Author Topic: All is not well in San Antonio according to Woj  (Read 7491 times)

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Re: All is not well in San Antonio according to Woj
« Reply #60 on: January 25, 2018, 12:19:48 AM »

Offline celticsclay

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Spurs up 8 on Cavs at end of 3rd.  Something tells me if you swapped LeBron onto Spurs and then swapped Pop and Lue the score would not be reversed.

Cavs were actually 2.5 point favorites for that game last and are having major issues with chemistry, lineups, role and effort. So maybe it would.

I'll actually just add this probably isn't a differing viewpoint we will be able to resolve. There really aren't any advanced stats for coaching to wins. Many of these players have only ever played under pops and no other coach. I have seen pops coach many games where he sat his star players and the backups still won the game or came very darn near (more talking about regular season which is what we are talking about with these records). I believe if you gave Pops Love, IT, Wade, Shumpert, Frye, Thompson, Green, Osman etc they would be a 55 win juggernaut. He would immediately stop playing Love out of position, would get better effort out of players like Thompson and Green and would probably immediately cut Jr Smith. Inversely if you put Anderson, Green, Gay, Parker, Gasol, Aldridge under Lue I think they would all regress and become a 45 win team or worse. I think very highly of Pops and very lowly of Lue. However, as I said there isn't really a way to change these opinions for either of us. The closest we may get is Lue getting fired if they lose their next game and see how much better the Cavs perform with a new coach...(which will stink as a Celtics fan if it happens)

Just following up on this, tonight on the second night of a back to back, the Spurs without Aldridge, Leonard, Ginobli, Gay or green have a 10 point lead in Memphis! I take it back. I think pops wins 60 with the talent in Cleveland. Wow

It's impressive for sure. Memphis wasn't full strength either though. Tyreke Evans, JaMychal Green, and Jarell Martin were all not playing. Memphis was starting Andrew Harrison and Ivan Rabb along with Brooks/Gasol/Selden.

This post was riddled with mistakes I don't feel like digging around to correct, my
Mistake.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2018, 02:54:03 AM by celticsclay »

Re: All is not well in San Antonio according to Woj
« Reply #61 on: January 25, 2018, 02:06:32 AM »

Offline rondofan1255

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Spurs up 8 on Cavs at end of 3rd.  Something tells me if you swapped LeBron onto Spurs and then swapped Pop and Lue the score would not be reversed.

Cavs were actually 2.5 point favorites for that game last and are having major issues with chemistry, lineups, role and effort. So maybe it would.

I'll actually just add this probably isn't a differing viewpoint we will be able to resolve. There really aren't any advanced stats for coaching to wins. Many of these players have only ever played under pops and no other coach. I have seen pops coach many games where he sat his star players and the backups still won the game or came very darn near (more talking about regular season which is what we are talking about with these records). I believe if you gave Pops Love, IT, Wade, Shumpert, Frye, Thompson, Green, Osman etc they would be a 55 win juggernaut. He would immediately stop playing Love out of position, would get better effort out of players like Thompson and Green and would probably immediately cut Jr Smith. Inversely if you put Anderson, Green, Gay, Parker, Gasol, Aldridge under Lue I think they would all regress and become a 45 win team or worse. I think very highly of Pops and very lowly of Lue. However, as I said there isn't really a way to change these opinions for either of us. The closest we may get is Lue getting fired if they lose their next game and see how much better the Cavs perform with a new coach...(which will stink as a Celtics fan if it happens)

Just following up on this, tonight on the second night of a back to back, the Spurs without Aldridge, Leonard, Ginobli, Gay or green have a 10 point lead in Memphis! I take it back. I think pops wins 60 with the talent in Cleveland. Wow

It's impressive for sure. Memphis wasn't full strength either though. Tyreke Evans, JaMychal Green, and Jarell Martin were all not playing. Memphis was starting Andrew Harrison and Ivan Rabb along with Brooks/Gasol/Selden.

The game was in Memphis. Evans is a significant player but the other two combine for 16 points a game and have only started something like 15 games combined. Aldridge, Green, and gay are all starters that combine for 42 points a game. So kind of a weird response.

Edit looked up someone besides green by accident, he has started 30 games but point is the same.

Tyreke is huge with how bad Mario Chalmers post-injury and Harrison are. He's as important as Dinwiddie with the Nets.
JaMychal and Jarell have played well recently. At least eye test wise, probably numbers too. Not season-long stats. Memphis is a weird example because of how bad they have been with Tyreke and Gasol available.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2018, 02:17:21 AM by rondofan1255 »

Re: All is not well in San Antonio according to Woj
« Reply #62 on: January 25, 2018, 02:56:49 AM »

Offline celticsclay

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Spurs up 8 on Cavs at end of 3rd.  Something tells me if you swapped LeBron onto Spurs and then swapped Pop and Lue the score would not be reversed.

Cavs were actually 2.5 point favorites for that game last and are having major issues with chemistry, lineups, role and effort. So maybe it would.

I'll actually just add this probably isn't a differing viewpoint we will be able to resolve. There really aren't any advanced stats for coaching to wins. Many of these players have only ever played under pops and no other coach. I have seen pops coach many games where he sat his star players and the backups still won the game or came very darn near (more talking about regular season which is what we are talking about with these records). I believe if you gave Pops Love, IT, Wade, Shumpert, Frye, Thompson, Green, Osman etc they would be a 55 win juggernaut. He would immediately stop playing Love out of position, would get better effort out of players like Thompson and Green and would probably immediately cut Jr Smith. Inversely if you put Anderson, Green, Gay, Parker, Gasol, Aldridge under Lue I think they would all regress and become a 45 win team or worse. I think very highly of Pops and very lowly of Lue. However, as I said there isn't really a way to change these opinions for either of us. The closest we may get is Lue getting fired if they lose their next game and see how much better the Cavs perform with a new coach...(which will stink as a Celtics fan if it happens)

Just following up on this, tonight on the second night of a back to back, the Spurs without Aldridge, Leonard, Ginobli, Gay  have a 10 point lead in Memphis! I take it back. I think pops wins 60 with the talent in Cleveland. Wow

It's impressive for sure. Memphis wasn't full strength either though. Tyreke Evans, JaMychal Green, and Jarell Martin were all not playing. Memphis was starting Andrew Harrison and Ivan Rabb along with Brooks/Gasol/Selden.

The game was in Memphis. Evans is a significant player but the other two combine for 16 points a game and have only started something like 15 games combined. Aldridge, Green, and gay are all starters that combine for 42 points a game. So kind of a weird response.

Edit looked up someone besides green by accident, he has started 30 games but point is the same.

Tyreke is huge with how bad Mario Chalmers post-injury and Harrison are. He's as important as Dinwiddie with the Nets.
JaMychal and Jarell have played well recently. At least eye test wise, probably numbers too. Not season-long stats. Memphis is a weird example because of how bad they have been with Tyreke and Gasol available.

I wasn't trying to say Memphis was great, but second night of a back to back to win by 23 is really impressive. I think with a depleted squad tonight it was just another case of pops being a dominant coach

Re: All is not well in San Antonio according to Woj
« Reply #63 on: January 25, 2018, 03:00:10 AM »

Offline rondofan1255

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Spurs up 8 on Cavs at end of 3rd.  Something tells me if you swapped LeBron onto Spurs and then swapped Pop and Lue the score would not be reversed.

Cavs were actually 2.5 point favorites for that game last and are having major issues with chemistry, lineups, role and effort. So maybe it would.

I'll actually just add this probably isn't a differing viewpoint we will be able to resolve. There really aren't any advanced stats for coaching to wins. Many of these players have only ever played under pops and no other coach. I have seen pops coach many games where he sat his star players and the backups still won the game or came very darn near (more talking about regular season which is what we are talking about with these records). I believe if you gave Pops Love, IT, Wade, Shumpert, Frye, Thompson, Green, Osman etc they would be a 55 win juggernaut. He would immediately stop playing Love out of position, would get better effort out of players like Thompson and Green and would probably immediately cut Jr Smith. Inversely if you put Anderson, Green, Gay, Parker, Gasol, Aldridge under Lue I think they would all regress and become a 45 win team or worse. I think very highly of Pops and very lowly of Lue. However, as I said there isn't really a way to change these opinions for either of us. The closest we may get is Lue getting fired if they lose their next game and see how much better the Cavs perform with a new coach...(which will stink as a Celtics fan if it happens)

Just following up on this, tonight on the second night of a back to back, the Spurs without Aldridge, Leonard, Ginobli, Gay  have a 10 point lead in Memphis! I take it back. I think pops wins 60 with the talent in Cleveland. Wow

It's impressive for sure. Memphis wasn't full strength either though. Tyreke Evans, JaMychal Green, and Jarell Martin were all not playing. Memphis was starting Andrew Harrison and Ivan Rabb along with Brooks/Gasol/Selden.

The game was in Memphis. Evans is a significant player but the other two combine for 16 points a game and have only started something like 15 games combined. Aldridge, Green, and gay are all starters that combine for 42 points a game. So kind of a weird response.

Edit looked up someone besides green by accident, he has started 30 games but point is the same.

Tyreke is huge with how bad Mario Chalmers post-injury and Harrison are. He's as important as Dinwiddie with the Nets.
JaMychal and Jarell have played well recently. At least eye test wise, probably numbers too. Not season-long stats. Memphis is a weird example because of how bad they have been with Tyreke and Gasol available.

I wasn't trying to say Memphis was great, but second night of a back to back to win by 23 is really impressive. I think with a depleted squad tonight it was just another case of pops being a dominant coach

Fair enough. My bad! Pops for Stevens and three unprotected FRP’s

Re: All is not well in San Antonio according to Woj
« Reply #64 on: January 25, 2018, 06:33:59 AM »

Offline Moranis

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Spurs up 8 on Cavs at end of 3rd.  Something tells me if you swapped LeBron onto Spurs and then swapped Pop and Lue the score would not be reversed.

Cavs were actually 2.5 point favorites for that game last and are having major issues with chemistry, lineups, role and effort. So maybe it would.

I'll actually just add this probably isn't a differing viewpoint we will be able to resolve. There really aren't any advanced stats for coaching to wins. Many of these players have only ever played under pops and no other coach. I have seen pops coach many games where he sat his star players and the backups still won the game or came very darn near (more talking about regular season which is what we are talking about with these records). I believe if you gave Pops Love, IT, Wade, Shumpert, Frye, Thompson, Green, Osman etc they would be a 55 win juggernaut. He would immediately stop playing Love out of position, would get better effort out of players like Thompson and Green and would probably immediately cut Jr Smith. Inversely if you put Anderson, Green, Gay, Parker, Gasol, Aldridge under Lue I think they would all regress and become a 45 win team or worse. I think very highly of Pops and very lowly of Lue. However, as I said there isn't really a way to change these opinions for either of us. The closest we may get is Lue getting fired if they lose their next game and see how much better the Cavs perform with a new coach...(which will stink as a Celtics fan if it happens)

Just following up on this, tonight on the second night of a back to back, the Spurs without Aldridge, Leonard, Ginobli, Gay or green have a 10 point lead in Memphis! I take it back. I think pops wins 60 with the talent in Cleveland. Wow

It's impressive for sure. Memphis wasn't full strength either though. Tyreke Evans, JaMychal Green, and Jarell Martin were all not playing. Memphis was starting Andrew Harrison and Ivan Rabb along with Brooks/Gasol/Selden.
and it is Memphis who without Conley is one of the worst, if not the worst, team in the league.
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Re: All is not well in San Antonio according to Woj
« Reply #65 on: January 25, 2018, 01:04:08 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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Spurs up 8 on Cavs at end of 3rd.  Something tells me if you swapped LeBron onto Spurs and then swapped Pop and Lue the score would not be reversed.

Cavs were actually 2.5 point favorites for that game last and are having major issues with chemistry, lineups, role and effort. So maybe it would.

I'll actually just add this probably isn't a differing viewpoint we will be able to resolve. There really aren't any advanced stats for coaching to wins. Many of these players have only ever played under pops and no other coach. I have seen pops coach many games where he sat his star players and the backups still won the game or came very darn near (more talking about regular season which is what we are talking about with these records). I believe if you gave Pops Love, IT, Wade, Shumpert, Frye, Thompson, Green, Osman etc they would be a 55 win juggernaut. He would immediately stop playing Love out of position, would get better effort out of players like Thompson and Green and would probably immediately cut Jr Smith. Inversely if you put Anderson, Green, Gay, Parker, Gasol, Aldridge under Lue I think they would all regress and become a 45 win team or worse. I think very highly of Pops and very lowly of Lue. However, as I said there isn't really a way to change these opinions for either of us. The closest we may get is Lue getting fired if they lose their next game and see how much better the Cavs perform with a new coach...(which will stink as a Celtics fan if it happens)

Just following up on this, tonight on the second night of a back to back, the Spurs without Aldridge, Leonard, Ginobli, Gay or green have a 10 point lead in Memphis! I take it back. I think pops wins 60 with the talent in Cleveland. Wow

It's impressive for sure. Memphis wasn't full strength either though. Tyreke Evans, JaMychal Green, and Jarell Martin were all not playing. Memphis was starting Andrew Harrison and Ivan Rabb along with Brooks/Gasol/Selden.
and it is Memphis who without Conley is one of the worst, if not the worst, team in the league.

Memphis had actually won 5 in a row at home prior to this game. They have also been above .500 for the last month (8-7) and certainly have not been playing like one of the worst teams in the league  . Someone like Sacramento that is 3-13 in their last 16 games is a whole different level. This isn't just my viewpoint, Memphis was only a 1 point underdog yesterday and got completely blown out. Pops is a masterful coach and should be admired more for what he does, even on days he is resting or missing multiple starters. Incredible coach and impressive performance....