Author Topic: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"  (Read 26297 times)

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A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« on: July 26, 2015, 03:19:05 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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I came across this article when looking up the "Danny is a snake" comment:

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/celtics/articles/2003/12/11/antoine_walker_calls_danny_ainge_a_snake/

Man, there is some gold in there.  Imagine if CB was going strong at that point?  This would have been fodder for years of discussion. 

Some nuggets:

Quote from: Antoine Walker
``I'm set for life regardless of if I get another contract. The money aspect of it wasn't beating me over. It was just that I knew he was a snake. I knew that. I never had a relationship with him. I knew he was going to be a snake.''

Quote from: Antoine
``Danny wanted to get rid of me,'' said Walker. ``If you look at the trade, I think he really felt like I wouldn't mesh with these guys in Dallas. Me, personally, I think he was really trying to set my career back a little bit. If you really look at what I got traded for, it's got to be the biggest difference [in talent] in history. Usually, an All-Star gets traded for an All-Star. And you gave away Tony Delk, a proven scorer in this league.

"I can't understand it, unless he was trying to put me in a situation where he didn't want me to succeed. Obviously, he's going to ship me West. That's obvious. He didn't think individually I'd shine in Dallas, maybe team-wise. But if I'm putting up minimum numbers and I'm just an average player with this team, he can live with that because he knows that's what he's going to get in return anyways, with Raef [LaFrentz].''

Quote from: Antoine Walker
`I don't like some of the owners. Because I particularly think if you run the team, you control what's going on. It is their first time. But if you tell me one thing and do something else, it's kind of hard for me. But about four or five guys on that team I have a lot of respect for, I like a

lot because we accomplished so much, we went through so much together. Coach O'Brien, I want him to do well, but it's tough for me to root for them. It's very tough because of the people that run the basketball operations.

Quote from: Danny Ainge
``Time will answer all the questions,'' said Ainge. ``I'm not going to get into a squabble with Antoine Walker. Every player that gets traded is emotionally hurt and their pride is hurt and I understand it. I've been a player and I've been traded twice. I understand his perspective. I obviously don't agree. And I can't think of a better situation that Antoine Walker went to than Dallas, individually and everything. The organization was the only organization that made any offers of any significance. This was not about me trading him to Dallas."

``I knew that this might be a step backwards. I knew how some people might perceive this. I knew that Antoine Walker would put up better numbers in Dallas in my opinion than he did in Boston. I said all that the day of the trade.''


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Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #1 on: July 26, 2015, 03:26:42 PM »

Offline TheFlex

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And to think my 8-9 year old self loved Antoine.


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Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2015, 03:40:48 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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Well Toine has a point about DA not wanting him in Boston. DA also wanted to trade Pierce. DA just wanted it to be his roster. He basically gave away everyone 70 cents on the dollar. He has learned from that at least and is trying to do better. I believe he has grown as a GM. Still he has to do better at filling needs and aquiring top talent. C's had all this cap and picks this offseason but they end up with Amir Johnson and not being able to trade up in the draft. SMH. Danny is an Average GM so far.

And one side note Toine shouldn't be complaining at all ever as DA did trade him a second time to get him to Miami where he got a ring.

Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2015, 03:46:06 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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Both Walker and Ainge have some "snake" in them, as far as I'm concerned.

Walker was a selfish player who focused on his own stats and who was never going to lead a team to a title (neither was Pierce btw until Garnett came along).

I don't like the way Danny treats his players. He shops them openly as if they were pawns on a chess board and it has bitten him back over the years. The Celtics winning tradition was not built that way. Red treated his guys with more loyalty and respect than Ainge ever will.
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Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2015, 03:53:07 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Quote
Danny wanted to get rid of me,'' said Walker. `
  I wanted to get rid of AW, too.   He was inefficient and drove me bonkers, that being said, he was the best we had for quite a few years.

DA is ruthless, he would trade away anyone to improve the team.  That being said the NBA is a business and it is nice to have a guy in our corner who will not makes moves with his heart but rather based on cold hard logic.

Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2015, 03:53:53 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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I came across this article when looking up the "Danny is a snake" comment:

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/celtics/articles/2003/12/11/antoine_walker_calls_danny_ainge_a_snake/

Man, there is some gold in there.  Imagine if CB was going strong at that point?  This would have been fodder for years of discussion. 

Some nuggets:

Quote from: Antoine Walker
``I'm set for life regardless of if I get another contract. The money aspect of it wasn't beating me over. It was just that I knew he was a snake. I knew that. I never had a relationship with him. I knew he was going to be a snake.''

Quote from: Antoine
``Danny wanted to get rid of me,'' said Walker. ``If you look at the trade, I think he really felt like I wouldn't mesh with these guys in Dallas. Me, personally, I think he was really trying to set my career back a little bit. If you really look at what I got traded for, it's got to be the biggest difference [in talent] in history. Usually, an All-Star gets traded for an All-Star. And you gave away Tony Delk, a proven scorer in this league.'



Quote from: Danny Ainge
``Time will answer all the questions,'' said Ainge. ``I'm not going to get into a squabble with Antoine Walker. Every player that gets traded is emotionally hurt and their pride is hurt and I understand it. I've been a player and I've been traded twice. I understand his perspective. I obviously don't agree. And I can't think of a better situation that Antoine Walker went to than Dallas, individually and everything. The organization was the only organization that made any offers of any significance. This was not about me trading him to Dallas."

Wow, lots of nuggets in this as you said Roy. I just highlighted a few. Poor Antoine. the first blooded comment really came back to haunt him.

The comparisons of the last bolded comment to the more recent Rondo to Dallas trade is also interesting.


Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2015, 03:57:18 PM »

Offline Evantime34

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Walker sounds like he is being unreasonable saying Danny just traded him because he wanted him to fail
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Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2015, 04:02:31 PM »

Offline jambr380

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I think people may not be seeing that this article is from 2003 - not too long after the first trade, where I agree with Antoine. Raef was a terrible return and his contract and injury history left a lot to be desired.

I believe Danny had control issues in his first couple of years in Boston. When he traded back for Antoine is when I think he became a good GM - doing what was best for the team rather than showing who was boss.

Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2015, 04:07:22 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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Quote
DA is ruthless, he would trade away anyone to improve the team.  That being said the NBA is a business and it is nice to have a guy in our corner who will not makes moves with his heart but rather based on cold hard logic.

The Four Celtic Generals:
Russell - Cowens - Bird - Garnett

The Four Celtic Lieutenants:
Cousy - Havlicek - McHale - Pierce

Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2015, 04:08:44 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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The NBA is a business - but it is also a team sport and I believe you have to balance those two aspects to be successful. Players who are treated like livestock are not going to carry emotion into their game ......... and you have to have emotional focus, both as a team and as an individual, to win championships.

Celtic Pride should still mean something. It would set the Celtics franchise apart from other teams in the league. Danny acts like he is above all that and I will always believe his purely analytic approach cost us Banner 18.
The Four Celtic Generals:
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Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #10 on: July 26, 2015, 04:10:01 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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Both Walker and Ainge have some "snake" in them, as far as I'm concerned.

Walker was a selfish player who focused on his own stats and who was never going to lead a team to a title (neither was Pierce btw until Garnett came along).

I don't like the way Danny treats his players. He shops them openly as if they were pawns on a chess board and it has bitten him back over the years. The Celtics winning tradition was not built that way. Red treated his guys with more loyalty and respect than Ainge ever will.

You can't make that comparison. This is a totally different league run under different sets of rules regarding player contracts, trades, etc. You cannot use the strategies of that era. I think Ainge has one of the best understandings of the current CBA structure and agent influence, etc. and uses it to put forth modern strategies for building contenders.

Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #11 on: July 26, 2015, 04:14:39 PM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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The overarching point is well-taken, though. His openly shopping players has done harm (e.g., Ray, Rondo). If a guy's ego takes a shot from being dangled at every trade deadline, he's not going to play as well for you and, subsequently, you lose trade value.

Would that not spread to other guys, as well? You may not be the one on the chopping block at that given time, but I'm sure you'd realize you could be next at any given time. And I'm sure free agents are aware, as well.

From a fan's perspective, we like seeing him make aggressive moves. From a player's perspective, though, he would probably really suck to play for.
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Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #12 on: July 26, 2015, 04:25:22 PM »

Offline GratefulCs

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Well, toine was a volume shooter guy and of course he wasn't going to get enough shots in dallas.



But who cares if danny thought he would thrive there or not.



Danny wanted him gone, and took what he could
I trust Danny Ainge

Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2015, 04:33:42 PM »

Offline emajic1

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Toine had an inflated opinion of himself.  Addictive mindset that I hope he has healed.   I didn't have a problem with the trade at all at the time, and feel Danny was trying to 'sell high' on Walker.  There are some similarities to how we valued Rondo more than the rest of the league.  That Lafrentz laid a complete egg is hindsight.  Sour grapes on Toine's part back then.  I don't think this is a classic read at all. 

Re: A classic read: "Danny is a snake"
« Reply #14 on: July 26, 2015, 04:47:11 PM »

Offline Jiri Welsch

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Pretty amazing to think Danny's been running the team that long. Seems like, and genuinely was, a while back when 'Toine was a focal point of the Celtics brand.

He came back as 88 though so I'm sure the relationship was mended in many respects.