Stoudemire to Portland?

[Chris]

Looks like this is heating up again:

The Portland Trail Blazers have made a strong play for Amare Stoudemire, discussing a package that includes LaMarcus Aldridge, Jerryd Bayless, and Raef LeFrentz's $12.7 million expiring contract, a person with direct knowledge of the talks told CBSSports.com Tuesday.

The Blazers have four extra second-round picks in the next two drafts to offer, plus the rights to British big man Joel Freeland, taken by Portland with the 30th pick in the 2006 draft.

Freeland has reportedly been included in the talks.

That's a pretty strong offer.  The only other actual players I'm hearing are Hinrich + Thomas from Chicago, but the Portland deal is just much better.

I can't believe this is accurate, or more than a rumor. To offer Aldridge and Bayless, plus additional considerations, is grossly overpaying for Amare, in my opinion.

I don't agree with this.  I understand the questions about Amare's defense (although to be fair, its not like he has been playing in defensive systems), but he arguably the best offensive big man in the game, who can kill defenses from everywhere on the court, and is only 26 years old. 

IMO, there is no way Aldridge ever becomes as good as Amare is right now, and Bayless has not shown much more than flashes this season.

But most importantly, Amare is exactly what Portland needs...a true "go-to" guy. 

[Lucky17]

Looks like this is heating up again:

The Portland Trail Blazers have made a strong play for Amare Stoudemire, discussing a package that includes LaMarcus Aldridge, Jerryd Bayless, and Raef LeFrentz's $12.7 million expiring contract, a person with direct knowledge of the talks told CBSSports.com Tuesday.

The Blazers have four extra second-round picks in the next two drafts to offer, plus the rights to British big man Joel Freeland, taken by Portland with the 30th pick in the 2006 draft.

Freeland has reportedly been included in the talks.

That's a pretty strong offer.  The only other actual players I'm hearing are Hinrich + Thomas from Chicago, but the Portland deal is just much better.

I can't believe this is accurate, or more than a rumor. To offer Aldridge and Bayless, plus additional considerations, is grossly overpaying for Amare, in my opinion.

I don't agree with this.  I understand the questions about Amare's defense (although to be fair, its not like he has been playing in defensive systems), but he arguably the best offensive big man in the game, who can kill defenses from everywhere on the court, and is only 26 years old. 

IMO, there is no way Aldridge ever becomes as good as Amare is right now, and Bayless has not shown much more than flashes this season.

But most importantly, Amare is exactly what Portland needs...a true "go-to" guy. 

In his short time in the league, Roy has already demonstrated he's their go-to option with the game on the line.

Along with his defense, Amare is also a huge question mark in terms of team chemistry. Factor in his contract situation, and I just don't think the rewards of trading for him outweigh the risks.

I've said it before: Portland should use its assets to land a young veteran wing player who can solidify the SF position for them. That what they need more than any perceived upgrade at PF.

[cordobes]

If I was Portland, I'd probably pass on this.  Aldridge is a darn good player and is a great complement to that lineup.  I'm not sure how Stoudemire will mold with Portland.  Throw in the fact that Portland would be giving up Raef's contract?  I think its probably a bad trade for Portland.

If you think about it, is it really that significant of an upgrade from Aldridge to Stoudemire when all things are considered?

I think I agree with this. While Stoudemire is surely an upgrade, I'm not sure he's a big enough upgrade to make this trade worth it. Portland already has the "problem" of having an abundance of young talent - meaning there's a lot of potential for contention over who is the first banana in years to come. Aldridge seems like the kind of guy that is ok being a second banana. If Portland is going to win a championship in the next 5 years or so, they're going to need players like Aldridge. Amare's first banana complaints are too well documented.

But on the flip side, maybe Amare would be the first banana in Portland. Roy is clearly the #1 guy on that team right now, but he's also the quintessential team player. He's playing the role of #1 guy because the team needs him to play that role right now. I suspect he'd be just fine deferring to Amare if it meant more Ws. So, if everyone else is ok letting Amare be #1, then maybe it would be a fantastic deal for Portland.

I disagree with this, mainly because I think most of their young talent is ideally 2nd or 3rd "banana" guys.  Amare is a true superstar, and would immediately become their go-to guy, and it would make their other young guys even better.

This is my biggest problem with Portland right now anyways.  They have too many #2's, and no true #1.  Roy is close, but I still see him as ideally a #2 guy.  While he can create his own shot, I think he is at his best when he is being a facilitator and not forcing the issue.  Amare is the perfect guy to bring in to force the issue, and lift this team up into the upper echelon.

Of course, I am not taking into account Amare's character issues, and his defensive problems, because I don't know how many of them will travel with him to a new team.  I wouldn't be surprised if you put him on a disciplined defensive team like Portland, and surround him with good defenders, that he might turn into a pretty good defender in his own right.  He certainly has the physical capability to do it.  And if he starts playing defense, he may be the best PF in the entire league.

Huh? D'Antoni's teams in Phoenix were better defensively than this Portland team is or was. Even the current version of the Suns is a better defensive squad than the Blazers. Following your logic, Stoudemire will become an even worse defender. I guess the Blazers are disciplined, but so were the Suns, they just missed the skills. That's Amare's problem: he lacks the ability to defend. I surely doubt it can be acquired by osmosis, I've never seen such a case.

[footey]

Stoudemire to Portland makes no sense to me. His utility in Phoenix has decreased largely because of the presence of Shaq. Why would Portland, with their own, back to the basket, younger version of Shaq, want Amare now?  Aldridge's game is more complementary of Oden's than Stoudemire's game is.

[guava_wrench]

I like this trade for Portland, especially with 2 bangers at center, Oden and Prysbilla, who don't demand the ball as much as Shaq does.

One difficult part will be Amare in such a slow paced offense.

[cordobes]

Stoudemire to Portland makes no sense to me. His utility in Phoenix has decreased largely because of the presence of Shaq. Why would Portland, with their own, back to the basket, younger version of Shaq, want Amare now?  Aldridge's game is more complementary of Oden's than Stoudemire's game is.

Who exactly are you talking about? Oden? A younger version of Shaq? Come on, this isn't 2007 anymore...

[Casperian]

Huh? D'Antoni's teams in Phoenix were better defensively than this Portland team is or was. Even the current version of the Suns is a better defensive squad than the Blazers. Following your logic, Stoudemire will become an even worse defender. I guess the Blazers are disciplined, but so were the Suns, they just missed the skills. That's Amare's problem: he lacks the ability to defend. I surely doubt it can be acquired by osmosis, I've never seen such a case.

People said the same about Ray Allen and Paul Pierce two years ago.

[ManUp]

Amare is a 1st team all-nba power forward in his prime. This is a down year for him, but I think that has everything to do with Phoenix situation. Chemistry hasn't been an issue with Amare prior to this season, so I don't know why he's a cancer all of a sudden. Can you really blame him for not being happy with the situation in Phoenix? They went from legit contenders to round fodder, and have changed their entire style of play to accomodate a has been superstar. Portland would be crazy not to get him while his value is low.

[cordobes]

Huh? D'Antoni's teams in Phoenix were better defensively than this Portland team is or was. Even the current version of the Suns is a better defensive squad than the Blazers. Following your logic, Stoudemire will become an even worse defender. I guess the Blazers are disciplined, but so were the Suns, they just missed the skills. That's Amare's problem: he lacks the ability to defend. I surely doubt it can be acquired by osmosis, I've never seen such a case.

People said the same about Ray Allen and Paul Pierce two years ago.

Yeps, but people who said that were clueless. Pierce and Allen were never bad defenders the way Stoudemire is. Even if they were, the fact still remains: the Suns were/are better defensive squads than the Blazers.

[Casperian]

Huh? D'Antoni's teams in Phoenix were better defensively than this Portland team is or was. Even the current version of the Suns is a better defensive squad than the Blazers. Following your logic, Stoudemire will become an even worse defender. I guess the Blazers are disciplined, but so were the Suns, they just missed the skills. That's Amare's problem: he lacks the ability to defend. I surely doubt it can be acquired by osmosis, I've never seen such a case.

People said the same about Ray Allen and Paul Pierce two years ago.

Yeps, but people who said that were clueless. Pierce and Allen were never bad defenders the way Stoudemire is. Even if they were, the fact still remains: the Suns were/are better defensive squads than the Blazers.

Well, no room for discussion, huh? 

Then let me ask you, do you think this trade makes sense for Portland?

[fairweatherfan]

Phoenix is probably going to lose Stoudemire to free agency anyway.  This trade makes good sense for both teams, as it gives the Blazers another star at a key position, and gives Phoenix cap relief, a budding young star in Aldridge, and a young potential star in Bayless, along with whatever other picks get thrown into the mix.  Phoenix for sure, and probably anyone else, will never win a title with Stoudemire unless he radically changes his approach to the game.  Better to toss him out and start developing some pieces that might help you get there someday.

[RebusRankin]

I'm on the fence on this one, intriguing for Portland but part of me thinks they should stand pat and let their players continue to develop.

[Roy Hobbs]

Aldridge's game is more complementary of Oden's than Stoudemire's game is.

How so?  I don't think that there's anything that Aldridge can do that Amare can't.  People seem to think of Amare as a great low post scorer -- and he has that ability -- but he also stretches the floor.  For instance, Amare is shooting an eFG% of 44.6% on jump shots this season, while Aldridge is shooting 42.0%; more than 50% of the shots for each player are jumpers.

 

[Donoghus]

I was against it before when the initial rumors were circulating and I am still against it after the latest speculation. I'm not a fan of it from Portland's standpoint.

[cordobes]

Aldridge's game is more complementary of Oden's than Stoudemire's game is.

How so?  I don't think that there's anything that Aldridge can do that Amare can't.  People seem to think of Amare as a great low post scorer -- and he has that ability -- but he also stretches the floor.  For instance, Amare is shooting an eFG% of 44.6% on jump shots this season, while Aldridge is shooting 42.0%; more than 50% of the shots for each player are jumpers. 

True. However, Amare stopped playing (let's not pretend he merely complained about the situation, like Nash did), because he didn't want to play at a slower pace (a change that indeed hurts him). Why will he be happy playing alongside Oden?

Huh? D'Antoni's teams in Phoenix were better defensively than this Portland team is or was. Even the current version of the Suns is a better defensive squad than the Blazers. Following your logic, Stoudemire will become an even worse defender. I guess the Blazers are disciplined, but so were the Suns, they just missed the skills. That's Amare's problem: he lacks the ability to defend. I surely doubt it can be acquired by osmosis, I've never seen such a case.

People said the same about Ray Allen and Paul Pierce two years ago.

Yeps, but people who said that were clueless. Pierce and Allen were never bad defenders the way Stoudemire is. Even if they were, the fact still remains: the Suns were/are better defensive squads than the Blazers.

Well, no room for discussion, huh? 

Then let me ask you, do you think this trade makes sense for Portland?

Heh... there's certainly room to discussion. The way I see it, Pierce and Allen were never truly bad defenders. They were very good (PP) or solid (RA) when they actually could afford to not care about saving forces because they needed to carry the offensive load. Stoudemire, OTOH, is consistently bad. He just lacks the awareness to defend some game situations, he doesn't react quick enough.

Amare's problem, in my view, is that he's an extremely good scorer, one of the bests in the game - especially if he has good guard play, but he's not very good on anything else. Somewhat of an one-dimentional player. I still don't dislike this for Portland, as I also see plenty of flaws on LMA and Bayless games.