Author Topic: Typical NBA  (Read 8503 times)

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Re: Typical NBA
« Reply #45 on: February 24, 2020, 02:11:54 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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The only call that still has me ticked is the out of bounds on JB call.

Yes the goaltend was a blown call but we won the jump ball and then sank a 3pointer.  So we ended up +1 out of the whole thing

....not to mention we got away with a goaltend on them as well.

At the end of the day Hayward missed an off balance layup and LeBron made a clutch shot.  That’s what lost the game

C’s didn’t win that jump. The Lakers didn’t score and then they cam down to shoot a 3. I get there are going to be bad calls in games but some of these calls were ridiculous. Did Marc Davis have money on the game? He was that bad. That T on Brad was a complete joke in that situation. Too many questionable calls by Marc Davis, either he just sucks as a ref or he is shady.

Fair enough.  There was still a missed goaltending call on us as well.  There was plenty of call that benefitted us as well.

Like I said, this game wasn’t decided by the refs.  The missed layup by Hayward and the fade-away by LeBron decided the game.

Yes. I came out of yesterday believing the C’s without question could have beaten the Lakers in the Staples Center.  Hayward’s miss was agonizing.   
Hayward misses shots sometimes at the rim that simply shouldn’t happen. This was obviously contested but he should have finished.  I think he is not skilled at making decisions at the rim and thus awkwardly finds himself between dunks and layups and the indecision costs him.  A crucial 4-point swing in this case that swung the game.

Just to inform:   Hayward has been by far the best of all our regulars at finishing at the rim this year.  He has an insane FG% within 3 feet of 75.6% (including last night).  The only guys on the entire roster with a higher percentage are Tremont, Tacko and Timelord, none of whom have anywhere near the sample size.  The next regular who is close to Hayward is Theis at 71.5%.

Hayward muffed two bunnies in this game.  And he was kicking himself afterward for it.  But don't confuse that with how good he has been at finishing this season.  He has been phenomenal at finishing at the rim this season.
NBA Officiating - Corrupt?  Incompetent?  Which is worse?  Does it matter?  It sucks.

Re: Typical NBA
« Reply #46 on: February 24, 2020, 03:01:25 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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What they should be taught instead by the NBA is to fear being guilty of making phantom calls.
This...many TPs!!!

Brian Scalabrini is saying it all the time on the NBCSB broadcasts, refs are guessing and assuming(specifically about fouls on Smart, but also in general). They see an outcome and assume the foul without actually seeing one. As Scal says "You have to be sure!"

And he is right. They do guess way to often. That Marc Davis call on the JB out of bounds was another great example. Davis saw the ball and Jaylen coming at him, closed his eyes, turned his head and just assumed there was no way Brown could stay in bounds and so assumed he was and called it that way. He guessed.

These phantom calls, guesses, assumptions based on outcomes need to stop. It might not be a total fix, but it will help.

If I can add one more...

The biggest thing that drives me absolutely insane whether we benefit from it or not, is the officials waiting to see if the ball goes in before they call a foul.  It’s either a foul or it isn’t.  It happened in yesterday’s game too, Lebons goes for a layup in the post and the ball rolls around on the rim for a second and then rolls out, as soon as the ball rolls out they blow the whistle for a foul on Jaylen.

After seeing the replay, Jaylen clearly fouled him but the fact that they do this drives me nuts.  It’s more proof to the point that they try to control the flow of the game as much as they can instead of just officiating it.
I wonder how much of the late whistle call is the ref trying to be dramatic and get eyes on him making the animated "and 1". So many ex-players say the refs have egos and want people to know who they are, that they are also part of "the show".

If that's true, it explains why refs might delay those calls, hoping the shot goes down and the ref can now be the focus on television with the whole, animated foul call and arm movement showing an "and 1" while the crowd roars approval.

Refs need to realize, they aren't "the show", they are simply props on the stage. If they are doing their jobs correctly, no one should know their names.

I don't think so - most actual And-1s are blown before the shot goes in.

Sometimes they're clearly applying an "advantage gained" policy where if the shot goes in anyway no foul, especially on one-on-one meetings at the basket. Others there's just a natural hesitation before the contact registered. The nagging problem is judging outcomes over actions - it's the same reason why a guy like IT could draw fouls from less contact than a guy like Shaq, who got clobbered constantly without a whistle because it didn't slow him down.

There's a real interesting philosophical conversation that could be had about whether contact should be called based on what it is rather than what it does. But it's pretty clear the refs defer to impact a lot.

Re: Typical NBA
« Reply #47 on: February 24, 2020, 05:35:33 PM »

Offline petbrick

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The solution is to boycott the NBA.

As long as a lot of fans pay to watch the NBA, they will never change their ways.


I contact them regularly through email and they routinely respond back. If enough of us make a habit of this, they'll be forced to deal with it.

NBA coaching staffs need more challenges. One per quarter would greatly help. The "overturns" need to be kept track of and then the worst of the offenders need to be suspended and retrained. (Or perhaps a different career choice.)

The NBA has by far the worst officiating of any organized professional sport.

Agree, part of it may be short attention span of modern life due to tech (something like a cousin of laziness when it comes to keen observational power, affecting a fast game like basketball more than other sports), but more than that probably poor training and guidelines handed down from above.

The more likely culprit is actually a different problem with technology: the medium (broadcasting) has become so much more advanced that the cameras have a better view of the game than the referees themselves. It's the same reason why teams have had to diversify what they offer to the live fans so much more -- the best seats in the house are increasingly being at home on the sofa.

So. You have a league that has been operating with three referees on the floor for 30 years that doesn't want to move one of those guys to the video booth for all sorts of reasons (or add a fourth to the booth), mostly because the skill it takes to be an NBA ref is, jokes aside, pretty substantial - remember the replacement refs they tried during the 09-10 preseason? It was a hot mess, even for preseason, because it turns out, the job is pretty hard!

In other words: You have a situation that basically demands someone advise the refs from a video booth (because these instant replay reviews are horrific), with no one to put there - and also, would people trust this ref more than the on-the-floor refs? Debatable.

Interesting read on the subject, though:
https://media.thinknum.com/articles/these-are-nba-referees-who-blow-the-most-calls-2019-season/

Re: Typical NBA
« Reply #48 on: February 24, 2020, 05:37:05 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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Good news, the NBA's last 2 minutes report says that every single call was correct!  ::)

Re: Typical NBA
« Reply #49 on: February 24, 2020, 05:57:53 PM »

Offline footey

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Scott Foster among the best?

Who knew??!!

Re: Typical NBA
« Reply #50 on: February 24, 2020, 05:59:22 PM »

Offline petbrick

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Scott Foster among the best?

Who knew??!!

Would be interesting to see how it looks if you filtered the data down to just games featuring the Celtics. I presume he would move to (what my totally subjective fan experience suggests is) his rightful spot at the top of the trash pile.

Re: Typical NBA
« Reply #51 on: February 24, 2020, 11:31:18 PM »

Offline liam

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Re: Typical NBA
« Reply #52 on: February 24, 2020, 11:50:59 PM »

Offline RockinRyA

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Good news, the NBA's last 2 minutes report says that every single call was correct!  ::)

The pinky touch wasnt in that report. Maybe those arent being reviewed? Pretty weird since they reviewed that in game.

Re: Typical NBA
« Reply #53 on: February 25, 2020, 09:34:33 AM »

Offline mmmmm

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Would be nice if it was a freaking FIVE minute report so that it would include THIS horrendous mess-up by Davis

https://stats.nba.com/events/?flag=1&GameID=0021900842&GameEventID=612&Season=2019-20&title=Hayward%20Out%20of%20Bounds%20-%20Bad%20Pass%20Turnover%20Turnover%20(P3.T15)

Of course, the nba.com site doesn't include the camera views that show that Jaylen wasn't even close to being out-of-bounds.   This view does show that Davis is busy ducking and dodging out of the way and no way could he have seen whether Jaylen stepped out yet blew the whistle anyway.
NBA Officiating - Corrupt?  Incompetent?  Which is worse?  Does it matter?  It sucks.