Author Topic: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)  (Read 187303 times)

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Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #135 on: September 12, 2013, 05:16:06 PM »

Offline McHales Pits

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Starting Lineup for Finals

1 - Ellis
2 - Bradley
3 - James
4 - Ibaka
5 - Jordan

In this series with Cleveland having slight framed big men, expect a lot of James-Ibaka at the 4 & 5 spots which allow Korver, Battier, & Chalmers to sub in regularly.

Ask any and all questions regarding Minnesota's offense/defense, Cleveland's offense/defense, or strategy related questions.

Thanks-

McHP
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Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #136 on: September 12, 2013, 05:21:49 PM »

Offline Fafnir

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Yeah Landry isn't a good defender.

Wanna go into more detail there? Maybe tell me why you aren't high on Lawson and Horford too? Why Horford can't anchor the defense for the few minutes KG is out? Why Wallace can't take advantage of Bradley/Monta when he (statistically) did with Nate Rob?

I appreciate everyone's opinion, but I'd like to see some actual backing up of opinions.
Carl Landry has below average length and quickness at the PF position (at least defensively). His so-so defensive instincts that leads to mediocre overall defensive ability. Offensive backup PF.

I'm not high on Lawson as the best player on a title team because:

1. Defensively he's a liability
2. He's up and down offensively with his decision making

He's a devastating speed threat who is an explosive scorer. But as a PG I don't think he's in a high enough class to make up for his D.

Al Horford puzzles me, I think he should be better than he is. He's efficient but unremarkable offensively. Doesn't create a ton of easy looks for himself and others much of the time. He can be too passive on that end as well, isn't a lead the team type scorer.

Defensively he's solid but not an anchor, doesn't protect the rim all that well or disrupt sets often enough.

He's also playing out of position for his entire career too so he's hard to judge. I just don' think they can be the 1/2 on a title team.

Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #137 on: September 12, 2013, 05:36:06 PM »

Offline AB_Celtic

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Yeah Landry isn't a good defender.

Wanna go into more detail there? Maybe tell me why you aren't high on Lawson and Horford too? Why Horford can't anchor the defense for the few minutes KG is out? Why Wallace can't take advantage of Bradley/Monta when he (statistically) did with Nate Rob?

I appreciate everyone's opinion, but I'd like to see some actual backing up of opinions.
Carl Landry has below average length and quickness at the PF position (at least defensively). His so-so defensive instincts that leads to mediocre overall defensive ability. Offensive backup PF.

I'm not high on Lawson as the best player on a title team because:

1. Defensively he's a liability
2. He's up and down offensively with his decision making

He's a devastating speed threat who is an explosive scorer. But as a PG I don't think he's in a high enough class to make up for his D.

Al Horford puzzles me, I think he should be better than he is. He's efficient but unremarkable offensively. Doesn't create a ton of easy looks for himself and others much of the time. He can be too passive on that end as well, isn't a lead the team type scorer.

Defensively he's solid but not an anchor, doesn't protect the rim all that well or disrupt sets often enough.

He's also playing out of position for his entire career too so he's hard to judge. I just don' think they can be the 1/2 on a title team.

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on Landry. I see his combination of quickness and strength as an asset defensively. To be clear: I'm not claiming he's elite defensively, I'm claiming that he's not a liability and helps a little. And one thing we can all agree on is he's one of the best offensive backup PFs in the league.

Lawson cannot be the sole best player on a title team, but when surrounded by the pieces that Cleveland has, he can be the leading scorer on a title team. Lawson may be streaky in terms of scoring, but he's still crazy efficient, and he doesn't turn the ball over much either. We knew that Lawson's defense was suspect, so who did we take at SG? One of the best wing defenders in the league. This will more than offset Lawson's defensive deficiencies.

Horford is unremarkable because he plays next to a player that steals the spotlight. You do not need to be remarkable to help your team win, and Horford certainly helps us win, and can be the best player on our team if the fit is there at the other spots. 17, 10 and 3 while shooting over 50% and earning nearly 9 win shares is pretty impressive. And don't you think he's good enough to hold down a defense for 13 minutes per game when KG rests? I do.



Everyone is focusing a little too much on the individual parts, rather than the sum of those parts.

Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #138 on: September 12, 2013, 06:12:02 PM »

Offline Lucky17

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Starting Lineup for Finals

1 - Ellis
2 - Bradley
3 - James
4 - Ibaka
5 - Jordan

In this series with Cleveland having slight framed big men, expect a lot of James-Ibaka at the 4 & 5 spots which allow Korver, Battier, & Chalmers to sub in regularly.

Ask any and all questions regarding Minnesota's offense/defense, Cleveland's offense/defense, or strategy related questions.

Thanks-

McHP

McHP,

Can you talk a little bit about any adjustments to the Minnesota offense if Tony Allen takes away Monta Ellis' ability to slash his way into the paint?
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Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #139 on: September 12, 2013, 06:48:05 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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Not to speak for McHP, but I'd likely use a lineup of Ibaka/James/Battier/Korver/Chalmers more often than not.  Maybe sub Jordan for Ibaka if he struggles to guard either of the Cavs bigs. 

That seems to be the lineup that would put the most strain on the Cavs to defend, while not really allowing them to keep their best defenders on the court, if they hope to keep up with the scoring ability of that lineup. 

Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #140 on: September 12, 2013, 07:16:04 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Not to speak for McHP, but I'd likely use a lineup of Ibaka/James/Battier/Korver/Chalmers more often than not.  Maybe sub Jordan for Ibaka if he struggles to guard either of the Cavs bigs. 

That seems to be the lineup that would put the most strain on the Cavs to defend, while not really allowing them to keep their best defenders on the court, if they hope to keep up with the scoring ability of that lineup.
I think Cleveland counters that going big. Yes, Lebron will get his in that lineup nut if he is cold or isn't involving others, or the others aren't hitting, Cleveland will clean up on the boards and dominate the offensive boards and the interior when they play offensively

Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #141 on: September 12, 2013, 07:37:13 PM »

Offline Kane3387

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I simply see too much Lebron in this series. Sounds like a cop out but it's not. I thought the last two teams minny faced should've beat them regardless of ownership.

When minny goes small i don't think Cleveland has the size to make them pay. Kg and horford aren't really any bigger then Ibaka and James. And they're a whole lot less athletic,

Minny has a versatility advantage here. If Bradley can limit rose or rondo then he can limit Lawson.

Minny wins the title IMO.


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Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #142 on: September 12, 2013, 09:19:11 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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My view on this is that both teams are amongst the best defensive teams in this game. So therefore, I see a lot of low scoring affairs.

But if that's the case, obviously Lebron is going to get his but who else on an offensively challenged Timberwolves squad is going to get any more? I think the Cavs have enough more offensive versatility than the Wolves. The Cavs can get 15 points a night from 5 different guys(Lawson, KG, Landry, Horford, Crawford) and maybe more from some, whereas the TWolves have Lebron and Ellis if he is chucking that will score against this tough Cavs defense.

I just feel the balanced scoring, as good if not better defense and the very obvious dominance of the boards makes Cleveland the team to beat.

Defense and rebounding, especially if you can have balanced scoring and the opposition has to shut down a whole team and not just one or possibly two guys.

Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #143 on: September 12, 2013, 09:58:05 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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My view on this is that both teams are amongst the best defensive teams in this game. So therefore, I see a lot of low scoring affairs.

But if that's the case, obviously Lebron is going to get his but who else on an offensively challenged Timberwolves squad is going to get any more? I think the Cavs have enough more offensive versatility than the Wolves. The Cavs can get 15 points a night from 5 different guys(Lawson, KG, Landry, Horford, Crawford) and maybe more from some, whereas the TWolves have Lebron and Ellis if he is chucking that will score against this tough Cavs defense.

I just feel the balanced scoring, as good if not better defense and the very obvious dominance of the boards makes Cleveland the team to beat.

Defense and rebounding, especially if you can have balanced scoring and the opposition has to shut down a whole team and not just one or possibly two guys.

This is pretty much how I see things, too.

But, what do the Commish and the two-time champ know? ;)


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Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #144 on: September 12, 2013, 11:13:47 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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My view on this is that both teams are amongst the best defensive teams in this game. So therefore, I see a lot of low scoring affairs.

But if that's the case, obviously Lebron is going to get his but who else on an offensively challenged Timberwolves squad is going to get any more? I think the Cavs have enough more offensive versatility than the Wolves. The Cavs can get 15 points a night from 5 different guys(Lawson, KG, Landry, Horford, Crawford) and maybe more from some, whereas the TWolves have Lebron and Ellis if he is chucking that will score against this tough Cavs defense.

I just feel the balanced scoring, as good if not better defense and the very obvious dominance of the boards makes Cleveland the team to beat.

Defense and rebounding, especially if you can have balanced scoring and the opposition has to shut down a whole team and not just one or possibly two guys.

This is pretty much how I see things, too.

But, what do the Commish and the two-time champ know? ;)

Reminds me of:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siRWRFWLtCs&sns=em

"You've gotta respect a 15-percent 3-point shooter. A guy
like that is always lethal." - Evan 'The God' Turner

Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #145 on: September 12, 2013, 11:46:38 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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Does voting end tonight? 

Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #146 on: September 12, 2013, 11:48:27 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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like that is always lethal." - Evan 'The God' Turner

Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #147 on: September 12, 2013, 11:50:28 PM »

Offline Lucky17

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Voting open for two days, no?

Polls open at 12 noon EST Sept. 12th. Close 11:59:59PM  Sept. 13th. PM all votes to me and just provide me your 2013 CB Draft winning team.
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Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #148 on: September 12, 2013, 11:53:13 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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Voting open for two days, no?

Polls open at 12 noon EST Sept. 12th. Close 11:59:59PM  Sept. 13th. PM all votes to me and just provide me your 2013 CB Draft winning team.

Indeed, my mistake. Good, I hadn't felt great about my vote.

"You've gotta respect a 15-percent 3-point shooter. A guy
like that is always lethal." - Evan 'The God' Turner

Re: 2013 CB Draft Finals: Minnesota(1) vs Cleveland(3)
« Reply #149 on: September 13, 2013, 12:03:32 AM »

Offline indeedproceed

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LeBron James is a career 43.2% shooter against the Clippers. Someone explain that to me.

"You've gotta respect a 15-percent 3-point shooter. A guy
like that is always lethal." - Evan 'The God' Turner