Author Topic: C's interested in Enes Kanter  (Read 20359 times)

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Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #30 on: June 30, 2015, 07:40:28 PM »

Offline tankcity!

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Did anyone see what he did on the Thunder??? Dude can score.

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #31 on: June 30, 2015, 07:42:00 PM »

Offline dreamgreen

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I'll take him.

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #32 on: June 30, 2015, 09:57:17 PM »

Offline anewframe

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Surely these rumors cannot be true. He is the opposite of a Brad Stevens guy.

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #33 on: June 30, 2015, 09:59:35 PM »

Offline Lucky17

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Surely these rumors cannot be true. He is the opposite of a Brad Stevens guy.

How so?

Regardless, if Stevens is the coach we think he is, he should be able to get something (the most?) out of any player.
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Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #34 on: June 30, 2015, 10:00:29 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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I certainly hope not...

He's quite possibly THE worst defensive big in the entire NBA.

I mean sure the guy is a capable scorer, but not capable enough to offset THAT much of a defensive liability.

Honest I would rather offer $10M to Sully than Kanter, and that (given my not too favorable feelings towards Sully) is saying something.

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #35 on: June 30, 2015, 10:11:24 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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There's just very little evidence Kanter can play adequate defense, even as a center.

Seems like posters on Celtics Blog says this about literally every player in the NBA (Kevin Love, Carmelo Anthony.)

Love to know who's defensive skills are up to Celtics Blog's expectations?

Tyson Chandler, DeAndre Jordan, Bismack Biyombo, Nerlens Noel - i could keep going, but these are all guys I think would help this team defensively (Bimombo less so since he can't start, but would still help instretches).

I would include guys like Greg Monroe and LaMarcus Aldridge - not good defenders (i.e. guys who will give you an advantage) they they are at least passable defenders (i.e. good enough to not be a liability).

Carmelo IS a defensive liability
Kevin Love IS a defensive liability
Enes Kanter IS a defensive liability

I'm fine with spending max or near max on a big man who is a very good offensive player, a very good rebounder and an adequate defender. 

I'm fine with spending max or near max on a big man who is a very good defensive player, a very good rebounder, and an adequate defender

I'm fine spending max or near max money on a big man who is a very good offensive player, a very good defensive player, and an adequate rebounder

I'm not fine with spending max or near max money on a big man who is a very good offensive player, a very good rebounder, and a terrible defensive player.


Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #36 on: June 30, 2015, 10:13:11 PM »

Offline gpap

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Surely these rumors cannot be true. He is the opposite of a Brad Stevens guy.

What the hell is a definition of a Brad Stevens?

Is this now the criteria of how good a player is?

Whether or not he'll be a Brad Stevens guy?

Oy vey!!!

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #37 on: June 30, 2015, 10:14:32 PM »

Offline gpap

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I certainly hope not...

He's quite possibly THE worst defensive big in the entire NBA.

I mean sure the guy is a capable scorer, but not capable enough to offset THAT much of a defensive liability.

Honest I would rather offer $10M to Sully than Kanter, and that (given my not too favorable feelings towards Sully) is saying something.

Just your opinion. Nothing more.

He'd be a huge upgrade over Tyler Zeller.

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #38 on: June 30, 2015, 10:15:23 PM »

Offline gpap

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There's just very little evidence Kanter can play adequate defense, even as a center.

Seems like posters on Celtics Blog says this about literally every player in the NBA (Kevin Love, Carmelo Anthony.)

Love to know who's defensive skills are up to Celtics Blog's expectations?

Tyson Chandler, DeAndre Jordan, Bismack Biyombo, Nerlens Noel - i could keep going, but these are all guys I think would help this team defensively (Bimombo less so since he can't start, but would still help instretches).

I would include guys like Greg Monroe and LaMarcus Aldridge - not good defenders (i.e. guys who will give you an advantage) they they are at least passable defenders (i.e. good enough to not be a liability).

Carmelo IS a defensive liability
Kevin Love IS a defensive liability
Enes Kanter IS a defensive liability

I'm fine with spending max or near max on a big man who is a very good offensive player, a very good rebounder and an adequate defender. 

I'm fine with spending max or near max on a big man who is a very good defensive player, a very good rebounder, and an adequate defender

I'm fine spending max or near max money on a big man who is a very good offensive player, a very good defensive player, and an adequate rebounder

I'm not fine with spending max or near max money on a big man who is a very good offensive player, a very good rebounder, and a terrible defensive player.

Back to Biyombo again ???

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #39 on: June 30, 2015, 10:16:09 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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Kanter is far better than Amare or Bargani.o with Boston.

I think that the reference was meant to compare Kanter to Amare and Bargnani when they were in their primes (not now). 

If you are going to try to argue that Kanter is better player now than Amare was in his prime (where he averaged at least 20 PPG, 8 RPG and 50% FG for 5 years straight) then wow...just wow.

I mean Amare has had at least 3 seasons where he's averaged at least 25/8 - Kanter would dream of ever being that dominant.

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #40 on: June 30, 2015, 10:17:29 PM »

Offline 86MaxwellSmart

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Did anyone see what he did on the Thunder??? Dude can score.

Yes---Kanter gets things done in the paint....we do need a guy like this....he's like a good version of Carlos Boozer.
Larry Bird was Greater than you think.

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #41 on: June 30, 2015, 10:21:17 PM »

Offline sadleprechaun

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I certainly hope not...

He's quite possibly THE worst defensive big in the entire NBA.


"Possibly" is generous.

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #42 on: June 30, 2015, 10:23:03 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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Just your opinion. Nothing more.

He'd be a huge upgrade over Tyler Zeller.

Not just my opinion - it's the opinion of probably about 90% of all writers who have ever written an article about Kanter, plus the vast majority of the public/fans...and there are statistics to back it up.

It doesn't matter how you judge defense - statistics or subjective 'eye test' - Kanter is a horrible defensive player by any and every measure.

As for him being a huge upgrade over Zeller...maybe on offense, but defense he's be a huge downgrade on Zeller (who is already a significant defensive liability as it is).

Finally, when is it that we all decided that being an 'upgrade' over an existing starter immediately justifies paying a person $40,000,000 - $60,000,000?

A max contract is anywhere from 25% - 35% of the cap, meaning a max contract player takes up roughly 1/3 of your entire payroll.  This means that as a general rule, you can only ever afford to have up to three max contract players on a roster...and even then you are left with next to nothing left over to add players around those guys.

If you are willing to give a guy a max contract, then he needs to be more than just an 'upgrade' - he needs to be somebody who is good enough to be a top 3 player on a championship contender...any less and it's not worth it.  Look at the Heat and Cavs - those guys took the "three star" approach and had Kevin Love and Chris Bosh as their third best players.  To be a max guy you don't necessarily need to be Love/Bosh good, but you need to be around there somewhere at least.

This season there is a LITTLE bit more room to move because of the increasing cap (which means a max contract won't be 30% of the cap after a couple of years) but even if/when the cap reaches the proposed $109m, a $13M - $15m contract is still significant. 

It will be the equivalent of $8m - $9m now - and you wouldn't just go and throw away $8m - $9m like it's insignificant at today's cap. 

I understand the attraction Kanter offers, but he's a guy you need to be careful with.  He's a guy who needs a very special set of players around him in order to really excel.  He MUST be paired with a good (and agile) defensive PF or you will fail in an epic way.  There is no team in the league who fits this better than OKC, with Ibaka.  It's a match made in heaven. 

So unless you have money to throw away, and you are confident you can get an excellent defensive PF to put next to him, it's just not worth investing that type of money. 

Back to Biyombo again ???

I'm sorry, is this where you try to give me an explanation as to why Biyombo is NOT a good defensive player? 

Because that's what the original question (that I replied to) asked.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2015, 10:40:25 PM by crimson_stallion »

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #43 on: June 30, 2015, 10:45:36 PM »

Offline greece66

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No Kanter

And for g_d's sake, no Asik either please.

Re: C's interested in Enes Kanter
« Reply #44 on: June 30, 2015, 11:26:29 PM »

Offline Smitty77

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Kanter is literally the WORST RATED DEFENSIVE center in the entire NBA per ESPN's Real Plus Minus!!!!!

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/page/2/sort/DRPM/position/9

Smitty77