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Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: TA9 on May 17, 2018, 10:26:38 AM

Title: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: TA9 on May 17, 2018, 10:26:38 AM
Regarding Tatum comparison:
Quote
It would be understandable if an ex-Celtic with his number already in the rafters and basketball immortality in Springfield in his future would blanch at a 20-year-old kid being compared to him. But Pierce appreciates Tatum’s game as much as anyone, and sees the similarities in the comparisons others have made.

“I see a lot of things Jayson does, how he creates space, gets to the hole deceptively, the way he knocks down shots — he’s a real shotmaker, he can get his shot off on anybody,’’ said Pierce. “He’s smart. He uses his body well, the way he pushes off with his shoulder to get an open shot. He has a lot of craftiness to his game, and that probably reminds I lot of people of me.

“I see it, I definitely do. I wasn’t the most athletic guy. Tatum is a lot more athletic than I was. He can use either hand. Once he gets a little stronger in the near future, look out. I mean, he’s obviously smart beyond his years.

“When I came out, I was a 21-year-old,’’ Pierce continued. “He was 19 for most of this season. I know that doesn’t sound like a lot, but a year and a half, two years, that’s a lot of developmental time. I had three years of college [at Kansas] to develop. He had one year [at Duke], and he’s already doing this. He’s a superstar in the making. You can compare a kid like that to me anytime you want.’’

Jaylen's NBA comparison:
Quote
“Jaylen can be your prototype swingman, a guy who can defend, shoot 3s, everything you need. He sort of reminds me of Kawhi Leonard, man. Like, seriously. Strong, very athletic in the open court, an improving handle, and now he’s knocking down 3s with confidence. He is way ahead of the curve.’’

The full article can be read here: https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2018/05/17/paul-pierce-jayson-tatum-celtics-news (https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2018/05/17/paul-pierce-jayson-tatum-celtics-news)
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: footey on May 17, 2018, 10:36:53 AM
Love how Paul stands up for the Celtics on ESPN, before it is popular. Now everyone wants to jump on the bandwagon.

Also seem surprised by Paul's humbleness in the Tatum comparison, essentially saying Tatum is playing better than him at that age, and that he is more athletic, etc.  Pierce sometimes lacked self-awareness as a player before the big 3 days. Seems like he's really matured, his ego is in check.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: A Future of Stevens on May 17, 2018, 10:46:12 AM
Imagine these comps pan out? Imagine we have a cerebral Kawhi Leonard, and a slightly longer, more athletic Paul Pierce (passing is obviously behind at the moment) for the next 10 years? Oh boy.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: rocknrollforyoursoul on May 17, 2018, 10:58:49 AM
Love how Paul stands up for the Celtics on ESPN, before it is popular. Now everyone wants to jump on the bandwagon.

Also seem surprised by Paul's humbleness in the Tatum comparison, essentially saying Tatum is playing better than him at that age, and that he is more athletic, etc.  Pierce sometimes lacked self-awareness as a player before the big 3 days. Seems like he's really matured, his ego is in check.

Pierce grew and matured a lot during the latter part of his career, and he continues to be a mature person, as well as an astute observer of the basketball world. He's way better than most former players when it comes to analysis and public speaking.

Imagine these comps pan out? Imagine we have a cerebral Kawhi Leonard, and a slightly longer, more athletic Paul Pierce (passing is obviously behind at the moment) for the next 10 years? Oh boy.

That would be awesome, and I'm starting to think it's true. This isn't Dee Brown and Al Jefferson—no disrespect to them; they were solid players and I like them; but the Flying Jays have a real opportunity to become all-NBA players.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: Vermont Green on May 17, 2018, 11:03:13 AM
Pierce is fair and humble in his assessment about Tatum, especially acknowledging the difference in age but I don't buy the "more athletic" narrative.  I guess he means that Tatum can jump a little higher but Pierce was much thicker and stronger and I believe as quick if not quicker.  Tatum may also be a better pure shooter in the end but Pierce did a lot with his strength and quickness that Tatum may not ever be able to do.  Pierce also had a grittiness intangible that Tatum may or may not develop (kind of like Smart).  Pierce had it from day one.

Tatum has a very promising future, he may end up better than Pierce, but he will need to get stronger (which he probably will as he matures physically) and continue to develop his game every year.  He is ahead of Pierce in some areas but not in others.  Even that the comparison is being discussed it a testament to Tatum's potential.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: Sophomore on May 17, 2018, 11:11:07 AM
That quote has me irrationally excited.  ;D
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: dysgenic on May 17, 2018, 11:33:41 AM
At times Tatum reminds me of Jamal Crawford. 
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: Joyride on May 17, 2018, 11:48:49 AM
I think we're looking at a real possibility that the whole starting lineup for 2018-19 Celts could be on the All-Star Team if the NBA goes back to East and West teams.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: droopdog7 on May 17, 2018, 11:50:53 AM
So I went to look at PP age just to get an idea and it looks like he was indeed about a year older when he started his career than tatum.  The other thing that stood out to me is that PP was on the very young side (October birthday) throughout his development.  Sort of refreshing to see as many athletes today are held back to gain an edge.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: Fafnir on May 17, 2018, 12:01:38 PM
At times Tatum reminds me of Jamal Crawford.
I really don't see it.

They both have pretty long arms, but that's about it.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: Celtics17 on May 17, 2018, 12:25:21 PM
Tatum does remind me of Paul in ways and while I am not sure but to me Jaylen is starting to resemble Kobe. The guy can seriously score and he is strong and doesn't back down from a challenge.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: Roy H. on May 17, 2018, 12:29:38 PM
At times Tatum reminds me of Jamal Crawford.
I really don't see it.

They both have pretty long arms, but that's about it.

Yeah, I don’t get the comparison. Different positions, vastly different strengths.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: TA9 on May 17, 2018, 12:47:26 PM
For perspective, a lot of people compared Tatum to Danny Granger and Jaylen to Jimmy Butler when they were coming out of college. To me, it seems like they both have outgrown their old comparisons.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: PhoSita on May 17, 2018, 12:53:23 PM
Tatum actually reminds me a little bit of Durant at times with his combination of length and grace.  Durant, of course, is several inches taller.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: 18isGREATERthan72 on May 17, 2018, 01:02:31 PM
Tatum actually reminds me a little bit of Durant at times with his combination of length and grace.  Durant, of course, is several inches taller.

Tatum can still grow a bit....  I don't think he'll be nearly 7 feet like Durant (although it's possible I suppose) but he could add an inch possibly.  He's just very long and has the shooting touch already.  I honestly think Durant is the closest comparison from the eye test.  Both are very lanky.

Without getting too ahead, I agree with the Kawhi comparison on Brown...  I don't think Brown will be as good as Kawhi on defense (I believe Kawhi has a freakishly long wingspan and vertical which allows him to guard the area of a center with the quickness of a guard) but offensively I think it's a good comparison.  Brown isn't elite at anything offensively except maybe finishing at the rim but he's very good at almost everything except for free throws.  His 3P shot is improving drastically, and his mid range pull up is so smooth at times.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: PAOBoston on May 17, 2018, 01:23:35 PM
So....a more athletic Paul Pierce and Kawhi 2.0. AWESOME! Ain't that the truth lol.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: A Future of Stevens on May 17, 2018, 01:31:51 PM
Tatum actually reminds me a little bit of Durant at times with his combination of length and grace.  Durant, of course, is several inches taller.

Grace. I have been searching for that term to describe Tatum. Awesome. The way he moves, its amazing for a player of his age. The movement with his lankiness is definitely Durant-esque. Honestly if Tatum becomes even 80% of the player Durant is, I hope he is a Celtic his entire career.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: kozlodoev on May 17, 2018, 01:46:10 PM
Pierce is fair and humble in his assessment about Tatum, especially acknowledging the difference in age but I don't buy the "more athletic" narrative.  I guess he means that Tatum can jump a little higher but Pierce was much thicker and stronger and I believe as quick if not quicker.  Tatum may also be a better pure shooter in the end but Pierce did a lot with his strength and quickness that Tatum may not ever be able to do.  Pierce also had a grittiness intangible that Tatum may or may not develop (kind of like Smart).  Pierce had it from day one.
Not when he was coming out of Kansas.

(http://www.paulpierce.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/0828_Kansas1.jpg)
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: mahcus smaht on May 17, 2018, 01:48:51 PM
Tatum actually reminds me a little bit of Durant at times with his combination of length and grace.  Durant, of course, is several inches taller.
I've felt his game most resembles a shorter, less long KD since summer league.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: Fafnir on May 17, 2018, 01:49:36 PM
Tatum actually reminds me a little bit of Durant at times with his combination of length and grace.  Durant, of course, is several inches taller.
He also loses the ball for no apparent reason way to often, much like young Durant. He's not as much of a stick as Durant was but still some added strength will do wonders for his game.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: gift on May 17, 2018, 02:02:05 PM
Pierce/Durant hybrid is a good comp for play style.

As for Jaylen Brown, I do think of Kawhi sometimes when watching him, especially coming around screens. Not the savant on defense, but even higher offensive potential. He's quicker and more explosive than Kawhi and shown the same type of development in shooting.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: CelticsElite on May 17, 2018, 02:29:19 PM
I'm with pierce Durant hybrid. Granger is selling him low

Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: td450 on May 17, 2018, 03:02:33 PM
Tatum is already a better shooter than Pierce ever was, but Pierce was a very strong guy. He very rarely got stripped going to rim, and could finish equally well with either hand. He also was awesome at finishing through contact. Pierce was wrong about Tatum finishing with either hand. He really doesn't do that yet very consistently. He does drive extremely well, though, and will probably end up being an even better scorer than Pierce some day.

I think Kawhi is a more like a 6'7 Marcus Smart, but with a really solid jump shot. Really long arms for his height. Tremendous defensive instincts. He gets his hands on everything and he's super strong.

Jaylen hasn't learned to use his hands defensively like that, at least yet. But he's quite a bit faster and quicker than Kawhi, and can jump better. He's also quite a bit ahead of where Kawhi was as a scorer at this point in his career. I'd be surprised if he doesn't turn out to be the better player.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: kozlodoev on May 17, 2018, 03:18:15 PM
Tatum is already a better shooter than Pierce ever was
Pierce shot above .400 from three in his rookie season, too, so let's hold our horses a little bit. The jury is still out.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: Fafnir on May 17, 2018, 03:22:29 PM
Tatum is already a better shooter than Pierce ever was
Pierce shot above .400 from three in his rookie season, too, so let's hold our horses a little bit. The jury is still out.
I was surprised to see that Pierce shot that well as a rookie from deep. Was a long long time ago....
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: td450 on May 17, 2018, 03:35:01 PM
Tatum is already a better shooter than Pierce ever was
Pierce shot above .400 from three in his rookie season, too, so let's hold our horses a little bit. The jury is still out.
It's true that Pierce shot above .400 from three in his rookie season.

Its also true that in his long and storied career, Pierce never quite posted percentages for either 2PT or 3PT shooting as high as Tatum posted this year as a 19/20 year old, so I stand by my statement.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: kozlodoev on May 17, 2018, 03:41:59 PM
Tatum is already a better shooter than Pierce ever was
Pierce shot above .400 from three in his rookie season, too, so let's hold our horses a little bit. The jury is still out.
It's true that Pierce shot above .400 from three in his rookie season.

Its also true that in his long and storied career, Pierce never quite posted percentages for either 2PT or 3PT shooting as high as Tatum posted this year as a 19/20 year old, so I stand by my statement.
It's also true that making inferences about an entire career from someone's rookie year can make you look like a fool.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: dysgenic on May 17, 2018, 09:43:57 PM
At times Tatum reminds me of Jamal Crawford.
I really don't see it.

They both have pretty long arms, but that's about it.

Two things stand out to me:
1. Both of them need only the smallest margin to get their shot off; yet they still manage to be able to score consistently on contested shots.  This is a rare commodity.
2. Both of them are willing to shoot anytime, from anywhere.  Thus they are a threat to score in many places that other players aren't.

I get that they are different positions, but they still remind me of each other (at times).






Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: SparzWizard on May 17, 2018, 10:45:06 PM
At times Tatum reminds me of Jamal Crawford.

Tatum will win 6MotY and become the best four-point play player in the NBA.  8)
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: gouki88 on May 17, 2018, 10:53:40 PM
At times Tatum reminds me of Jamal Crawford.
I really don't see it.

They both have pretty long arms, but that's about it.

Two things stand out to me:
1. Both of them need only the smallest margin to get their shot off; yet they still manage to be able to score consistently on contested shots.  This is a rare commodity.
2. Both of them are willing to shoot anytime, from anywhere.  Thus they are a threat to score in many places that other players aren't.

I get that they are different positions, but they still remind me of each other (at times).
When he makes a fool out of defenders with sweet dribble moves I can sorta see it.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: SparzWizard on May 18, 2018, 12:14:18 AM
I can see Tatum being the next Kevin Durant.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: trickybilly on May 18, 2018, 12:24:24 AM
(https://historyrat.files.wordpress.com/2012/11/george-gervin.jpg)
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: Fafnir on May 18, 2018, 12:37:01 AM
At times Tatum reminds me of Jamal Crawford.
I really don't see it.

They both have pretty long arms, but that's about it.

Two things stand out to me:
1. Both of them need only the smallest margin to get their shot off; yet they still manage to be able to score consistently on contested shots.  This is a rare commodity.
2. Both of them are willing to shoot anytime, from anywhere.  Thus they are a threat to score in many places that other players aren't.

I get that they are different positions, but they still remind me of each other (at times).
I disagree with both of your similarities.

Tatum is good at creating space with his footwork and length, but he's not a quick fire guy like crawford. He also isn't a chucker like Crawford. He can and will take a shot from any area of the floor sure, but he doesn't just chuck.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: mahcus smaht on May 25, 2018, 07:20:17 PM
Tatum is already a better shooter than Pierce ever was
Pierce shot above .400 from three in his rookie season, too, so let's hold our horses a little bit. The jury is still out.
It's true that Pierce shot above .400 from three in his rookie season.

Its also true that in his long and storied career, Pierce never quite posted percentages for either 2PT or 3PT shooting as high as Tatum posted this year as a 19/20 year old, so I stand by my statement.
It's also true that making inferences about an entire career from someone's rookie year can make you look like a fool.
Marcus Smart shot a pretty solid 34%  from deep as a rookie.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: liam on May 25, 2018, 07:24:25 PM
Tatum standing next to Moose looked like the same height. Is Tatum now 6'10"? Looks like it.
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: OldSchoolDude on May 25, 2018, 07:34:30 PM
(https://historyrat.files.wordpress.com/2012/11/george-gervin.jpg)

Tatum is smooth but he need to work on his finger roll to be like the "Ice Man"  ;)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EjHZJL6Jj8
Title: Re: Pierce responds to Tatum comparison and compares Jaylen to a current all star
Post by: mr. dee on May 25, 2018, 08:20:55 PM
Tatum maybe taller than we think. I saw him next to Baynes and he looked taller than him. Isn't Baynes like 6'10"?