Where does Howard rank among centers of the past 30 years?

[Kwhit10]

Also it's even more impressive that guys like Robinson, Hakeem, Ewing, Shaq, and in their early years Dikembe and Zo were all facing one another.  Where as Howard is doing this against who that can be put on the same tier as him.

[Donoghus]

Also it's even more impressive that guys like Robinson, Hakeem, Ewing, Shaq, and in their early years Dikembe and Zo were all facing one another.  Where as Howard is doing this against who that can be put on the same tier as him.

Yeah, the 90s was quite the golden era for centers.

[Prof. Clutch]

My opinion of Howard's dominance always changes after he plays the C's because he always comes out of it looking like a mere mortal.

[Who]

That is a tough question. I would put Dwight above Ewing, Mourning and Parish.

I'm not sure if I would put him any higher than that though.

[GreenFaith1819]

The Amazing thing with Shaq is that I believe he became better than Hakeem, as he reached his prime. He was never as quick as him, but in watching some head-to-head matchups between the two as Shaq matured, I must give kudos to Shaq - the man was able to keep Hakeem under control.

Every year those two met - it seemed to me that the gap between them became smaller and smaller - with Shaq finding ways to neutralize Hakeem's quickness.

Shaq worked on his game..improving every year. Hakeem may have been the most polished Center to ever play the game, IMO - but no one will ever forget the devastation of Shaq. He was a monster.

He has a mean forearm too, just ask Bynum.

[Prof. Clutch]

It's hard to believe watching last nights game that we went up against a team that has the defensive player of the year.  I mean Howard did have 5 blocks, but I don't feel that his defense had a really strong impact on any part of the game.  Celtics still shot a solid percentage (44.6) and took it to the hole a lot.

If he can't get it done on offense, Dwight needs to find a way to dominate on defense.

[Roy Hobbs]

That is a tough question. I would put Dwight above Ewing, Mourning and Parish.

I'm not sure if I would put him any higher than that though.

Over Ewing?  Why so?  I think Ewing was probably better on both ends.  Ewing's one weakness was a perceived lack of leadership / clutchness, but Howard doesn't seem to shine in either area.

[Prof. Clutch]

BTW, its amazing to me that Duncan has truly managed to shape his legacy so that he's widely considered a PF and not a C.

Can someone explain to me why a 7 footer whose game centers around playing in the post is not a Center?

[indeedproceed]

Dwight Howard is universally seen as the best center in the NBA.  I think that's a fair assessment, based upon his numbers and team success.  However, I still think he's a step or two down from "greatness"; he can't dominate games consistently like most of the great centers could.

Does he stack up against the great centers of the 80s and 90s?  I don't think so.  Off the top of my head (and I'm sure I'm forgetting some great players) I'd rank the centers since 1980 as follows:

1. Hakeem
1a. Shaq
3. Kareem (post-1980 version)
4. David Robinson
5. Moses Malone
6. Patrick Ewing
7. Robert Parish
8. Alonzo Mourning (in his prime)
9. Dwight Howard
10. Yao Ming (when healthy)
11. Dikembe Mutombo

Some might quibble about how high I have Parish ranked, but outside of that, is there any debate that Howard doesn't belong anywhere near the top-6 on that list?

Similarly, does anybody think that with improvements to his game, Howard can break into that top group?  I simply don't; Howard has the athleticism, but not the skill, to go down as one of the greatest centers ever.
 

not to go all tangential on you, but how are you going to rank Shaq behind Hakeem?

[Donoghus]

Dwight Howard is universally seen as the best center in the NBA.  I think that's a fair assessment, based upon his numbers and team success.  However, I still think he's a step or two down from "greatness"; he can't dominate games consistently like most of the great centers could.

Does he stack up against the great centers of the 80s and 90s?  I don't think so.  Off the top of my head (and I'm sure I'm forgetting some great players) I'd rank the centers since 1980 as follows:

1. Hakeem
1a. Shaq
3. Kareem (post-1980 version)
4. David Robinson
5. Moses Malone
6. Patrick Ewing
7. Robert Parish
8. Alonzo Mourning (in his prime)
9. Dwight Howard
10. Yao Ming (when healthy)
11. Dikembe Mutombo

Some might quibble about how high I have Parish ranked, but outside of that, is there any debate that Howard doesn't belong anywhere near the top-6 on that list?

Similarly, does anybody think that with improvements to his game, Howard can break into that top group?  I simply don't; Howard has the athleticism, but not the skill, to go down as one of the greatest centers ever.
 

not to go all tangential on you, but how are you going to rank Shaq behind Hakeem?

I certainly think you can make that argument.  Hakeem was absolutely incrdible and devastating in his prime. 

[indeedproceed]

Yeah but Shaq got 4 rings in what, 5 or 6 years?

[Roy Hobbs]

Dwight Howard is universally seen as the best center in the NBA.  I think that's a fair assessment, based upon his numbers and team success.  However, I still think he's a step or two down from "greatness"; he can't dominate games consistently like most of the great centers could.

Does he stack up against the great centers of the 80s and 90s?  I don't think so.  Off the top of my head (and I'm sure I'm forgetting some great players) I'd rank the centers since 1980 as follows:

1. Hakeem
1a. Shaq
3. Kareem (post-1980 version)
4. David Robinson
5. Moses Malone
6. Patrick Ewing
7. Robert Parish
8. Alonzo Mourning (in his prime)
9. Dwight Howard
10. Yao Ming (when healthy)
11. Dikembe Mutombo

Some might quibble about how high I have Parish ranked, but outside of that, is there any debate that Howard doesn't belong anywhere near the top-6 on that list?

Similarly, does anybody think that with improvements to his game, Howard can break into that top group?  I simply don't; Howard has the athleticism, but not the skill, to go down as one of the greatest centers ever.
 

not to go all tangential on you, but how are you going to rank Shaq behind Hakeem?

I have them 1 and 1a, meaning essentially a tie.  In his prime, Hakeem was a better rebounder, a more versatile scorer, a better passer, and a better defender.  Shaq was a more efficient scorer (although his free throw shooting knocks him down a bit there, allowing Hakeem to almost catch him), and a better scorer overall.

Hakeem faced better competition, and had lesser teammates.  Those are the only reasons why he has fewer rings.

[Roy Hobbs]

Yeah but Shaq got 4 rings in what, 5 or 6 years?

With Kobe and D. Wade as teammates.  Granted, those guys aren't quite as good as Sam Cassell and Mario Elie, but they're close.

[GreenFaith1819]

BTW, its amazing to me that Duncan has truly managed to shape his legacy so that he's widely considered a PF and not a C.

Can someone explain to me why a 7 footer whose game centers around playing in the post is not a Center?

My take on your question is because Tim Duncan has historically been matched up against the PFs of the opposing teams throughout his career.

He had David to take on Shaq, Patrick, Hakeem, etc. He did not spend a great amount of time on either team's opposing centers throughout the years.

[angryguy77]

Dwight Howard is universally seen as the best center in the NBA.  I think that's a fair assessment, based upon his numbers and team success.  However, I still think he's a step or two down from "greatness"; he can't dominate games consistently like most of the great centers could.

Does he stack up against the great centers of the 80s and 90s?  I don't think so.  Off the top of my head (and I'm sure I'm forgetting some great players) I'd rank the centers since 1980 as follows:

1. Hakeem
1a. Shaq
3. Kareem (post-1980 version)
4. David Robinson
5. Moses Malone
6. Patrick Ewing
7. Robert Parish
8. Alonzo Mourning (in his prime)
9. Dwight Howard
10. Yao Ming (when healthy)
11. Dikembe Mutombo

Some might quibble about how high I have Parish ranked, but outside of that, is there any debate that Howard doesn't belong anywhere near the top-6 on that list?

Similarly, does anybody think that with improvements to his game, Howard can break into that top group?  I simply don't; Howard has the athleticism, but not the skill, to go down as one of the greatest centers ever.
 

Fixed it for you. Shaq is a product of the league hype machine. If the refs would call the offensive foul on him like they should for his back-downs, he wouldn't have scored as much during his career. He's allowed to use his size to push people out of the way almost every time he has the ball down low. He's scoring because of his size, not skill. Not his fault I know, but he never had a good offensive game outside of dunking range. His game is due to size and power, and Imo, he's the most overrated player the league has ever seen.

 I'm convinced that you could take any guy that size and he could do the same thing as Shaq. Great players can't be duplicated, but Shaq's play can, which makes me think he shouldn't be in a top 10 discussion.