Celtics vs Lakers

[djbilly33]

Taking off our Celtics glasses, which organization has a better outlook?

I don't know much about the Lakers this year, finances, cap room, roster, things like that. I do know they have Kobe next year, Randle who was a top 6 pick in the draft, they have at least another top 6 pick this draft and I heard they have some cap room at the end of the season.

The Celtics have some cap room, more draft picks than I can count, and some players worth keeping. IMO, Smart, Thomas, AB, Turner and Sullinger seem to be a lock for the foundation. None of them are allstars or stars for that matter. If we make the playoffs as an 8th seed, we most likely will be swept out which we then lose a higher pick in the draft.

With that being said, thoughts? We're not lala land so free agents won't be in line to come here like they will be for the Lakers. The Lakers could in theory draft Okafor this year, side him with Randle and Kobe. They sign or trade for a 1 and 3 and have a team to chase a title next year. We have next to nothing going forward, draft picks in the teens or 20s for this year, role players and no stars, no FA's.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Celtics by a landslide, but the Lakers have cap flexibility and usually have an easy time attracting big name free-agents, so we'll see. Given how they've been managed in the last few years, I wouldn't trust them, and if the reports are true of them wasting their load on Rondo, then there'll be stuck for quite some time.

[apc]

Just a couple of points, Stevens and Scott are not in the same league. And good coaches are hard to find.
But considering the D Howard fiasco and Nash bad trade, they came out of that better then you would think.

[Celtics18]

Taking off our Celtics glasses, which organization has a better outlook?

I don't know much about the Lakers this year, finances, cap room, roster, things like that. I do know they have Kobe next year, Randle who was a top 6 pick in the draft, they have at least another top 6 pick this draft and I heard they have some cap room at the end of the season.

The Celtics have some cap room, more draft picks than I can count, and some players worth keeping. IMO, Smart, Thomas, AB, Turner and Sullinger seem to be a lock for the foundation. None of them are allstars or stars for that matter. If we make the playoffs as an 8th seed, we most likely will be swept out which we then lose a higher pick in the draft.

With that being said, thoughts? We're not lala land so free agents won't be in line to come here like they will be for the Lakers. The Lakers could in theory draft Okafor this year, side him with Randle and Kobe. They sign or trade for a 1 and 3 and have a team to chase a title next year. We have next to nothing going forward, draft picks in the teens or 20s for this year, role players and no stars, no FA's.

I don't believe a core of Kobe Bryant, Julius Randle, and Jahlil Okafor would come anywhere near competing for a title next season . . . unless of course that 1 and 3 they pick up are Steph Curry and Lebron James.

Even then, I think they'd be a long shot. 

[Who]

Lakers have cap flexibility but less future picks. The Celtics have both (cap flex + loads of future picks) so I give Boston the nod right now. A bit of luck in the lottery for LAL and a strong draft pick could shift things back LAL's way though.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Worth mentioning that they owe next year's draft pick to the Suns if they don't end up with a top 5 pick.

[255 Rings]

Celtics by a landslide, but the Lakers have cap flexibility and usually have an easy time attracting big name free-agents, so we'll see. Given how they've been managed in the last few years, I wouldn't trust them, and if the reports are true of them wasting their load on Rondo, then there'll be stuck for quite some time.

An easy time attracting FAs? Last I remember the last big FA signing was Shaquille O'Neal, and that was in 1996, way before the strict cap limit that now exists. I wish everyone would stop praising the Lakers' supposed Hollywood pull it supposedly has on players. It's obvious that the majority of folks would prefer the sunny beaches and vivid night-life of LA than the frigid cold of Boston but not every single player has that mentality. If we have a better roster and more promise to contend why would any superstar player not consider us? Plus we haven't been in a situation where we have massive cap space to offer a FA big money since forever, and next year we'll see if we can sign anyone impactful (though I think Ainge prefers to attain a star via a trade than a summer signing, it's how he landed both KG and Ray back in '07). The Lakers aren't entirely screwed though, they can still remain a top 5 lock to draft a lottery player in this draft and huge cap space next year. Thing is though that next year is when the new TV deal occurs so therefore every team that already has a superstar on their roster can crank up the price to retain them. I ain't worried about the Lakers not one bit, and even if they make noise in the off-season with signings they still have their dim-wit coach Byron Scott who's never taking them anywhere anyway. 4 coaches in 3 years, yeah, Lakers suck and I'm lovin' it!

[LarBrd33]

Probably lakers assuming they end up with a top 4 pick.

They'll have something like rondo, Kobe, Kevin love, Julius randle and whoever they draft top 4... Or they can trade the pick or randle for another all-star.

Boston has lots of mediocre future picks and a better foundation of role players but this is a game of superstars and the Lakers will have an easier time acquiring them.   Draft and free agency is on Lakers side.  For all that's mentioned about bostons picks, how many of them would you need to package together to get a top 4?    This year it's looking like we will have 15 + 26.  Will take a lot more than that.  If a superstar becomes available through the draft, free agency or trade market, the Lakers seem better positioned.

[TheFlex]

Getting Jordan Clarkson in the 2nd round really helps. The question is whether he'll be Gilbert-Arenas-in-the-second-round good or Patrick-Beverley-in-the-second-round good. I can't help but lean towards the former, but regardless of what you think, his emergence takes a lot of pressure off the Lakers to land a Rondo or a Dragic this summer. There's already rumors of his impact on their free agency plan (http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/237336/Jordan-Clarkson-Could-Change-Lakers-Free-Agency-Plans).

Don't forget they also snagged Tarik Black, who showed legitimate promise with Houston and has put up encouraging numbers for a bad Lakers team. Even if he only ends up being good enough to be an above-average backup center, that's two notable pieces that the Lakers landed for close to nothing compared to being the bare-bones roster outside of Kobe Bryant that we saw them at the end of last season.

The Lakers need a few more breaks to go their way, but if they can keep their pick and sign Kevin Love -- both real possibilities -- I can't honestly say we'd be as far ahead of them as many like to think.

Clarkson/?
Kobe/[Nick Young]
Justise Winslow/Nick Young
Kevin Love/Julius Randle/Ed Davis
Jordan Hill/Tarik Black

Now obviously we should be happy to be rid of the Kobe problem having traded PP and KG, but worst case scenario they:

-entertain Love with a couple of playoff runs alongside Kobe at which point he's 28 and,
-they use the cap space from Kobe's departure to add another star alongside Love and,
-round out the team with an established and improved Winslow, established and improved Clarkson and whoever they can get at a position of need for an established and improved Randle.

Long story short, advantage obviously goes to Boston, but never count the Lakers out. Good things just seem to happen to them, no matter how bad their front office is.

[TheFlex]

Probably lakers assuming they end up with a top 4 pick.

They'll have something like rondo, Kobe, Kevin love, Julius randle and whoever they draft top 4... Or they can trade the pick or randle for another all-star.

Boston has lots of mediocre future picks and a better foundation of role players but this is a game of superstars and the Lakers will have an easier time acquiring them.   Draft and free agency is on Lakers side.  For all that's mentioned about bostons picks, how many of them would you need to package together to get a top 4?    This year it's looking like we will have 15 + 26.  Will take a lot more than that.  If a superstar becomes available through the draft, free agency or trade market, the Lakers seem better positioned.

I agree with you that the Lakers' outlook is not as bleak as many make it seem to be, but disagree with a lot with much of your reasoning.

Signing Rajon Rondo to anything more than $15m per would be detrimental to any franchise and I would welcome the Lakers doing that. Any FA prediction that has Rondo or Dragic going to LA doesn't make any sense to me. That's not to say it won't happen, but still. If they get a top 4 pick they could just draft Mudiay if they didn't believe in Clarkson, and I have a hard time believing that they don't believe in one of the best second-round rookies since Arenas. I will go out on a limb and say that Clarkson will be a better player next year than Rondo is. Either way, they'd be better suited using their money on convincing Love and others to join Kobe.

The Lakers of the future look much scarier in ways they couldn't have dreamed of back in October, but that has much more to do with Clarkson, Tarik Black, tanking (and thus keeping their pick) and Kevin Love's drama in Cleveland than it does with Rondo's drama in Boston/Dallas. If they can surround Love with Clarkson and a prospect like Winslow as Love enjoys his first couple hundred Laker games in Kobe's twilight years, giving them a cost-controlled core with the ability to add a max player after Kobe's departure, they will be frightening. Adding Rondo at max dollars only impedes their ability to do that and increases the pressure on them to make stars out of young prospects. That is something they clearly have no advantage over us at doing.

[colincb]

Top Fakers FA signings according to LakersNation

Shaq
Rambis
Derek Fisher
Brian Shaw
Rick Fox

One star, 4 role players.

http://www.lakersnation.com/lakers-top-free-agent-signings-of-all-time-video/2014/08/06/

[GC003332]

It would be interesting to see the wording of any in their prime free agents contracts if they were to sign with Lakers this off season .
Ie . I want an iron clad agreement that Kobe will hang it up after the 2015-2015 season, with the way his past 3 seasons have ended I wouldn't put it past Kobe to want to play on after next season if he has an relative injury free season next year.Or make a dramatic comeback later on down the line.
Prime time free agents , clear the decks Kobe.

Gavin

[colincb]

Probably lakers assuming they end up with a top 4 pick.

They'll have something like rondo, Kobe, Kevin love, Julius randle and whoever they draft top 4... Or they can trade the pick or randle for another all-star.

Boston has lots of mediocre future picks and a better foundation of role players but this is a game of superstars and the Lakers will have an easier time acquiring them.   Draft and free agency is on Lakers side.  For all that's mentioned about bostons picks, how many of them would you need to package together to get a top 4?    This year it's looking like we will have 15 + 26.  Will take a lot more than that.  If a superstar becomes available through the draft, free agency or trade market, the Lakers seem better positioned.

Rondo leads the Fakers back to glory eh?  You're such a troll.

[colincb]

I will take Celtic’s ownership/GM/head coach, our picks overall, and starting talent base. Cap is a push.

- Lakers have a high 1st this year (unless they get unlucky),
- Clarkson and Randle as a starting base,
- Lots of cap space. 
- Not much history attracting FAs, but a bigger market, offset a bit by higher tax rates. Difficulty for both teams is that the player's union's stance on the CBA is going to reward teams that did not manage their cap positions well.
- Ownership is a big problem for the Lakers (and the head coach is a problem too IMO).  Ownership and front office were ranked 28th best by ESPN survey compared to the Celtics being ranked 7th and highest among rebuilding teams.
- The Lakers are also in a tougher conference.

Current year Laker picks ranked third best by Tankathon compared to fifth best for us with about a 30-40% premium in favor of the Lakers using Tankathon's power score. Future picks are much worse than ours though with Lakers 2016 and 2018 1sts gone because of trades.

I'll take our core vs theirs.  Not counting Kobe as he's a figurehead front man at this point in his career.

If you buy that LA has a big advantage in free agency, then maybe they can close the gap. It has not been proven in practice except for Shaq under Jerry Buss.  There is going to be so much excess cap floating around the next few years that it will be a player's/sellers market, so I expect players will be choosy about where they go. Do not think Kobe's going to be much of a draw.

If I was a free agent, I'd be very concerned about their ownership/management issues.  They are currently ranked just ahead of the Nets and Knicks who are Billy Sulivan regime-level awful and ranked worse than Minnesota. Clearly a clusterFringe with Jim Buss in charge.  I would be surprised if agents and players were not aware of the issues there.

[More Banners]

With their crappy coach, old Kobe, and very young players, signing Rondo just might make sense for them.

Won't make the playoffs, but the Rondo love makes sense.