Trade Irving for the sake of the team

[KGs Knee]

To simply state the Celts are a better team without Kyrie is borderline ridiculous.

It's not just ridiculous, it's factually untrue. The stats clearly show the team is better with Kyrie than without him.

But you'll only casually see posters like the OP even attempt to address this, because they know they can't, and deep down know their opinions are unsubstantiated horse crap based on nothing but incorrect observations.

This thread for the most part is just a running joke at this point. Sure, I'm not against trading Kyrie it actually brought back a better player. But the OP originally proposed a farcical trade idea, and has then used the rest of the thread to try to convince the rest of us Kyrie makes the team worse despite the facts demonstrating the opposite.

But the saddest part of it all is that the OP isn't alone, and there are a handful of other posters here who are apparently just as incapable of looking at facts and drawing reasonable conclusions. Basically we've got a thread full of Donald Trump wannabes.

[Tr1boy]

To simply state the Celts are a better team without Kyrie is borderline ridiculous.

It's not just ridiculous, it's factually untrue. The stats clearly show the team is better with Kyrie than without him.

But you'll only casually see posters like the OP even attempt to address this, because they know they can't, and deep down know their opinions are unsubstantiated horse crap based on nothing but incorrect observations.

This thread for the most part is just a running joke at this point. Sure, I'm not against trading Kyrie it actually brought back a better player. But the OP originally proposed a farcical trade idea, and has then used the rest of the thread to try to convince the rest of us Kyrie makes the team worse despite the facts demonstrating the opposite.

But the saddest part of it all is that the OP isn't alone, and there are a handful of other posters here who are apparently just as incapable of looking at facts and drawing reasonable conclusions. Basically we've got a thread full of Donald Trump wannabes.

I can say the same about your post that has very little to do about basketball and instead forum basketball political nonsense

If you read my original posts... I said there is a disconnect. How Kyrie plays, especially 2nd half of games = underutilize 3 or 4 other key players.  Team passing is not as good as it should be and in turn team D suffers also

You want to build a team around Irving... well it can be done. I already laid out the idea.  But at the expense of  underutilizing/trading Hayward, Brown, Rozier, Tatum?   

Its 1 vs 4

No thanks

Kyrie needs to "adjust" not the other way around.  His "hero" ball is not required/should not be required with the talent this team has.  Press on the emergency  button when required

Alot of blame on Hayward, Brown, Rozier with the sacrfices they have made... is utterly ridiculous and unfair.... proof is in the pudding the last 2 games and it will continue

[PAOBoston]

How do these two games compare to our eight game winning streak?

This team has played extremely good — as in, completely dominant — basketball with Kyrie at times.  We’re a top-nine offense and a top-four defense, and Brown and Hayward have both started to progress.  Since a 10-10 start, we’re 13-5.

What’s the problem we’re trying to solve?

People aren’t just happy when we finally get to have nice things.

[Tr1boy]

"It was fun," said Hayward, who was coming off a season-high 35 points Wednesday night in a victory over Minnesota. "I think when we have good spacing, we have talented players and it just makes the game easier. If you make the right read, everybody gets involved and it's fun."

Jaylen Brown scored 21 points, Jayson Tatum added 18 points, and Al Horford had 10 points, eight rebounds and eight assists.

The Celtics won easily despite playing their second straight game with star guard Kyrie Irving sidelined by scratched corneas. Without Irving, the Celtics moved the ball around and had 35 assists on 42 field goals.

Hayward and Horford had eight apiece and Terry Rozier, who started for Irving, added seven assists for the Celtics.

"We've really tried to emphasize that all year," coach Brad Stevens said. "For the most part everybody was in a good rhythm and playing well together and seeking out the right shot. We've just got to keep doing that as much as possible."

[Diggles]

The only way I trade him is to get AD...….

[Monkhouse]

To simply state the Celts are a better team without Kyrie is borderline ridiculous.

It's not just ridiculous, it's factually untrue. The stats clearly show the team is better with Kyrie than without him.

But you'll only casually see posters like the OP even attempt to address this, because they know they can't, and deep down know their opinions are unsubstantiated horse crap based on nothing but incorrect observations.

This thread for the most part is just a running joke at this point. Sure, I'm not against trading Kyrie it actually brought back a better player. But the OP originally proposed a farcical trade idea, and has then used the rest of the thread to try to convince the rest of us Kyrie makes the team worse despite the facts demonstrating the opposite.

But the saddest part of it all is that the OP isn't alone, and there are a handful of other posters here who are apparently just as incapable of looking at facts and drawing reasonable conclusions. Basically we've got a thread full of Donald Trump wannabes.

I can say the same about your post that has very little to do about basketball and instead forum basketball political nonsense

If you read my original posts... I said there is a disconnect. How Kyrie plays, especially 2nd half of games = underutilize 3 or 4 other key players.  Team passing is not as good as it should be and in turn team D suffers also

You want to build a team around Irving... well it can be done. I already laid out the idea.  But at the expense of  underutilizing/trading Hayward, Brown, Rozier, Tatum?   

Its 1 vs 4

No thanks

Kyrie needs to "adjust" not the other way around.  His "hero" ball is not required/should not be required with the talent this team has.  Press on the emergency  button when required

Alot of blame on Hayward, Brown, Rozier with the sacrfices they have made... is utterly ridiculous and unfair.... proof is in the pudding the last 2 games and it will continue

How is Kyrie playing hero ball? There have been so many times where our offense has looked flat, and that's when you need a superstar/Allstar to step up.. Did you see the Rockets game? Our entire offense went quiet. Without Irving in there, would've been even far more dreadful.

Jesus. He's averaging 6.6 APG, his career high, and has stated how many times he wants his teammates to succeed. He's also doing this in 3 minutes less than when he averaged 6.1 in his 3rd year.

It's like talking to a brick wall. Like you literally don't even post any facts to prove your point. It's just all opinionated angst compounded with an overlying hatred for Irving. We get it triboy, you don't like Irving. It's really sad to me that posters here just can't enjoy Irving's game, and that's fine. But to say our team would be better if we lost him? In what galaxy is a player averaging 23.1 PPG, 6.6 APG, 4.9 RPG, along with scorching hot .40% from 3PA not making any team better? It's not like he's taking away shots from Tatum or Hayward. It's up to Hayward to step up, and be more aggressive. We can't just wait for Irving to be out of the game every time, we want Hayward to drop 35... That's just foolish. In the 3 games before Irving was injured, he was leading the league in 10.7 APG. So it's not like he's selfish... Or a ball hog.

Yeah but okay... Let's give the starting reins to Terry Rozier, probably one of the worst point guards I've ever seen on the defensive end. I'll laugh and take a shot every time he tries to defend a pick and roll and gets smoked. 

[GreenFaith1819]

When it's CRUNCH TIME, in the playoffs...versus the likes of Giannis, Oladipo, Simmons, Embiid, Kawhi - you're going to need HERO BALL - at times quite often.

Kyrie, GH and Big Al are well versed in this department.

[Tr1boy]

When it's CRUNCH TIME, in the playoffs...versus the likes of Giannis, Oladipo, Simmons, Embiid, Kawhi - you're going to need HERO BALL - at times quite often.

Kyrie, GH and Big Al are well versed in this department.

Its just GH and Big Al turn on the "jets"  when necessary and try to keep in line with the "team concept" even if the score is close

For example

Last night the Mavs make it close (64 to 60)  and I guarantee you, Irving would have launched the next 10 shots of his own (make or miss).   Team defense suffers, Hayward/Brown/Rozier turn into a spot up shooters.....  probably lose the game

What does Hayward do when the score becomes close in the 3rd quarter? (64-60)

He just keeps trusting his teammates, making the extra passes.  Team energy and defense never wavered last night

this is the difference

[td450]

How do these two games compare to our eight game winning streak?

This team has played extremely good — as in, completely dominant — basketball with Kyrie at times.  We’re a top-nine offense and a top-four defense, and Brown and Hayward have both started to progress.  Since a 10-10 start, we’re 13-5.

What’s the problem we’re trying to solve?

The problem is that the championship version of this team requires strong performances from Brown, Hayward and Rozier. Pace and ball movement make those guys different players. Our team's advantage isn't that Kyrie can consistently outplay Durant or Harden or Giannis. Our advantage is that we have more guys that can beat you than anyone else. We will not beat GS if Kyrie and Morris play well, but Brown and Hayward average 10 pts a game.

We can do this with Kyrie, but he would have to do less of what he loves to do best, which is to carve up defenses with his handle.

[GreenFaith1819]

When it's CRUNCH TIME, in the playoffs...versus the likes of Giannis, Oladipo, Simmons, Embiid, Kawhi - you're going to need HERO BALL - at times quite often.

Kyrie, GH and Big Al are well versed in this department.

Its just GH and Big Al turn on the "jets"  when necessary and try to keep in line with the "team concept" even if the score is close

For example

Last night the Mavs make it close (64 to 60)  and I guarantee you, Irving would have launched the next 10 shots of his own (make or miss).   Team defense suffers, Hayward/Brown/Rozier turn into a spot up shooters.....  probably lose the game

What does Hayward do when the score becomes close in the 3rd quarter? (64-60)

He just keeps trusting his teammates, making the extra passes.  Team energy and defense never wavered last night

this is the difference

Do you think that GH would've gotten us past LeBron and CLE last May?

I'll answer the question - probably YES.

But does this team - without Kyrie - beat GSW last year?

You need bonafide stars. Kyrie has been there on the Big Stage and performed admirably. So has GH - in the WCS 16-17. Big Al performed well for us last year in the playoffs.

But there is a reason why Danny traded a LOT for Kyrie.

[Tr1boy]

How do these two games compare to our eight game winning streak?

This team has played extremely good — as in, completely dominant — basketball with Kyrie at times.  We’re a top-nine offense and a top-four defense, and Brown and Hayward have both started to progress.  Since a 10-10 start, we’re 13-5.

What’s the problem we’re trying to solve?

The problem is that the championship version of this team requires strong performances from Brown, Hayward and Rozier. Pace and ball movement make those guys different players. Our team's advantage isn't that Kyrie can consistently outplay Durant or Harden or Giannis. Our advantage is that we have more guys that can beat you than anyone else. We will not beat GS if Kyrie and Morris play well, but Brown and Hayward average 10 pts a game.

We can do this with Kyrie, but he would have to do less of what he loves to do best, which is to carve up defenses with his handle.

Exactly and well put

[tazzmaniac]

When it's CRUNCH TIME, in the playoffs...versus the likes of Giannis, Oladipo, Simmons, Embiid, Kawhi - you're going to need HERO BALL - at times quite often.

Kyrie, GH and Big Al are well versed in this department.

Its just GH and Big Al turn on the "jets"  when necessary and try to keep in line with the "team concept" even if the score is close

For example

Last night the Mavs make it close (64 to 60)  and I guarantee you, Irving would have launched the next 10 shots of his own (make or miss).   Team defense suffers, Hayward/Brown/Rozier turn into a spot up shooters.....  probably lose the game

What does Hayward do when the score becomes close in the 3rd quarter? (64-60)

He just keeps trusting his teammates, making the extra passes.  Team energy and defense never wavered last night

this is the difference

It was the Mavs during the regular season.  They're not a good team and its not the playoffs.   

[Tr1boy]

When it's CRUNCH TIME, in the playoffs...versus the likes of Giannis, Oladipo, Simmons, Embiid, Kawhi - you're going to need HERO BALL - at times quite often.

Kyrie, GH and Big Al are well versed in this department.

Its just GH and Big Al turn on the "jets"  when necessary and try to keep in line with the "team concept" even if the score is close

For example

Last night the Mavs make it close (64 to 60)  and I guarantee you, Irving would have launched the next 10 shots of his own (make or miss).   Team defense suffers, Hayward/Brown/Rozier turn into a spot up shooters.....  probably lose the game

What does Hayward do when the score becomes close in the 3rd quarter? (64-60)

He just keeps trusting his teammates, making the extra passes.  Team energy and defense never wavered last night

this is the difference

It was the Mavs during the regular season.  They're not a good team and its not the playoffs.   

So how did they score 112 and beat us the last time around?

[elcotte]

When it's CRUNCH TIME, in the playoffs...versus the likes of Giannis, Oladipo, Simmons, Embiid, Kawhi - you're going to need HERO BALL - at times quite often.

Kyrie, GH and Big Al are well versed in this department.

Its just GH and Big Al turn on the "jets"  when necessary and try to keep in line with the "team concept" even if the score is close

For example

Last night the Mavs make it close (64 to 60)  and I guarantee you, Irving would have launched the next 10 shots of his own (make or miss).   Team defense suffers, Hayward/Brown/Rozier turn into a spot up shooters.....  probably lose the game

What does Hayward do when the score becomes close in the 3rd quarter? (64-60)

He just keeps trusting his teammates, making the extra passes.  Team energy and defense never wavered last night

this is the difference

your guarantee is hollow....as is your "would haves, probablys" and the rest of your post. You just want to put any struggle against any opponent on Kyrie. Anyone can see that Brown has been timid until the last couple of games as has Tatum with respect to making cuts to the basket. They all need to run and create more open shots.

[nickagneta]

When it's CRUNCH TIME, in the playoffs...versus the likes of Giannis, Oladipo, Simmons, Embiid, Kawhi - you're going to need HERO BALL - at times quite often.

Kyrie, GH and Big Al are well versed in this department.

Its just GH and Big Al turn on the "jets"  when necessary and try to keep in line with the "team concept" even if the score is close

For example

Last night the Mavs make it close (64 to 60)  and I guarantee you, Irving would have launched the next 10 shots of his own (make or miss).   Team defense suffers, Hayward/Brown/Rozier turn into a spot up shooters.....  probably lose the game

What does Hayward do when the score becomes close in the 3rd quarter? (64-60)

He just keeps trusting his teammates, making the extra passes.  Team energy and defense never wavered last night

this is the difference

It was the Mavs during the regular season.  They're not a good team and its not the playoffs.   

So how did they score 112 and beat us the last time around?

The Mavs are the worst road team in the league. They have a 3-17 record on the road. Conversely, the Mavs have one of the best home records in the league losing only 3 games at home which is tied for least losses at home in the league.

You know, these things are really easy to look up.