Author Topic: I’m Moving On. AD Doesn’t Want BOS & Trading Tatum For A Rental Would Be Idiotic  (Read 28348 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online Roy H.

  • Forums Manager
  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 58538
  • Tommy Points: -25636
  • Bo Knows: Joe Don't Know Diddley
We need AD to keep saying he won't resign here and we want his value low. Makes dealing for him cost less. Even if he wanted to come here he needs to stick to the story to ensure C's don't have to deal Tatum.

Maybe it allows team to make it Brown, Horford and 3 first of Grizz(we protect it top 3), Kings, Clippers/C's.

It might reduce what the Celtics are willing to give, but why would it change what the Pelicans are willing to take?

Other teams can come up with better offers than Jaylen and picks.


I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER——— AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!@ 34 minutes

Offline Csfan1984

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8825
  • Tommy Points: 289
We need AD to keep saying he won't resign here and we want his value low. Makes dealing for him cost less. Even if he wanted to come here he needs to stick to the story to ensure C's don't have to deal Tatum.

Maybe it allows team to make it Brown, Horford and 3 first of Grizz(we protect it top 3), Kings, Clippers/C's.

It might reduce what the Celtics are willing to give, but why would it change what the Pelicans are willing to take?

Other teams can come up with better offers than Jaylen and picks.
A single player maybe but Im not so sure about the whole package though. Brown, Horford and 3 first is tough to beat.

Offline Phantom255x

  • Larry Bird
  • *****************************
  • Posts: 29509
  • Tommy Points: 2923
  • On To Banner 18!
We need AD to keep saying he won't resign here and we want his value low. Makes dealing for him cost less. Even if he wanted to come here he needs to stick to the story to ensure C's don't have to deal Tatum.

Maybe it allows team to make it Brown, Horford and 3 first of Grizz(we protect it top 3), Kings, Clippers/C's.

It might reduce what the Celtics are willing to give, but why would it change what the Pelicans are willing to take?

Other teams can come up with better offers than Jaylen and picks.
A single player maybe but Im not so sure about the whole package though. Brown, Horford and 3 first is tough to beat.

I really don't understand this board's mission to trade Horford. Guy is so underrated and would actually fit perfectly alongside AD in our hypothetical front court. As for $$$, Horford strikes me as someone who'd be okay opting out and then re-upping again on something like a 3/60M deal (so a few extra years), and that would also be better than paying him close to 30M AAV. He's our Embiid stopper too.
"Tough times never last, but tough people do." - Robert H. Schuller

Offline LilRip

  • Paul Silas
  • ******
  • Posts: 6857
  • Tommy Points: 391
I would trade Tatum, Hayward (salary), Theis and picks. I’d hate to trade Hayward and Tatum but that fixes our wing logjam and bolsters our big rotation as well. 

Starters: Kyrie, Smart, Brown, Davis, Horford... that’s a strong lineup on both ends of the floor

And then sign people to come off the bench. Rozier will obvs be gone, Morris likely too. We’ll need to fill out the bench around Semi and Baynes aka we need a scorer/playmaker off the bench. Like a Jamal Crawford/D-Rose-type (no one is coming to mind right now)
- LilRip

Offline Csfan1984

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8825
  • Tommy Points: 289
We need AD to keep saying he won't resign here and we want his value low. Makes dealing for him cost less. Even if he wanted to come here he needs to stick to the story to ensure C's don't have to deal Tatum.

Maybe it allows team to make it Brown, Horford and 3 first of Grizz(we protect it top 3), Kings, Clippers/C's.

It might reduce what the Celtics are willing to give, but why would it change what the Pelicans are willing to take?

Other teams can come up with better offers than Jaylen and picks.
A single player maybe but Im not so sure about the whole package though. Brown, Horford and 3 first is tough to beat.

I really don't understand this board's mission to trade Horford. Guy is so underrated and would actually fit perfectly alongside AD in our hypothetical front court.
You have to give to get Horford is a huge piece not a throw in. Hayward you can't trade. Smart and Irving are good together. Who else is left? Not much choice if you want AD

Offline Phantom255x

  • Larry Bird
  • *****************************
  • Posts: 29509
  • Tommy Points: 2923
  • On To Banner 18!
We need AD to keep saying he won't resign here and we want his value low. Makes dealing for him cost less. Even if he wanted to come here he needs to stick to the story to ensure C's don't have to deal Tatum.

Maybe it allows team to make it Brown, Horford and 3 first of Grizz(we protect it top 3), Kings, Clippers/C's.

It might reduce what the Celtics are willing to give, but why would it change what the Pelicans are willing to take?

Other teams can come up with better offers than Jaylen and picks.
A single player maybe but Im not so sure about the whole package though. Brown, Horford and 3 first is tough to beat.

I really don't understand this board's mission to trade Horford. Guy is so underrated and would actually fit perfectly alongside AD in our hypothetical front court.
You have to give to get Horford is a huge piece not a throw in. Hayward you can't trade. Smart and Irving are good together. Who else is left? Not much choice if you want AD

Probably have to include one of Smart/Brown. Or Tatum, MLE Player, Williams + Picks. Maybe NOP likes Rozier and you could include him and half his $$$ counts as outgoing salary on our end through a S&T. Definitely a lot of possibilities.

Also I'm not really sure the Pelicans themselves would be interested in taking on Horford as they'd prefer a rebuild and would probably want younger pieces.

You're also right that Hayward is essentially untouchable, at least through this summer.

Personally I think the goal is, if you want AD and also to have the best possible roster afterwards, you need Horford, Kyrie, Hayward, and at least one of Rozier/Smart/Brown. Then I trust Danny and co. to put together a decent bench.
"Tough times never last, but tough people do." - Robert H. Schuller

Online Roy H.

  • Forums Manager
  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 58538
  • Tommy Points: -25636
  • Bo Knows: Joe Don't Know Diddley
We need AD to keep saying he won't resign here and we want his value low. Makes dealing for him cost less. Even if he wanted to come here he needs to stick to the story to ensure C's don't have to deal Tatum.

Maybe it allows team to make it Brown, Horford and 3 first of Grizz(we protect it top 3), Kings, Clippers/C's.

It might reduce what the Celtics are willing to give, but why would it change what the Pelicans are willing to take?

Other teams can come up with better offers than Jaylen and picks.
A single player maybe but Im not so sure about the whole package though. Brown, Horford and 3 first is tough to beat.

I really don't understand this board's mission to trade Horford. Guy is so underrated and would actually fit perfectly alongside AD in our hypothetical front court.
You have to give to get Horford is a huge piece not a throw in. Hayward you can't trade. Smart and Irving are good together. Who else is left? Not much choice if you want AD

Even assuming that Horford would allow himself to be traded -- which is up for debate -- why would New Orleans value him highly?  He'd be a 33 year old short-timer who wouldn't move the needle for NOP.  They'd no doubt try to retrade him, but it's difficult to match $30+ million salaries, especially without taking long-term salary back.  Not many contenders are going to have cap space / matching expiring contracts, plus positive assets to trade for Horford.

But, again, my speculation is that Horford would opt out if he suspected he might be traded to a going-nowhere franchise. 


I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER——— AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!@ 34 minutes

Offline Csfan1984

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8825
  • Tommy Points: 289
We need AD to keep saying he won't resign here and we want his value low. Makes dealing for him cost less. Even if he wanted to come here he needs to stick to the story to ensure C's don't have to deal Tatum.

Maybe it allows team to make it Brown, Horford and 3 first of Grizz(we protect it top 3), Kings, Clippers/C's.

It might reduce what the Celtics are willing to give, but why would it change what the Pelicans are willing to take?

Other teams can come up with better offers than Jaylen and picks.
A single player maybe but Im not so sure about the whole package though. Brown, Horford and 3 first is tough to beat.

I really don't understand this board's mission to trade Horford. Guy is so underrated and would actually fit perfectly alongside AD in our hypothetical front court.
You have to give to get Horford is a huge piece not a throw in. Hayward you can't trade. Smart and Irving are good together. Who else is left? Not much choice if you want AD

Probably have to include one of Smart/Brown. Or Tatum, MLE Player, Williams + Picks. Maybe NOP likes Rozier and you could include him and half his $$$ counts as outgoing salary on our end. Definitely a lot of possibilities.

Also I'm not really sure the Pelicans themselves would be interested in taking on Horford as they'd prefer a rebuild and would probably want younger pieces.

You're also right that Hayward is essentially untouchable, at least through this summer.

Personally I think the goal is, if you want AD and also to have the best possible roster afterwards, you need Horford, Kyrie, Hayward, and at least one of Rozier/Smart/Brown. Then I trust Danny and co. to put together a decent bench.
Horford is a great match for the Pelicans short and long term.
They can play Holiday, Moore, Brown, Randle, Horford in the short term. Horford may help that team gel as he is a top glue guy. Then they have three first, one that projects high. And in the long tern Horford is off the books in a year for cap relief. For more rebuild ammo. It makes a ton of sense for them.

Its a tough deal to beat for teams. Is there really a team out there that has a better prospect that surpasses Brown with three first to build around? Is a team going to give an all star for a one year gamble on AD?

I like keeping Tatum and centering the deal around Brown and Horford.

Offline LilRip

  • Paul Silas
  • ******
  • Posts: 6857
  • Tommy Points: 391
We need AD to keep saying he won't resign here and we want his value low. Makes dealing for him cost less. Even if he wanted to come here he needs to stick to the story to ensure C's don't have to deal Tatum.

Maybe it allows team to make it Brown, Horford and 3 first of Grizz(we protect it top 3), Kings, Clippers/C's.

It might reduce what the Celtics are willing to give, but why would it change what the Pelicans are willing to take?

Other teams can come up with better offers than Jaylen and picks.
A single player maybe but Im not so sure about the whole package though. Brown, Horford and 3 first is tough to beat.

I really don't understand this board's mission to trade Horford. Guy is so underrated and would actually fit perfectly alongside AD in our hypothetical front court.
You have to give to get Horford is a huge piece not a throw in. Hayward you can't trade. Smart and Irving are good together. Who else is left? Not much choice if you want AD

Even assuming that Horford would allow himself to be traded -- which is up for debate -- why would New Orleans value him highly?  He'd be a 33 year old short-timer who wouldn't move the needle for NOP.  They'd no doubt try to retrade him, but it's difficult to match $30+ million salaries, especially without taking long-term salary back.  Not many contenders are going to have cap space / matching expiring contracts, plus positive assets to trade for Horford.

But, again, my speculation is that Horford would opt out if he suspected he might be traded to a going-nowhere franchise.

^ this!

Horford is of little use to anyone outside us, given contract situation as well as age.

As “untradeable” as people are making Hayward out to be, if he can string a strong run in the playoffs, then u have a guy who:
1. Technically in his prime
2. Former all star whose powers have returned
3. Locked up for multiple years, allowing you time to build around him

Plus Tatum (I assume it has to be Tatum as the centerpiece of the deal)
- LilRip

Offline Csfan1984

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8825
  • Tommy Points: 289
We need AD to keep saying he won't resign here and we want his value low. Makes dealing for him cost less. Even if he wanted to come here he needs to stick to the story to ensure C's don't have to deal Tatum.

Maybe it allows team to make it Brown, Horford and 3 first of Grizz(we protect it top 3), Kings, Clippers/C's.

It might reduce what the Celtics are willing to give, but why would it change what the Pelicans are willing to take?

Other teams can come up with better offers than Jaylen and picks.
A single player maybe but Im not so sure about the whole package though. Brown, Horford and 3 first is tough to beat.

I really don't understand this board's mission to trade Horford. Guy is so underrated and would actually fit perfectly alongside AD in our hypothetical front court.
You have to give to get Horford is a huge piece not a throw in. Hayward you can't trade. Smart and Irving are good together. Who else is left? Not much choice if you want AD

Even assuming that Horford would allow himself to be traded -- which is up for debate -- why would New Orleans value him highly?  He'd be a 33 year old short-timer who wouldn't move the needle for NOP.  They'd no doubt try to retrade him, but it's difficult to match $30+ million salaries, especially without taking long-term salary back.  Not many contenders are going to have cap space / matching expiring contracts, plus positive assets to trade for Horford.

But, again, my speculation is that Horford would opt out if he suspected he might be traded to a going-nowhere franchise.
Horford is a glue guy and formerly recent all star. He has two or three years left if they keep him long term. If they don't keep him he provides cap relief which helps towards rebuilding. Plenty of reason to want him. I don't think he will opt out of 30 million

Offline celts10

  • Jaylen Brown
  • Posts: 543
  • Tommy Points: 25
I would trade Tatum, Hayward (salary), Theis and picks. I’d hate to trade Hayward and Tatum but that fixes our wing logjam and bolsters our big rotation as well. 

Starters: Kyrie, Smart, Brown, Davis, Horford... that’s a strong lineup on both ends of the floor

And then sign people to come off the bench. Rozier will obvs be gone, Morris likely too. We’ll need to fill out the bench around Semi and Baynes aka we need a scorer/playmaker off the bench. Like a Jamal Crawford/D-Rose-type (no one is coming to mind right now)

I really like your trade scenario and the hypothetical starting lineup. Do you really think Ainge will ship out Hayward though? I'd rather send Hayward instead of Horford or Smart, but I'm still unsure if Ainge will give up on GH just yet.

Offline gouki88

  • NCE
  • Red Auerbach
  • *******************************
  • Posts: 31552
  • Tommy Points: 3141
  • 2019 & 2021 CS Historical Draft Champion
I would trade Tatum, Hayward (salary), Theis and picks. I’d hate to trade Hayward and Tatum but that fixes our wing logjam and bolsters our big rotation as well. 

Starters: Kyrie, Smart, Brown, Davis, Horford... that’s a strong lineup on both ends of the floor

And then sign people to come off the bench. Rozier will obvs be gone, Morris likely too. We’ll need to fill out the bench around Semi and Baynes aka we need a scorer/playmaker off the bench. Like a Jamal Crawford/D-Rose-type (no one is coming to mind right now)

I really like your trade scenario and the hypothetical starting lineup. Do you really think Ainge will ship out Hayward though? I'd rather send Hayward instead of Horford or Smart, but I'm still unsure if Ainge will give up on GH just yet.
Yuck. I'd much rather move Horford than Hayward. 4 year age difference is massive, and I think GH is going to return to being the better player.

I don't think Ainge will ship out GH though. Not if he wants Brad on his side.
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Offline nickagneta

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 48120
  • Tommy Points: 8794
  • President of Jaylen Brown Fan Club
We need AD to keep saying he won't resign here and we want his value low. Makes dealing for him cost less. Even if he wanted to come here he needs to stick to the story to ensure C's don't have to deal Tatum.

Maybe it allows team to make it Brown, Horford and 3 first of Grizz(we protect it top 3), Kings, Clippers/C's.

It might reduce what the Celtics are willing to give, but why would it change what the Pelicans are willing to take?

Other teams can come up with better offers than Jaylen and picks.
A single player maybe but Im not so sure about the whole package though. Brown, Horford and 3 first is tough to beat.

I really don't understand this board's mission to trade Horford. Guy is so underrated and would actually fit perfectly alongside AD in our hypothetical front court.
You have to give to get Horford is a huge piece not a throw in. Hayward you can't trade. Smart and Irving are good together. Who else is left? Not much choice if you want AD

Even assuming that Horford would allow himself to be traded -- which is up for debate -- why would New Orleans value him highly?  He'd be a 33 year old short-timer who wouldn't move the needle for NOP.  They'd no doubt try to retrade him, but it's difficult to match $30+ million salaries, especially without taking long-term salary back.  Not many contenders are going to have cap space / matching expiring contracts, plus positive assets to trade for Horford.

But, again, my speculation is that Horford would opt out if he suspected he might be traded to a going-nowhere franchise.
Horford is a glue guy and formerly recent all star. He has two or three years left if they keep him long term. If they don't keep him he provides cap relief which helps towards rebuilding. Plenty of reason to want him. I don't think he will opt out of 30 million
You are absolutely dead wrong about Horford opting out of his final year. Horford wants to win a title and he and his family love Boston. If Boston says they are trading him somewhere he doesn't want to go, and who in their right mind wants to play NBA basketball for the Pelicans without Davis there, especially if you are a veteran hoping to win a title, Horford will opt out and sign elsewhere. And no trade.

People need to stop thinking with their love of certain players.

Tatum is gone in a Davis trade.

Smart could/will also be going for salary matching reasons.
 
Horford controls where he plays next year and New Orleans is definitely not where he wants to play.

Hayward still has injury concerned and has 2 years at more than $30 million a year on his contract. New Orleans let it be known the would like some salary relief if they can get it. They don't want to be responsible for Hayward's remaining contract.

Brown could well be gone to NOP instead of Smart.

Williams could be gone as well since NOP might want him as a perspective Davis defensive replacement.

This all might suck to you if you want Tatum, Smart, Brown or Williams a Celtic long term, but it's what it is, reality. It's the cost of getting a top three player in the league.

Offline keevsnick

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5515
  • Tommy Points: 549
We need AD to keep saying he won't resign here and we want his value low. Makes dealing for him cost less. Even if he wanted to come here he needs to stick to the story to ensure C's don't have to deal Tatum.

Maybe it allows team to make it Brown, Horford and 3 first of Grizz(we protect it top 3), Kings, Clippers/C's.

It might reduce what the Celtics are willing to give, but why would it change what the Pelicans are willing to take?

Other teams can come up with better offers than Jaylen and picks.
A single player maybe but Im not so sure about the whole package though. Brown, Horford and 3 first is tough to beat.

I really don't understand this board's mission to trade Horford. Guy is so underrated and would actually fit perfectly alongside AD in our hypothetical front court.
You have to give to get Horford is a huge piece not a throw in. Hayward you can't trade. Smart and Irving are good together. Who else is left? Not much choice if you want AD

Even assuming that Horford would allow himself to be traded -- which is up for debate -- why would New Orleans value him highly?  He'd be a 33 year old short-timer who wouldn't move the needle for NOP.  They'd no doubt try to retrade him, but it's difficult to match $30+ million salaries, especially without taking long-term salary back.  Not many contenders are going to have cap space / matching expiring contracts, plus positive assets to trade for Horford.

But, again, my speculation is that Horford would opt out if he suspected he might be traded to a going-nowhere franchise.
Horford is a glue guy and formerly recent all star. He has two or three years left if they keep him long term. If they don't keep him he provides cap relief which helps towards rebuilding. Plenty of reason to want him. I don't think he will opt out of 30 million
You are absolutely dead wrong about Horford opting out of his final year. Horford wants to win a title and he and his family love Boston. If Boston says they are trading him somewhere he doesn't want to go, and who in their right mind wants to play NBA basketball for the Pelicans without Davis there, especially if you are a veteran hoping to win a title, Horford will opt out and sign elsewhere. And no trade.

People need to stop thinking with their love of certain players.

Tatum is gone in a Davis trade.

Smart could/will also be going for salary matching reasons.
 
Horford controls where he plays next year and New Orleans is definitely not where he wants to play.

Hayward still has injury concerned and has 2 years at more than $30 million a year on his contract. New Orleans let it be known the would like some salary relief if they can get it. They don't want to be responsible for Hayward's remaining contract.

Brown could well be gone to NOP instead of Smart.

Williams could be gone as well since NOP might want him as a perspective Davis defensive replacement.

This all might suck to you if you want Tatum, Smart, Brown or Williams a Celtic long term, but it's what it is, reality. It's the cost of getting a top three player in the league.

I agree on most everything, except the Hayward part. That seems like an organization that might sell themselves on Hayward being a former all-star, and also a city where and NAB team might not want to go full rebuild. I don't think its likely he'd be in a trade, but if he's at least at like 80-85% by years end I don't think its impossible.

Offline SHAQATTACK

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 36776
  • Tommy Points: 2961
i think he costs us three good young plays and picks .
I m ok with this .

where Im kinda on the fence about the above is doing this with out Kyrie on the team.

Glade , i don't have to make the final decision