Can you win a championship with horrible bench?

[celticsclay]

So at least two teams that are expected to make the second round seem to have objectively awful benches (especially in light of Cousins injury)

The Warriors are going to have the following as their significant bench players:

Iggy (35 years old, 5.7ppg this year)
Bogut (returning to league for first time in two seasons, age 34)
Livingston (33 years old, 4ppg this season)
Cook (seems like solid bench guard)

Assuming Looney still plays, not sure who else is playing.

The 76ers are playing a bit stronger, but not sure how highly these guys have been viewed around the league:
Mike Scott
Bobo
Ennis
Bolden

How much do you think these benches matter for winning a championship?

[PhoSita]

A great deal depends on what you need from your bench (scoring or just adequate defense?) and how many minutes your starters can play.

[celticsclay]

A great deal depends on what you need from your bench (scoring or just adequate defense?) and how many minutes your starters can play.

So in the case of Golden State they have three all-stars and a near all star in Green. I think they mostly have enough offense because one of Durant, Klay or Curry will be on the floor. But I guess they have some pretty limited shooting when they bring in any of their bench guys. Cook is the only good shooter from 3?

[Green-18]

So at least two teams that are expected to make the second round seem to have objectively awful benches (especially in light of Cousins injury)

The Warriors are going to have the following as their significant bench players:

Iggy (35 years old, 5.7ppg this year)
Bogut (returning to league for first time in two seasons, age 34)
Livingston (33 years old, 4ppg this season)
Cook (seems like solid bench guard)

Assuming Looney still plays, not sure who else is playing.

The 76ers are playing a bit stronger, but not sure how highly these guys have been viewed around the league:
Mike Scott
Bobo
Ennis
Bolden

How much do you think these benches matter for winning a championship?

I can't call the Warriors bench horrible when they have Iguodala and Livingston.  Their "death lineup" of of Curry, Thompson, Iguodala, Durant and Green posted a net rating of 29.1 this season.  This was by far the best in the NBA for any lineup that played at least 150 minutes together.  The "death lineup" also played more minutes than any other combo for Golden State during last years playoffs, and posted a net rating of 23.9.  People may also forget that Iggy missed the last four games of the WCF against Houston.

 

[celticsclay]

So at least two teams that are expected to make the second round seem to have objectively awful benches (especially in light of Cousins injury)

The Warriors are going to have the following as their significant bench players:

Iggy (35 years old, 5.7ppg this year)
Bogut (returning to league for first time in two seasons, age 34)
Livingston (33 years old, 4ppg this season)
Cook (seems like solid bench guard)

Assuming Looney still plays, not sure who else is playing.

The 76ers are playing a bit stronger, but not sure how highly these guys have been viewed around the league:
Mike Scott
Bobo
Ennis
Bolden

How much do you think these benches matter for winning a championship?

I can't call the Warriors bench horrible when they have Iguodala and Livingston.  Their "death lineup" of of Curry, Thompson, Iguodala, Durant and Green posted a net rating of 29.1 this season.  This was by far the best in the NBA for any lineup that played at least 150 minutes together.  The "death lineup" also played more minutes than any other combo for Golden State during last years playoffs, and posted a net rating of 23.9.  People may also forget that Iggy missed the last four games of the WCF against Houston.

 

You realize those guys are both completely washed up?

[Green-18]

So at least two teams that are expected to make the second round seem to have objectively awful benches (especially in light of Cousins injury)

The Warriors are going to have the following as their significant bench players:

Iggy (35 years old, 5.7ppg this year)
Bogut (returning to league for first time in two seasons, age 34)
Livingston (33 years old, 4ppg this season)
Cook (seems like solid bench guard)

Assuming Looney still plays, not sure who else is playing.

The 76ers are playing a bit stronger, but not sure how highly these guys have been viewed around the league:
Mike Scott
Bobo
Ennis
Bolden

How much do you think these benches matter for winning a championship?

I can't call the Warriors bench horrible when they have Iguodala and Livingston.  Their "death lineup" of of Curry, Thompson, Iguodala, Durant and Green posted a net rating of 29.1 this season.  This was by far the best in the NBA for any lineup that played at least 150 minutes together.  The "death lineup" also played more minutes than any other combo for Golden State during last years playoffs, and posted a net rating of 23.9.  People may also forget that Iggy missed the last four games of the WCF against Houston.

 

You realize those guys are both completely washed up?

What makes Iguodala washed up when it comes to being an effective role player off the bench?  Is he no longer capable of defending and getting out in transition as part of the "death lineup"?  Does his playoff experience mean nothing?  The Warriors were a better team with him on the court this season. 

He's perfectly capable of giving the team what it needs in the playoffs. 

[SparzWizard]

Didn't the 2011 Miami Heat had a horrible bench after acquiring LeBron and Bosh

They did make it to the finals but the Mavericks were just rolling every team in the postseason run.

[PhoSita]

A great deal depends on what you need from your bench (scoring or just adequate defense?) and how many minutes your starters can play.

So in the case of Golden State they have three all-stars and a near all star in Green. I think they mostly have enough offense because one of Durant, Klay or Curry will be on the floor. But I guess they have some pretty limited shooting when they bring in any of their bench guys. Cook is the only good shooter from 3?

I agree that shooting is an issue for them if they're playing multiple non-shooting bigs (or Draymond plus a non-shooting big).

For the most part though they can have at least two of their deadly shooters on the floor at any given time, and they have enough OK-ish shooters on the bench (Cook, Iggy, Jerebko) that they're fine.

[Rakulp]

Those horses are going to be rode until they break down and have to be shot.

I think Philadelphia will feel it before the Warriors. 

[celticsclay]

A great deal depends on what you need from your bench (scoring or just adequate defense?) and how many minutes your starters can play.

So in the case of Golden State they have three all-stars and a near all star in Green. I think they mostly have enough offense because one of Durant, Klay or Curry will be on the floor. But I guess they have some pretty limited shooting when they bring in any of their bench guys. Cook is the only good shooter from 3?

I agree that shooting is an issue for them if they're playing multiple non-shooting bigs (or Draymond plus a non-shooting big).

For the most part though they can have at least two of their deadly shooters on the floor at any given time, and they have enough OK-ish shooters on the bench (Cook, Iggy, Jerebko) that they're fine.

Cook is definitely an ok shooter. Iggy is shooting 25% the last 6 weeks and was only 31% the last two seasons combined. I guess... that is ok??? Jerekbro is not in the rotation. Playing two guys that can not shoot at the same time is pretty unusual in the NBA.

[tstorey_97]

Question for you guys:
(Let's say Smart is back)

Hayward
Brown
Morris
Rozier

How does the Celtic's "bench" rank with the rest of the playoff teams?

A site called "fadeawayworld.net" offers the following breakdown (2/19) of the top 10 benches in the NBA...

#1 Clippers
#2 Nets
#3 Knicks
#4 Cavs
#5 Kings
#6 Heat
#7 Hornets
#8 Hawks
#9 Your Boston Celtics
#10 Pacers

Soooo, GSW, Rox, Nugs, Raps, Bux et al, don't rate here?

Regardless, should the C's get through a round or two? Fadeawayworld.net has anointed them best bench of the remaining teams.
 

[Moranis]

The 93-94 Rockets not only had a terrible bench but also an objectively terrible starting 5.  The next year the bench was only slightly better.

The Shaq/Kobe Lakers bench kept getting worse and that 01-02 team had a pretty darn terrible bench (George, Walker, Shaw, and Hunter).

[ManUp]

Yes, the 2008 Celtics did

James Posey was our only quality reserve.

Everyone else was just serviceable

[SparzWizard]

Yes, the 2008 Celtics did

James Posey was our only quality reserve.

Everyone else was just serviceable

Eddie House and Glen Davis?

[ImShakHeIsShaq]

Most of LBJ's teams had mediocre benches, they barely had high quality starters outside of his chips and a few seasons surrounding them. GSW benches have been blegh outside of Iggy.


Our bench has some of the best talent in the league, it has seriously under performed, it should be the best in the league, certainly top 2-3.