Potential PF/C Trade Targets For Boston

[hpantazo]

There's zero chance Duren is even close to being available. Stewart's future with Detroit, on the other hand, isn't 100% considering his awkward fit at PF next to Duren, but that's not something they really are under any urgency to figure out this season. There was a rumor the Celtics kicked the tires on Stewart before he was extended, but nothing happened obviously. Wiseman or Bagley are the ones I think they would eventually move, especially Wiseman if they don't extend him. They're both basically blocked by Duren and you could see Wiseman wanting to go somewhere where he has more of a shot at getting minutes. Those two make too much for the Celtics to really consider, however.

Achiuwa is interesting. I don't know much about him besides him being an athlete who can't shoot. The Raptors could go so many different directions that it's hard to gauge what their thinking is, though. Skimming Raptors message boards, it seems that he was slowed by an ankle injury last year and he had trouble playing different roles other than center. They traded for Poetl and then Achiuwa basically had no idea what to do in a F/PF role. His bball IQ and hands are questionable. Basically, he's an undersized C that has had trouble converting to F/PF, which is what he should probably be in the NBA for his physical profile. For the C's, you get him if you really believe he's better than what he's shown, but I wonder if they wouldn't be more interested in a seasoned veteran as opposed to a guy who's still a project.

I agree, I don't know if Achiuwa really addresses any needs for the Celtics.

[Vermont Green]

I have been stewing on this since the off season.  I am looking at it from two perspectives though.  One is the more obvious or more widely noted and that is the need for a bench big (PF or C) or a 3rd big behind Horford.  It is a real narrow needle to thread.  To me, just being a little better than Kornet isn't good enough to make a difference.  Kornet played 804 minutes in the regular season over 69 of 82 games but only 32 minutes in the playoffs (8 of 20 games).  So this added player needs to be good enough to actually play in the playoffs but still "gettable" with the $6.2M TPE.  Achiuwa is an example of a player that may be "gettable" with the TPE and a pick but I see him as on the bubble as to good enough to be a playoff regular.  Stewart from DET was another decent target but he signed an extension so would be a base year guy and no longer possible for us to get I don't think.

The other way that I have been looking at this is starting by considering that our current starting 5, although made up of all excellent players, may not have the ideal balance.  Some view Brown and Tatum as overlapping but I am fine with that now with the addition of Holiday (ballhandler) and Porzingis (skilled big).  I see the greater overlap being between Holiday and White and the lacking being a defensive, rebounding type big.  So if we could magically bring is a starting level big, say even trade White for someone, who could that player be?  To me, someone like Adebayo would be perfect but obviously we are not getting him.

Another option is to consider trading Brown (in the off season), if you are in the camp that Brown and Tatum are overlapping and less than ideal.  So who would that ideal 5th starter be that you might be able to get by trading Brown?  Brown is not going to bring back Jokic or someone like that, but there are a lot of top players he probably could bring back.

I am sure some are going to say the "small" line up is just fine.  I don't disagree necessarily, but I think it is pretty clear that it is not ideal.

[liam]

These guys are gettable but not sure they move the needle:

Darius Bazley

Kai Jones

Isaiah Roby

Isaiah Roby

I like Stanley Johnson as a small ball big

Dewayne Dedmon I'm not a fan...

JaMychal Green

Blake Griffin good fit but probably retired...

Nerlens Noel Cooked?

Isaiah Todd

Taj Gibson

Derrick Favors

Jeremiah Robinson-Earl

[hardlyyardley]

We had the ideal guy and released him....Mo Wagner

[footey]

I'd take a flyer on Kai Jones.  If he goes off the rails, cut him.  Clippers were looking at him recently. He'd actually be a good fit size wise. 

[PAOBoston]

I'd take a flyer on Kai Jones.  If he goes off the rails, cut him.  Clippers were looking at him recently. He'd actually be a good fit size wise.

What exactly does Kai Jones provide? He isn’t exactly a good player.

[green_bballers13]

What about Poku in OKC? He broke his arm, and since coming back, isn't playing. OKC is decent and might not have time to develop him. I think he could prob play over Kornet.

[michigan adam]

I have been stewing on this since the off season.  I am looking at it from two perspectives though.  One is the more obvious or more widely noted and that is the need for a bench big (PF or C) or a 3rd big behind Horford.  It is a real narrow needle to thread.  To me, just being a little better than Kornet isn't good enough to make a difference.  Kornet played 804 minutes in the regular season over 69 of 82 games but only 32 minutes in the playoffs (8 of 20 games).  So this added player needs to be good enough to actually play in the playoffs but still "gettable" with the $6.2M TPE.  Achiuwa is an example of a player that may be "gettable" with the TPE and a pick but I see him as on the bubble as to good enough to be a playoff regular.  Stewart from DET was another decent target but he signed an extension so would be a base year guy and no longer possible for us to get I don't think.

The other way that I have been looking at this is starting by considering that our current starting 5, although made up of all excellent players, may not have the ideal balance.  Some view Brown and Tatum as overlapping but I am fine with that now with the addition of Holiday (ballhandler) and Porzingis (skilled big).  I see the greater overlap being between Holiday and White and the lacking being a defensive, rebounding type big.  So if we could magically bring is a starting level big, say even trade White for someone, who could that player be?  To me, someone like Adebayo would be perfect but obviously we are not getting him.

Another option is to consider trading Brown (in the off season), if you are in the camp that Brown and Tatum are overlapping and less than ideal.  So who would that ideal 5th starter be that you might be able to get by trading Brown?  Brown is not going to bring back Jokic or someone like that, but there are a lot of top players he probably could bring back.

I am sure some are going to say the "small" line up is just fine.  I don't disagree necessarily, but I think it is pretty clear that it is not ideal.

another perspective might be that he really doesn't need to be good enough to make the playoff rotation.  He needs to be good enough to allow for the proper rest and injury recovery for the top 8 guys we rely on in the playoffs.  Stated differently, if the player is good enough for us to get the top seed(win allot of games) ,allow the desired rest for our other bigs, and allow the proper heal time for our injuries, then the player has done his work.  Kornet has not been that player in the past.  This year has started better than other years but....The C's need another big.  That big is unlikely to be a playoff rotation player.  I'm fine with that for the TPE and a couple of second round picks, or a 1st round pick if we get a second or two back with the player.  Achiuwa is good enough to be that player, and won't kill you if one of the other bigs has foul trouble or injury in the playoffs.

[Kernewek]

another perspective might be that he really doesn't need to be good enough to make the playoff rotation.  He needs to be good enough to allow for the proper rest and injury recovery for the top 8 guys we rely on in the playoffs.  Stated differently, if the player is good enough for us to get the top seed(win allot of games) ,allow the desired rest for our other bigs, and allow the proper heal time for our injuries, then the player has done his work. 

I agree with this, I think. Good post.

[Vermont Green]

I have been stewing on this since the off season.  I am looking at it from two perspectives though.  One is the more obvious or more widely noted and that is the need for a bench big (PF or C) or a 3rd big behind Horford.  It is a real narrow needle to thread.  To me, just being a little better than Kornet isn't good enough to make a difference.  Kornet played 804 minutes in the regular season over 69 of 82 games but only 32 minutes in the playoffs (8 of 20 games).  So this added player needs to be good enough to actually play in the playoffs but still "gettable" with the $6.2M TPE.  Achiuwa is an example of a player that may be "gettable" with the TPE and a pick but I see him as on the bubble as to good enough to be a playoff regular.  Stewart from DET was another decent target but he signed an extension so would be a base year guy and no longer possible for us to get I don't think.

The other way that I have been looking at this is starting by considering that our current starting 5, although made up of all excellent players, may not have the ideal balance.  Some view Brown and Tatum as overlapping but I am fine with that now with the addition of Holiday (ballhandler) and Porzingis (skilled big).  I see the greater overlap being between Holiday and White and the lacking being a defensive, rebounding type big.  So if we could magically bring is a starting level big, say even trade White for someone, who could that player be?  To me, someone like Adebayo would be perfect but obviously we are not getting him.

Another option is to consider trading Brown (in the off season), if you are in the camp that Brown and Tatum are overlapping and less than ideal.  So who would that ideal 5th starter be that you might be able to get by trading Brown?  Brown is not going to bring back Jokic or someone like that, but there are a lot of top players he probably could bring back.

I am sure some are going to say the "small" line up is just fine.  I don't disagree necessarily, but I think it is pretty clear that it is not ideal.

another perspective might be that he really doesn't need to be good enough to make the playoff rotation.  He needs to be good enough to allow for the proper rest and injury recovery for the top 8 guys we rely on in the playoffs.  Stated differently, if the player is good enough for us to get the top seed(win allot of games) ,allow the desired rest for our other bigs, and allow the proper heal time for our injuries, then the player has done his work.  Kornet has not been that player in the past. This year has started better than other years but....The C's need another big.  That big is unlikely to be a playoff rotation player.  I'm fine with that for the TPE and a couple of second round picks, or a 1st round pick if we get a second or two back with the player.  Achiuwa is good enough to be that player, and won't kill you if one of the other bigs has foul trouble or injury in the playoffs.

If Kornet has not been and is not expected to be "that player", how much better than Kornet does the player have to be in order to help with the regular season?  Kornet, by the way, was +61 last season in 69 games, 804 minutes last season.  This season, he is exactly +0 in 104 minutes.

So we need a player better than Kornet.  I assume better than Muscala as he did not help much last season either.  I am not sure that Achiuwa is better, or enough better than the Kornets and Muscalas of the world to turn losses into wins.  Maybe.  But it is not like Kornet has hurt the team as a regular season fill in player.  I think you may be overestimating the impact of a slightly better fill in player.

[KG Living Legend]

I have been stewing on this since the off season.  I am looking at it from two perspectives though.  One is the more obvious or more widely noted and that is the need for a bench big (PF or C) or a 3rd big behind Horford.  It is a real narrow needle to thread.  To me, just being a little better than Kornet isn't good enough to make a difference.  Kornet played 804 minutes in the regular season over 69 of 82 games but only 32 minutes in the playoffs (8 of 20 games).  So this added player needs to be good enough to actually play in the playoffs but still "gettable" with the $6.2M TPE.  Achiuwa is an example of a player that may be "gettable" with the TPE and a pick but I see him as on the bubble as to good enough to be a playoff regular.  Stewart from DET was another decent target but he signed an extension so would be a base year guy and no longer possible for us to get I don't think.

The other way that I have been looking at this is starting by considering that our current starting 5, although made up of all excellent players, may not have the ideal balance.  Some view Brown and Tatum as overlapping but I am fine with that now with the addition of Holiday (ballhandler) and Porzingis (skilled big).  I see the greater overlap being between Holiday and White and the lacking being a defensive, rebounding type big.  So if we could magically bring is a starting level big, say even trade White for someone, who could that player be?  To me, someone like Adebayo would be perfect but obviously we are not getting him.

Another option is to consider trading Brown (in the off season), if you are in the camp that Brown and Tatum are overlapping and less than ideal.  So who would that ideal 5th starter be that you might be able to get by trading Brown?  Brown is not going to bring back Jokic or someone like that, but there are a lot of top players he probably could bring back.

I am sure some are going to say the "small" line up is just fine.  I don't disagree necessarily, but I think it is pretty clear that it is not ideal.

another perspective might be that he really doesn't need to be good enough to make the playoff rotation.  He needs to be good enough to allow for the proper rest and injury recovery for the top 8 guys we rely on in the playoffs.  Stated differently, if the player is good enough for us to get the top seed(win allot of games) ,allow the desired rest for our other bigs, and allow the proper heal time for our injuries, then the player has done his work.  Kornet has not been that player in the past. This year has started better than other years but....The C's need another big.  That big is unlikely to be a playoff rotation player.  I'm fine with that for the TPE and a couple of second round picks, or a 1st round pick if we get a second or two back with the player.  Achiuwa is good enough to be that player, and won't kill you if one of the other bigs has foul trouble or injury in the playoffs.

If Kornet has not been and is not expected to be "that player", how much better than Kornet does the player have to be in order to help with the regular season?  Kornet, by the way, was +61 last season in 69 games, 804 minutes last season.  This season, he is exactly +0 in 104 minutes.

So we need a player better than Kornet.  I assume better than Muscala as he did not help much last season either.  I am not sure that Achiuwa is better, or enough better than the Kornets and Muscalas of the world to turn losses into wins.  Maybe.  But it is not like Kornet has hurt the team as a regular season fill in player.  I think you may be overestimating the impact of a slightly better fill in player.

 Isaiah Stewart would be nice. How simple is it to aquire him? He make a little over 5 million this year so Prichard and any scrub we have works. We could even trade Kornet,  Stevens, and Walsh plus 2nd rounders for him.

 He might be worth it.

[Celtics2021]

I have been stewing on this since the off season.  I am looking at it from two perspectives though.  One is the more obvious or more widely noted and that is the need for a bench big (PF or C) or a 3rd big behind Horford.  It is a real narrow needle to thread.  To me, just being a little better than Kornet isn't good enough to make a difference.  Kornet played 804 minutes in the regular season over 69 of 82 games but only 32 minutes in the playoffs (8 of 20 games).  So this added player needs to be good enough to actually play in the playoffs but still "gettable" with the $6.2M TPE.  Achiuwa is an example of a player that may be "gettable" with the TPE and a pick but I see him as on the bubble as to good enough to be a playoff regular.  Stewart from DET was another decent target but he signed an extension so would be a base year guy and no longer possible for us to get I don't think.

The other way that I have been looking at this is starting by considering that our current starting 5, although made up of all excellent players, may not have the ideal balance.  Some view Brown and Tatum as overlapping but I am fine with that now with the addition of Holiday (ballhandler) and Porzingis (skilled big).  I see the greater overlap being between Holiday and White and the lacking being a defensive, rebounding type big.  So if we could magically bring is a starting level big, say even trade White for someone, who could that player be?  To me, someone like Adebayo would be perfect but obviously we are not getting him.

Another option is to consider trading Brown (in the off season), if you are in the camp that Brown and Tatum are overlapping and less than ideal.  So who would that ideal 5th starter be that you might be able to get by trading Brown?  Brown is not going to bring back Jokic or someone like that, but there are a lot of top players he probably could bring back.

I am sure some are going to say the "small" line up is just fine.  I don't disagree necessarily, but I think it is pretty clear that it is not ideal.

another perspective might be that he really doesn't need to be good enough to make the playoff rotation.  He needs to be good enough to allow for the proper rest and injury recovery for the top 8 guys we rely on in the playoffs.  Stated differently, if the player is good enough for us to get the top seed(win allot of games) ,allow the desired rest for our other bigs, and allow the proper heal time for our injuries, then the player has done his work.  Kornet has not been that player in the past. This year has started better than other years but....The C's need another big.  That big is unlikely to be a playoff rotation player.  I'm fine with that for the TPE and a couple of second round picks, or a 1st round pick if we get a second or two back with the player.  Achiuwa is good enough to be that player, and won't kill you if one of the other bigs has foul trouble or injury in the playoffs.

If Kornet has not been and is not expected to be "that player", how much better than Kornet does the player have to be in order to help with the regular season?  Kornet, by the way, was +61 last season in 69 games, 804 minutes last season.  This season, he is exactly +0 in 104 minutes.

So we need a player better than Kornet.  I assume better than Muscala as he did not help much last season either.  I am not sure that Achiuwa is better, or enough better than the Kornets and Muscalas of the world to turn losses into wins.  Maybe.  But it is not like Kornet has hurt the team as a regular season fill in player.  I think you may be overestimating the impact of a slightly better fill in player.

 Isaiah Stewart would be nice. How simple is it to aquire him? He make a little over 5 million this year so Prichard and any scrub we have works. We could even trade Kornet,  Stevens, and Walsh plus 2nd rounders for him.

 He might be worth it.

He signed an extension this fall and has a cap number far higher than $5 million (over $12.5 million to be precise).  He is not acquirable.

[obnoxiousmime]

I wonder if we're getting off track. Are we trying to get a project big man? Or are we just getting a veteran who's either better, more versatile, and/or different skill set than Kornet? Because some of these young players would only make sense if we were thinking a year or two down the line. Sure, I'd take a flyer on some of these guys like Poku, but I'm certainly not acquiring them to provide more reliability than someone like Kornet this season.

Obviously I would love someone who can play in the playoffs and not be a liability, but that might be hard. Even getting someone mediocre might be hard and not worth it considering we already have Kornet here and familiar with the system/players.

I guess the question is, what is the ideal? Then the follow-up is, how low do you go until it's no longer worth making the change?

[Goldstar88]

I’d like to see how Queta does. Looked decent in preseason. He’s big, strong, athletic. Good lateral quickness for a center.. I also don’t think Brad does anything until they are at or close to the trade deadline.

[otherdave]

And then you have to remember the stringent personality/background checks that the organization uses (only half joking here).  Not sure exactly what Brad's methods are, BUT he only brings in high overall character, great locker room guys who will understand and accept their roles.  No head cases for Brad.  I feel the overall character traits are just as important to Brad as the fit as a player on the court.  This is something that is not talked about a lot on this board, but something perhaps we should bear in mind when having these "who should the C's trade for" discussions.