Political correctness on CelticsBlog...

[17wasEZ]

Wow, some great replies and great debate. I'll just leave it at this -

1. I grew up with a Mom who used to have me go find my own "switch" from a tree in the back yard when I had it coming to me and three sisters who all knocked me out at one point or another.
* The last thing I think is that women are "soft" - they are tougher than us in so many ways, it's hard to count.

2. I even stated this sentiment before going on my rant in my original post about the Celtics. But apparently that isn't enough in order to stay politically correct. No, no, no...even if you preface your statement saying what I'm about to say isn't meant to imply that I think women are weak, it's just figurative, this doesn't suffice. Because, God Forbid, someone wearing a diaper somewhere will STILL take offense because they are so pathetically tied to the draconian protection of their own insecurities.

3. I don't buy the argument that choosing to express yourself with figurative metaphors means you have the inability to express yourself in a more dignified manner - I went through college writing essays about Shakespeare, Milton and Chaucer. It has nothing to do with that...

4. What I do believe is that people should just be able to say what they what they want, within reason, without being worried about some particular segment of the human population they "might offend" with one word or one metaphoric expression.

5. Is it too much to ask that we can assume that most people are all grown up, so much in fact, that they actually have the ability to discern the difference between a figurative metaphor and a literal attack on a segment of the population. Or should we be so arrogant as to insult the intelligence of the entire human population by trying to protect and coddle them from all the big, bad, mean, nasty words out there. If so, let's just turn the clock back to 1984, turn the  thermostat up to 451 and send out the language paratroopers.

6. I just think there is so much harm being done in the name of political correctness and that it has disastrous consequences on our ability to actually communicate easily and think analytically; because if you are always hyper consumed with monitoring every minutia of language that comes out of your pie hole, how can that not hinder your ability for true expression?

7. Ever been on a playground? Kids are brutal to each other. Why? Because they just say what's on their mind; "you're fat, you're ugly, you're pretty, you're cute, you're stupid, you're smart...whatever. Guess what, seems like most of the kids make it through just fine. Not only that, you learn some of your greatest life lessons by getting punched in the nose, figuratively and literally, while growing up on the playground. Why? Because it's reflective of the real, grown up world - or the grown up world before PC entered into it.

8. Now if there is a bully who obviously crossing some very clear lines - which would be equivalent to me having gone on a scathing, misogynistic rant against the female gender - that is an entirely different animal.   

9. My comments were figurative and I apologize if they offended anyone.

10. I also completely repect the wishes of the Moderators who have put together a great site. This is their business and as such they have the right to "refuse service to anyone" - or, in other words, to monitor it however they see fit. I have the right to either play by their rules continue posting or to disengage.
* i love the site, think it's great and will obviously choose to continue engaging.

11. But I'll say one thing, I've played basketball my entire life and talked a lot of trash on the court. If I ever told someone they were playing like a jelly fish, they would have no idea what I was talkign about and they'd probably punch me in the head.

12. However, if I told them they needed to grow a set and stop playing like a chic(which would imply playing like a female) they would know exactly what I was talking about and they wouldn't take it as a reflection of my opinion of women as a whole. Two possible things would happen after I made a comment like this:

A) if they were on my team, someone on the other team would get nailed under the glass or on a roll to the rim.
B) If they were on the other team, I'd probably get hammered

What wouldn't happen? They wouldn't say this to their girls, because most of them would know who's really in charge in their relationship and no man wants to have their ass handed to them on a daily basis by an p---ed off "chic"!. That's a recipe for disaster and a battle you will not win. Why? Because most of them have a lot more fight in them then we do...

In the future, I'll refrain from using language that may have multiple interpretations that require people to think analytically about what the real intent of the statement is.         
 

Even though I'm known to be pretty thoughtful with my responses in my "real life", I have to admit I agree with much of what you have stated.  There was a time in this country when it wasn't about saying something that was pc, but rather, saying something because it was right.

My mom and dad grew up during the Great Depression and learned a lot of valuable lessons that they passed on to us.  They weren't thin skinned. Most everyone from that era grew up tough. My mom is still alive and "tells it like it is" when something needs to be said. She's not crude and she doesn't cuss, but her words can pack a punch. Even though she is a woman, I know very few people who can "man up" like she can.

Unfortunately, it seems that there are many people these days that want to run to their mommy and daddy, or teacher, or boss, or government leaders, etc. because they find something "offensive" or "unfair". To them I say "life is unfair and there is always someone, somewhere who will take offense to what you say or what you do".

As a Christian guy in a country that is not only moving away from Christianity, but even sometimes mocking it, I realize that I have to be thick skinned. No problem.

With that said, I do realize that there is a need for rules and regulations to be enforced by administrators of blogs (like this cool site).

Lastly, to varying degrees, we all have times when we're more positive or negative than the next guy, but we're always Celtic fans.  Let's remember that!

[Roy H.]

Being politically correct is all well and good. For those of you who run the site, you might try it a little more often yourselves. I was told in no uncertain terms that I was just plain wrong when I expressed my opinion on a certain player. This was done by one of the people who run the site. Now, while that may no be political in nature it sure lacks etiquette. Then, this same person told me he should have been more 'wishy washy' in his remarks concerning my comments implying that I was being wish washy. If you want to have a sight and tell others how to use it then you might want abide by your own rules.

As I recall (okay, I looked it up), you indicated that Wilt Chamberlain would have won 12+ championships if he played on the Celtics.  You phrased it as "I would argue that . . ." The staff member (myself) said "And that argument would be wrong", before spending several paragraphs explaining why that staff member thought your reasoning was wrong.

On a blog where we debate things, somebody saying that your argument is wrong is not, in my opinion, anything other than a natural consequence of engaging in a debate where people share contrary opinions.  If somebody said "You're an idiot", I'd agree.  If somebody says, "Your argument is wrong", and then explains their position, I don't see much wrong with that.

[KCattheStripe]

Being politically correct is all well and good. For those of you who run the site, you might try it a little more often yourselves. I was told in no uncertain terms that I was just plain wrong when I expressed my opinion on a certain player. This was done by one of the people who run the site. Now, while that may no be political in nature it sure lacks etiquette. Then, this same person told me he should have been more 'wishy washy' in his remarks concerning my comments implying that I was being wish washy. If you want to have a sight and tell others how to use it then you might want abide by your own rules.

As I recall (okay, I looked it up), you indicated that Wilt Chamberlain would have won 12+ championships if he played on the Celtics.  You phrased it as "I would argue that . . ." The staff member (myself) said "And that argument would be wrong", before spending several paragraphs explaining why that staff member thought your reasoning was wrong.

On a blog where we debate things, somebody saying that your argument is wrong is not, in my opinion, anything other than a natural consequence of engaging in a debate where people share contrary opinions.  If somebody said "You're an idiot", I'd agree.  If somebody says, "Your argument is wrong", and then explains there position, I don't see much wrong with that.

You're an idiot.

Wait... I should never just skim posts.

[ScoobyDoo]

I actually don't think anything I've posted should make me appear to be a jerk in any way whatsoever. Rather, I would think it would make me out as someone who simply expresses their thoughts in the manner they wish. People could then tell me they like it, hate it, disagree with it, think it's stupid, whatever.. if they'd like an apology they could request it and I could explain that it was figurative and not literal and apologize - that would be called healthy communication amongst adults, female and male, who have the ability to think and reason in order to come to their own conclusions about anything that may have been said or done.   

What I'm not is over sensitive. The main reason for this is that I am not a person who walks around with a diaper on and a box of huggies manically anticipating/fearing the next time someone might say something "offensive" about "anything" that might result in the catastrophic annihilation of all the heretofore precious perceptions I had of myself or of the world that would then send me into a death spiral of collapsing self perception. 

[angryguy77]

Example of PC ridiculousness: Geronimo's  great grandson objecting to the use of that name for the operation to get Osama.

It doesn't matter if it is real life or on a blog, PC will kill debate and it will ruin a good thing. Cblog is not immune.

[ScoobyDoo]

TP to 17wasEZ and thank you. This is exactly what I'm talking about. People of that generation that your parents experienced would shudder at the ridiculousness of "Political correctness".

They would be like "are you serious?". They didn't have time for it because they were dealing with things that actually mattered in life. They couldn't afford to walk around with a diaper on, sucking their thumbs in agonizing and paralyzing  fear of who might be the next person that is going to say "BOO!!" to them. Good God.

I didn't grow up in the depression. But I did grow up in severe poverty, with no bathroom, no toilet, no hot running water, no shower and in a house that averaged about 43 degrees inside during the winter and was condemned and torn down after we moved out of it after high school. Trust me when I tell you I wasn't too worried about what people said about me or anything else or which words they used  to express themselves". I had other things that actually mattered on my mind most of the time. If you actually talk to someone you can then usually figure out who they are and if you'd like to continue talking to them.

Here's a thought, if someone says something you don't like, how about asking them what their intent was. A shocking thing might happen - you might get an answer. And that answer might explain things in a light entirely different than what you had thought was implied. That would be called "communication" between analytical adults.

Like you said, your mom told it "like it was" and there is immeasurable value to that. My guess is that she does it because she knows life is too short and "can" be far too difficult to worry about political correctness - if life was an "ocean", political correctness would be a desert, IMHO.

Women are tough as nails and there is a good reason for it - life is an awesome ride but it's also no picnic. Everyone carries their own load and no one gets out without their share of bumps and bruises along the way. But, chin up, smile on the face and don't be afraid to take a shot on the nose every now and then - if it doesn't kill you it'll probably make you stronger.

Now then, if the Celtics intend on playing like the men they are tomorrow, I expect to see some Heat bodies taking some pretty good shots and hitting the floor pretty hard.

And I have to say, and I hope this doesn't offend anyone, I am glad we are rolling out a team of men tomorrow and not women, "only" because I don't know that many women who have the physical ability to hammer LeBron as he's coming to the hole for a dunk.      

[barefacedmonk]

I'm a little confused...what does political correctness mean? If it means saying whatever you want to say without a filter...then, I'm glad this blog is pc.

[Rondo2287]

I'm a little confused...what does political correctness mean? If it means saying whatever you want to say without a filter...then, I'm glad this blog is pc.

Cosign, if thats what you want you may as well go join an anarchist group

[ScoobyDoo]

Ding, Ding Angryguy77!!! TP

Or, the "draconian protection of their own insecurities..."

I grew up in a situation that I could have easily ended up as still poverty stricken, drug and alcohol riddled environment...or should I have worked my way through college and changed my life?

Should kids that grow up in bad inner city situations just accept that it's their life or try everything they possibly can to get out and change their life?

Should Geronimo's great grandson focus all his energies on the improvement of his life or should he focus on what some operation in some other country that has nothing to do with him other than serving to make him safer as an American?

It's a self indulgent, sissified, mamby pamby world we live in these days...

Maybe the entire country should go shovel crap on a farm for three months through the summer in 100 degree heat, or try raking blueberries, or try taking a crap outside in 10 below zero weather all winter, or pant vegetables in a field 8 hours a day getting bit by deer flies and horse flies.

I doubt after any of those experiences over a fair part of their lives they wouldn't be too worried about much of what anyone might say about anything.

It seems we might be so spoiled that we now spend a large part of our time worrying about who's offending us. God forbid we ever have another great depression, I'm not sure we're tough enough to survive it at this point. We'd all probably just turn on each other...
    

[ACF]

If someone came to visit you and then tried to tell you how to communicate in the confines of your own home wouldn't you be upset? CelticsBlog is essentially Jeff's house, we are his guests, so we must follow his rules. Simple as that.

[angryguy77]

I'm a little confused...what does political correctness mean? If it means saying whatever you want to say without a filter...then, I'm glad this blog is pc.

No, it's judging people because they say something w/o you knowing the context in which they are speaking. It's a lack of common sense.

Their is a difference between having tact and pc.

PC also fosters a huge double standard in our society and I believe it is used as a weapon for a certain political ideology.
It's when a show like the Family Guy gets an insane amount of pressure not to have an episode showing allah. However, nothing is said when it routinely shows the face of God and pokes fun at Christ.  

[angryguy77]

If someone came to visit you and then tried to tell you how to communicate in the confines of your own home wouldn't you be upset? CelticsBlog is essentially Jeff's house, we are his guests, so we must follow his rules. Simple as that.

It's not about rules or that there shouldn't be any. This is a discussion about how ridiculous some rules are and how extreme this one is. For the most part this is a great blog, but this is one aspect that could use improvement imo.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Well, my definition of PC is being able to speak metaphorically about issues. For example, being able to say after game two that "I felt like the Celtics like chicks in game two" and "they need to take the dresses off and start playing like men if they expect to win game three..." in other words, they need to get tougher and start laying some smack on people, which men are generally better at doing because of their physical make up.

Rather than having to say "I think the Celtics will need to put some armor on and try to play more like strong males in game three if they expect to be victorious."  

It is a long, long, long way from being anarchist in nature and being able to say "whatever" you want. It assumes people have the analytical ability to discern your intent.

It assumes common sense and courtesy but allows for some figurative speech. That's my definition...

[ScoobyDoo]

Great points AG77. That's exactly it...

[ACF]

If someone came to visit you and then tried to tell you how to communicate in the confines of your own home wouldn't you be upset? CelticsBlog is essentially Jeff's house, we are his guests, so we must follow his rules. Simple as that.

It's not about rules or that there shouldn't be any. This is a discussion about how ridiculous some rules are and how extreme this one is.
 

Yes, I understand but it's still Jeff's house and his rules. To an extent, I can see some of the stuff you're talking about and I can agree with some of it, too. But this is a family friendly environment and so we try to treat each other with respect and civility. If that is being PC, then I don't mind being PC.