...not because I'm convinced he'd live up to being a top 3 pick.

What's interesting is that his averages this season of 10.7 points, 4.8 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 blocks in 22.4mpg (11.29EFF) statistically put him slightly ahead of Malcolm Brogdon this season (11.00 EFF).  As we all know, 24 year old Malcolm Brogdon is the darling of the 2016 draft and would be frontrunner for Rookie of the Year if it weren't for 2014 draftees Embiid and Saric.   

So in other words, Jahlil Okafor is arguably outperforming every single 2016 draftee this season.  That lends credibility to the draftniks suggestion that Okafor was a better prospect than anyone available at #3 this year.  If these were Okafor's rookie numbers, he'd be just a hair above Malcolm Brogdon for Rookie of the Year frontrunner despite the fact 21 year old Okafor literally 3 years younger than Brogdon.   Go figure.

Now of course, the DNP's hurt Okafor's hypothetical bid for 2016-17 Rookie of the Year, but there's obviously some extraordinary circumstances at play there.  He's currently playing behind the transcendent Joel Embiid and Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.  Philly is obviously trying to experiment right now with different rotations.

why are you like this?

It's a response to the idea that Philly couldn't get a late 1st for Okafor.  That's clearly not true.  He's outperforming every 2016 draftee this season.

I was clearly referring to the bolded text.

Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.

why did you write that in your post?

Because some people here seem to think very highly of Kyler's opinion and that's his most recent comments on this evolving situation:  https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819528715772329984

Speaking of "sell high moments', I interpreted Kyler's comments as follows...

You know how people here are willing to trade Smart + Jaylen + Both Brooklyn 1sts for Cousins?  Well given DeMarcus' reputation as a loose cannon and his upcoming 200 million dollar contract, you have to figure Joel Embiid has more trade value.   I may be wrong, but I think Kyler might have been suggesting that Philly should use this sell high moment to move Embiid for a giant package and build around Simmons and Noel.   It actually might not be a bad idea if you think Embiid's either going to regress or re-injure himself.  The Sixers have a sell high moment here.  Nobody would expect it.   Two questions.  #1 - What's your best offer for Embiid.  #2 - Should Philly surprise everyone by taking it?

Lol more classic LarBrd33 logic - ignore half a dozen tweets to focus on one that fits his narrative.

Seriously, this trolling or just blatant bias/terrible logic, whatever it is, is starting to get a bit ridiculous. You seriously can't ignore some of his tweets and take others out of context to try and argue your point. That's just juvenile.

EDIT: For the third time in the last couple of days, I will post the proper context for people so that you don't deceive them with your flawed logic.

I hope Ainge is calling the Sixers for Noel.

For reals. He'd help us so, so much, and we certainly need it with how terrible we've been defensively and on the boards.

I think we can really challenge Toronto in the playoffs with a Noel upgrade.

I'm sure teams including Boston have asked about Noel, but until someone makes a worthwhile offer, there's no incentive for Philly to trade him.

Sure, if you ignore reality and pretty much only listen to fans on LibertyBallers.

It's widely reported that Noel does not want to stay there outside of the max, which they're certainly not going to give to a backup player behind Embiid, because he's not a backup big and doesn't want to be one. And even if they would be willing to do something that stupid, which they aren't, mind you, it's clear that that's not a move that good organizations make.

Traditionally, I can't say anything on this forum without someone labeling it trolling.  Whether it's me saying Paul pierce isn't as good as LeBron, me saying Rondo isn't as good as Chris Paul, me saying Embiid and Jabari Parker are worth more than our 2016 Brooklyn pick, me saying it's in the best interest for the Celtics to tank in 2013-14, etc.  The word doesn't apply.  Half the time, people just genuinely don't understand my point of view until years later.   The other half of the time, a couple people can't tell when I'm very blatantly being tongue-in-cheek.   

What are we even talking about at this point? 

That Philly can't get a late 1st for Okafor?  THat's obviously false.

That Okafor has been terrible?  Statistically he's outperforming every single player drafted in 2016 this season - so there's that.

That Noel hates his situation and wants to be traded?   As of today he says he says he is "definitely satisfied" with his role and perhaps the happiest he's ever been in Philly:  http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/sixers/20170113_Noel__definitely_satisfied__with_role_on_Sixers.html

That Steve Kyler thinks Noel and Simmons are the only two untradeable stars on Philly?   Take that up with Steve Kyler.  That's literally what he said.  Don't quote some rando's twitter as the word of god and then scoff when someone takes that same rando's twitter as the word of god.

That the Sixers missed their sell-high moment?   Truly debatable.   Noel's trade value presumably bottomed out a few weeks ago and has steadily increased.  If he proves capable of sharing the court with Embiid, proves that his newfound mid-range shot isn't a fluke, and if Philly keeps being relatively successful with him in the lineup - it's safe to say they will have a new "sell high" opportunity with the budding young center.    As for Okafor, he's down right now but he's still a 21 year old center who teams presumably think about as highly of as they did a year ago.  Whether or not they are willing to give up anything substantial and whether or not Philly is willing to take pennies on the dollar for a quality big man prospect with multiple years left on his rookie contract - that's up in the air right now.

This isn't obvious to me or a lot of a other people

It really should be.  Unless you genuinely think the kid is a cancer who makes a basketball team worse and never has hope of improving, there's just no way that's true.  He's a 21 year old who was selected 1st Team All Rookie last year.  You're talking about him not being worth an RJ Hunter level draft pick.   That makes no sense. 

If Okafor could be had for a late 1st, Boston would have him already.

Would you give up a lottery or mid first for MCW?
Would you give one up for Trey Burke?
Jordan Clarkson?
Mirotic?

Heck Mason Plumlee WAS traded for a late first a year after being named to the all-rookie first team!

These are all guys that were named all-rookie first team in the last few drafts and I highly doubt anyone would give up more than a late round first for any of them. With the exception of Mirotic all of them are still young.

You are on the wrong side of this.

[LarBrd33]

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's obviously not true.

How is it obviously not true. This is what people have been saying for a long time (including 76ers fans) and you refuse to accept it.

The 76ers fans commenting that don't genuinely believe it.  And neither do you.   It's like someone here frustrated that Jaylen Brown doesn't get minutes and saying "he's probably not even worth a 2nd rounder at this point".

Okafor was was selected 1st-Team All-Rookie and his Per minute numbers this season actually show improvement.  If he could be had for a late 1st rounder, a team like Boston would already have him.  He's on the second year of a rookie contract and it's highly, highly improbable that the guy selected with the late 1st will be anywhere near the quality of prospect as Okafor.

Ya'll are just being hyperbolic.

Does per minute mean much though...when you are playing less?

His per 100 possessions show a downward trend...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/okafoja01.html


I would give up a non-top10 projected pick...but that's because I'm intrigued...not because I'm convinced he'd live up to being a top 3 pick.

What's interesting is that his averages this season of 10.7 points, 4.8 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 blocks in 22.4mpg (11.29EFF) statistically put him slightly ahead of Malcolm Brogdon this season (11.00 EFF).  As we all know, 24 year old Malcolm Brogdon is the darling of the 2016 draft and would be frontrunner for Rookie of the Year if it weren't for 2014 draftees Embiid and Saric.   

So in other words, Jahlil Okafor is arguably outperforming every single 2016 draftee this season.  That lends credibility to the draftniks suggestion that Okafor was a better prospect than anyone available at #3 this year.  If these were Okafor's rookie numbers, he'd be just a hair above Malcolm Brogdon for Rookie of the Year frontrunner despite the fact 21 year old Okafor literally 3 years younger than Brogdon.   Go figure.

Now of course, the DNP's hurt Okafor's hypothetical bid for 2016-17 Rookie of the Year, but there's obviously some extraordinary circumstances at play there.  He's currently playing behind the transcendent Joel Embiid and Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.  Philly is obviously trying to experiment right now with different rotations.

why are you like this?

It's a response to the idea that Philly couldn't get a late 1st for Okafor.  That's clearly not true.  He's outperforming every 2016 draftee this season.

I was clearly referring to the bolded text.

Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.

why did you write that in your post?

Because some people here seem to think very highly of Kyler's opinion and that's his most recent comments on this evolving situation:  https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819528715772329984

Speaking of "sell high moments', I interpreted Kyler's comments as follows...

You know how people here are willing to trade Smart + Jaylen + Both Brooklyn 1sts for Cousins?  Well given DeMarcus' reputation as a loose cannon and his upcoming 200 million dollar contract, you have to figure Joel Embiid has more trade value.   I may be wrong, but I think Kyler might have been suggesting that Philly should use this sell high moment to move Embiid for a giant package and build around Simmons and Noel.   It actually might not be a bad idea if you think Embiid's either going to regress or re-injure himself.  The Sixers have a sell high moment here.  Nobody would expect it.   Two questions.  #1 - What's your best offer for Embiid.  #2 - Should Philly surprise everyone by taking it?

Lol more classic LarBrd33 logic - ignore half a dozen tweets to focus on one that fits his narrative.

Seriously, this trolling or just blatant bias/terrible logic, whatever it is, is starting to get a bit ridiculous. You seriously can't ignore some of his tweets and take others out of context to try and argue your point. That's just juvenile.

EDIT: For the third time in the last couple of days, I will post the proper context for people so that you don't deceive them with your flawed logic.

I hope Ainge is calling the Sixers for Noel.

For reals. He'd help us so, so much, and we certainly need it with how terrible we've been defensively and on the boards.

I think we can really challenge Toronto in the playoffs with a Noel upgrade.

I'm sure teams including Boston have asked about Noel, but until someone makes a worthwhile offer, there's no incentive for Philly to trade him.

Sure, if you ignore reality and pretty much only listen to fans on LibertyBallers.

It's widely reported that Noel does not want to stay there outside of the max, which they're certainly not going to give to a backup player behind Embiid, because he's not a backup big and doesn't want to be one. And even if they would be willing to do something that stupid, which they aren't, mind you, it's clear that that's not a move that good organizations make.

Traditionally, I can't say anything on this forum without someone labeling it trolling.  Whether it's me saying Paul pierce isn't as good as LeBron, me saying Rondo isn't as good as Chris Paul, me saying Embiid and Jabari Parker are worth more than our 2016 Brooklyn pick, me saying it's in the best interest for the Celtics to tank in 2013-14, etc.  The word doesn't apply.  Half the time, people just genuinely don't understand my point of view until years later.   The other half of the time, a couple people can't tell when I'm very blatantly being tongue-in-cheek.   

What are we even talking about at this point? 

That Philly can't get a late 1st for Okafor?  THat's obviously false.

That Okafor has been terrible?  Statistically he's outperforming every single player drafted in 2016 this season - so there's that.

That Noel hates his situation and wants to be traded?   As of today he says he says he is "definitely satisfied" with his role and perhaps the happiest he's ever been in Philly:  http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/sixers/20170113_Noel__definitely_satisfied__with_role_on_Sixers.html

That Steve Kyler thinks Noel and Simmons are the only two untradeable stars on Philly?   Take that up with Steve Kyler.  That's literally what he said.  Don't quote some rando's twitter as the word of god and then scoff when someone takes that same rando's twitter as the word of god.

That the Sixers missed their sell-high moment?   Truly debatable.   Noel's trade value presumably bottomed out a few weeks ago and has steadily increased.  If he proves capable of sharing the court with Embiid, proves that his newfound mid-range shot isn't a fluke, and if Philly keeps being relatively successful with him in the lineup - it's safe to say they will have a new "sell high" opportunity with the budding young center.    As for Okafor, he's down right now but he's still a 21 year old center who teams presumably think about as highly of as they did a year ago.  Whether or not they are willing to give up anything substantial and whether or not Philly is willing to take pennies on the dollar for a quality big man prospect with multiple years left on his rookie contract - that's up in the air right now.

This isn't obvious to me or a lot of a other people

It really should be.  Unless you genuinely think the kid is a cancer who makes a basketball team worse and never has hope of improving, there's just no way that's true.  He's a 21 year old who was selected 1st Team All Rookie last year.  You're talking about him not being worth an RJ Hunter level draft pick.   That makes no sense. 

If Okafor could be had for a late 1st, Boston would have him already.

Would you give up a lottery or mid first for MCW?
Would you give one up for Trey Burke?
Jordan Clarkson?
Mirotic?

Heck Mason Plumlee WAS traded for a late first a year after being named to the all-rookie first team!

These are all guys that were named all-rookie first team in the last few drafts and I highly doubt anyone would give up more than a late round first for any of them. With the exception of Mirotic all of them are still young.

You are on the wrong side of this.

I think it's fairly obvious Philly could get a late 1st for Okafor at any time.  There's no point in doing that.  Far better keeping him.

[Eddie20]

How has this guy not been permanently banned? He does nothing but talk about another franchise with the sole intention of irritating people that actually care and root for the Celtics.

[celticsclay]

The rise and fall of Okafor:

http://phillysportsnetwork.com/2017/01/13/okafor/

Apparently, they can't even get a late first round pick for him now.

That's obviously not true.

How is it obviously not true. This is what people have been saying for a long time (including 76ers fans) and you refuse to accept it.

The 76ers fans commenting that don't genuinely believe it.  And neither do you.   It's like someone here frustrated that Jaylen Brown doesn't get minutes and saying "he's probably not even worth a 2nd rounder at this point".

Okafor was was selected 1st-Team All-Rookie and his Per minute numbers this season actually show improvement.  If he could be had for a late 1st rounder, a team like Boston would already have him.  He's on the second year of a rookie contract and it's highly, highly improbable that the guy selected with the late 1st will be anywhere near the quality of prospect as Okafor.

Ya'll are just being hyperbolic.

Does per minute mean much though...when you are playing less?

His per 100 possessions show a downward trend...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/okafoja01.html


I would give up a non-top10 projected pick...but that's because I'm intrigued...not because I'm convinced he'd live up to being a top 3 pick.

What's interesting is that his averages this season of 10.7 points, 4.8 rebounds, 1.1 assists, 1.1 blocks in 22.4mpg (11.29EFF) statistically put him slightly ahead of Malcolm Brogdon this season (11.00 EFF).  As we all know, 24 year old Malcolm Brogdon is the darling of the 2016 draft and would be frontrunner for Rookie of the Year if it weren't for 2014 draftees Embiid and Saric.   

So in other words, Jahlil Okafor is arguably outperforming every single 2016 draftee this season.  That lends credibility to the draftniks suggestion that Okafor was a better prospect than anyone available at #3 this year.  If these were Okafor's rookie numbers, he'd be just a hair above Malcolm Brogdon for Rookie of the Year frontrunner despite the fact 21 year old Okafor literally 3 years younger than Brogdon.   Go figure.

Now of course, the DNP's hurt Okafor's hypothetical bid for 2016-17 Rookie of the Year, but there's obviously some extraordinary circumstances at play there.  He's currently playing behind the transcendent Joel Embiid and Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.  Philly is obviously trying to experiment right now with different rotations.

why are you like this?

It's a response to the idea that Philly couldn't get a late 1st for Okafor.  That's clearly not true.  He's outperforming every 2016 draftee this season.

I was clearly referring to the bolded text.

Nerlens Noel - a center that Steve Kyler calls one of the two "stars" on the team.

why did you write that in your post?

Because some people here seem to think very highly of Kyler's opinion and that's his most recent comments on this evolving situation:  https://twitter.com/stevekylerNBA/status/819528715772329984

Speaking of "sell high moments', I interpreted Kyler's comments as follows...

You know how people here are willing to trade Smart + Jaylen + Both Brooklyn 1sts for Cousins?  Well given DeMarcus' reputation as a loose cannon and his upcoming 200 million dollar contract, you have to figure Joel Embiid has more trade value.   I may be wrong, but I think Kyler might have been suggesting that Philly should use this sell high moment to move Embiid for a giant package and build around Simmons and Noel.   It actually might not be a bad idea if you think Embiid's either going to regress or re-injure himself.  The Sixers have a sell high moment here.  Nobody would expect it.   Two questions.  #1 - What's your best offer for Embiid.  #2 - Should Philly surprise everyone by taking it?

Lol more classic LarBrd33 logic - ignore half a dozen tweets to focus on one that fits his narrative.

Seriously, this trolling or just blatant bias/terrible logic, whatever it is, is starting to get a bit ridiculous. You seriously can't ignore some of his tweets and take others out of context to try and argue your point. That's just juvenile.

EDIT: For the third time in the last couple of days, I will post the proper context for people so that you don't deceive them with your flawed logic.

I hope Ainge is calling the Sixers for Noel.

For reals. He'd help us so, so much, and we certainly need it with how terrible we've been defensively and on the boards.

I think we can really challenge Toronto in the playoffs with a Noel upgrade.

I'm sure teams including Boston have asked about Noel, but until someone makes a worthwhile offer, there's no incentive for Philly to trade him.

Sure, if you ignore reality and pretty much only listen to fans on LibertyBallers.

It's widely reported that Noel does not want to stay there outside of the max, which they're certainly not going to give to a backup player behind Embiid, because he's not a backup big and doesn't want to be one. And even if they would be willing to do something that stupid, which they aren't, mind you, it's clear that that's not a move that good organizations make.

Traditionally, I can't say anything on this forum without someone labeling it trolling.  Whether it's me saying Paul pierce isn't as good as LeBron, me saying Rondo isn't as good as Chris Paul, me saying Embiid and Jabari Parker are worth more than our 2016 Brooklyn pick, me saying it's in the best interest for the Celtics to tank in 2013-14, etc.  The word doesn't apply.  Half the time, people just genuinely don't understand my point of view until years later.   The other half of the time, a couple people can't tell when I'm very blatantly being tongue-in-cheek.   

What are we even talking about at this point? 

That Philly can't get a late 1st for Okafor?  THat's obviously false.

That Okafor has been terrible?  Statistically he's outperforming every single player drafted in 2016 this season - so there's that.

That Noel hates his situation and wants to be traded?   As of today he says he says he is "definitely satisfied" with his role and perhaps the happiest he's ever been in Philly:  http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/sixers/20170113_Noel__definitely_satisfied__with_role_on_Sixers.html

That Steve Kyler thinks Noel and Simmons are the only two untradeable stars on Philly?   Take that up with Steve Kyler.  That's literally what he said.  Don't quote some rando's twitter as the word of god and then scoff when someone takes that same rando's twitter as the word of god.

That the Sixers missed their sell-high moment?   Truly debatable.   Noel's trade value presumably bottomed out a few weeks ago and has steadily increased.  If he proves capable of sharing the court with Embiid, proves that his newfound mid-range shot isn't a fluke, and if Philly keeps being relatively successful with him in the lineup - it's safe to say they will have a new "sell high" opportunity with the budding young center.    As for Okafor, he's down right now but he's still a 21 year old center who teams presumably think about as highly of as they did a year ago.  Whether or not they are willing to give up anything substantial and whether or not Philly is willing to take pennies on the dollar for a quality big man prospect with multiple years left on his rookie contract - that's up in the air right now.

This isn't obvious to me or a lot of a other people

It really should be.  Unless you genuinely think the kid is a cancer who makes a basketball team worse and never has hope of improving, there's just no way that's true.  He's a 21 year old who was selected 1st Team All Rookie last year.  You're talking about him not being worth an RJ Hunter level draft pick.   That makes no sense. 

If Okafor could be had for a late 1st, Boston would have him already.

Would you give up a lottery or mid first for MCW?
Would you give one up for Trey Burke?
Jordan Clarkson?
Mirotic?

Heck Mason Plumlee WAS traded for a late first a year after being named to the all-rookie first team!

These are all guys that were named all-rookie first team in the last few drafts and I highly doubt anyone would give up more than a late round first for any of them. With the exception of Mirotic all of them are still young.

You are on the wrong side of this.

I'm not sure how you are saying I am moving the goal posts (of if you are saying lb will) he said okafor couldn't get traded for a late and implied it was partly because he was all rookie first team. I pointed out there are many players that have had that value very recently after making all rookie first team and plumlee, a fellow big was actually just traded for exactly that shortly after winning the award. Found it fascinating lb just ignored it