Detroit Pistons are lucky...

[shut_the_gate]

That no one covers just how terrible of a decade they really had.

I think they get looked over because they have always hovered around the playoff spots similar to the Hornets but if you just look at their draft history it isn't a pretty picture.

2010- Drafted Greg Monroe over Hayward & George
2011- Drafted Brandon Knight over Kemba, Klay, Leonard, Vucevic
2012- Drafted Drummond which is their only hit of the decade
2013- Drafted KCP over CJ McCollum, Adams, Olynyk, Giannis
2014- Traded 1st round pick and Drafted Dinwiddie but gave up on him within 2 years for Jackson
2015- Drafted Stanley Johnson over Justise Winslow, Myles Turner, Devin Booker and Kelly Oubre Jr.
2016- Drafted Henry Ellenson over Malik Beasley, Caris LeVert, Pascal Siakam, Dejounte Murray
2017- Drafted Luke Kennard over Donovan Mitchell, Bam Adebayo, John Collins
2018- Traded 1st round pick for the corpse of Blake Griffin could have picked Michael Porter Jr.
2019- Drafted Sekou Doumbouya TBD

Very Grim

[Stig]

well they never had top drafts, so can't blame them as hard as kings, suns, Knicks, etc. They were ok for a few seasons in the last decade, at least now they have a good coach.

[Moranis]

well they never had top drafts, so can't blame them as hard as kings, suns, Knicks, etc. They were ok for a few seasons in the last decade, at least now they have a good coach.

they have been significantly worse with Casey then they were with SVG

[perks-a-beast]

Yeah that’s what happens when you wallow in mediocrity for a decade without bottoming out in the NBA. Detroit, Charlotte, Sacramento, New Orleans, Minnesota followed that same formula and look where it got them. Constantly drafting in the 6-14 range is a recipe for disaster.

The thing that really sucks with Detroit, though, is that I don’t see things being any brighter for them this decade. No real stars or young studs to speak of right now.

[shut_the_gate]

Yeah that’s what happens when you wallow in mediocrity for a decade without bottoming out in the NBA. Detroit, Charlotte, Sacramento, New Orleans, Minnesota followed that same formula and look where it got them. Constantly drafting in the 6-14 range is a recipe for disaster.

The thing that really sucks with Detroit, though, is that I don’t see things being any brighter for them this decade. No real stars or young studs to speak of right now.

I don't think you understand the point I was making, it's not that they should of bottomed out isn't that they drafted so poorly somehow, essential every year, like in 2010 they picked Monroe with the 7th pick when 9 and 10 were Hayward and George or 2010 when they used the 8th pick on Knight when Kemba was the next pick, Klay was 11 and Kawhi was 15. It's that some how through different administrations and different coaches they managed to always pick they wrong guy in their draft bracket and that is something no other team has done...it's amazing how bad they've drafted.

[footey]

Celtics have had a few head scratchers with mid round draft picks over the years. All teams have.

John Hollinger in recent podcast gave good perspective when looking at how a team in hindsight didn't draft someone taken later in the draft who turns out better than the guy they drafted:  The odds are pretty good that someone from the "field" will perform better than the guy you pick, just based on the raw numbers.  This is especially true when you pick outside the top part of the lottery.

[jambr380]

Celtics have had a few head scratchers with mid round draft picks over the years. All teams have.

John Hollinger in recent podcast gave good perspective when looking at how a team in hindsight didn't draft someone taken later in the draft who turns out better than the guy they drafted:  The odds are pretty good that someone from the "field" will perform better than the guy you pick, just based on the raw numbers.  This is especially true when you pick outside the top part of the lottery.

In general, I would agree with this (because it's definitely true), but the OPs take seems a bit different on this one. He is saying that someway, somehow the Pistons have got it wrong seemingly every single time in the last decade (Drummond is 'okay', but I guess he counts as a hit). And it's not like they've consistently been drafting in the mid-late part of the draft; most all of those picks were lottery picks. You'd think at some point, they would have drafted a player they could build around.

DET, even after many years of mediocrity are essentially back at ground zero once they trade Drummond (and, really, what are they going to get for him?) - with nothing to show for it.

[Fafnir]

The Pistons issue isn't that they've had misses, its that they haven't had any real franchise changing hits at all. Trading Middleton is perhaps the biggest "what could have been" for the Pistons.

Imagine if they'd built and added better around the talent base of Middleton/Drummond? Not a title team sure (neither are all-nba level talents), but certainly a playoff team and two pieces that could have been good sidekicks to an all-nba level guy if they'd acquired one.

[Stig]

Yeah that’s what happens when you wallow in mediocrity for a decade without bottoming out in the NBA. Detroit, Charlotte, Sacramento, New Orleans, Minnesota followed that same formula and look where it got them. Constantly drafting in the 6-14 range is a recipe for disaster.

The thing that really sucks with Detroit, though, is that I don’t see things being any brighter for them this decade. No real stars or young studs to speak of right now.

I don't think you understand the point I was making, it's not that they should of bottomed out isn't that they drafted so poorly somehow, essential every year, like in 2010 they picked Monroe with the 7th pick when 9 and 10 were Hayward and George or 2010 when they used the 8th pick on Knight when Kemba was the next pick, Klay was 11 and Kawhi was 15. It's that some how through different administrations and different coaches they managed to always pick they wrong guy in their draft bracket and that is something no other team has done...it's amazing how bad they've drafted.

I think you can apply that to many teams, for example SAC's draft history in the same years:
Cousins, Bismack Biyombo, Thomas Robinson, Ben McLemore, Willie Cauley-Stein, Marquese Chriss, De'Aaron Fox

they always draft in front of Pistons and 3 of the 7 picks are top 5, yet only Cousins and Fox are 'hits'. In the same period MIN only has 2.5 hits: KAT, Wiggins, both no.1, and Zack Lavine who they give away. Same story for Suns, Bulls, CHA

[Moranis]

Some of the analysis on their poor drafting is pretty strange.  Take Greg Monroe.  He was essentially a 15.5/9.5 guy for the Pistons.  It isn't really the Pistons fault that the league has taken a dramatic shift away from traditional centers like Monroe.  And even with all of that, Monroe still has the 4th most win shares from the draft. 

Or KCP.  He doesn't move the needle, but to put people like Adams or Olynyk as guys that they missed on seems strange.  Those guys don't move the needle either and selecting Giannis in that slot wasn't realistic.  The same is also true of Kawhi.  He couldn't realistically go where the Pistons were drafting (and he took years to develop). 

Brandon Knight looked like he was going to be a very good player.  He just can't stay healthy.  I think there are real arguments that if he had stayed healthy he might be as good as Kemba.  He certainly started off his career better.  Now if you want to chide the Pistons on that one, it should be for trading Knight, Middleton, and Kravstov for Brandon Jennings, though if Jennings doesn't get hurt who knows what he might have been.


And don't get me wrong, the Pistons haven't drafted well, but it is hard to draft where they have been drafting.  Moreso than any other tier the boom or bust potential is epic.  Look at other teams in that same area and compare drafting records.  The Hornets for example are worse drafters.  I mean seriously over the same time frame, Kemba is the only player drafted that would classify as even an average value pick (he is better than that) and most of their picks have been epic failures (which isn't the case with the Pistons).  The Bucks obviously hit with Giannis (and Brogdon as a 2nd round pick), but the rest of their drafting record has been very bad.  The Pelicans when they aren't in the top 6 have been awful.  It is just hard to draft in the back half of the lottery which is why you don't want to continually be in that draft position.  Even if you hit one in five times (which is probably about the ratio), the odds of that one being someone like Kawhi or Giannis (i.e. good enough to carry a franchise) are so small, hitting just once isn't going to elevate a team much.

[Walker Wiggle]

You could do this exercise with virtually any team in the league and make them look like morons.

[Atzar]

The Pistons are in a really bad place.

They're already one of the worst teams in the league in terms of home attendance, and that trend has been consistent over the past several years.  I believe they are actually dead last in percentage of home arena filled this season.  This is BEFORE the deep rebuild that is looming in front of them; it's only getting worse from here. 

They don't have a way to accelerate the process like we did.  Griffin, with his current injury, is untradeable.  He's a $100M paperweight.  Jackson has no value, unless a team wants the expiring contract.  I expect them to trade Drummond, but I think the return will be modest.  Derrick Rose likely has some value.  Nobody else on that roster is any better than okay. 

They project to have cap space after this season, but the upcoming FA class is lackluster after AD (almost all of the interesting players signed extensions) and no big free agent would go to the Pistons in their current state anyway.  So they really have no other choice but to do it the long way - bottom out and build through the draft.

So yeah.  Have fun with that, Detroit.

[Moranis]

I asked this elsewhere but seems to fit here.

Which team says no in a Griffin for Wall swap?

[tstorey_97]

Interesting debate. So much is luck.

Sam Presti picks - Durant, Westbrook, Harden, Ibaka which is good luck.
These players generate highlight reels for a number of years and can't win a title.

Bad luck.

Red Auerbach - Good luck picking players, but, he helped his own luck by being the man who invented the "modern" NBA game.

Perhaps, not for long, but, "today's NFL" is Belichick's.

Detroit hasn't had the luck and the management to seize whatever opportunity might arise.

Ainge hires Stevens. 2013/14 season...this guy, Jordan Crawford starts 39 games and is playing lights out. Ainge trades him before he wins too many games.

The management element here is "we need a higher pick." Thus, they get Smart at #6.

Ainge has had a couple of moments this year with five of his first round picks on the floor. Ainge, BTW has had bad "lottery luck" hasn't he?

Smart - Tatum - Brown - Robert  W - Grant W

Management got the team a shot at Irving - Davis - Brown, by trading  Kevin and Paul and this is how long it took to "get close again."

Pistoneees just shy on luck.

[gift]

I came in here thinking "how in the world are the detroit pistons lucky"?

well done.