CelticsStrong
Around the League => Transaction Ideas and Rumors => Topic started by: KG Living Legend on June 13, 2018, 03:06:47 AM
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The Clippers have the 12th and 13th pick in this draft. They traded Chris Paul they have a big hole at point guard. Terry Rozier is an emerging starting point guard in the NBA they can pick who they want 12 and then getting NBA ready point card 13th not a bad trade for both teams hopefully the Celtics got a slider like Porter Jr.
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Wish I knew what was happening with Smart before the draft. If I lose Smart I want to keep Rozier. Since we can't know that I lean to keeping Rozier unless we move up to 8 or better. Just not a lot of faith in guys after pick 8.
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I feel like a move like this would be contingent on other moves. I’m a vacuum I’d be very tempted to make this move, as it would help us lock up a cost-controlled player (unlike Rozier poses to be) or could help us move up
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I'd push for the 12th pick and a young guy they have on the bench.
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I voted no. Kyrie is always hurt and we need a good backup. Rozier is going to be better than anyone we pick at 13.
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I feel like a move like this would be contingent on other moves. I’m a vacuum I’d be very tempted to make this move, as it would help us lock up a cost-controlled player (unlike Rozier poses to be) or could help us move up
It would definitely need to be contingent on another deal. I do think it should be 12 instead of 13, but in either case, if we could package this Clippers pick with #27 to get up to #9 if Wendell Carter felll down, I would be on board. Otherwise I would prefer to keep Rozier, as he will be far more useful than anyone we could pick at #12 or #13 next season, and in genera we have enough picks.
Having said that, I could probably be talked into #12 without a second deal lined up if we also got the protection on the Clippers pick we have in 2019 or 2020 knocked down from top 14 to top 10.
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With Kyrie knee, Marcus FA status, we can’t give up Rozier unless it returns a great prospect. Don’t feel Carter qualifies.
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I didn't vote as it would depend on who is available at that spot and DA probably would say the same thing. So the question would be, would I trade TRoz for Robert Williams? I'd say no. There could be a couple of good wings available but we are good there. If we replaced him with another guard I'd say what's the point? Money and contract status? The pick would be paid more than what TRoz makes right now. I love SGA from Kentucky but he was still a freshman and wouldn't sniff too much playing time. That said, I'm going to vote no after I post this.
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With Kyrie knee, Marcus FA status, we can’t give up Rozier unless it returns a great prospect. Don’t feel Carter qualifies.
I think Carter is a very good prospect. Don’t think he’s a surefire All-Star, but I also wouldn’t be surprised if when we look back on this draft he had the best career out of all the bigs taken in the top 10. I also think he’s better than any center in the draft next year, which looks terribly weak on centers.
If we want a long-term prospect to offer Al insurance, Carter would be a good bet. (Not outright replacing Al, but being able to step in after a season and competently fill in for Al as Terry did for Kyrie this year).
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With Kyrie knee, Marcus FA status, we can’t give up Rozier unless it returns a great prospect. Don’t feel Carter qualifies.
I think Carter is a very good prospect. Don’t think he’s a surefire All-Star, but I also wouldn’t be surprised if when we look back on this draft he had the best career out of all the bigs taken in the top 10. I also think he’s better than any center in the draft next year, which looks terribly weak on centers.
If we want a long-term prospect to offer Al insurance, Carter would be a good bet. (Not outright replacing Al, but being able to step in after a season and competently fill in for Al as Terry did for Kyrie this year).
If Carter was available at 13, which he won't be, I would do that trade in a second, even with concerns footey brought up. We could then use the 27th pick or trade up for a PG/Combo Guard in this draft. There are lots of experienced back-court players who'd be available (DiVincenzo, Shamet, Holiday, Brunson, Milton, J. Carter.... the list goes on). In this scenario, we are replacing a backup not a starter. There's always the vet minimum route, someone like Napier, Seth Curry and the unlikely but still a possibility, Rondo).
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With Kyrie knee, Marcus FA status, we can’t give up Rozier unless it returns a great prospect. Don’t feel Carter qualifies.
I think Carter is a very good prospect. Don’t think he’s a surefire All-Star, but I also wouldn’t be surprised if when we look back on this draft he had the best career out of all the bigs taken in the top 10. I also think he’s better than any center in the draft next year, which looks terribly weak on centers.
If we want a long-term prospect to offer Al insurance, Carter would be a good bet. (Not outright replacing Al, but being able to step in after a season and competently fill in for Al as Terry did for Kyrie this year).
If Carter actually falls to a spot where we could get him with Terry plus a non-Sacto pick I would think hard about it. He seems to have good BBIQ and a well-rounded skill set. His fit with our young core has the potential to be really, really good. He doesn't have Ayton's ceiling, but who does, and his floor looks pretty high.
If the team likes him enough there are complementary moves we could make as Kyrie insurance - maybe the MLE goes to a combo guard. We would also have to find minutes for Carter. It's possible that he could take 10-15 minutes a game even in his first year - he's got an NBA body and his BBIQ seems high - but I don't think you could start the season trusting him to play in Baynes' slot. Maybe if you get Carter you hang on to Baynes and have to send out Theis - who I like, and see as a really nice player! - but it seems like a waste to bury him on the bench. Theis could bring back a future pick or picks, which will come in handy, or maybe a backup PG if we need the MLE for a Baynes replacement (Dedmon?). Ideally, Carter starts by taking Theis' minutes, a few minutes each from Baynes and Mook, and by the end of the year he's ready for more.
I have wondered about his ability to defend on the perimeter. Some observers were down on him for that reason, but I've seen more convincing arguments that he's fine as long as he drops down into a stance (his technique was inconsistent - we can fix that) and his defensive abilities were hidden because Duke played a lot of zone to cover Bagley's limitations.
Such a tough decision. It's still tempting to hang on to all the picks and wait for next year. Rolling with Terry and adding Hayward and Irving is a pretty good default. I guess we'll find out how the Cs evaluate these guys and whether they have a different evaluation from the other teams picking 5-10.
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With Kyrie knee, Marcus FA status, we can’t give up Rozier unless it returns a great prospect. Don’t feel Carter qualifies.
I think Carter is a very good prospect. Don’t think he’s a surefire All-Star, but I also wouldn’t be surprised if when we look back on this draft he had the best career out of all the bigs taken in the top 10. I also think he’s better than any center in the draft next year, which looks terribly weak on centers.
If we want a long-term prospect to offer Al insurance, Carter would be a good bet. (Not outright replacing Al, but being able to step in after a season and competently fill in for Al as Terry did for Kyrie this year).
If Carter was available at 13, which he won't be, I would do that trade in a second, even with concerns footey brought up. We could then use the 27th pick or trade up for a PG/Combo Guard in this draft. There are lots of experienced back-court players who'd be available (DiVincenzo, Shamet, Holiday, Brunson, Milton, J. Carter.... the list goes on). In this scenario, we are replacing a backup not a starter. There's always the vet minimum route, someone like Napier, Seth Curry and the unlikely but still a possibility, Rondo).
Yeah - if it's Terry straight up for Carter that is hard to pass on. I can't see him sliding to the Clippers unless there was a red flag in his team interviews/workouts.
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I don't think LA would (given they have Beverly and Teodosic), but the C's should.
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I don't think LA would (given they have Beverly and Teodosic), but the C's should.
Patrick Beverley turns 30 in one month, missed the entire season, is an unrestricted free agent, and isn’t as good as Terry Rozier.
Milos Teodosic turns 32 next season, missed half of last season, and is also in a walk year. He’s also probably not as good as Terry, and if he is currently, their trend lines are crossing very quickly.
There are valid reasons for the Clippers to keep their picks over trading for Rozier, but the existence of Beverley and Teodosic are not those reasons.
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as tempting as it is to move Rozier for a shiny new prospect in the draft, unless we're getting mid-lottery, I'm hesitant to move him before we know the deal with Smart. I don't want Larkin to be the primary backup PG (and he's not even signed)
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One thing that thinking about trading Rozier has done is modify my stance about Smart. To be clear, it would be a major blow if we lost him. That said, there are some interesting PG free agents who should be available for the big mid-level, especially on a short deal. If Smart walks, we will have access to this, since we’d no longer worry about the tax or hard cap.
So if Rozier were traded and Smart walked, we wouldn’t necessarily be stuck with Larkin-type gambles for our primary backup. A couple of these options might even fight over Boston. If Ainge can use Rozier as a primary component of a trade that gets us into the top 10, he should do it.
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No.
Not really sold that the "shiny new toy" they get at #13 in this draft would end up being better than Rozier or what Rozier will add to this team next season.
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Considering Rozier is a former #16 pick and after the kind of playoffs he had... I'd be upset if we simply dealt him for #13.
If we trade Rozier in a package to move up, I'd prefer it's in the 1-10 range to be honest.
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Considering Rozier is a former #16 pick and after the kind of playoffs he had... I'd be upset if we simply dealt him for #13.
If we trade Rozier in a package to move up, I'd prefer it's in the 1-10 range to be honest.
That just seems to be the market these days. Like with Teague, who had put together a much longer and consistent (and better) body of work than Rozier. He didn't get Atlanta a very strong pick
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I’m pro-trade Rozier for any lotto pick but one big consequence of Trading Rozier before free agency starts is that it gives Marcus Smarts agent more leverage in negotiations which might drive up his price tremendously.
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With Kyrie knee, Marcus FA status, we can’t give up Rozier unless it returns a great prospect. Don’t feel Carter qualifies.
I think Carter is a very good prospect. Don’t think he’s a surefire All-Star, but I also wouldn’t be surprised if when we look back on this draft he had the best career out of all the bigs taken in the top 10. I also think he’s better than any center in the draft next year, which looks terribly weak on centers.
If we want a long-term prospect to offer Al insurance, Carter would be a good bet. (Not outright replacing Al, but being able to step in after a season and competently fill in for Al as Terry did for Kyrie this year).
Exactly. This is what I’ve been saying. He can defend and block shots, pass and make plays, rebound, and score inside and from 3 with solid shooting. I like to compliment and eventually replace Al.
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That's good value IMO, but I'm torn. We're contenders next year. I'm very iffy on a move that makes us worse in a season in which we can potentially win it all. Any draft pick is very, very unlikely to be as good as Rozier next season.
I'd lean towards no - keep Rozier and go for it. If the right player dropped in the draft then I'd reconsider, but as of right now, no.
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I would do it
Then pick Divicenzo. If Smart doesn't resign/Celtics won't match....then sign Larkin for cheap and give him more mins.
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Considering Rozier is a former #16 pick and after the kind of playoffs he had... I'd be upset if we simply dealt him for #13.
If we trade Rozier in a package to move up, I'd prefer it's in the 1-10 range to be honest.
That just seems to be the market these days. Like with Teague, who had put together a much longer and consistent (and better) body of work than Rozier. He didn't get Atlanta a very strong pick
He got Atlanta the #12 pick heading into unrestricted free agency. Teague is actually a pretty solid comp for Rozier after three years — if you were getting Jeff Teague for years 4-8 of his career, what would pay?
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Considering Rozier is a former #16 pick and after the kind of playoffs he had... I'd be upset if we simply dealt him for #13.
If we trade Rozier in a package to move up, I'd prefer it's in the 1-10 range to be honest.
That just seems to be the market these days. Like with Teague, who had put together a much longer and consistent (and better) body of work than Rozier. He didn't get Atlanta a very strong pick
He got Atlanta the #12 pick heading into unrestricted free agency. Teague is actually a pretty solid comp for Rozier after three years — if you were getting Jeff Teague for years 4-8 of his career, what would pay?
Ah yeah, forgot he was an UFA. Considering Rozier has a year left and is an RFA after that, I would value him higher than #13 alone. Problem is teams always seem to get enamoured with picks around May & June. I also don’t know what other asset/s I would want in addition to the pick. LAC aren’t exactly brimming with promising players or contributing cheap vets.
Hopefully Rozier doesn’t demand Teague level money
I would do it
Then pick Divicenzo. If Smart doesn't resign/Celtics won't match....then sign Larkin for cheap and give him more mins.
DiVincenzo at 13?? Cmon man, there will be way better prospects available there. Sexton, Williams, Shai GA, Miles Bridges and Troy Brown may all likely be available at that spot, and they’re much better picks than DiV
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Of course I would trade Rozier for the #13 pick. But nobody is going to offer that, so it's a moot point. Terry ain't got that kind of trade value.
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Considering Rozier is a former #16 pick and after the kind of playoffs he had... I'd be upset if we simply dealt him for #13.
If we trade Rozier in a package to move up, I'd prefer it's in the 1-10 range to be honest.
That just seems to be the market these days. Like with Teague, who had put together a much longer and consistent (and better) body of work than Rozier. He didn't get Atlanta a very strong pick
He got Atlanta the #12 pick heading into unrestricted free agency. Teague is actually a pretty solid comp for Rozier after three years — if you were getting Jeff Teague for years 4-8 of his career, what would pay?
Ah yeah, forgot he was an UFA. Considering Rozier has a year left and is an RFA after that, I would value him higher than #13 alone. Problem is teams always seem to get enamoured with picks around May & June. I also don’t know what other asset/s I would want in addition to the pick. LAC aren’t exactly brimming with promising players or contributing cheap vets.
Hopefully Rozier doesn’t demand Teague level money
I would do it
Then pick Divicenzo. If Smart doesn't resign/Celtics won't match....then sign Larkin for cheap and give him more mins.
DiVincenzo at 13?? Cmon man, there will be way better prospects available there. Sexton, Williams, Shai GA, Miles Bridges and Troy Brown may all likely be available at that spot, and they’re much better picks than DiV
Didn't they say that also when Rozier went 16th?
Divicenzo is this drafts Brogdon imo. And we all know Brogdon should have gone much higher.
watch
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there are rumors that the Suns with the 16th pick are interested in Divicenzo. And if not alot of mocks have Divicenzo going 19th to the Spurs
13 for Divicenzo might be a tad high, but to prevent the above, you may need to overpay
Divicenzo is a very good fit for the Celtics
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Considering Rozier is a former #16 pick and after the kind of playoffs he had... I'd be upset if we simply dealt him for #13.
If we trade Rozier in a package to move up, I'd prefer it's in the 1-10 range to be honest.
That just seems to be the market these days. Like with Teague, who had put together a much longer and consistent (and better) body of work than Rozier. He didn't get Atlanta a very strong pick
He got Atlanta the #12 pick heading into unrestricted free agency. Teague is actually a pretty solid comp for Rozier after three years — if you were getting Jeff Teague for years 4-8 of his career, what would pay?
Jeff Teague was an all star that had performed at a reasonable level for years. He is not a good comp of Terry Rozier.
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Considering Rozier is a former #16 pick and after the kind of playoffs he had... I'd be upset if we simply dealt him for #13.
If we trade Rozier in a package to move up, I'd prefer it's in the 1-10 range to be honest.
That just seems to be the market these days. Like with Teague, who had put together a much longer and consistent (and better) body of work than Rozier. He didn't get Atlanta a very strong pick
He got Atlanta the #12 pick heading into unrestricted free agency. Teague is actually a pretty solid comp for Rozier after three years — if you were getting Jeff Teague for years 4-8 of his career, what would pay?
Jeff Teague was an all star that had performed at a reasonable level for years. He is not a good comp of Terry Rozier.
Jeff Teague after year 3 is a very good comp for Rozier after year 3. That is what I said.
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That's good value IMO, but I'm torn. We're contenders next year. I'm very iffy on a move that makes us worse in a season in which we can potentially win it all. Any draft pick is very, very unlikely to be as good as Rozier next season.
I'd lean towards no - keep Rozier and go for it. If the right player dropped in the draft then I'd reconsider, but as of right now, no.
Next year, we add Hayward, and Tatum and Brown grow another year as decision makers. The burden of running the offense is going to shift.
Kyrie will still have the ball because he's so talented, but when he's not in, we aren't going to want Rozier and Smart running the show any more. Remember, Stevens preferred Evan Turner as the primary decision maker when he was still here. Last year we were stuck with Smart and Rozier when Kyrie was out because our wings were so inexperienced. That's over now.
I would expect the C's to eventually prefer a bigger athlete to back up Kyrie, with the idea that they guard the point, but are better for switching. We won't need them to be the primary creator type of point guard. Rozier and Smart are the last vestiges of the team from 2016/17. The new way is big and fast across the board. We can let them go now.