Author Topic: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?  (Read 20148 times)

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Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #90 on: June 05, 2018, 09:42:35 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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I'm seeing Draft projects with Doncic at the 2nd pick or even third. I saw one with Doncic going forth to the Grizzles. If he falls that far Danny should go after him.

I can’t see the Grizzlies passing at 4, or trading him for anything but a huge package.  But if Ainge can somehow get Doncic without giving up Brown or Tatum, he is my hero.  I haven’t posted in the draft draft thread because Doncic has been my 2018 draft binkie for 18 months.  And I can’t let myself dream.

To whom would you compare Doncic? I only ask because, well, I don't know much of anything about him other than the possibility of the guy staying in Europe next year and the fact that Phoenix just hired one of his former coaches, or something. I think.

I don’t like comps for him because we really haven’t seen a player like him before.  People like saying Hayward for some reason, but they’re sort of comparing Doncic at 18 and 19 to a version of Hayward at age 25, and that feels wrong.  So, in keeping with the spirit of comparing him to players Celtics’ fans will recognize, I will say he’s Jayson Tatum but better.  Maybe Tatum has an inch in him — Doncic has a lack of verifiable measurements so it’s tough to say — but a better Jayson Tatum.  He can do all the stuff Tatum does, some of it a little better, and he can be an actual point guard as opposed to an emergency point guard because somehow three or four of them got injured at once.
I know I’m going to get flamed for this, but some aspects (not all!) of his game remind me of Bird a bit. Particularly on offence. Obviously a higher emphasis on the three rather than the mid-range, and not nearly the rebounder Bird was, but the way Doncic gets points reminds me of some of the ways Bird used to.

Please don’t shoot me for saying such a sacrilegious thing! I’m not saying he’ll have a career like Bird or anything, not even comparing him really, but a considerable portion of what he does is Bird-esque. Plus, he plays with fire in his belly, which is awesome fun

Really, because I don't see any of that at all. Dude looks like a slower, albeit better passing, version of Mario Hezonja, imo.
To each their own, but I don’t get that comp whatsoever. Hezonja never had a season 50% as good as Doncic has had this year

Any particular clips/highlight videos that I should watch in order to get the full Luka Doncic experience, lol ;D, because in the one that I just viewed he couldn't get around/create any kind of space against the only two black guys on the court, LOL ;D, and this dude is 18? :o Shouldn't he be a lot faster, quicker, and a much better leaper? That's where the comparison to Hezonja comes into play, for me, but I'm weird :-\, and remember, I was dead wrong about Tatum, so there's that ;D.
I was wrong about Tatum too! I remember being quite angry after traded #1 lol.

But with Doncic, I feel it's a bit harder to get a feel for him from watching highlight videos as you don't ever really see his defensive versatility in them, but as a 6'8" 230lb guy who can guard some PG's, most SG's and SF's and some PF's it's a crucial aspect of his game.

His EuroBasket work is really impressive, as he goes up against a lot of NBA caliber guys, and dominated next to Dragic.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_bUEAaaR40
His legit NBA range and insane ball-handling really show in this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-t9j71jbp0
This is a good clip for his performance for Real. Shows his IQ and ability to score from all three levels. Like Tatum, he uses a lot of dribble moves for separation, e.g. how Tatum uses a hang hesitation dribble to shoot from, except Doncic uses similar moves more for getting to the ring and passing.

I think he'll be truly special

Brb...;D.

Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #91 on: June 05, 2018, 09:49:34 PM »

Offline saltlover

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I'm seeing Draft projects with Doncic at the 2nd pick or even third. I saw one with Doncic going forth to the Grizzles. If he falls that far Danny should go after him.

I can’t see the Grizzlies passing at 4, or trading him for anything but a huge package.  But if Ainge can somehow get Doncic without giving up Brown or Tatum, he is my hero.  I haven’t posted in the draft draft thread because Doncic has been my 2018 draft binkie for 18 months.  And I can’t let myself dream.

To whom would you compare Doncic? I only ask because, well, I don't know much of anything about him other than the possibility of the guy staying in Europe next year and the fact that Phoenix just hired one of his former coaches, or something. I think.

I don’t like comps for him because we really haven’t seen a player like him before.  People like saying Hayward for some reason, but they’re sort of comparing Doncic at 18 and 19 to a version of Hayward at age 25, and that feels wrong.  So, in keeping with the spirit of comparing him to players Celtics’ fans will recognize, I will say he’s Jayson Tatum but better.  Maybe Tatum has an inch in him — Doncic has a lack of verifiable measurements so it’s tough to say — but a better Jayson Tatum.  He can do all the stuff Tatum does, some of it a little better, and he can be an actual point guard as opposed to an emergency point guard because somehow three or four of them got injured at once.

Okay, first of all, thanks for the breakdown, so TP :).

That said, and I want to preface this by saying that I was completely wrong about Tatum, I just watched this highlight video so I am now obviously an expert in all things Luka Doncic, LOL ;) ::) ;D, and I have to tell you, outside of 2-3 post-ups and passes, I guess, there's nothing about him that even remotely intrigues me :-\, so what am I missing, here, besides everything, lol?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRLFREnWUoc

Do I need to look at another highlight video, because that seems like a lot of work ;) ::) ;D.

I don’t have highlight videos to recommend.  I’ve watched about a dozen full games of his, which are way better to go off than highlight videos. (Not saying you should run and do that — I watched about a game a month).  He’s very instinctive, at both ends of the court.  There’s a reason he was the Euroleague MVP, the Euroleague Final Four MVP, the Spanish League MVP, and that his team won the Euroleague, will win the Spanish league this week, and that Slovenia won Eurobasket.  He was the best player on the court in September when Slovenia beat Spain by 20 in the Eurobasket semis.  That court also included both Gasols, Rubio, and Dragic.  There’s no question in my mind he would have started for a majority of NBA teams this season, and would have been in the rotation for every single one.

I don’t know how many, if any, teams will pass on him. Any that do will regret it.  I frankly think the Doncic falling past #1 rumor is just a smokescreen and a need to generate clicks, same as it was obvious that Ben Simmons was the best player in the draft a couple of years ago.  (And if I had Doncic, I wouldn’t trade him straight up for Simmons).  Doncic has a Hall of Fame ceiling with a quality starter floor.  He’s the only player in this draft I would conceive of trading Tatum or Brown for.

And the only reason he hasn’t announced that he’s coming to the NBA yet is because his team is still playing, and he’s both professional and a good teammate.  A couple days after they win he will announce that he’s coming to the NBA.  He has zero left to prove in Europe.

Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #92 on: June 05, 2018, 09:51:17 PM »

Offline liam

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I'm seeing Draft projects with Doncic at the 2nd pick or even third. I saw one with Doncic going forth to the Grizzles. If he falls that far Danny should go after him.

I can’t see the Grizzlies passing at 4, or trading him for anything but a huge package.  But if Ainge can somehow get Doncic without giving up Brown or Tatum, he is my hero.  I haven’t posted in the draft draft thread because Doncic has been my 2018 draft binkie for 18 months.  And I can’t let myself dream.

To whom would you compare Doncic? I only ask because, well, I don't know much of anything about him other than the possibility of the guy staying in Europe next year and the fact that Phoenix just hired one of his former coaches, or something. I think.

I don’t like comps for him because we really haven’t seen a player like him before.  People like saying Hayward for some reason, but they’re sort of comparing Doncic at 18 and 19 to a version of Hayward at age 25, and that feels wrong.  So, in keeping with the spirit of comparing him to players Celtics’ fans will recognize, I will say he’s Jayson Tatum but better.  Maybe Tatum has an inch in him — Doncic has a lack of verifiable measurements so it’s tough to say — but a better Jayson Tatum.  He can do all the stuff Tatum does, some of it a little better, and he can be an actual point guard as opposed to an emergency point guard because somehow three or four of them got injured at once.

My comp is Ben Simmons with a jump shot. Doncic is huge like Simmons and can pass like that and break down defenses like that but with a vastly superior jump shot. .333 career 3 point shooter in EuroLeague competition. 80% free-throw shooter.

Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #93 on: June 05, 2018, 09:54:06 PM »

Offline Forza Juventus

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Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #94 on: June 05, 2018, 10:32:18 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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I don’t have highlight videos to recommend.  I’ve watched about a dozen full games of his, which are way better to go off than highlight videos. (Not saying you should run and do that — I watched about a game a month).  He’s very instinctive, at both ends of the court.  There’s a reason he was the Euroleague MVP, the Euroleague Final Four MVP, the Spanish League MVP, and that his team won the Euroleague, will win the Spanish league this week, and that Slovenia won Eurobasket.  He was the best player on the court in September when Slovenia beat Spain by 20 in the Eurobasket semis.  That court also included both Gasols, Rubio, and Dragic.  There’s no question in my mind he would have started for a majority of NBA teams this season, and would have been in the rotation for every single one.

I don’t know how many, if any, teams will pass on him. Any that do will regret it.  I frankly think the Doncic falling past #1 rumor is just a smokescreen and a need to generate clicks, same as it was obvious that Ben Simmons was the best player in the draft a couple of years ago.  (And if I had Doncic, I wouldn’t trade him straight up for Simmons).  Doncic has a Hall of Fame ceiling with a quality starter floor.  He’s the only player in this draft I would conceive of trading Tatum or Brown for.

And the only reason he hasn’t announced that he’s coming to the NBA yet is because his team is still playing, and he’s both professional and a good teammate.  A couple days after they win he will announce that he’s coming to the NBA.  He has zero left to prove in Europe.

I'll certainly cede to your expertise, here, seeing as to how you've clearly seen far more of him than I have, and in the videos that gouki88 provided (and TP to him for that, btw :)), yeah, okay, I loved the two passes that he threw between the legs of, well, two defenders, but I guess that my hesitation/problem with Doncic primarily stems from the fact that he wasn't executing hardly any of his step-back/crossover moves against guys with NBA-level lateral quickness, or at least imo, anyway, which I realize doesn't exactly count for anything, lol ;D, and when he matched up against Kevin Seraphin, of all people, who could barely guard anyone in the league, Luka couldn't even get around him, not to mention the fact that it looks like he also struggles with getting, well, around "the show" as exhibited by the opposing big guys when defending against pick and rolls in those videos.

Aside from that, those are some pretty bold statements that you've made, there, and for me, I guess that it just comes down to skepticism, as we've seen accomplished European players come over to the NBA, before, who were expected to be stars or at least very good players, iirc, and too many of them just flat out couldn't guard anyone, at the absolute minimum, and as a result I just wonder as to if these guys had come up through the collegiate ranks as opposed to starring on the international circuit, would they even be drafted, because physically, they're not at all different from their American counterparts, and yet the dudes in Europe wind up being lottery picks while similar, well, white American college players ultimately find themselves playing in, well, Europe, lol.

I just think that the whole thing is weird :-\.

Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #95 on: June 05, 2018, 10:40:03 PM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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I'm seeing Draft projects with Doncic at the 2nd pick or even third. I saw one with Doncic going forth to the Grizzles. If he falls that far Danny should go after him.

I can’t see the Grizzlies passing at 4, or trading him for anything but a huge package.  But if Ainge can somehow get Doncic without giving up Brown or Tatum, he is my hero.  I haven’t posted in the draft draft thread because Doncic has been my 2018 draft binkie for 18 months.  And I can’t let myself dream.

To whom would you compare Doncic? I only ask because, well, I don't know much of anything about him other than the possibility of the guy staying in Europe next year and the fact that Phoenix just hired one of his former coaches, or something. I think.

I don’t like comps for him because we really haven’t seen a player like him before.  People like saying Hayward for some reason, but they’re sort of comparing Doncic at 18 and 19 to a version of Hayward at age 25, and that feels wrong.  So, in keeping with the spirit of comparing him to players Celtics’ fans will recognize, I will say he’s Jayson Tatum but better.  Maybe Tatum has an inch in him — Doncic has a lack of verifiable measurements so it’s tough to say — but a better Jayson Tatum.  He can do all the stuff Tatum does, some of it a little better, and he can be an actual point guard as opposed to an emergency point guard because somehow three or four of them got injured at once.
I know I’m going to get flamed for this, but some aspects (not all!) of his game remind me of Bird a bit. Particularly on offence. Obviously a higher emphasis on the three rather than the mid-range, and not nearly the rebounder Bird was, but the way Doncic gets points reminds me of some of the ways Bird used to.

Please don’t shoot me for saying such a sacrilegious thing! I’m not saying he’ll have a career like Bird or anything, not even comparing him really, but a considerable portion of what he does is Bird-esque. Plus, he plays with fire in his belly, which is awesome fun

Really, because I don't see any of that at all. Dude looks like a slower, albeit better passing, version of Mario Hezonja, imo.
To each their own, but I don’t get that comp whatsoever. Hezonja never had a season 50% as good as Doncic has had this year

Any particular clips/highlight videos that I should watch in order to get the full Luka Doncic experience, lol ;D, because in the one that I just viewed he couldn't get around/create any kind of space against the only two black guys on the court, LOL ;D, and this dude is 18? :o Shouldn't he be a lot faster, quicker, and a much better leaper? That's where the comparison to Hezonja comes into play, for me, but I'm weird :-\, and remember, I was dead wrong about Tatum, so there's that ;D.

Two new videos that you may find more helpful:

Strengths: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwGFRNilQ8Q

Weaknesses: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYp6rav9TiU

He's definitely difficult to gauge, but ultimately I think he's a very good prospect.  While he can be nifty with the ball, he often seems very practical and in his decision-making, and perhaps that's why he appears less exciting.  He's not flashy, but his bbIQ and confidence is high.  While he's average-ish athletically, he has great size and agility to make good on what he has. 

My favorite comp is a hybrid of Hayward and Ginobili.

You may watch these and then flip over to some college highlights, like Ayton's - it'll give you a good picture of just how much bigger and stronger Doncic's competition has been. 

All that said, I have mixed feelings about how his career is going to pan out.  First, any one that goes to SAC (#2) is at a disadvantage.  Second, he's the type of player that will excel around other great players.  Like Ginobili and Hayward, his skills (IQ, playmaking, etc) can make every one else on the court better; at the same time, if he's surrounded by poor/unmotivated players, many of those contributions could be lost.   
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Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #96 on: June 05, 2018, 11:58:07 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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I'm seeing Draft projects with Doncic at the 2nd pick or even third. I saw one with Doncic going forth to the Grizzles. If he falls that far Danny should go after him.

I can’t see the Grizzlies passing at 4, or trading him for anything but a huge package.  But if Ainge can somehow get Doncic without giving up Brown or Tatum, he is my hero.  I haven’t posted in the draft draft thread because Doncic has been my 2018 draft binkie for 18 months.  And I can’t let myself dream.

To whom would you compare Doncic? I only ask because, well, I don't know much of anything about him other than the possibility of the guy staying in Europe next year and the fact that Phoenix just hired one of his former coaches, or something. I think.

I don’t like comps for him because we really haven’t seen a player like him before.  People like saying Hayward for some reason, but they’re sort of comparing Doncic at 18 and 19 to a version of Hayward at age 25, and that feels wrong.  So, in keeping with the spirit of comparing him to players Celtics’ fans will recognize, I will say he’s Jayson Tatum but better.  Maybe Tatum has an inch in him — Doncic has a lack of verifiable measurements so it’s tough to say — but a better Jayson Tatum.  He can do all the stuff Tatum does, some of it a little better, and he can be an actual point guard as opposed to an emergency point guard because somehow three or four of them got injured at once.
I know I’m going to get flamed for this, but some aspects (not all!) of his game remind me of Bird a bit. Particularly on offence. Obviously a higher emphasis on the three rather than the mid-range, and not nearly the rebounder Bird was, but the way Doncic gets points reminds me of some of the ways Bird used to.

Please don’t shoot me for saying such a sacrilegious thing! I’m not saying he’ll have a career like Bird or anything, not even comparing him really, but a considerable portion of what he does is Bird-esque. Plus, he plays with fire in his belly, which is awesome fun

Really, because I don't see any of that at all. Dude looks like a slower, albeit better passing, version of Mario Hezonja, imo.
To each their own, but I don’t get that comp whatsoever. Hezonja never had a season 50% as good as Doncic has had this year

Any particular clips/highlight videos that I should watch in order to get the full Luka Doncic experience, lol ;D, because in the one that I just viewed he couldn't get around/create any kind of space against the only two black guys on the court, LOL ;D, and this dude is 18? :o Shouldn't he be a lot faster, quicker, and a much better leaper? That's where the comparison to Hezonja comes into play, for me, but I'm weird :-\, and remember, I was dead wrong about Tatum, so there's that ;D.

Two new videos that you may find more helpful:

Strengths: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwGFRNilQ8Q

Weaknesses: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYp6rav9TiU

He's definitely difficult to gauge, but ultimately I think he's a very good prospect.  While he can be nifty with the ball, he often seems very practical and in his decision-making, and perhaps that's why he appears less exciting.  He's not flashy, but his bbIQ and confidence is high.  While he's average-ish athletically, he has great size and agility to make good on what he has. 

My favorite comp is a hybrid of Hayward and Ginobili.

You may watch these and then flip over to some college highlights, like Ayton's - it'll give you a good picture of just how much bigger and stronger Doncic's competition has been. 

All that said, I have mixed feelings about how his career is going to pan out.  First, any one that goes to SAC (#2) is at a disadvantage.  Second, he's the type of player that will excel around other great players.  Like Ginobili and Hayward, his skills (IQ, playmaking, etc) can make every one else on the court better; at the same time, if he's surrounded by poor/unmotivated players, many of those contributions could be lost.


Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #97 on: June 06, 2018, 12:29:11 AM »

Offline gouki88

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I'm seeing Draft projects with Doncic at the 2nd pick or even third. I saw one with Doncic going forth to the Grizzles. If he falls that far Danny should go after him.

I can’t see the Grizzlies passing at 4, or trading him for anything but a huge package.  But if Ainge can somehow get Doncic without giving up Brown or Tatum, he is my hero.  I haven’t posted in the draft draft thread because Doncic has been my 2018 draft binkie for 18 months.  And I can’t let myself dream.

To whom would you compare Doncic? I only ask because, well, I don't know much of anything about him other than the possibility of the guy staying in Europe next year and the fact that Phoenix just hired one of his former coaches, or something. I think.

I don’t like comps for him because we really haven’t seen a player like him before.  People like saying Hayward for some reason, but they’re sort of comparing Doncic at 18 and 19 to a version of Hayward at age 25, and that feels wrong.  So, in keeping with the spirit of comparing him to players Celtics’ fans will recognize, I will say he’s Jayson Tatum but better.  Maybe Tatum has an inch in him — Doncic has a lack of verifiable measurements so it’s tough to say — but a better Jayson Tatum.  He can do all the stuff Tatum does, some of it a little better, and he can be an actual point guard as opposed to an emergency point guard because somehow three or four of them got injured at once.
I know I’m going to get flamed for this, but some aspects (not all!) of his game remind me of Bird a bit. Particularly on offence. Obviously a higher emphasis on the three rather than the mid-range, and not nearly the rebounder Bird was, but the way Doncic gets points reminds me of some of the ways Bird used to.

Please don’t shoot me for saying such a sacrilegious thing! I’m not saying he’ll have a career like Bird or anything, not even comparing him really, but a considerable portion of what he does is Bird-esque. Plus, he plays with fire in his belly, which is awesome fun

Really, because I don't see any of that at all. Dude looks like a slower, albeit better passing, version of Mario Hezonja, imo.
To each their own, but I don’t get that comp whatsoever. Hezonja never had a season 50% as good as Doncic has had this year

Any particular clips/highlight videos that I should watch in order to get the full Luka Doncic experience, lol ;D, because in the one that I just viewed he couldn't get around/create any kind of space against the only two black guys on the court, LOL ;D, and this dude is 18? :o Shouldn't he be a lot faster, quicker, and a much better leaper? That's where the comparison to Hezonja comes into play, for me, but I'm weird :-\, and remember, I was dead wrong about Tatum, so there's that ;D.

Two new videos that you may find more helpful:

Strengths: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwGFRNilQ8Q

Weaknesses: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYp6rav9TiU

He's definitely difficult to gauge, but ultimately I think he's a very good prospect.  While he can be nifty with the ball, he often seems very practical and in his decision-making, and perhaps that's why he appears less exciting.  He's not flashy, but his bbIQ and confidence is high.  While he's average-ish athletically, he has great size and agility to make good on what he has. 

My favorite comp is a hybrid of Hayward and Ginobili.

You may watch these and then flip over to some college highlights, like Ayton's - it'll give you a good picture of just how much bigger and stronger Doncic's competition has been. 

All that said, I have mixed feelings about how his career is going to pan out.  First, any one that goes to SAC (#2) is at a disadvantage.  Second, he's the type of player that will excel around other great players.  Like Ginobili and Hayward, his skills (IQ, playmaking, etc) can make every one else on the court better; at the same time, if he's surrounded by poor/unmotivated players, many of those contributions could be lost.   
That's why he should stay another year, let Boston get the #2 pick from Sacramento and then trade up to #1 and come here! Simple as that ;D
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Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #98 on: June 06, 2018, 01:38:54 PM »

Offline droopdog7

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Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #99 on: June 06, 2018, 02:10:14 PM »

Offline liam

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Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #100 on: June 07, 2018, 03:58:35 PM »

Offline number_n9ne

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My new favorite draft binkies in order are:

Elie Okobo
Donte DiVincenvo
Khyri Thomas
Jerome Robinson
Moritz Wagner

I think Okobo could be the most NBA ready rookie coming into the league next season and could replace Rozier's minutes if we trade him. Plus he would give Yabu someone to speak French with  ;D

Prefect scenario would be to get Okobo at #27 and then buy or trade for a pick in the second for Wagner or Robinson.

Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #101 on: June 07, 2018, 11:06:01 PM »

Offline rondofan1255

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Huh?

Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #102 on: June 07, 2018, 11:07:31 PM »

Offline liam

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Huh?

My lucky draft mustache. It got us Tatum last year! ;D

Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #103 on: June 07, 2018, 11:10:13 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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Lol, TP ;D.

Re: Who's your 2018 draft binkie?
« Reply #104 on: June 07, 2018, 11:29:27 PM »

Offline liam

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Anyone have any hot takes on Dzanan Musa? He looks like Steph Curry in these highlight videos.