#DeflateGate (Court of Appeals Reinstates Suspension)

[footey]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/01/22/nfl-investigators-have-visited-browns-over-in-game-texting/

When is the national media going to descend on Cleveland over text-gate?  oh wait, there not because the entire league is jealous of them?  hmmm

If the Browns were in the Super Bowl, I'm sure the media would be all over them, although maybe not to this extent.  Similarly, if the Pats had lost last week, the media scrutiny would be less, although I'm sure there would be some due to Spygate, etc.

That is laughable.

[Donoghus]

Also Roy, not sure if this has been posted yet, but a NON patriots source on ball firmness 

The MMQB @theMMQB 
  ·  17h 17 hours ago   
Again, from our informal test, diff between 12.5 and 10.5 psi is practically imperceptible. 10.5 definitely not soft.

"Practically imperceptible" and "imperceptible" aren't equivalent.

Similarly, "not soft" doesn't equal "not softer".

haha ok.  I mean I guess to me, if a guy who is only trying to tell the difference between a 12.5 and 10.5 psi ball thinks its practically imperceptible, it would be imperceptible for a guy who is trying to throw the ball with linemen bearing down on him or trying to catch a ball while protecting himself from impending doom from a safety.

It'd be imperceptible in the course of the game when the QB is simply going through the motions of getting the ball snapped to him and trying to either hand it off or get it out of his hands ASAP, IMO.  They're not taking the time to grip it and play around with it in between plays. There's a possibility they could pick up on it while on the sideline but even I would doubt that  Also, keep in mind that the referees had no clue in the first half that the balls they were spotting were under-inflated.

If someone can actually notice a 2 psi difference, good for them because my guess is that its close [dang] near impossible unless you're consciously being told there is a difference or are consciously looking for a difference.

[Roy H.]

Jemele Hill @jemelehill 
  ·  16h 16 hours ago   
Ironic: Every week, fans complain about how incompetent the officials are. Now suddenly they're incapable of making mistakes. OK.

Jemele Hill @jemelehill 
  ·  17h 17 hours ago   
Seriously ... Has anyone considered the fact that MAYBE the official who measured the footballs didn't do his job properly?

Now you're getting desperate, citing Jemele Hill.

[Roy H.]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/01/22/nfl-investigators-have-visited-browns-over-in-game-texting/

When is the national media going to descend on Cleveland over text-gate?  oh wait, there not because the entire league is jealous of them?  hmmm

If the Browns were in the Super Bowl, I'm sure the media would be all over them, although maybe not to this extent.  Similarly, if the Pats had lost last week, the media scrutiny would be less, although I'm sure there would be some due to Spygate, etc.

That is laughable.

Yeah, I'm starting to buy into the "persecution complex" argument a bit.

[Rondo2287]

Also Roy, not sure if this has been posted yet, but a NON patriots source on ball firmness 

The MMQB @theMMQB 
  ·  17h 17 hours ago   
Again, from our informal test, diff between 12.5 and 10.5 psi is practically imperceptible. 10.5 definitely not soft.

"Practically imperceptible" and "imperceptible" aren't equivalent.

Similarly, "not soft" doesn't equal "not softer".

haha ok.  I mean I guess to me, if a guy who is only trying to tell the difference between a 12.5 and 10.5 psi ball thinks its practically imperceptible, it would be imperceptible for a guy who is trying to throw the ball with linemen bearing down on him or trying to catch a ball while protecting himself from impending doom from a safety.

Again, Brady himself acknowledged that he likes a 12.5 ball -- rather than 13.5 -- because of the grip.

How can anybody then argue that he can't tell the difference between a 12.5 ball and a 10.5 ball? 

If Peter King could detect a difference (which he did), then why wouldn't the guy who meticulously selected the game balls earlier that day be able to tell?

Pats fans need to make up their minds:  is this a case of "everyone is looking for an edge, and QBs do this all the time, so it's no big deal" or is it "Tom Brady, Golden Boy, would never bend the rules or lie to the media"?

I think there is another option, which is the compilations of facts leading me to dismiss the whole thing

1. Its not a big deal because the supposed advantage gained is immaterial
2. the media is blowing it out of proportion
3. there is no evidence that the patriots did anything wrong
4. the supposed whistleblower said he didn't notice anything wrong with the football and wasn't the whistleblower
5. Its annoying that the patriots get an extra level of scrutiny because they are good and consistently succeeding in a league that is designed to promote parody

[Donoghus]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/01/22/nfl-investigators-have-visited-browns-over-in-game-texting/

When is the national media going to descend on Cleveland over text-gate?  oh wait, there not because the entire league is jealous of them?  hmmm

If the Browns were in the Super Bowl, I'm sure the media would be all over them, although maybe not to this extent.  Similarly, if the Pats had lost last week, the media scrutiny would be less, although I'm sure there would be some due to Spygate, etc.

That is laughable.

There's certainly a media double standard here.  If this was the Jacksonville Jaguars heading into the Super Bowl, the outrage (both real & faux) wouldn't nearly be as much.

Pats lost the benefit of the doubt with Spygate.  That put a target on Belichick as well as his career tug of war with the media and he sets himself up as a person that's always ripe for the picking.   Add in the team's success over the past 15 years and the often accompanied contempt for success and you have yourself a formula for exaggerated outrage and the idea of tearing down success. 

Pats brought it up themselves with Spygate among other things no doubt, but there is certainly a double standard here with the media too.

[footey]

Jemele Hill @jemelehill 
  ·  16h 16 hours ago   
Ironic: Every week, fans complain about how incompetent the officials are. Now suddenly they're incapable of making mistakes. OK.

Jemele Hill @jemelehill 
  ·  17h 17 hours ago   
Seriously ... Has anyone considered the fact that MAYBE the official who measured the footballs didn't do his job properly?

Now you're getting desperate, citing Jemele Hill.

She raises a legitimate point.  Why didn't the refs detect the underinflated balls? It is there job to enforce the rule. What possible explanation can you give that does not undermine your position that Brady could have detected the difference during the game.  There are so many possibilities of what could have happened here, some of which would find Brady and the Pats blameless. Am surprised that you, who by and large  one of the smartest, most impartial, members, of this Blog, would just assume the worst about Brady and the Pats.

Unless you enjoy tweaking Pats fans. Then I get it, but am disappointed in you.

[D.o.s.]

It's funny that everyone who is trying to dismiss this story has made impassioned arguments about why "It's not even a big deal, guys!" which has the net effect of keeping the story alive. It's like watching a child try to take the baseball home after an out because "I don't want to play anymore," and drawing even more attention to the out in the process.

Anyway, via deadspin. I laughed:




http://deadspin.com/a-nation-divided-1681328140

[Donoghus]

It's funny that everyone who is trying to dismiss this story has made impassioned arguments about why "It's not even a big deal, guys!" which has the net effect of keeping the story alive. It's like watching a child try to take the baseball home after an out because "I don't want to play anymore," and drawing even more attention to the out in the process.

Anyway, via deadspin. I laughed:




http://deadspin.com/a-nation-divided-1681328140

So what you're saying is that sports fans are rational beings? 

[Cman]

Also Roy, not sure if this has been posted yet, but a NON patriots source on ball firmness 

The MMQB @theMMQB 
  ·  17h 17 hours ago   
Again, from our informal test, diff between 12.5 and 10.5 psi is practically imperceptible. 10.5 definitely not soft.

"Practically imperceptible" and "imperceptible" aren't equivalent.

Similarly, "not soft" doesn't equal "not softer".

haha ok.  I mean I guess to me, if a guy who is only trying to tell the difference between a 12.5 and 10.5 psi ball thinks its practically imperceptible, it would be imperceptible for a guy who is trying to throw the ball with linemen bearing down on him or trying to catch a ball while protecting himself from impending doom from a safety.

Again, Brady himself acknowledged that he likes a 12.5 ball -- rather than 13.5 -- because of the grip.

How can anybody then argue that he can't tell the difference between a 12.5 ball and a 10.5 ball? 

If Peter King could detect a difference (which he did), then why wouldn't the guy who meticulously selected the game balls earlier that day be able to tell?

Pats fans need to make up their minds:  is this a case of "everyone is looking for an edge, and QBs do this all the time, so it's no big deal" or is it "Tom Brady, Golden Boy, would never bend the rules or lie to the media"?

Roy, your point is well taken, but I think the argument is that its one thing when before a game a QB is toying around with the balls, practicing with them, gripping them, throwing them, inspecting them, trying to detect little differences. But, it is then quite a different thing when in the heat of the game the ball is snapped to the QB, who either hands it off immediately or takes less than two seconds to pass to the ball. The weight and feel of the ball in the hand at that point is probably the last thing the QB is thinking of.

In addition, there's also no evidence that Brady ever used one of the deflated balls (there was a report of officials swapping out Pats balls for Colts balls), and its also not clear how underinflated the balls really were. The NFL will hopefully clear up these two points at some point soon (ie, which balls were played with and what the actual inflation was of all the balls).

Again, your point is well taken, and there is a lot of ex-post justification going on in this thread by Pats fans, myself included. But just want to point out why Brady's statements are not necessarily inconsistent, at least at this point in time given how little we know.

[Roy H.]

1. Its not a big deal because the supposed advantage gained is immaterial

I agree.  Theoretically, this could make a difference, but it clearly didn't in the Colts game.

2. the media is blowing it out of proportion

Agreed.  I think that's due to it being the lead up to the Super Bowl, along with the Patriots' history of cheating, but this isn't something that should be leading off the national evening news.

3. there is no evidence that the patriots did anything wrong

I disagree with you there.  Circumstantial evidence is evidence.  If only a couple of balls had been deflated, or if the Colts balls had been deflated, I'd agree.  Based on what we've heard so far, though, I think that it's not that hard to follow the logic chain.

4. the supposed whistleblower said he didn't notice anything wrong with the football and wasn't the whistleblower

I see this as irrelevant.  It's sloppy reporting by the media, but does it make a difference who pointed out the deflation?

5. Its annoying that the patriots get an extra level of scrutiny because they are good and consistently succeeding in a league that is designed to promote parody

Doesn't Spygate play a role here, along with some of the other unproven allegations (like the Patriots taping the Rams' practice, and knowing their calls put in place the week before the game)?

[Cman]

It's funny that everyone who is trying to dismiss this story has made impassioned arguments about why "It's not even a big deal, guys!" which has the net effect of keeping the story alive. It's like watching a child try to take the baseball home after an out because "I don't want to play anymore," and drawing even more attention to the out in the process.

Anyway, via deadspin. I laughed:




http://deadspin.com/a-nation-divided-1681328140

Connecticut, you traitors....

[Rondo2287]

It's funny that everyone who is trying to dismiss this story has made impassioned arguments about why "It's not even a big deal, guys!" which has the net effect of keeping the story alive. It's like watching a child try to take the baseball home after an out because "I don't want to play anymore," and drawing even more attention to the out in the process.

Anyway, via deadspin. I laughed:




http://deadspin.com/a-nation-divided-1681328140

Connecticut, you traitors....

I liked one of the comments, "NE you poor Edited for profanity.  Please do not do it again.s, even the oceans are against you"

[Cman]

1. Its not a big deal because the supposed advantage gained is immaterial

I agree.  Theoretically, this could make a difference, but it clearly didn't in the Colts game.

2. the media is blowing it out of proportion

Agreed.  I think that's due to it being the lead up to the Super Bowl, along with the Patriots' history of cheating, but this isn't something that should be leading off the national evening news.

3. there is no evidence that the patriots did anything wrong

I disagree with you there.  Circumstantial evidence is evidence.  If only a couple of balls had been deflated, or if the Colts balls had been deflated, I'd agree.  Based on what we've heard so far, though, I think that it's not that hard to follow the logic chain.

4. the supposed whistleblower said he didn't notice anything wrong with the football and wasn't the whistleblower

I see this as irrelevant.  It's sloppy reporting by the media, but does it make a difference who pointed out the deflation?

5. Its annoying that the patriots get an extra level of scrutiny because they are good and consistently succeeding in a league that is designed to promote parody

Doesn't Spygate play a role here, along with some of the other unproven allegations (like the Patriots taping the Rams' practice, and knowing their calls put in place the week before the game)?

Roy, if you grant that the media got it wrong in point 4, then can't you also consider that the media got it wrong on point 3? We are still waiting on confirmation from the NFL about how many balls were deflated and by how much.

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

It's funny that everyone who is trying to dismiss this story has made impassioned arguments about why "It's not even a big deal, guys!" which has the net effect of keeping the story alive. It's like watching a child try to take the baseball home after an out because "I don't want to play anymore," and drawing even more attention to the out in the process.

To me, it seems that Pats haters and those insisting that this is a huge deal and worthy of the death penalty are the ones keeping it alive.