3 way Trade Idea

[#1P4P]

The Celtics trading Brown now would be like the Warriors trading Klay before their Championship run. Would Klay for LaMarcus or Dwight circa 2013 been a good trade?

It could’ve worked, but why would you trade the younger player that produces at an All Star level, continues to improve his skills and production, has a great work ethic, and has already been a Top 2 Celtic in the past 2 ECF runs?

He averaged an efficient 20.6 PPG in his age 23 season despite ranking 49th in the NBA in USG, a distant 5th(!) in touches on the team, and relegated to a 3&D role (a.k.a the stay in the corner role) that he has clearly outgrown for the sake of the team.

With Gordon gone and Kemba out, his production and the results that will follow are going to put these Jaylen trade ideas to bed.

[Muzzy66]

No, no, no PLEASE GOD NO. 

If I ever see Embiid in a Celtics jersey I will sincerely boycott this team for the rest of my life.

Embiid is immature, he's arrogant, hes lazy, he cant defend anything outside 5 feet, and he can't stay on the court.  I want absolutely nothing to do with him.

[Muzzy66]

Embiid is a 26 year old 7-footer who can put us 25 pts and 12 rebs.  I don't get why people are so down on him.  In fact, I think Houston would likely just take Embiid and the others over taking Brown et al. from the Celtics.

In terms of a trade based on Embiid for Brown, I think the Celtics would do that.  I don't love giving up Brown and Embiid has durability issues but 7-footers with his skill are a lot more rare and harder to get than good wings.

1. He's not suited to the modern big man game.  His outside shot is highly inconsistent, he can only play and defend one position so he has zero versatility, and he lacks the footspeed to be able to defend the P&R (or anything outside about 5 feet)

2. He lazy and out of shape.  He's lucky to give you half a game at max (or close to max) ability before he gets winded and drops off to 30% of himself for the rest of the game.  He puts close to zero effort on defence, regularly standing around watching instead of actually defending and frequently walking at a snails pace up the court on defence.   

3. He's got a disgusting personality, being both arrogant and egotistical.  He constantly brags about how great he is or about how much better he is then his opponent, which is made all the worse by the fact that hes a poor leader who has never won anything and constantly gets his butt handed to him by teams that he's supposed to have a clear advantage over.  He needs to learn to respect his opponent and actually WIN SOMETHING before he decides to walk around bragging about how great he is.

4. He is physically broken and cannot be depended on to be on the court when you need him.  The man has played in only 39% of possible games over his first seasons in the NBA (158 / 410).  That's almost two thirds of games missed over a 5 year period.  He can't play full games because he lacks the fitness, he can't play back-to-backs, he has potential to be stuck on minutes restrictions at any given time.  And while he may only play in a fraction of his games, he certainly gets paid for all 82 of them...

Embiid is a mess, and not somebody I want anywhere near this team.

[gouki88]

Not sure why Philly would want to pair Harden & Simmons

[Csfan1984]

And this is why danny screwed the pooch the past 3 years.  There is no way to add to this team significantly without including Brown.

Feels that way. As I wouldn't trade Brown for Embiid is my issue with the trade and not Embiid the player.
C's wasted chances to add to Brown and Tatum. Now it's, hope a team is selling low either because a guy demands a trade or they are tanking.

[Kernewek]

Embiid is a 26 year old 7-footer who can put us 25 pts and 12 rebs.  I don't get why people are so down on him.  In fact, I think Houston would likely just take Embiid and the others over taking Brown et al. from the Celtics.

In terms of a trade based on Embiid for Brown, I think the Celtics would do that.  I don't love giving up Brown and Embiid has durability issues but 7-footers with his skill are a lot more rare and harder to get than good wings.

1. He's not suited to the modern big man game.  His outside shot is highly inconsistent, he can only play and defend one position so he has zero versatility, and he lacks the footspeed to be able to defend the P&R (or anything outside about 5 feet)

2. He lazy and out of shape.  He's lucky to give you half a game at max (or close to max) ability before he gets winded and drops off to 30% of himself for the rest of the game.  He puts close to zero effort on defence, regularly standing around watching instead of actually defending and frequently walking at a snails pace up the court on defence.   

3. He's got a disgusting personality, being both arrogant and egotistical.  He constantly brags about how great he is or about how much better he is then his opponent, which is made all the worse by the fact that hes a poor leader who has never won anything and constantly gets his butt handed to him by teams that he's supposed to have a clear advantage over.  He needs to learn to respect his opponent and actually WIN SOMETHING before he decides to walk around bragging about how great he is.

4. He is physically broken and cannot be depended on to be on the court when you need him.  The man has played in only 39% of possible games over his first seasons in the NBA (158 / 410).  That's almost two thirds of games missed over a 5 year period.  He can't play full games because he lacks the fitness, he can't play back-to-backs, he has potential to be stuck on minutes restrictions at any given time.  And while he may only play in a fraction of his games, he certainly gets paid for all 82 of them...

Embiid is a mess, and not somebody I want anywhere near this team.

I mostly agree with you on points 2 & 4, but perhaps a more honest way of evaluating point four would be the possible games he could have played in since his rookie season, rather than since he was drafted, as he was entirely out for his first two seasons owing to a broken bone, which happens. If he was a draft and stash player you wouldn't blink an eye at those two missed seasons. You're also ignoring the 2020 season (51/71 games played).

Overall, we're looking at 64% of regular-season games (203 over 317), as you didn't count playoff games so I won't either. It's still not a particularly encouraging number, but it's a significant improvement over 39%.

 Spew vitriol if that's your perogative, but don't couch it in bad facts.

[Muzzy66]

I mostly agree with you on points 2 & 4, but perhaps a more honest way of evaluating point four would be the possible games he could have played in since his rookie season, rather than since he was drafted, as he was entirely out for his first two seasons owing to a broken bone, which happens. If he was a draft and stash player you wouldn't blink an eye at those two missed seasons.

You're also ignoring the 2020 season (51/71 games played).

I'm confused by your logic here. 

1. I'm criticising the idea of acquiring Embiid, and one of my key reasons is his long (and ongoing) history of health/injury problems.  This is because players who have long and ongoing history of health problems are more likely to suffer from health problems in the future, and hence have a higher risk of NOT be available when you need them.  I fail to see how it makes sense to completely ignore two entire seasons (164 games) that Embiid missed due to injury when evaluating this.   We are evaluating the risk of Embiid's injury history.  He missed two entire seasons due to injuries.  That's significant.

2. Of course I wouldn't blink an eye if he missed two seasons because of a draft and stash.  Again, I'm evaluating the risk of Embiid's injury history.  Missing two seasons due to a draft and stash agreement would have absolutely zero relevance in evaluating injury risk, so why would I consider it? 

3. I didn't include this season because it wasn't a normal season by any stretch of the imagination.  The league was shortened.  Play stopped completely for months, which gave tons of injured players additional rest time.  When play resumed all games were played in the bubble, so players did not have to go through any of the usual travel (etc) that could potential put extra wear on players.  Games were also more spread out, so the schedule was not as hectic.  It was nothing like a typical NBA season, so I didn't think it fair to include when evaluating a player's overall history.