Defense wins championships

[mr. dee]

I mean they were the 5th best offense this year and the 5th best defense.

You need both in the modern NBA.

Probably. But even then, Kawhi is the only guy who can consistently score on that team. Others are just role players who embraced their roles.

That's really not true, he's the only consistent isolation player. They have plenty of shooters, transition players, and passers.

Spot up shooters are role players. Gasol is a role player at this point and can no longer score consistently. So is Ibaka. VanFleet is an Eddie House type spark off the bench, another role player. They can shoot, yes. But they don't consistently score.

Danny Green was cold as ice until he woke up in the finals.

I don't know why being a called a role player is a taboo on this forum or anywhere in general. Teams don't necessarily need superstars or all-stars for that matter as help. They need someone who will play within their role and execute the system offense/defense to perfection.

It isn't a taboo, but you are just wrong about Siakam and Lowry, they aren't role players.  Siamkam is probably looking at an all-star appearance next year, and Lowry already has been an all-star. 

from espn
"Kawhi Leonard and Pascal Siakam combined for 1,187 points this postseason, tied with Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen for 2nd-most by a duo in a single postseason in NBA history. Only LeBron James and Dwyane Wade had more in 2012 (1,222)."

These guys aren't Tony Allen and Kendrick Perkins.

Not saying they are just role players, but are you really taking these guys over the likes of Harden, Kyrie, Damian, Westbrook or even prior to this Finals series?

Lowry was considered in as a lower tier all-star and Siakam as just a young solid player. He could leap as an All-Star next year but he's not exactly a superstar either (at least not yet).

[blink]

Masai doesn't have any secret to team building, remember he tried to blow it up and trade Lowry before this run really started. He definitely has drafted for the modern NBA recently, look at how many versatile wings they have on their roster. Just a smart GM who was willing to go for it multiple times. (Ibaka trade, Kawhi trade, etc)

Well he took the crazy road knowing that KL might not resign, and it got them a chip.

His 'role players' really developed into championship level players this year - Siakam, VanFleet.

[Fafnir]

If you're walking your claim back to they only have one all-nba caliber player I'm 100% in agreement with you on that point.

[blink]

I mean they were the 5th best offense this year and the 5th best defense.

You need both in the modern NBA.

Probably. But even then, Kawhi is the only guy who can consistently score on that team. Others are just role players who embraced their roles.

That's really not true, he's the only consistent isolation player. They have plenty of shooters, transition players, and passers.

Spot up shooters are role players. Gasol is a role player at this point and can no longer score consistently. So is Ibaka. VanFleet is an Eddie House type spark off the bench, another role player. They can shoot, yes. But they don't consistently score.

Danny Green was cold as ice until he woke up in the finals.

I don't know why being a called a role player is a taboo on this forum or anywhere in general. Teams don't necessarily need superstars or all-stars for that matter as help. They need someone who will play within their role and execute the system offense/defense to perfection.

It isn't a taboo, but you are just wrong about Siakam and Lowry, they aren't role players.  Siamkam is probably looking at an all-star appearance next year, and Lowry already has been an all-star. 

from espn
"Kawhi Leonard and Pascal Siakam combined for 1,187 points this postseason, tied with Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen for 2nd-most by a duo in a single postseason in NBA history. Only LeBron James and Dwyane Wade had more in 2012 (1,222)."

These guys aren't Tony Allen and Kendrick Perkins.

Not saying they are just role players, but are you really taking these guys over the likes of Harden, Kyrie, Damian, Westbrook or even prior to this Finals series?

Lowry was considered in as a lower tier all-star and Siakam as just a young solid player. He could leap as an All-Star next year but he's not exactly a superstar either (at least not yet).

No one said they were superstars!?!??!  Who ever said that?

So now you are saying that they 'aren't' role players.  Ok well we can all agree on that then lol...

[Fafnir]

Masai doesn't have any secret to team building, remember he tried to blow it up and trade Lowry before this run really started. He definitely has drafted for the modern NBA recently, look at how many versatile wings they have on their roster. Just a smart GM who was willing to go for it multiple times. (Ibaka trade, Kawhi trade, etc)

Well he took the crazy road knowing that KL might not resign, and it got them a chip.

His 'role players' really developed into championship level players this year - Siakam, VanFleet.

Van Vleet barely made the team! Its not like Masai saw something others didn't, if he knew he could play this well he wouldn't have been so close to getting cut  .

He built a good team and was willing to try and make it better once he saw they had plateaued. If anything I think the biggest thing you can point to their success is how their player development program has worked out. They've gotten a large number of young guys to improve over the years, from DeRozen to the current roster.

[mr. dee]

I mean they were the 5th best offense this year and the 5th best defense.

You need both in the modern NBA.

Probably. But even then, Kawhi is the only guy who can consistently score on that team. Others are just role players who embraced their roles.

That's really not true, he's the only consistent isolation player. They have plenty of shooters, transition players, and passers.

Spot up shooters are role players. Gasol is a role player at this point and can no longer score consistently. So is Ibaka. VanFleet is an Eddie House type spark off the bench, another role player. They can shoot, yes. But they don't consistently score.

Danny Green was cold as ice until he woke up in the finals.

I don't know why being a called a role player is a taboo on this forum or anywhere in general. Teams don't necessarily need superstars or all-stars for that matter as help. They need someone who will play within their role and execute the system offense/defense to perfection.

It isn't a taboo, but you are just wrong about Siakam and Lowry, they aren't role players.  Siamkam is probably looking at an all-star appearance next year, and Lowry already has been an all-star. 

from espn
"Kawhi Leonard and Pascal Siakam combined for 1,187 points this postseason, tied with Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen for 2nd-most by a duo in a single postseason in NBA history. Only LeBron James and Dwyane Wade had more in 2012 (1,222)."

These guys aren't Tony Allen and Kendrick Perkins.

this term role player gets tossed around a lot. What and who exactly is a role player? In my book every player has a role.

Its self-explanatory. They are players with specific roles on the team (Rim-protector, spot-up shooter, lock up defender, etc.)

Star players are guys who can do more than one role and carry the team for most of the time. There is a time that some All-Star players are role players at one point. Even Kawhi himself was one.

[blink]

Masai doesn't have any secret to team building, remember he tried to blow it up and trade Lowry before this run really started. He definitely has drafted for the modern NBA recently, look at how many versatile wings they have on their roster. Just a smart GM who was willing to go for it multiple times. (Ibaka trade, Kawhi trade, etc)

Well he took the crazy road knowing that KL might not resign, and it got them a chip.

His 'role players' really developed into championship level players this year - Siakam, VanFleet.

Van Vleet barely made the team! Its not like Masai saw something others didn't, if he knew he could play this well he wouldn't have been so close to getting cut  .

He built a good team and was willing to try and make it better once he saw they had plateaued. If anything I think the biggest thing you can point to their success is how their player development program has worked out. They've gotten a large number of young guys to improve over the years, from DeRozen to the current roster.

I know, VanFleet is such a feel-good story.  I used to watch him a lot at Wichita State, because I grew up watching Missouri Valley Basketball oh so long ago.  He has improved a lot this year and just keeps on working at his game.

Hopefully our young guys get back in the gym a lot this summer and dedicate themselves to improving.

[gouki88]

I mean they were the 5th best offense this year and the 5th best defense.

You need both in the modern NBA.

Probably. But even then, Kawhi is the only guy who can consistently score on that team. Others are just role players who embraced their roles.

That's really not true, he's the only consistent isolation player. They have plenty of shooters, transition players, and passers.

Spot up shooters are role players. Gasol is a role player at this point and can no longer score consistently. So is Ibaka. VanFleet is an Eddie House type spark off the bench, another role player. They can shoot, yes. But they don't consistently score.

Danny Green was cold as ice until he woke up in the finals.

I don't know why being a called a role player is a taboo on this forum or anywhere in general. Teams don't necessarily need superstars or all-stars for that matter as help. They need someone who will play within their role and execute the system offense/defense to perfection.

It isn't a taboo, but you are just wrong about Siakam and Lowry, they aren't role players.  Siamkam is probably looking at an all-star appearance next year, and Lowry already has been an all-star. 

from espn
"Kawhi Leonard and Pascal Siakam combined for 1,187 points this postseason, tied with Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen for 2nd-most by a duo in a single postseason in NBA history. Only LeBron James and Dwyane Wade had more in 2012 (1,222)."

These guys aren't Tony Allen and Kendrick Perkins.

this term role player gets tossed around a lot. What and who exactly is a role player? In my book every player has a role.

Its self-explanatory. They are players with specific roles on the team (Rim-protector, spot-up shooter, lock up defender, etc.)

Star players are guys who can do more than one role and carry the team for most of the time. There is a time that some All-Star players are role players at one point. Even Kawhi himself was one.

I get your point, but the Toronto guys are definitely the upper echelon of role players. Kyle Lowry was an All-Star this season, Marc Gasol is still an elite defender who can score from all 3 levels and has great court vision, Siakam is a long 2-4 defender who can get points in a hurry, and Van Vleet is a good play-making shooter who comes up clutch, and was a pest for Curry all series.

[keevsnick]

This should be obvious, but its actually DEFENSE+OFFENSE that wins championships.

[mr. dee]

I mean they were the 5th best offense this year and the 5th best defense.

You need both in the modern NBA.

Probably. But even then, Kawhi is the only guy who can consistently score on that team. Others are just role players who embraced their roles.

That's really not true, he's the only consistent isolation player. They have plenty of shooters, transition players, and passers.

Spot up shooters are role players. Gasol is a role player at this point and can no longer score consistently. So is Ibaka. VanFleet is an Eddie House type spark off the bench, another role player. They can shoot, yes. But they don't consistently score.

Danny Green was cold as ice until he woke up in the finals.

I don't know why being a called a role player is a taboo on this forum or anywhere in general. Teams don't necessarily need superstars or all-stars for that matter as help. They need someone who will play within their role and execute the system offense/defense to perfection.

It isn't a taboo, but you are just wrong about Siakam and Lowry, they aren't role players.  Siamkam is probably looking at an all-star appearance next year, and Lowry already has been an all-star. 

from espn
"Kawhi Leonard and Pascal Siakam combined for 1,187 points this postseason, tied with Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen for 2nd-most by a duo in a single postseason in NBA history. Only LeBron James and Dwyane Wade had more in 2012 (1,222)."

These guys aren't Tony Allen and Kendrick Perkins.

Not saying they are just role players, but are you really taking these guys over the likes of Harden, Kyrie, Damian, Westbrook or even prior to this Finals series?

Lowry was considered in as a lower tier all-star and Siakam as just a young solid player. He could leap as an All-Star next year but he's not exactly a superstar either (at least not yet).

No one said they were superstars!?!??!  Who ever said that?

So now you are saying that they 'aren't' role players.  Ok well we can all agree on that then lol...

Glue guys are still role players. But a very good ones. Again, why do people take the term as an insult or means to degrade a player?

[SparzWizard]

Offense wins championships (see 2018) 

[blink]

I mean they were the 5th best offense this year and the 5th best defense.

You need both in the modern NBA.

Probably. But even then, Kawhi is the only guy who can consistently score on that team. Others are just role players who embraced their roles.

That's really not true, he's the only consistent isolation player. They have plenty of shooters, transition players, and passers.

Spot up shooters are role players. Gasol is a role player at this point and can no longer score consistently. So is Ibaka. VanFleet is an Eddie House type spark off the bench, another role player. They can shoot, yes. But they don't consistently score.

Danny Green was cold as ice until he woke up in the finals.

I don't know why being a called a role player is a taboo on this forum or anywhere in general. Teams don't necessarily need superstars or all-stars for that matter as help. They need someone who will play within their role and execute the system offense/defense to perfection.

It isn't a taboo, but you are just wrong about Siakam and Lowry, they aren't role players.  Siamkam is probably looking at an all-star appearance next year, and Lowry already has been an all-star. 

from espn
"Kawhi Leonard and Pascal Siakam combined for 1,187 points this postseason, tied with Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen for 2nd-most by a duo in a single postseason in NBA history. Only LeBron James and Dwyane Wade had more in 2012 (1,222)."

These guys aren't Tony Allen and Kendrick Perkins.

Not saying they are just role players, but are you really taking these guys over the likes of Harden, Kyrie, Damian, Westbrook or even prior to this Finals series?

Lowry was considered in as a lower tier all-star and Siakam as just a young solid player. He could leap as an All-Star next year but he's not exactly a superstar either (at least not yet).

No one said they were superstars!?!??!  Who ever said that?

So now you are saying that they 'aren't' role players.  Ok well we can all agree on that then lol...

Glue guys are still role players. But a very good ones. Again, why do people take the term as an insult or means to degrade a player?

Dude you just changed your mind and said they aren't role players, but now they are 'glue guys'? 

man alive Siakam and Lowry are not role players / glue guys.   They are all stars (soon to be all stars) and high level starters on an NBA championship team.  That completely ISN'T the definition of "glue guy".

[mr. dee]

Offense wins championships (see 2018) 

Wrong. Warriors still have 3 or 4 defensive caliber team on their consecutive finals run

Draymond Green - DPOY
Klay Thompson - All-Defensive 2nd Team
Andre Iguodala - 2x All-Defensive Team
Andrew Bogut - All-Defensive 2nd Team and Blocks Leader
Kevin Durant - Lengthy and mobile defender.
Kevon Looney - Solid rim protector
Javale McGee - Same as Looney

[Ogaju]

I mean they were the 5th best offense this year and the 5th best defense.

You need both in the modern NBA.

Probably. But even then, Kawhi is the only guy who can consistently score on that team. Others are just role players who embraced their roles.

That's really not true, he's the only consistent isolation player. They have plenty of shooters, transition players, and passers.

Spot up shooters are role players. Gasol is a role player at this point and can no longer score consistently. So is Ibaka. VanFleet is an Eddie House type spark off the bench, another role player. They can shoot, yes. But they don't consistently score.

Danny Green was cold as ice until he woke up in the finals.

I don't know why being a called a role player is a taboo on this forum or anywhere in general. Teams don't necessarily need superstars or all-stars for that matter as help. They need someone who will play within their role and execute the system offense/defense to perfection.

It isn't a taboo, but you are just wrong about Siakam and Lowry, they aren't role players.  Siamkam is probably looking at an all-star appearance next year, and Lowry already has been an all-star. 

from espn
"Kawhi Leonard and Pascal Siakam combined for 1,187 points this postseason, tied with Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen for 2nd-most by a duo in a single postseason in NBA history. Only LeBron James and Dwyane Wade had more in 2012 (1,222)."

These guys aren't Tony Allen and Kendrick Perkins.

this term role player gets tossed around a lot. What and who exactly is a role player? In my book every player has a role.

Its self-explanatory. They are players with specific roles on the team (Rim-protector, spot-up shooter, lock up defender, etc.)

Star players are guys who can do more than one role and carry the team for most of the time. There is a time that some All-Star players are role players at one point. Even Kawhi himself was one.

Your point is the likes of Michael Jordan, Kareem, Bird, Magic did not have a role on their teams?

[mr. dee]

I mean they were the 5th best offense this year and the 5th best defense.

You need both in the modern NBA.

Probably. But even then, Kawhi is the only guy who can consistently score on that team. Others are just role players who embraced their roles.

That's really not true, he's the only consistent isolation player. They have plenty of shooters, transition players, and passers.

Spot up shooters are role players. Gasol is a role player at this point and can no longer score consistently. So is Ibaka. VanFleet is an Eddie House type spark off the bench, another role player. They can shoot, yes. But they don't consistently score.

Danny Green was cold as ice until he woke up in the finals.

I don't know why being a called a role player is a taboo on this forum or anywhere in general. Teams don't necessarily need superstars or all-stars for that matter as help. They need someone who will play within their role and execute the system offense/defense to perfection.

It isn't a taboo, but you are just wrong about Siakam and Lowry, they aren't role players.  Siamkam is probably looking at an all-star appearance next year, and Lowry already has been an all-star. 

from espn
"Kawhi Leonard and Pascal Siakam combined for 1,187 points this postseason, tied with Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen for 2nd-most by a duo in a single postseason in NBA history. Only LeBron James and Dwyane Wade had more in 2012 (1,222)."

These guys aren't Tony Allen and Kendrick Perkins.

Not saying they are just role players, but are you really taking these guys over the likes of Harden, Kyrie, Damian, Westbrook or even prior to this Finals series?

Lowry was considered in as a lower tier all-star and Siakam as just a young solid player. He could leap as an All-Star next year but he's not exactly a superstar either (at least not yet).

No one said they were superstars!?!??!  Who ever said that?

So now you are saying that they 'aren't' role players.  Ok well we can all agree on that then lol...

Glue guys are still role players. But a very good ones. Again, why do people take the term as an insult or means to degrade a player?

Dude you just changed your mind and said they aren't role players, but now they are 'glue guys'? 

man alive Siakam and Lowry are not role players / glue guys.   They are all stars (soon to be all stars) and high level starters on an NBA championship team.  That completely ISN'T the definition of "glue guy".

Would you call them championship caliber starters back with Derozan?