CB Draft Eastern Semis: (1) Bulls vs. (4) Celtics

[Kane3387]

I don't understand why DJ Augustin would play ahead of Rip Hamilton.

You can still put Westbrook on Wade defensively. Just have Rip defend Jrue Holiday. He'll do a better job on Jrue than DJ Augustin will + make whoever is guarding him (Rip) on the other end work harder than Augustin will.

I like Augustin helping out with the facilitation aspect of the offense. And I like his three point shooting more. I also believe that Augustin matches up better with Holiday.

I mean look at their H2H numbers. They are pretty even.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=augusdj01&p2=holidjr01

[KCattheStripe]

3) Marc Gasol should be able to score on Chris Bosh, but not nearly as well as Bosh scores on Gasol, and Gasol won't have the elite athletic defenders around him that he has on Memphis

ZBO is crying in a room somewhere, no one's ever called him an elite athlete before.

[Kane3387]

Starters
PG: DJ Augustin vs Jrue Holiday = advantage Chicago
SG: Westbrook vs Wade = advantage Chicago
SF: Artest vs Pierce = advantage Chicago
PF: B.Griffin vs T.Young = advantage Boston
C:  M.Gasol vs C.Bosh = advantage Chicago

I like Chicago going smaller with Bosh at center and Thaddeus at power forward. I think it's their best lineup.

I am lower than most on Russell Westbrook. I still think his decision making is too weak to put up there with the best of the best. I also seem to rate Wade higher than most and still consider him an MVP caliber talent and believe he'd see a big bump without LeBron.

I also agree that Ron Artest does a great job defending Pierce and would slow him down considerably. There is still an advantage there for Chicago though.

I think Marc Gasol will get quite a bit of joy attacking Chris Bosh's defense but I think Bosh will create even more on the other end of the floor attacking Marc Gasol. I just don't think Gasol has enough quickness / mobility to cover a player like Bosh while also providing (or not providing as the case may be) effective team defense off of Bosh against dribble drive threats like Wade, Jrue and Pierce.

Blake Griffin is too big and powerful for Thaddeus Young. He'll have and will capitalize on those opportunities. Also, he'll pound Thaddeus on the boards.

I think Boston should play Rip Hamilton or Stephen Jackson instead of DJ Augustin.

I think the advantage for Griffin is by far the most pronounced. It is easy to say this guy has an advantage here and this guy has one here, but you have to factor into what degree the advantage takes place.

Holiday and Augustin are pretty evenly matched based on the numbers. Holiday also played with better defensive players in Brand and Igoudala then Augustin ever had in Charlotte. Their environments weren't the same. I give the edge to Jrue but it's not that significant.

Look at their averages for last season in 2012.

Holiday -   13.5 pts, 4.5 asts, 3.3 rebs, 2.0 TO all in 33.8 mpg
Augustin - 11.1 pts, 6.4 asts, 2.3 rebs, 2.3 TO all in 29.3 mpg

When you consider who Holiday was coached by and the talent around him I don't think there is much of an advantage here.

Also before you kill DJ. Consider his talent in Charlotte vs the talent he has here in Boston. It's not even close and pin Charlotte he still shot the ball well from three and averaged over 6 apg in less then 30 mpg.

As for Westbrook. With Augustin in his decision making is simplified more. He is asked to attack and be a scorer and then playmaker. Not vice versa. Russ can play off the ball. He did that with Harden fine.

He matched up with Wade well. Take into account that Harden and Fisher played a lot of time with Russ in the finals. Overall Russell outplayed Wade. Holiday has no chance of guarding Russ. Pierce is no Iggy. Bosh is no Brand. And Russ is one of the few players who is so explosive and athletic that he doesn't get shots blocked a lot. He does get fouled a lot though. Wade will have to pick up Russ or he is gonna have a field day .

Young won't provide Bosh much help. Defensively they both will get dominated in the paint and on the glass. They will pick up fouls. Offensively they will shoot jumpers. Nothing inside. And I can live with that.

[Kane3387]

I dunno I'm still not convined that Chicago walks away with this series.

I'm having a hard time visualizing how that defense is going to keep Westbrook, Gasol, and Griffin from netting bigtime points in the paint.

I know IP is going to be MIA until tonight so I'll hold onto my votes until later, but I'm having trouble going one way or the other with this matchup right now.

I'm thinking this would be a very offensive series, especially with Chicago going small.

But Chicago has a more cohesive offensive lineup, less weaknesses in their other options. Boston has less shooting and would need Griffin to do more than I think he's capable of to counteract the areas where Chicago is stronger.

I think you're underestimating Blake and Marc's matchup here. I posted a clip of Blake's game against Bosh as a rookie. It's only a minute long. He can get all those shots with the teammates he has around him. Young is going to need help with Griffin. Bosh will have to be that help and that leaves Marc Gasol wide open in the paint and under the boards.

He will have to pick his poison with one of my All-Star bigs. Bosh and Young is a horrible defensive front line. Both Marc and Blake is going to have an advantage every time down the floor on offense if Bosh guards Gasol and Young guards Griffin. .Tjhey are going to accumulate a ton of fouls. Defensively the only way I am beaten is if both his bigs shoot 60% from the permitter and 40% from three.

The only way Bosh works at Center is because Lebron James is his PF. Thad Young, suffice to say, is no Lebron James. Bosh at Center didn't work in Toronto with Bargs and it won't work in Chicago with Thad.

[Kane3387]

3) Marc Gasol should be able to score on Chris Bosh, but not nearly as well as Bosh scores on Gasol, and Gasol won't have the elite athletic defenders around him that he has on Memphis

ZBO is crying in a room somewhere, no one's ever called him an elite athlete before.

Yeah are you really trying to sell Chris Bosh that hard on Celtics Blog. We have all watched who Bosh truly is since he went to Miami. He needs to be playing along side a physically imposing force. Young is not that guy. Too much finesse in the paint for Chicago.

[Kane3387]

This is the anchor of your defense?







Against these guys?

[Kane3387]

^

No way. Sorry. Not in a seven game series. Not when Artest is making Pierce scrap and claw for every little thing he can get. And not when Russ and Wade are battling it out at a supernova like pace.

Also let's not forget. My two All-Star in their prime bigs just beat Pau Gasol and Marcin Gortat. Now you want me to believe they get done in by Chris Bosh and Thad Young?


Funny.

[ronaldo943]

^

No way. Sorry. Not in a seven game series. Not when Artest is making Pierce scrap and claw for every little thing he can get. And not when Russ and Wade are battling it out at a supernova like pace.

Also let's not forget. My two All-Star in their prime bigs just beat Pau Gasol and Marcin Gortat. Now you want me to believe they get done in by Chris Bosh and Thad Young?

Funny.

I have to agree with this.

[Kane3387]

And you can sell Holiday's defense all you want IP. I would if I were you.

BUT... ever since Russell took his game to an ALL-STAR level 3 years ago he has dominated Holiday.


2010 - 31 pts, 12 asts, 5 rebs
2011 - 27 pts, 12 asts, 5 rebs
2012 - 22 pts,   4 asts, 13 rebs of which 7 were offensive

You better come correct with D Wade's defense or you're in for a world of hurt. We all know Wade is lazy closing out shooters, so DJ and his 38% 3 pt. shooting will get some looks when Wade tries to help as Russ blows by Jrue.

DJ WILL NEVER guard Dwyane Wade either.

Russ is an athletic physical specimen. He is a freak much in the way LeBron James is. This guy can play 48 minutes easy.

He played 42.2 mpg in the finals where he an Wade were primarily matched up.

Scroll to the bottom and look after you click the link. So don't tell me he is going to get tired because Holiday is guarding him and then he has to pick up Wade. He played Wade primarily straight up for 42.2 mpg in June.

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/3468/russell-westbrook

[indeedproceed]

Also let's not forget. My two All-Star in their prime bigs just beat Pau Gasol and Marcin Gortat. Now you want me to believe they get done in by Chris Bosh and Thad Young?

A) that's why I didn't vote for you last round. You shouldn't have won.

B) so your 4th seed barely scraped by a 5th seed. My team finished first in the division, the conference, and the league. They've been well rested, and just got done sweeping their first round opponent. Your team barely won its division, the weakest in the entire league, and barely won its first round matchups.

All the gifs and crappy photoshops in the world won't make up for the fact that you're a second round exit playoff team, any one smart trade away from true contention.

Clutch? We got that b role.
Playmakers? We got that b role.
Defenders? We got that b role.
3 elite talents who don't fit together surrounded by a crew of misfit malcontents with no real depth? NO! That's too specific! (but it does describe the Boston Celtics)

We got beef if we wanna slow it down, we got legs if they wanna speed it up, and we got elite defenders all over the roster (1,2,3, and 5 all placed on bball prospectus's all-defense team), and we've got 3 elite scorers who have all won a ring.

Your team is good, but you were one trade away. You're not the better team here.

[StartOrien]

Kane was one trade away from being elite for sure, but I'm not so sure ip is being honest being so dismissive. This is a particularily challenging matchup for the bulls. I see gasol causing a lot of issues, and people are overlooking his passing ability to get griffin some easier shots.

I'm of the opinion that westbrooks assist to turnover ratio can be explained by the very simplistic offense the thunder run. Iso pick and rolls with minimal movement. I love that kid.

Where I think the bulls can get some separation is with the truth. Even if he stays commited to his diet and workout regime like he did in the second half of the season I don't believe he can keep up with pierce.

[Roy H.]

Also let's not forget. My two All-Star in their prime bigs just beat Pau Gasol and Marcin Gortat. Now you want me to believe they get done in by Chris Bosh and Thad Young?

A) that's why I didn't vote for you last round. You shouldn't have won.

B) so your 4th seed barely scraped by a 5th seed. My team finished first in the division, the conference, and the league. They've been well rested, and just got done sweeping their first round opponent. Your team barely won its division, the weakest in the entire league, and barely won its first round matchups.

All the gifs and crappy photoshops in the world won't make up for the fact that you're a second round exit playoff team, any one smart trade away from true contention.

Clutch? We got that b role.
Playmakers? We got that b role.
Defenders? We got that b role.
3 elite talents who don't fit together surrounded by a crew of misfit malcontents with no real depth? NO! That's too specific! (but it does describe the Boston Celtics)

We got beef if we wanna slow it down, we got legs if they wanna speed it up, and we got elite defenders all over the roster (1,2,3, and 5 all placed on bball prospectus's all-defense team), and we've got 3 elite scorers who have all won a ring.

Your team is good, but you were one trade away. You're not the better team here.

[indeedproceed]

Well keep in mind fellas Im on my honeymoon sneakin phone time and risking a tongue lashing (not the good kind) everytime I post til she's asleep. I wish I could be more detail oriented here, but I just can't. My phone won't even let me sniff synergy sports. Not that my arguments are bad, but I've gotta do a lot of it piece wise and it's just tough.

Anywho, I'm likely done til afterthe deadline. If my arguments and my teams awesomeness didn't sway you, you're the one who has to live with being wrong, not me.

[ronaldo943]

One thing i will have to admit is that in reality even though i didnt win that series i was still glad since IP and Roy both voted for me, and these guys check every single stat they can check. I still think we had the better team but everyone one was sold on his BIG 3 but i dont have a problem with that as for next year i know what type of team im building

[Kane3387]

so your 4th seed barely scraped by a 5th seed. My team finished first in the division, the conference, and the league. They've been well rested, and just got done sweeping their first round opponent. Your team barely won its division, the weakest in the entire league, and barely won its first round matchups.

Matchups are what matter. Not record or rest. The Dallas Mavericks in 2007 went 67-15. Had plenty of rest before the playoffs and lost to an 8th seeded GS team. That was due to matchup issues that GS exploited.

The Orlando Magic in 2010 had a top record and had swept the first two playoff series they were in. The played a Celtc's team that was a fourth seed and before they knew it they were down 0-3. That was match ups. Boston erased their greatest advantage in Howard and exploited their match ups.

I could go on and on but sports are about match ups. Especially the NBA playoffs. You don't matchup well with my team. It is what it is. You best player in Wade is matched by Russ. Your second best player is facing one of the few players who consistently makes him play at inefficient and below average level. Your front court is pathetic compared to mine and has no chance of defending or out rebounding them.

All the gifs and crappy photoshops in the world won't make up for the fact that you're a second round exit playoff team, any one smart trade away from true contention.

Right back at you. All the love you get for your witty comments and rhetoric doesn't hide the fact your team has no inside presence at all. It's undersized, soft, and perimeter based.

Clutch? We got that b role.
Playmakers? We got that b role.
Defenders? We got that b role.
3 elite talents who don't fit together surrounded by a crew of misfit malcontents with no real depth? NO! That's too specific! (but it does describe the Boston Celtics)

Like Wade in Boston at the end of game 4 when Lebron fouled out?

We got beef if we wanna slow it down, we got legs if they wanna speed it up, and we got elite defenders all over the roster (1,2,3, and 5 all placed on bball prospectus's all-defense team), and we've got 3 elite scorers who have all won a ring.

Beef? Haywood and Splitter? There is steak like my big sand there is gristle like what you call a Center. LeBron James is not playing PF for Chicago. Bosh won't work at Center.

Your team is good, but you were one trade away. You're not the better team here.

Your team is good, but you were one trade away. You're not the better team here.