Arenas suspended indefinitely

[thirstyboots18]

I haven't read the whole thread, so I don't know if this was mentioned, but in "When the Game Was Ours" it is mentioned on pg. 105 that M. L. Carr carried a loaded gun in the car, and on game days, to the Garden both as a player and as a coach.  That was during the time of bussing.  He said "I never had to fire it but that didn't mean I didn't have to use it."

Just food for thought.....

[CDawg834]

And why isn't Crittenden suspended for a year?  According to the Globe, he's the one who loaded a clip of ammo into his gun. Arenas' guns were unloaded if what I've been reading is true.

A suspension for Crittendon is on the way, in all likelihood.  In his case, David Stern is willing to let the legal investigation play out first before acting.  He was probably going to do the same for Arenas, if Agent Zero had just kept his mouth shut.  But since he insisted on constantly making light of the situation (and by doing so, indirectly mocking the league's weapons policy), Stern had no choice but to act now on him.  He can still wait on Crittendon, who has smartly kept quiet.  His punishment will come, as he is culpable in this incident too.  It takes both sides for a disagreement to escalate to this point.

[Roy Hobbs]

"There's a difference between a hunting accident and threatening (even if in jest) to shoot another person over a gambling debt, isn't there?"

Is there?  Does Dick Cheney need to kill pheasants to feed his family, or he is out running around in the woods discharging a deadly weapon and killing things for entertainment?  Gilbert Arenas made a stupid decision, but in his mind it was a joke, or entertainment.

Yes, there is.  Human life is more valuable than a pheasants.  Killing animals legally for sport is different in kind than killing another human being.  You seem very willing to give Arenas the benefit of the doubt that it was all a big joke, but the guy who was allegedly threatened took it seriously. 

You can say Gilbert's actions were reckless and endangered someone, but how is that different from going out with a group of friends with the intention of firing guns at low-flying birds in an environment with limited visibility, and apparently not enough gun safety knowledge or regard?

One is an accident, the other is criminal.  That's all the difference there needs to be.

[FatKidsDad]

Why is Arenas suspended and Crittendon is not?

They are both alleged to have participated in firearms violations in the locker room, contrary to CBA Section 9:

Section 9. Firearms.
(a) Whenever a player is physically present at a facility or venue owned, operated, or being used by a Team, the NBA, or any League-related entity, and whenever a player is traveling on any NBA-related business, whether on behalf of the player’s Team, the NBA, or any League-related entity, such player shall not possess a firearm of any kind. For purposes of the foregoing, “a facility or venue” includes, but is not limited to: an arena; a practice facility; a Team or League office or facility; an All-Star or NBA Playoff venue; and the site of a promotional or charitable appearance.

(b) Any violation of Section 9(a) above shall be considered conduct prejudicial to the NBA under Article 35(d) of the NBA Constitution and By-Laws, and shall therefore subject the player to discipline by the NBA in accordance with such Article.

The allegation is still under investigation and yet to be proven, therefore no suspension for either is (yet) warranted.

Arenas, however, had the subsequent mock shooting (with fingers as guns) event, which is on video and not in dispute. 

According to the NBA Constitution and Bylaws Article 35(d):

(d) The Commissioner shall have the power to suspend for a definite or indefinite period, or to impose a fine not exceeding $50,000, or inflict both such suspension and fine upon any Player who, in his opinion, (i) shall have made or caused to be made any statement having, or that was designed to have, an effect prejudicial or detrimental to the best interests of basketball or of the Association or of a Member, or (ii) shall have been guilty of conduct that does not conform to standards of morality or fair play, that does not comply at all times with all federal, state, and local laws, or that is prejudicial or detrimental to the Association.

Apparently, under this section, it is Stern's opinion that Arenas' actions constitute a "statement" that has "...an effect prejudicial or detrimental to the best interests of basketball or of the Association or of a Member"

Whether Arenas, or any of us, agree with that rule, that is the rule that NBA member teams and members of the Players Association are contractually bound to live by.

That is why Stern can do what he did.

[liam]

Good, what he did was very stupid. He should have to go and talk to Jason Williams ( When ever he sobers up) Guns are never funny. Pointing one at someone is never funny or harmless.

[Schupac]

"There's a difference between a hunting accident and threatening (even if in jest) to shoot another person over a gambling debt, isn't there?"

Is there?  Does Dick Cheney need to kill pheasants to feed his family, or he is out running around in the woods discharging a deadly weapon and killing things for entertainment?  Gilbert Arenas made a stupid decision, but in his mind it was a joke, or entertainment.

Yes, there is.  Human life is more valuable than a pheasants.  Killing animals legally for sport is different in kind than killing another human being.  You seem very willing to give Arenas the benefit of the doubt that it was all a big joke, but the guy who was allegedly threatened took it seriously. 

You can say Gilbert's actions were reckless and endangered someone, but how is that different from going out with a group of friends with the intention of firing guns at low-flying birds in an environment with limited visibility, and apparently not enough gun safety knowledge or regard?

One is an accident, the other is criminal.  That's all the difference there needs to be.

You are right, human life is more valuable than a pheasant's.  But 1 pheasant's life is more valuable than 0 humans.  0 human beings were injured as a result of Gilbert Arenas' actions.  I am not giving Gilbert Arenas the benefit of the doubt, I am basing my thoughts on all the information available.  I'm sorry Roy, but I haven't read a single thing indicating Arenas had malicious intent with these weapons.  The gambling debt did not even involve him.

"One is an accident, the other is criminal.  That's all the difference there needs to be."

I know you are a lawyer, but this isn't a court of law.  We are having a discussion based on what is or isn't reasonable.  I'm not trying to get into a legal debate with you because 1) I'll lose and 2) I don't much care for what's legal, but what is logical.  It is rare indeed when they are not the same thing, but when they are not, I don't simply defer to 'well it's the law'.  Please don't take this to mean I think D.C. gun laws are stupid, but to mean that just because what Arenas did was illegal does not by default make it worse than something that was legal.

And please remember, I never once said what Arenas did wasn't stupid, unfunny, ill-advised, or even illegal.  All I said was it wasn't malicious and it wasn't "thug" or "gangster".  I don't see how one accident of stupidity where the threat of injury existed is worse than one accident of stupidity where a serious injury was sustained.

edit:  I am hopping on an airplane in a few hours so I won't be able to really continue this discussion, but those are my feelings on the matter.  Truncated - Arenas is stupid, not gangster.  As such he should be punished like a dummy, not a criminal.

[bdm860]

Am I missing something here?  On pages 6-7 of this thread it seems like there is suddenly a player named "Crittendon" who entered the league.  Lol ok I'm being a little facetious with this, but in my experience on Celticsblog there has never been a typo repeated by 7 different posters (by my count, all knowledgeable, respected posters too) regarding a players name. Someone would usually jump in with a corny joke or something right away.  So I guess I'm wondering if I'm missing some sort of inside joke or something. 

[housecall]

I don't see where either player Arenas or Crittenton has any defense or a leg to stand on for bringing guns to the premises of the Wizards.So far ive heard Arenas  excuse for having them there,which sounds lame.My father owned guns when i was a child and i didn't know it until i was an adult.I own guns and im the only person in my household that will ever know they exist.Its not something you are afraid your kids are going to accidentally come across,if you are safety conscious in the first place.I haven't heard Crittendon's reasoning yet for why he had a gun in the locker room...maybe he will say because he didn't want his dogs to eat them.

[Schupac]

bdm860 - Apparently it's Crittenton, not Crittendon.  For me, it'sa typo I've been making for a long time, nothing intentional.

I'm surprised to see this thread cooled down a bit.  I even hopped on my family's archaic, snail slow computer to follow it.  Oh well.

[Eja117]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4813488

This is interesting. It's like the Wiz are trying to erase Gilbert from history or something.

I'm beginning to have conflicted emotions. I mean nobody got hurt or anything and I feel like other players have done worse things.

If he had been Kobe or Lebron or Chris Paul we'd hear a very very different story from everyone involved (assuming we even heard the story in the first place)

I just think it's kind of obvious that NBA suspensions are in direct proportion to how mad you make Stern, which is in direct proportion to how much negative publicity you get.

[Schupac]

I just think it's kind of obvious that NBA suspensions are in direct proportion to how mad you make Stern, which is in direct proportion to how much negative publicity you get.

That is the best way I've heard it put yet.

[moiso]

I just think it's kind of obvious that NBA suspensions are in direct proportion to how mad you make Stern, which is in direct proportion to how much negative publicity you get.

That is the best way I've heard it put yet.

I actually really like how Stern operates.  No long investigations, no appeals, and I generally agree with his decisions.
On another note, yesterday a friend told me that Arenas defecated in another player's shoe.  I'm not sure of the source.  Disregarding the gun business for a moment, the Wiz gave $100mil and the title of team leader to a guy... who poops in shoes.  Crazy crazy. 

[bdm860]

I just think it's kind of obvious that NBA suspensions are in direct proportion to how mad you make Stern, which is in direct proportion to how much negative publicity you get.

That is the best way I've heard it put yet.

I don't know, is there something wrong with that though?

The NBA is a business.  The more bad publicity = more bad for business = bigger suspension.  That's how the business world generally works.

If you work for a bank and do something stupid that costs them money, do you think you're going to be punished more if you cost them $10, $1,000, or $1,000,000?