CelticsStrong
Around the League => Around the NBA => Topic started by: Birdman on January 30, 2013, 09:53:27 AM
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I feel sorry for the Grizzlies fans and players. They are now going to trade Rudy Gay and probably wont get much in return. They are depleting their roster b/c of money. In November it look like they was one of the top 5 teams. Now if they trade Gay and they already traded away part of their bench to Cleveland, they wont make it pass the 1st round. And wouldnt be surprise to see them trade Zach
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Yeah, it sucks when a team self-limits its potential due to financial reasons. I'm sure all the Bruins fans (at least those prior to the last couple of lockouts) can relate to what the Grizzlies fans are experiencing.
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Heck if Memphis are cleaning payroll, i would check to see what they want for Gasol or Zach..
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But it is the cost in keeping a team in a small market.
It can be this or watch the team leave for another city.
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Yep, u see it in all sports..small market teams can never compete with big market teams. Only way they can if they get lucky in the draft or in baseball they have a great minor league system
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Yep, u see it in all sports..small market teams can never compete with big market teams. Only way they can if they get lucky in the draft or in baseball they have a great minor league system
Or the NFL where there is great revenue sharing and a hard cap that all team cans afford.
On a side note, this team has always performed better when either Gay or Randolph were out. They just don't fit well together.
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I want to see what Memphis adds in a deal for Gay before I judge. If they can successfully convert Calderon into a solid shooting and / or defending wing -- to go with whatever else they get from Toronto, they may not really be taking a significant step back.
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Yeah, it sucks when a team self-limits its potential due to financial reasons. I'm sure all the Bruins fans (at least those prior to the last couple of lockouts) can relate to what the Grizzlies fans are experiencing.
Could you imagine how good the Suns would be, now, if they did not sell all their 1st round draft picks for cash, back in the day.
Rondo, Deng...
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Yeah, it sucks when a team self-limits its potential due to financial reasons. I'm sure all the Bruins fans (at least those prior to the last couple of lockouts) can relate to what the Grizzlies fans are experiencing.
Could you imagine how good the Suns would be, now, if they did not sell all their 1st round draft picks for cash, back in the day.
Rondo, Deng...
i think its ok they sold it, they got nash b4, rondo will not develop as bench player though with nash
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Yeah, it sucks when a team self-limits its potential due to financial reasons. I'm sure all the Bruins fans (at least those prior to the last couple of lockouts) can relate to what the Grizzlies fans are experiencing.
Considering they have new ownership and a new stats guy heading the player decision-making, I'm not sure money is the main thing driving this decision.
Rather, I think the new guys come in and they say, so we're paying a lot of money for a team that's good, but how good can they really be?
I think somebody like John Hollinger says, well, they're basically at their ceiling right now. If you want me to really do my thing, then we have to tear this down a bit and start fresh, perhaps holding onto Conley and Gasol because they're still relatively young and not too overpaid.
I imagine Hollinger wants to build a team based on efficiency, both in terms of production and in terms of how much a player is paid. He also probably wants to get some pieces in place that are more bankable long term, whereas he probably looks at Randolph and sees a guy who will probably decline quickly, and views Gay as a cap albatross.
It does suck for Memphis fans in the short term, but I think there's good reason to believe the new management has plans for the team that will make the fans happy. I'd compare it a little bit to how Danny Ainge came here and took apart a team that was pretty good but really very limited in how far it could go. Took a bunch of steps backward, but eventually the team took a major leap forward.
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Heck if Memphis are cleaning payroll, i would check to see what they want for Gasol or Zach..
If they're trading Gasol and Zach, I imagine they'd be looking to trade them to a team that can send only cheap contracts back.
For example, trading Gasol and picks to the new Seattle SuperSonics for Demarcus Cousins.
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Yeah its awful to see. I am a fan of the Grizzlies and the put together a good squad. But now they have no bench and might benefit by trading one of their stars for more pieces. Bad to see the lineup come apart but if they can get three role players for the price of one star it might end up helping them? In the long run anyway.
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Yeah, it sucks when a team self-limits its potential due to financial reasons. I'm sure all the Bruins fans (at least those prior to the last couple of lockouts) can relate to what the Grizzlies fans are experiencing.
Considering they have new ownership and a new stats guy heading the player decision-making, I'm not sure money is the main thing driving this decision.
Rather, I think the new guys come in and they say, so we're paying a lot of money for a team that's good, but how good can they really be?
Their new owner lost a ton of money between the time he agreed to buy the team and now. He can't afford the luxury tax.
As for Hollinger, I think he is given much more credit than he deserves as a decision maker. That team is run by Chris Wallace. Hollinger has a strong say in it, but I don't think he has as much power as others think.
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Yeah, it sucks when a team self-limits its potential due to financial reasons. I'm sure all the Bruins fans (at least those prior to the last couple of lockouts) can relate to what the Grizzlies fans are experiencing.
Considering they have new ownership and a new stats guy heading the player decision-making, I'm not sure money is the main thing driving this decision.
Rather, I think the new guys come in and they say, so we're paying a lot of money for a team that's good, but how good can they really be?
Their new owner lost a ton of money between the time he agreed to buy the team and now. He can't afford the luxury tax.
As for Hollinger, I think he is given much more credit than he deserves as a decision maker. That team is run by Chris Wallace. Hollinger has a strong say in it, but I don't think he has as much power as others think.
Maybe so, and I'm not saying money doesn't play a role. I just don't think it's at all a purely money driven thing. It's not like, "Man, I wish we could keep this together but we can't pay the luxury tax."
Even if Hollinger isn't the main man calling the shots, I'm sure they brought him in for a reason -- to shake up the decisionmaking a little bit. And I don't doubt that the new ownership wants to compete, but do so without fielding a team that's really expensive and has probably already reached its ceiling as a borderline contender.
I think of it sort of like the Bobcats a few years ago. They had a solid playoff team with Felton, Jackson, Wallace, Chandler etc. Then they brought in a new GM who said, look, if you want to get better than this, we need to tear it down first. Obviously the Grizz are much better now than that Bobcats team was, but I think it's similar.
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Who knows how much sway Hollinger actually has, but I guarantee he's telling everyone who'll listen that paying ~$54 million for the next 3 years to a guy with a below-average PER is not a good strategy.
And honestly, the Grizzlies had the most success in franchise history when Gay was out with an injury, so I don't feel too bad for them. Losing all those role players might be a bigger blow than trading Gay.
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Who knows how much sway Hollinger actually has, but I guarantee he's telling everyone who'll listen that paying ~$54 million for the next 3 years to a guy with a below-average PER is not a good strategy.
And honestly, the Grizzlies had the most success in franchise history when Gay was out with an injury, so I don't feel too bad for them. Losing all those role players might be a bigger blow than trading Gay.
Agreed. They looked at their best with Battier at SF. Conley / Allen / Randolph / Gasol is good enough to be competitive. They just need a fairly deep cast of role players to back them up, something they don't have right now.
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The thing about blowing up the Grizz is that this is something that has been assumed would happen since they signed their 3 stars. It was assumed that their market couldn't handle the three max or close to max contracts for an extended period, and most of the analysts assumed that they just signed them all to maintain their value, but then eventually trade one or two of them.
So, I am not sure this is really a change in philosophy, I just think the pressure is on now that the new luxury tax is kicking in, and they need to finally pull the trigger.
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The thing about blowing up the Grizz is that this is something that has been assumed would happen since they signed their 3 stars. It was assumed that their market couldn't handle the three max or close to max contracts for an extended period, and most of the analysts assumed that they just signed them all to maintain their value, but then eventually trade one or two of them.
So, I am not sure this is really a change in philosophy, I just think the pressure is on now that the new luxury tax is kicking in, and they need to finally pull the trigger.
That's a solid point. Z-Bo wasn't meant to be a fixture for them. They got him for very little from the Clippers and it just happened that he really worked out for them. But I don't think they expected to pay him long term.
This trend also started before the new ownership group -- they were trying to trade O.J. Mayo for a couple years because they didn't want to have to pay him as well as Rudy Gay.
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I feel for Kings fans
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I feel for Kings fans
Indeed.
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Who knows how much sway Hollinger actually has, but I guarantee he's telling everyone who'll listen that paying ~$54 million for the next 3 years to a guy with a below-average PER is not a good strategy.
And honestly, the Grizzlies had the most success in franchise history when Gay was out with an injury, so I don't feel too bad for them. Losing all those role players might be a bigger blow than trading Gay.
Agreed. They looked at their best with Battier at SF. Conley / Allen / Randolph / Gasol is good enough to be competitive. They just need a fairly deep cast of role players to back them up, something they don't have right now.
Except battier was a different era altogether for Memphis..oj mayo and tony Allen flourished when gay was out and they made the second round
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The thing about blowing up the Grizz is that this is something that has been assumed would happen since they signed their 3 stars. It was assumed that their market couldn't handle the three max or close to max contracts for an extended period, and most of the analysts assumed that they just signed them all to maintain their value, but then eventually trade one or two of them.
So, I am not sure this is really a change in philosophy, I just think the pressure is on now that the new luxury tax is kicking in, and they need to finally pull the trigger.
That's a solid point. Z-Bo wasn't meant to be a fixture for them. They got him for very little from the Clippers and it just happened that he really worked out for them. But I don't think they expected to pay him long term.
I also think they didn't really want to keep Gay from the beginning either (although there were rumors that their old owner LOVED him). I think they just realized that he had value, and that they didn't want to lose that value for nothing. So, basically, they signed him, and have been waiting for the right time to trade him.
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Who knows how much sway Hollinger actually has, but I guarantee he's telling everyone who'll listen that paying ~$54 million for the next 3 years to a guy with a below-average PER is not a good strategy.
And honestly, the Grizzlies had the most success in franchise history when Gay was out with an injury, so I don't feel too bad for them. Losing all those role players might be a bigger blow than trading Gay.
Agreed. They looked at their best with Battier at SF. Conley / Allen / Randolph / Gasol is good enough to be competitive. They just need a fairly deep cast of role players to back them up, something they don't have right now.
Except battier was a different era altogether for Memphis..oj mayo and tony Allen flourished when gay was out and they made the second round
The team flourished, Mayo not at all. He continued to shoot at 40% and get just 22 MPG like he had since Tony supplanted him in the rotation.
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I live in TN and know all about the Grizzlies.
I guarantee you they would take Green and Bass for Gay if Ainge could find a 3rd team to absorb Bass's contract with expiring players for their 2nd unit.
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I live in TN and know all about the Grizzlies.
I guarantee you they would take Green and Bass for Gay if Ainge could find a 3rd team to absorb Bass's contract with expiring players for their 2nd unit.
Meh, I wouldn't do it.
17 mil and 19.5 mil for Rudy Gay is just way too much.
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I live in TN and know all about the Grizzlies.
I guarantee you they would take Green and Bass for Gay if Ainge could find a 3rd team to absorb Bass's contract with expiring players for their 2nd unit.
Meh, I wouldn't do it.
17 mil and 19.5 mil for Rudy Gay is just way too much.
That is what Memphis is saying.
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I live in TN and know all about the Grizzlies.
I guarantee you they would take Green and Bass for Gay if Ainge could find a 3rd team to absorb Bass's contract with expiring players for their 2nd unit.
Hollinger has a Jeff Green voodoo doll that he stabs every night before he goes to bed.
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I live in TN and know all about the Grizzlies.
I guarantee you they would take Green and Bass for Gay if Ainge could find a 3rd team to absorb Bass's contract with expiring players for their 2nd unit.
I live in Boston, and I know all about the Celtics. I don't guarantee you anything about what Danny would do.
No offense, and I am sure you are more connected to the Grizz than most people on here. But I think its going a bit far to suggest that you know whether or not they would accept a deal.
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The thing about blowing up the Grizz is that this is something that has been assumed would happen since they signed their 3 stars. It was assumed that their market couldn't handle the three max or close to max contracts for an extended period, and most of the analysts assumed that they just signed them all to maintain their value, but then eventually trade one or two of them.
So, I am not sure this is really a change in philosophy, I just think the pressure is on now that the new luxury tax is kicking in, and they need to finally pull the trigger.
That's a solid point. Z-Bo wasn't meant to be a fixture for them. They got him for very little from the Clippers and it just happened that he really worked out for them. But I don't think they expected to pay him long term.
I also think they didn't really want to keep Gay from the beginning either (although there were rumors that their old owner LOVED him). I think they just realized that he had value, and that they didn't want to lose that value for nothing. So, basically, they signed him, and have been waiting for the right time to trade him.
I don't think Colangelo re-signed guys like Bargnani, Calderon and Derozon to long, big money contracts with future trades in mind but I think he had the same mentality that Heisley did when he re-signed Gay: not being able to let go, seeing more positives than negatives, wanting to let things develop more and so on and so on. It's kind of fitting that he's pursuing Gay now. When Gay got a max deal, I think it surprised almost everyone. Colangelo might have been the only other person who would've given Gay a max deal too. They deserve each other in a way.
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I live in TN and know all about the Grizzlies.
I guarantee you they would take Green and Bass for Gay if Ainge could find a 3rd team to absorb Bass's contract with expiring players for their 2nd unit.
Meh, I wouldn't do it.
17 mil and 19.5 mil for Rudy Gay is just way too much.
Not for Toronto it isn't.
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Everyone thought Gay would get a max contract offer as a RFA. What surprised people is that the Grizzlies didn't let him get that offer and just match it, instead they offered the max themselves.
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Fans' worst nightmare are cheap owners.
I'd understand if the team is losing money. And I know Memphis is a small market, but I doubt they are losing money.
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I feel for Kings fans
Indeed.
Very good point. More so than Memphis fans.
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Who knows how much sway Hollinger actually has, but I guarantee he's telling everyone who'll listen that paying ~$54 million for the next 3 years to a guy with a below-average PER is not a good strategy.
And honestly, the Grizzlies had the most success in franchise history when Gay was out with an injury, so I don't feel too bad for them. Losing all those role players might be a bigger blow than trading Gay.
Agreed. They looked at their best with Battier at SF. Conley / Allen / Randolph / Gasol is good enough to be competitive. They just need a fairly deep cast of role players to back them up, something they don't have right now.
Except battier was a different era altogether for Memphis..oj mayo and tony Allen flourished when gay was out and they made the second round
The team flourished, Mayo not at all. He continued to shoot at 40% and get just 22 MPG like he had since Tony supplanted him in the rotation.
You're right about that...I'm just trying to remember who started at sf...I think maybe Sam young
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Fans' worst nightmare are cheap owners.
I'd understand if the team is losing money. And I know Memphis is a small market, but I doubt they are losing money.
Not yet.
But when the new cap penalties start working in, well, even the Lakers are talking about cutting payroll.
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I feel for Rudy Gay if he gets traded to Toronto. Toronto may be a great place to live, and it may have financial advantages for a person earning a salary there, but it just seems like a player is being exiled when he is sent there.
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Everyone thought Gay would get a max contract offer as a RFA. What surprised people is that the Grizzlies didn't let him get that offer and just match it, instead they offered the max themselves.
Really, everyone? I think there was shock that Gay got such a big deal. Part of that was the shock of Heisley opening his checkbook but Gay becoming a max player also played a part. Really, I have zero connections and am just guessing but I have a hard time believing that everyone thought Gay was worth a max deal or would get one.
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I live in TN and know all about the Grizzlies.
I guarantee youIMO, after reading local news (everyday) and listening to talk radio (with Grizzly insiders) they would take Green and Bass for Gay if Ainge could find a 3rd team to absorb Bass's contract with expiring players for their 2nd unit.
I live in Boston, and I know all about the Celtics. I don't guarantee you anything about what Danny would do.
No offense, and I am sure you are more connected to the Grizz than most people on here. But I think its going a bit far to suggest that you know whether or not they would accept a deal.
Let me fix it for you. ::)
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Everyone thought Gay would get a max contract offer as a RFA. What surprised people is that the Grizzlies didn't let him get that offer and just match it, instead they offered the max themselves.
Really, everyone? I think there was shock that Gay got such a big deal. Part of that was the shock of Heisley opening his checkbook but Gay becoming a max player also played a part. Really, I have zero connections and am just guessing but I have a hard time believing that everyone thought Gay was worth a max deal or would get one.
Its funny how there are so many players that get max deals when they dont deserve one. And then the guys that deserve max deals take a pay cut to help their teams more.
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Everyone thought Gay would get a max contract offer as a RFA. What surprised people is that the Grizzlies didn't let him get that offer and just match it, instead they offered the max themselves.
Really, everyone? I think there was shock that Gay got such a big deal. Part of that was the shock of Heisley opening his checkbook but Gay becoming a max player also played a part. Really, I have zero connections and am just guessing but I have a hard time believing that everyone thought Gay was worth a max deal or would get one.
A max deal from your own team is a bigger deal (longer term) than one you can get in FA. So yes people were shocked with the deal Memphis gave him. But it was expected he'd get offered the max for a RFA and that Memphis would match.
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I live in TN and know all about the Grizzlies.
I guarantee youIMO, after reading local news (everyday) and listening to talk radio (with Grizzly insiders) they would take Green and Bass for Gay if Ainge could find a 3rd team to absorb Bass's contract with expiring players for their 2nd unit.
I live in Boston, and I know all about the Celtics. I don't guarantee you anything about what Danny would do.
No offense, and I am sure you are more connected to the Grizz than most people on here. But I think its going a bit far to suggest that you know whether or not they would accept a deal.
Let me fix it for you. ::)
Much better. Sorry, to pick on you, but its a pet peeve of mine.
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I live in TN and know all about the Grizzlies.
I guarantee youIMO, after reading local news (everyday) and listening to talk radio (with Grizzly insiders) they would take Green and Bass for Gay if Ainge could find a 3rd team to absorb Bass's contract with expiring players for their 2nd unit.
I live in Boston, and I know all about the Celtics. I don't guarantee you anything about what Danny would do.
No offense, and I am sure you are more connected to the Grizz than most people on here. But I think its going a bit far to suggest that you know whether or not they would accept a deal.
Let me fix it for you. ::)
Much better. Sorry, to pick on you, but its a pet peeve of mine.
I could tell. LOL! TP
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But it is the cost in keeping a team in a small market.
It can be this or watch the team leave for another city.
Well, I'd say Memphis isn't really an NBA-worthy city anyway. And with teams in Charlotte, Atlanta, New Orleans, and OKC, the South had enough teams already before the Grizz arrived.
But now I'm getting started on the whole contraction question (not to mention which teams deserve which nicknames)! ;D
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But it is the cost in keeping a team in a small market.
It can be this or watch the team leave for another city.
Well, I'd say Memphis isn't really an NBA-worthy city anyway. And with teams in Charlotte, Atlanta, New Orleans, and OKC, the South had enough teams already before the Grizz arrived.
But now I'm getting started on the whole contraction question (not to mention which teams deserve which nicknames)! ;D
I agree. It's pretty easy to get a $5 ticket to a Grizzlies game. You just got to by a monthly nose bleed pack.
The main problem is Memphis is they are in a central time zone and play alot of west coast games. They start playing when many people are going to bed.
They should add another western team (Seattle) and move Memphis to the East.
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But it is the cost in keeping a team in a small market.
It can be this or watch the team leave for another city.
Well, I'd say Memphis isn't really an NBA-worthy city anyway. And with teams in Charlotte, Atlanta, New Orleans, and OKC, the South had enough teams already before the Grizz arrived.
But now I'm getting started on the whole contraction question (not to mention which teams deserve which nicknames)! ;D
I agree. It's pretty easy to get a $5 ticket to a Grizzlies game. You just got to by a monthly nose bleed pack.
The main problem is Memphis is they are in a central time zone and play alot of west coast games. They start playing when many people are going to bed.
They should add another western team (Seattle) and move Memphis to the East.
Alright, you opened the door! ;D ...
Eliminate Toronto, Charlotte, Memphis, and Milwaukee.
Move New Orleans or Minnesota to the East to rebalance the conferences.
Return "Jazz" to New Orleans, give "Grizzlies" to Utah, and change Washington back to "Bullets."
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I live in TN and know all about the Grizzlies.
I guarantee youIMO, after reading local news (everyday) and listening to talk radio (with Grizzly insiders) they would take Green and Bass for Gay if Ainge could find a 3rd team to absorb Bass's contract with expiring players for their 2nd unit.
I live in Boston, and I know all about the Celtics. I don't guarantee you anything about what Danny would do.
No offense, and I am sure you are more connected to the Grizz than most people on here. But I think its going a bit far to suggest that you know whether or not they would accept a deal.
Let me fix it for you. ::)
Much better. Sorry, to pick on you, but its a pet peeve of mine.
I could tell. LOL! TP
If this Grizz inside info is true lets go for this trade.
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=as639wj (http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=as639wj)
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Everyone thought Gay would get a max contract offer as a RFA. What surprised people is that the Grizzlies didn't let him get that offer and just match it, instead they offered the max themselves.
Really, everyone? I think there was shock that Gay got such a big deal. Part of that was the shock of Heisley opening his checkbook but Gay becoming a max player also played a part. Really, I have zero connections and am just guessing but I have a hard time believing that everyone thought Gay was worth a max deal or would get one.
A max deal from your own team is a bigger deal (longer term) than one you can get in FA. So yes people were shocked with the deal Memphis gave him. But it was expected he'd get offered the max for a RFA and that Memphis would match.
I doubt it simply because Gay has never played at a max level and there is no way the consensus around the league was that he would get a max offer.