I know what everyone is thinking!!!

[Chris22]

We are playing much better than I thought we would at this stage.

Now let's get Green and Young back on the court.

[greece66]

and maybe there isn't a "Jordan" or a "Duncan" coming out in next yr's. draft but i'd still like to see us get the best pick we can...since we're down in the basement anyway.

Amen

[Rondo9]

if this great play in pre-season meant we were going to win 45-50 games then i'd be enthused. but all this means is we're going to win 30-35 wins probably just miss the playoffs or be an 8 seed and get bounced in the 1st.

which does nothing for this team. people make too big a deal out of young guys getting playoff experience, which in some cases it is valuable. but in our case imo all we're doing is getting these young guys playoff experience for another team...or at least most of 'em.

And it means that they young guys are growing. If the Celtics make the playoffs, then it mostly means that Smart, Olynyk, Bradley, Sullinger, Zeller and Young are playing very well it's step in the right direction.

[GreenWarrior]

if this great play in pre-season meant we were going to win 45-50 games then i'd be enthused. but all this means is we're going to win 30-35 wins probably just miss the playoffs or be an 8 seed and get bounced in the 1st.

which does nothing for this team. people make too big a deal out of young guys getting playoff experience, which in some cases it is valuable. but in our case imo all we're doing is getting these young guys playoff experience for another team...or at least most of 'em.

And it means that they young guys are growing. If the Celtics make the playoffs, then it mostly means that Smart, Olynyk, Bradley, Sullinger, Zeller and Young are playing very well it's step in the right direction.

if they're leading the way then, yes.

but if most of the mins. are going to bass, green, Wallace and i'll throw rondo in there for the hell of it, and the young guys are playing minimal mins. or playing the similar mins. to the start of last yr. then it doesn't mean anything for us.

[greece66]

Exactly my feelings.
The point is not to have a team that might make the playoffs this year.
The point is to be again a contender in 4-5 years.
This is what makes rebuilding so painful, but this is what it is.
Getting in the playoffs per se is irrelevant to the larger scheme of things.
Sure, we ll get a few more hours of televised fun but that's it.
Anything that does not contribute to developing talent and building team character is besides the point for the next couple of years.

[moiso]

Exactly my feelings.
The point is not to have a team that might make the playoffs this year.
The point is to be again a contender in 4-5 years.
This is what makes rebuilding so painful, but this is what it is.
Getting in the playoffs per se is irrelevant to the larger scheme of things.
Sure, we ll get a few more hours of televised fun but that's it.
Anything that does not contribute to developing talent and building team character is besides the point for the next couple of years.

I think 4-5 years is a ridiculously slow goal.  Once Ainge can make one big trade he will immediately try to fill in the blanks to create a contender.  Ainge wants that to happen yesterday, but 1-2 years may be more realistic.

[Rondo9]

Exactly my feelings.
The point is not to have a team that might make the playoffs this year.
The point is to be again a contender in 4-5 years.
This is what makes rebuilding so painful, but this is what it is.
Getting in the playoffs per se is irrelevant to the larger scheme of things.
Sure, we ll get a few more hours of televised fun but that's it.
Anything that does not contribute to developing talent and building team character is besides the point for the next couple of years.

But if they make the playoffs then it's most likely a testament to the developing of talent and team character. You have to make the playoffs if you want to contend and if these young guys help contribute to a Celtic playoff push this year then isn't that making progress?

[greece66]

1. Well, Ainge might do again something spectacular in the 2007-08 fashion, but I think it is highly unlikely. We all followed the Love Affair this summer. We were not even close to getting him. (And even with Love we would not be a contender).
And, besides, we don't want again a team with a short expiry date like the 2008 one. I might be wrong, but I think the plan is to form a core of good players in their mid-twenties who will have been playing for some time together under the guidance of Stevens. This will take time, but once in place it will make us a top-5 team for a good period of time. It is the Philly plan executed in a better way.
And, yes, building a contender takes time and/or luck. The Cavs were really lucky with LBJ and OKC with KD, but what about the other teams? Have you seen how long it took the LAC to build a contender? And look at all the other teams struggling (so far with only partial success) to get there- Washington, Portland, Chicago... What makes you think we can make it faster than they, especially given they right now have way more assets than we do?
2. The problem with seriously competing for the playoffs is that we will most likely end up 9th or 10th, which is the worst place to be. I think we will push for the playoffs only if (around December) we feel confident we can get something more than the 8th place, but this is highly unlikely.

[greece66]

and a playoff team. Atlanta for instance is a playoff team, but IMHO has way less chances than we to reach contender status in the next five years or so.

[Rondo9]

1. Well, Ainge might do again something spectacular in the 2007-08 fashion, but I think it is highly unlikely. We all followed the Love Affair this summer. We were not even close to getting him. (And even with Love we would not be a contender).
And, besides, we don't want again a team with a short expiry date like the 2008 one. I might be wrong, but I think the plan is to form a core of good players in their mid-twenties who will have been playing for some time together under the guidance of Stevens. This will take time, but once in place it will make us a top-5 team for a good period of time. It is the Philly plan executed in a better way.
And, yes, building a contender takes time and/or luck. The Cavs were really lucky with LBJ and OKC with KD, but what about the other teams? Have you seen how long it took the LAC to build a contender? And look at all the other teams struggling (so far with only partial success) to get there- Washington, Portland, Chicago... What makes you think we can make it faster than they, especially given they right now have way more assets than we do?
2. The problem with seriously competing for the playoffs is that we will most likely end up 9th or 10th, which is the worst place to be. I think we will push for the playoffs only if (around December) we feel confident we can get something more than the 8th place, but this is highly unlikely.

Washington and Portland are rising teams, and you haven't answered my question: If this young team makes the playoffs, isn't that progress in the development phase.

[hwangjini_1]

No one wants to say anything good in fear of everything turning to crap. without going overboard after only two preseason games I will say I am impressed with the Celtic's defense and also with them constantly pushing the ball up the floor on offense.

I just can't spend all year hating on individuals on this team and cheering for tanking. this team is going to be exciting to watch and may finish higher in the standings than you think.

sorry. but you dont know what i am thinking, let alone everyone else. but i like your enthusiasm, so tp for the thread. 

[DesertDweller]

Our team is going to get owned nightly once the regular season starts.   Pretty terrible collection of talent.  30 wins would be overachieving.

How are the Celtics talent "terrible"?

This guy has always got something bad to say, never anything positive.  starting to make me sick.  you will notice there is one cliché on this board that deliberately goads anything you think is good!!!

[GreenWarrior]

Exactly my feelings.
The point is not to have a team that might make the playoffs this year.
The point is to be again a contender in 4-5 years.
This is what makes rebuilding so painful, but this is what it is.
Getting in the playoffs per se is irrelevant to the larger scheme of things.
Sure, we ll get a few more hours of televised fun but that's it.
Anything that does not contribute to developing talent and building team character is besides the point for the next couple of years.

But if they make the playoffs then it's most likely a testament to the developing of talent and team character. You have to make the playoffs if you want to contend and if these young guys help contribute to a Celtic playoff push this year then isn't that making progress?

again, if the playoffs happen because olynyk, Sully and Smart magically become 20-10 guys(or something like that) then great! that's progress.

but if Green, Rondo, Wallace and Bass are getting the mins.? these kids could have all the character in the world and it won't make their team be any better.

I hate to break it to C's fans but there is no Pierce on this team right now. we have some nice players but that 's about it. no superstar though. and how did we get Pierce? by being bad.

this league is very simple. you have the stars - you win.

now, i'm not one for tanking. tanking would imply trying to lose games on purpose. that's not what i'm saying. i'm saying, if these young guys of ours are so good? then hand the reigns over to them. if we win, then the future is bright. if we lose, then we know these guys need a star and they may get it with the lousy record they had.

i'd rather see a young team lose than a bunch of mediocre veterans make an 8 seed and get bounced.

[Rondo9]

Exactly my feelings.
The point is not to have a team that might make the playoffs this year.
The point is to be again a contender in 4-5 years.
This is what makes rebuilding so painful, but this is what it is.
Getting in the playoffs per se is irrelevant to the larger scheme of things.
Sure, we ll get a few more hours of televised fun but that's it.
Anything that does not contribute to developing talent and building team character is besides the point for the next couple of years.

But if they make the playoffs then it's most likely a testament to the developing of talent and team character. You have to make the playoffs if you want to contend and if these young guys help contribute to a Celtic playoff push this year then isn't that making progress?

again, if the playoffs happen because olynyk, Sully and Smart magically become 20-10 guys(or something like that) then great! that's progress.

but if Green, Rondo, Wallace and Bass are getting the mins.? these kids could have all the character in the world and it won't make their team be any better.

I hate to break it to C's fans but there is no Pierce on this team right now. we have some nice players but that 's about it. no superstar though. and how did we get Pierce? by being bad.

this league is very simple. you have the stars - you win.

now, i'm not one for tanking. tanking would imply trying to lose games on purpose. that's not what i'm saying. i'm saying, if these young guys of ours are so good? then hand the reigns over to them. if we win, then the future is bright. if we lose, then we know these guys need a star and they may get it with the lousy record they had.

i'd rather see a young team lose than a bunch of mediocre veterans make an 8 seed and get bounced.

The celtics have mixture of veteran talent and youngsters if they're going to make the playoffs it'll require rondo green bass if he's on the team and the young players to play well it's going to be a team effort the young guys will get their mintues to show what they got And it's not mediocrity if you have a ton of draft picks and expiring contracts in the future

[GreenWarrior]

Exactly my feelings.
The point is not to have a team that might make the playoffs this year.
The point is to be again a contender in 4-5 years.
This is what makes rebuilding so painful, but this is what it is.
Getting in the playoffs per se is irrelevant to the larger scheme of things.
Sure, we ll get a few more hours of televised fun but that's it.
Anything that does not contribute to developing talent and building team character is besides the point for the next couple of years.

But if they make the playoffs then it's most likely a testament to the developing of talent and team character. You have to make the playoffs if you want to contend and if these young guys help contribute to a Celtic playoff push this year then isn't that making progress?

again, if the playoffs happen because olynyk, Sully and Smart magically become 20-10 guys(or something like that) then great! that's progress.

but if Green, Rondo, Wallace and Bass are getting the mins.? these kids could have all the character in the world and it won't make their team be any better.

I hate to break it to C's fans but there is no Pierce on this team right now. we have some nice players but that 's about it. no superstar though. and how did we get Pierce? by being bad.

this league is very simple. you have the stars - you win.

now, i'm not one for tanking. tanking would imply trying to lose games on purpose. that's not what i'm saying. i'm saying, if these young guys of ours are so good? then hand the reigns over to them. if we win, then the future is bright. if we lose, then we know these guys need a star and they may get it with the lousy record they had.

i'd rather see a young team lose than a bunch of mediocre veterans make an 8 seed and get bounced.

The celtics have mixture of veteran talent and youngsters if they're going to make the playoffs it'll require rondo green bass if he's on the team and the young players to play well it's going to be a team effort the young guys will get their mintues to show what they got And it's not mediocrity if you have a ton of draft picks and expiring contracts in the future

that no one wanted this summer.