Where does Howard rank among centers of the past 30 years?

[Roy Hobbs]

Dwight Howard is universally seen as the best center in the NBA.  I think that's a fair assessment, based upon his numbers and team success.  However, I still think he's a step or two down from "greatness"; he can't dominate games consistently like most of the great centers could.

Does he stack up against the great centers of the 80s and 90s?  I don't think so.  Off the top of my head (and I'm sure I'm forgetting some great players) I'd rank the centers since 1980 as follows:

1. Hakeem
1a. Shaq
3. Kareem (post-1980 version)
4. David Robinson
5. Moses Malone
6. Patrick Ewing
7. Robert Parish
8. Alonzo Mourning (in his prime)
9. Dwight Howard
10. Yao Ming (when healthy)
11. Dikembe Mutombo

Some might quibble about how high I have Parish ranked, but outside of that, is there any debate that Howard doesn't belong anywhere near the top-6 on that list?

Similarly, does anybody think that with improvements to his game, Howard can break into that top group?  I simply don't; Howard has the athleticism, but not the skill, to go down as one of the greatest centers ever.
 

[vgulab]

1. hakeem
2. shaq
3. kareem
4. moses malone
5. patrick ewing
6. david robinson
7. dwight howard

I think Howard has the potencial to be in the top 5. His defense is incredible but he has no offensive skills. Still i  see bright future for him in Orlando for the next 10 years.

[2short]

I feel howard is an amazing athlete, amazing really.  But as a basketball player he isn't that good.  He is the sort of guy who if injured badly would be much different.  Granted he is still very young and seems to have the work ethic and good attitude that he is going to develop.  The defense is arleady there, help d actually.  But his offensive game is soley based on being bigger/faster he really has no moves that approach anyone mentioned except mutumbo

[moiso]

1. Chuck Nevitt 2. Mitch Kupchac 3. Paul Mokeski 4. Swen Nater 5. Dwight Howard.
Nah, your list is pretty good except, like you said- Parish is high.  Howard is 24 so any amount of offensive improvement will push him higher on the list.  That said, he still looks like a huge, athletic stiff on offense.  Right now is closer to Mutombo than the truly great ones.

[moiso]

But I guess it's hard to complain about the guy who wins defensive player of the year and leads the league in blocks and rebounds every year.

[Roy Hobbs]

But I guess it's hard to complain about the guy who wins defensive player of the year and leads the league in blocks and rebounds every year.

Yeah, he's the best in the NBA currently.  Basically, Dikembe with a bit more of an offensive game.  I agree with you, though: he's a lot closer to Dikembe than he is to Shaq in terms of dominance.

[Kwhit10]

Dwight Howard doesn't have a shot, he can't shoot outside of 5 feet.  He gets all his points on dunks.  I'm expecting his offense to keep developing but at this stage you might have to just take him as what he is as of now.  So I would have him around the ten slot give or take.

Howard also doesn't block shots like the big of the 90's did.  Zo, Mutombo, Ewing, Olajuwan, and David Robinson routinely blocked over 3 sometimes over 4 shots a game.  Even starting when the entered the league.  I don't know if this is a product of going to college unlike Dwight; but he is under 3bpg even though he's increased every year in the league.

[wdleehi]

Brad Daugherty and Ben Wallace should be in there as well. 

[Roy Hobbs]

Brad Daugherty and Ben Wallace should be in there as well. 

Good call.  I'd have both of them below Howard, but they belong in the discussion.

[twinbree]

No debate IMO. As poor as his offensive skills are, on defense which is supposed to be his strength - I don't think he's that much better skill-wise. His rebounding and shot blocking seem to be mainly based on his leaping ability. Statistically he's great and I know it doesn't matter how you do it as long as it gets the job done but he relies too much on his athleticism for me to think he can overtake the guys above him on the list.

[Brendan]

With any list like this are we talking peak value or franchise value.

I'd put Shaq ahead of Hakeem. He was unstoppable his peak years in LAL, where his game was at peak evolution and he still had most of his athleticism. If Hakeem doesn't win in 94 and 95 when there was no MJ, would he be rated as highly? I'm unsure. Maybe he doesn't get enough credit though - b/c people like me put an * next to his name. (Tangent: Actually a great what if is, if MJ stays, beats Houston those years. Wins one more and then retires leaving 97 and 98 titles to Utah. Really changes the perspective on Malone, Stockton, and Hakeem.)

Over the last thirty years of the feature centers:

1. Shaq
2. Hakeem
3. Kareem (post 80s)
4. Robinson
5. Malone
6 - 8 (Ewing, Mourning, Yao)
9 Howard

Parish, Dikembe, Wallace weren't feature guys, I don't think they belong on the list.

Howard is like super Dikembe - good enough he can be a bad feature guy, but not a good feature guy.

[misha]

If Dwight wants to be in discussion with those guys, he needs to improve another component of his game. He always had defense and strength, but that's not enough. Jump shot (not likely), efficient post moves or something else needed to make him more unstoppable.

[PosImpos]

I'm still hoping Yao can come back healthy and be dominant for a few more years to increase his legacy.  I think if the Rockets make some good moves (and you know Morey usually does) they can be in serious contention in the West as long as Yao is healthy and able to put up 20 / 10 / 2.

I agree Dwight is currently below the guys you listed because of his lack of offensive polish.  At times he dominates but then he gets taken out of games so easily when he's played by strong physical defenders like Perk.  A truly dominant player can't be game-planned so easily.

[Donoghus]

Right now, I'd throw him in that tier with guys like Alonzo Mourning and Dikembe Mutombo.  

Below the Robinson/Ewing tier.  

Needs to work on his offensive game more.

[GreenFaith1819]

Dwight Howard is universally seen as the best center in the NBA.  I think that's a fair assessment, based upon his numbers and team success.  However, I still think he's a step or two down from "greatness"; he can't dominate games consistently like most of the great centers could.

Does he stack up against the great centers of the 80s and 90s?  I don't think so.  Off the top of my head (and I'm sure I'm forgetting some great players) I'd rank the centers since 1980 as follows:

1. Hakeem
1a. Shaq
3. Kareem (post-1980 version)
4. David Robinson
5. Moses Malone
6. Patrick Ewing
7. Robert Parish
8. Alonzo Mourning (in his prime)
9. Dwight Howard
10. Yao Ming (when healthy)
11. Dikembe Mutombo

Some might quibble about how high I have Parish ranked, but outside of that, is there any debate that Howard doesn't belong anywhere near the top-6 on that list?

Similarly, does anybody think that with improvements to his game, Howard can break into that top group?  I simply don't; Howard has the athleticism, but not the skill, to go down as one of the greatest centers ever.
 

This is where I'd rank Howard. And the Robert Parish Rank? Perfect IMO. He didn't get a lot of recognition because of Bird and McHale, but he was an important piece of the Three.

Watch the old Youtube videos on Parish - he battled nearly all the Old School Centers very very closely..no one dominated him at all. He held his own. I loved that Baseline Spin move of his.

Now onto Dwight - I have some issues with him..is he intimidating? You bet. Shotblocker? One of the best I've seen since the Old School Centers. Physically Strong? Only from waist up. Has poor lower-body strength, which Kendrick Perkins still exploits, I think.

Offense? I am disappointed in this facet of Dwight Howard's game. IMO, he has the same offensive repetoire from May 2009..a running hook, a baby hook, and a dunk.

Perk is a Great Defensive Center, but IMO Dwight's Offensive Game should have evolved to the point where he can overcome Perk. It hasn't. Now don't get me wrong - I'm glad that it hasn't.

Now. take Bogut and Kaman - they seemed to have gotten better Offensively each year. But not Dwight - yet.