Author Topic: Who better than Tatum?  (Read 6024 times)

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Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #30 on: January 22, 2021, 10:16:59 PM »

Offline Somebody

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::) Another Tatum lovefest? I'd take a lot of players over Tatum over the next 7ish years. Doncic and Jokic are the obvious 25 and-under candidates with Towns being another one if he recovers from the horrible 2020 he had, while big men who'll likely age well due to their defensive value like Davis, Embiid and Giannis are still young enough to have around 7 good years left. Then you get into the MVPs who might age like fine wine: Durant, Harden, LeBron, Curry, etc. Now I'm not taking all of those guys over Tatum in the next 7 years or so, but I'm pretty confident that at least a couple of them can still maintain their level of play over this period (I mean Durant looks even better than he ever did after an Achilles tear). That's 5-7 guys I'd take over Tatum without even including players who might explode out of nowhere in the future.
Ur just mad that he said "Who" better than Tatum and not "Somebody". ;)

I guess u and Who are gonna have to battle it out with some 1v1 games...
LOL no, I'm just bemused about the love that Tatum gets on this forum when he doesn't really warrant this kind of praise.

Yeah, I guess you’re right.... :angel:

Jayson Tatum fouls out 1 point short of tying the NBA record for playoff points by a rookie at 351, just behind Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.

Jayson Tatum is the first player in Boston Celtics franchise history with three 40-point games before turning 23.


Jayson Tatum is the second-youngest player in NBA postseason history to record at least 25 points, 10 rebounds, and five assists in a Game 7. The only player to do so at a younger age is Kobe Bryant.


Jayson Tatum is having a career-changing season this year and against the Pacers he achieved another incredible milestone. In particular, Tatum tied the record for most consecutive 30+ road games in the Boston Celtic’s history with five.


Jayson Tatum etched his name into the Boston Celtics' record books Wednesday afternoon, becoming the youngest player in franchise history to obtain All-NBA status as he earned third-team honors.


Tatum is just the second Celtic to top 4,000 points before turning 23 (the other is Antoine Walker). He’s currently averaging 25 ppg. With 33 games between now and his birthday on March 4th, he could be close to 5,000.
A volume stat that Tatum compiles because he played on a strong team and got a ton of games to rack up his totals doesn't make him the second coming of Jabbar.

The first player on a franchise who hasn't had very good players drafted at the age of 19 contributing right out of the gate makes this significantly less impressive.

Playing on a great team will give you the opportunities to do so when you're good at a young age.

These milestones don't mean much except for being a nice thing to talk about - he's a good scorer, no one's denying that.

Honours that have been historically sketchy and continued to be iffy last season by snubbing players like Joel Embiid, Khris Middleton, etc from those squads in favour of Chris Paul, Russell Westbrook and Ben Simmons? Sounds like those honours don't do a very good job at differentiating the good from the great except for the very obvious picks :laugh:

Is sharing an honour with Antoine Walker proof that you're an MVP calibre player? :laugh:
Jaylen Brown for All-NBA

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #31 on: January 22, 2021, 10:29:03 PM »

Offline footey

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Man, I like Jayson. But Jaylen has really caught up to him as a 3 point shooter. And Jaylen finishes, well, just better than Jayson. When Jaylen drives to the cup I have much higher confidence that he will finish than Jayson.

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #32 on: January 22, 2021, 11:39:31 PM »

Offline Goldstar88

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::) Another Tatum lovefest? I'd take a lot of players over Tatum over the next 7ish years. Doncic and Jokic are the obvious 25 and-under candidates with Towns being another one if he recovers from the horrible 2020 he had, while big men who'll likely age well due to their defensive value like Davis, Embiid and Giannis are still young enough to have around 7 good years left. Then you get into the MVPs who might age like fine wine: Durant, Harden, LeBron, Curry, etc. Now I'm not taking all of those guys over Tatum in the next 7 years or so, but I'm pretty confident that at least a couple of them can still maintain their level of play over this period (I mean Durant looks even better than he ever did after an Achilles tear). That's 5-7 guys I'd take over Tatum without even including players who might explode out of nowhere in the future.
Ur just mad that he said "Who" better than Tatum and not "Somebody". ;)

I guess u and Who are gonna have to battle it out with some 1v1 games...
LOL no, I'm just bemused about the love that Tatum gets on this forum when he doesn't really warrant this kind of praise.

Yeah, I guess you’re right.... :angel:

Jayson Tatum fouls out 1 point short of tying the NBA record for playoff points by a rookie at 351, just behind Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.

Jayson Tatum is the first player in Boston Celtics franchise history with three 40-point games before turning 23.


Jayson Tatum is the second-youngest player in NBA postseason history to record at least 25 points, 10 rebounds, and five assists in a Game 7. The only player to do so at a younger age is Kobe Bryant.


Jayson Tatum is having a career-changing season this year and against the Pacers he achieved another incredible milestone. In particular, Tatum tied the record for most consecutive 30+ road games in the Boston Celtic’s history with five.


Jayson Tatum etched his name into the Boston Celtics' record books Wednesday afternoon, becoming the youngest player in franchise history to obtain All-NBA status as he earned third-team honors.


Tatum is just the second Celtic to top 4,000 points before turning 23 (the other is Antoine Walker). He’s currently averaging 25 ppg. With 33 games between now and his birthday on March 4th, he could be close to 5,000.
A volume stat that Tatum compiles because he played on a strong team and got a ton of games to rack up his totals doesn't make him the second coming of Jabbar.

The first player on a franchise who hasn't had very good players drafted at the age of 19 contributing right out of the gate makes this significantly less impressive.

Playing on a great team will give you the opportunities to do so when you're good at a young age.

These milestones don't mean much except for being a nice thing to talk about - he's a good scorer, no one's denying that.

Honours that have been historically sketchy and continued to be iffy last season by snubbing players like Joel Embiid, Khris Middleton, etc from those squads in favour of Chris Paul, Russell Westbrook and Ben Simmons? Sounds like those honours don't do a very good job at differentiating the good from the great except for the very obvious picks :laugh:

Is sharing an honour with Antoine Walker proof that you're an MVP calibre player? :laugh:

RJ87 is right, you clearly have something against him. No matter what he achieves you will find a way to discount it. If he wins a ring with the Celtics and gets finals MVP, you will say, “Well, if it wasn’t for Jaylen......” it’s fine, though. If you want to hate on the C’s franchise player that has virtually no weaknesses in his game,
Have at it. lol...
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #33 on: January 23, 2021, 01:05:52 AM »

Offline Somebody

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::) Another Tatum lovefest? I'd take a lot of players over Tatum over the next 7ish years. Doncic and Jokic are the obvious 25 and-under candidates with Towns being another one if he recovers from the horrible 2020 he had, while big men who'll likely age well due to their defensive value like Davis, Embiid and Giannis are still young enough to have around 7 good years left. Then you get into the MVPs who might age like fine wine: Durant, Harden, LeBron, Curry, etc. Now I'm not taking all of those guys over Tatum in the next 7 years or so, but I'm pretty confident that at least a couple of them can still maintain their level of play over this period (I mean Durant looks even better than he ever did after an Achilles tear). That's 5-7 guys I'd take over Tatum without even including players who might explode out of nowhere in the future.
Ur just mad that he said "Who" better than Tatum and not "Somebody". ;)

I guess u and Who are gonna have to battle it out with some 1v1 games...
LOL no, I'm just bemused about the love that Tatum gets on this forum when he doesn't really warrant this kind of praise.

Lol, I think you can be a little more honest here and admit that you have something against him for whatever reason. It just seems like you hold him to an entirely different standard than you hold players who don't play for us.

Some fans love certain players, while hating others. It is what it is. I can't stand watching Harden's game and make no qualms about it no matter what stats you throw at me. At least I'm upfront about it.
If you're basing that on the exchange about Doncic/Tatum we had a while ago then I absolutely disagree. Just because I don't drink the crazy kool-aid that Tatum is somehow the next Durant/LeBron doesn't mean that I don't rate him or hold him to a completely different standard than players who don't play for us: he's an All-NBA level wing who excels at both ends of the floor, but this is more of a pre-2021 Paul George type of talent (he's been nuts this season) who you pair with a Kawhi to compete for championships and not the Kawhi you build around, you don't give him a pass like you do with guys like Doncic if he's the best player on your squad (a Tatum-led squad is going to win on considerably finer margins compared to a Doncic-centric squad assuming that their supporting casts are comparable, Doncic can have a reasonable case at winning NBA titles in spite of his sketchy outside shooting and subpar shot selection while Tatum needs his team and himself to play out of their minds to have that opportunity). I'll hold any two-way All-NBA wing who's the best player on a squad with title aspirations (eg. Butler) to the standard I'm currently holding Tatum to (if Tatum does what Butler did in the 2020 playoffs this year I'll heap praise on him like I did with Butler).

I don't hate Tatum as a player, I simply hate how he's being utilised: he's clearly willing and able to play a less heliocentric role, but our coaching staff is being delusional about his offensive prowess by turning to Tatumball whenever we need offence in crunch time. I'm not calling for the coaching staff to relegate Tatum in the corner, but an approach with more off-ball movement to create looks for Jaylen and Kemba so we have more layers to our offence while Tatum maintains a heavy offensive load would be more effective than spamming PnRs and isos for Tatum against 5 men waiting for him to jack up a contested stepback three or turn the ball over with a bad pass.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2021, 04:47:46 AM by Somebody »
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Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #34 on: January 23, 2021, 01:07:13 AM »

Offline Somebody

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::) Another Tatum lovefest? I'd take a lot of players over Tatum over the next 7ish years. Doncic and Jokic are the obvious 25 and-under candidates with Towns being another one if he recovers from the horrible 2020 he had, while big men who'll likely age well due to their defensive value like Davis, Embiid and Giannis are still young enough to have around 7 good years left. Then you get into the MVPs who might age like fine wine: Durant, Harden, LeBron, Curry, etc. Now I'm not taking all of those guys over Tatum in the next 7 years or so, but I'm pretty confident that at least a couple of them can still maintain their level of play over this period (I mean Durant looks even better than he ever did after an Achilles tear). That's 5-7 guys I'd take over Tatum without even including players who might explode out of nowhere in the future.
Ur just mad that he said "Who" better than Tatum and not "Somebody". ;)

I guess u and Who are gonna have to battle it out with some 1v1 games...
LOL no, I'm just bemused about the love that Tatum gets on this forum when he doesn't really warrant this kind of praise.

Yeah, I guess you’re right.... :angel:

Jayson Tatum fouls out 1 point short of tying the NBA record for playoff points by a rookie at 351, just behind Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.

Jayson Tatum is the first player in Boston Celtics franchise history with three 40-point games before turning 23.


Jayson Tatum is the second-youngest player in NBA postseason history to record at least 25 points, 10 rebounds, and five assists in a Game 7. The only player to do so at a younger age is Kobe Bryant.


Jayson Tatum is having a career-changing season this year and against the Pacers he achieved another incredible milestone. In particular, Tatum tied the record for most consecutive 30+ road games in the Boston Celtic’s history with five.


Jayson Tatum etched his name into the Boston Celtics' record books Wednesday afternoon, becoming the youngest player in franchise history to obtain All-NBA status as he earned third-team honors.


Tatum is just the second Celtic to top 4,000 points before turning 23 (the other is Antoine Walker). He’s currently averaging 25 ppg. With 33 games between now and his birthday on March 4th, he could be close to 5,000.
A volume stat that Tatum compiles because he played on a strong team and got a ton of games to rack up his totals doesn't make him the second coming of Jabbar.

The first player on a franchise who hasn't had very good players drafted at the age of 19 contributing right out of the gate makes this significantly less impressive.

Playing on a great team will give you the opportunities to do so when you're good at a young age.

These milestones don't mean much except for being a nice thing to talk about - he's a good scorer, no one's denying that.

Honours that have been historically sketchy and continued to be iffy last season by snubbing players like Joel Embiid, Khris Middleton, etc from those squads in favour of Chris Paul, Russell Westbrook and Ben Simmons? Sounds like those honours don't do a very good job at differentiating the good from the great except for the very obvious picks :laugh:

Is sharing an honour with Antoine Walker proof that you're an MVP calibre player? :laugh:
RJ87 is right, you clearly have something against him. No matter what he achieves you will find a way to discount it. If he wins a ring with the Celtics and gets finals MVP, you will say, “Well, if it wasn’t for Jaylen......” it’s fine, though. If you want to hate on the C’s franchise player that has virtually no weaknesses in his game,
Have at it. lol...
Bolded tells me all I need to know, if you actually believe what you said by gawking at the raw box score, "have at it. lol..." :laugh:
Jaylen Brown for All-NBA

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #35 on: January 23, 2021, 12:06:25 PM »

Offline smokeablount

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::) Another Tatum lovefest? I'd take a lot of players over Tatum over the next 7ish years. Doncic and Jokic are the obvious 25 and-under candidates with Towns being another one if he recovers from the horrible 2020 he had, while big men who'll likely age well due to their defensive value like Davis, Embiid and Giannis are still young enough to have around 7 good years left. Then you get into the MVPs who might age like fine wine: Durant, Harden, LeBron, Curry, etc. Now I'm not taking all of those guys over Tatum in the next 7 years or so, but I'm pretty confident that at least a couple of them can still maintain their level of play over this period (I mean Durant looks even better than he ever did after an Achilles tear). That's 5-7 guys I'd take over Tatum without even including players who might explode out of nowhere in the future.
Ur just mad that he said "Who" better than Tatum and not "Somebody". ;)

I guess u and Who are gonna have to battle it out with some 1v1 games...
LOL no, I'm just bemused about the love that Tatum gets on this forum when he doesn't really warrant this kind of praise.

Yeah, I guess you’re right.... :angel:

Jayson Tatum fouls out 1 point short of tying the NBA record for playoff points by a rookie at 351, just behind Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.

Jayson Tatum is the first player in Boston Celtics franchise history with three 40-point games before turning 23.


Jayson Tatum is the second-youngest player in NBA postseason history to record at least 25 points, 10 rebounds, and five assists in a Game 7. The only player to do so at a younger age is Kobe Bryant.


Jayson Tatum is having a career-changing season this year and against the Pacers he achieved another incredible milestone. In particular, Tatum tied the record for most consecutive 30+ road games in the Boston Celtic’s history with five.


Jayson Tatum etched his name into the Boston Celtics' record books Wednesday afternoon, becoming the youngest player in franchise history to obtain All-NBA status as he earned third-team honors.


Tatum is just the second Celtic to top 4,000 points before turning 23 (the other is Antoine Walker). He’s currently averaging 25 ppg. With 33 games between now and his birthday on March 4th, he could be close to 5,000.
A volume stat that Tatum compiles because he played on a strong team and got a ton of games to rack up his totals doesn't make him the second coming of Jabbar.

The first player on a franchise who hasn't had very good players drafted at the age of 19 contributing right out of the gate makes this significantly less impressive.

Playing on a great team will give you the opportunities to do so when you're good at a young age.

These milestones don't mean much except for being a nice thing to talk about - he's a good scorer, no one's denying that.

Honours that have been historically sketchy and continued to be iffy last season by snubbing players like Joel Embiid, Khris Middleton, etc from those squads in favour of Chris Paul, Russell Westbrook and Ben Simmons? Sounds like those honours don't do a very good job at differentiating the good from the great except for the very obvious picks :laugh:

Is sharing an honour with Antoine Walker proof that you're an MVP calibre player? :laugh:
RJ87 is right, you clearly have something against him. No matter what he achieves you will find a way to discount it. If he wins a ring with the Celtics and gets finals MVP, you will say, “Well, if it wasn’t for Jaylen......” it’s fine, though. If you want to hate on the C’s franchise player that has virtually no weaknesses in his game,
Have at it. lol...
Bolded tells me all I need to know, if you actually believe what you said by gawking at the raw box score, "have at it. lol..." :laugh:

And conversely I remember arguing with you when you said he had less upside than Paul Pierce, so that tells me all I need to know.

Either you’re a great stats analyst but a poor talent evaluator, or you’ve got some kind of bias against Tatum. That take aged poorly.
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Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #36 on: January 23, 2021, 12:57:07 PM »

Offline Goldstar88

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::) Another Tatum lovefest? I'd take a lot of players over Tatum over the next 7ish years. Doncic and Jokic are the obvious 25 and-under candidates with Towns being another one if he recovers from the horrible 2020 he had, while big men who'll likely age well due to their defensive value like Davis, Embiid and Giannis are still young enough to have around 7 good years left. Then you get into the MVPs who might age like fine wine: Durant, Harden, LeBron, Curry, etc. Now I'm not taking all of those guys over Tatum in the next 7 years or so, but I'm pretty confident that at least a couple of them can still maintain their level of play over this period (I mean Durant looks even better than he ever did after an Achilles tear). That's 5-7 guys I'd take over Tatum without even including players who might explode out of nowhere in the future.
Ur just mad that he said "Who" better than Tatum and not "Somebody". ;)

I guess u and Who are gonna have to battle it out with some 1v1 games...
LOL no, I'm just bemused about the love that Tatum gets on this forum when he doesn't really warrant this kind of praise.

Yeah, I guess you’re right.... :angel:

Jayson Tatum fouls out 1 point short of tying the NBA record for playoff points by a rookie at 351, just behind Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.

Jayson Tatum is the first player in Boston Celtics franchise history with three 40-point games before turning 23.


Jayson Tatum is the second-youngest player in NBA postseason history to record at least 25 points, 10 rebounds, and five assists in a Game 7. The only player to do so at a younger age is Kobe Bryant.


Jayson Tatum is having a career-changing season this year and against the Pacers he achieved another incredible milestone. In particular, Tatum tied the record for most consecutive 30+ road games in the Boston Celtic’s history with five.


Jayson Tatum etched his name into the Boston Celtics' record books Wednesday afternoon, becoming the youngest player in franchise history to obtain All-NBA status as he earned third-team honors.


Tatum is just the second Celtic to top 4,000 points before turning 23 (the other is Antoine Walker). He’s currently averaging 25 ppg. With 33 games between now and his birthday on March 4th, he could be close to 5,000.
A volume stat that Tatum compiles because he played on a strong team and got a ton of games to rack up his totals doesn't make him the second coming of Jabbar.

The first player on a franchise who hasn't had very good players drafted at the age of 19 contributing right out of the gate makes this significantly less impressive.

Playing on a great team will give you the opportunities to do so when you're good at a young age.

These milestones don't mean much except for being a nice thing to talk about - he's a good scorer, no one's denying that.

Honours that have been historically sketchy and continued to be iffy last season by snubbing players like Joel Embiid, Khris Middleton, etc from those squads in favour of Chris Paul, Russell Westbrook and Ben Simmons? Sounds like those honours don't do a very good job at differentiating the good from the great except for the very obvious picks :laugh:

Is sharing an honour with Antoine Walker proof that you're an MVP calibre player? :laugh:
RJ87 is right, you clearly have something against him. No matter what he achieves you will find a way to discount it. If he wins a ring with the Celtics and gets finals MVP, you will say, “Well, if it wasn’t for Jaylen......” it’s fine, though. If you want to hate on the C’s franchise player that has virtually no weaknesses in his game,
Have at it. lol...
Bolded tells me all I need to know, if you actually believe what you said by gawking at the raw box score, "have at it. lol..." :laugh:

Yes, the numbers lie, any records that he has achieved, are of no consequence. You make comments with nothing to back up your argument. Just that, “he’s overrated” no examples of how to support this or anything of substance. You just don’t like him, I get it.
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #37 on: January 23, 2021, 01:09:38 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Wasn't this thread about comparing Tatum to other players trying to determine which players will be better than him over the next 7-10 years.

I see, by some, Tatum being compared to players much older than him. How about remembering where some of these players were at 22 years old. Many weren't close to being as good as Tatum at the same age. Many weren't leading their teams to conference finals multiple times by the time they were Tatum's age. And Tatum's game is going to grow.

I can easily see Tatum growing into a top 3-5 player in this league....with Jaylen right behind him.

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #38 on: May 19, 2021, 10:15:57 AM »

Offline Goldstar88

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under 25 in the NBA? No one. I like Zion and Doncic, but Tatums scoring ability is on another level now. The fact that he’s an elite two way wing player, puts him ahead of those two, IMO.  He plays the most important position in basketball.
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #39 on: May 19, 2021, 10:25:39 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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Nick Wright says 11 clearly ahead. With Butler and 2 others also

Tatum in that 15 to 24 range

I would say probably around 15 is accurate

It can be argued between Tatum, Mitchell, Bam... its pretty close

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #40 on: May 19, 2021, 10:30:47 AM »

Offline Goldstar88

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Nick Wright says 11 clearly ahead. With Butler and 2 others also

Tatum in that 15 to 24 range

I would say probably around 15 is accurate

It can be argued between Tatum, Mitchell, Bam... its pretty close

Gotta read the original post. Taking Mitchell or Bam over Tatum is insane.
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #41 on: May 19, 2021, 10:45:50 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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Nick Wright says 11 clearly ahead. With Butler and 2 others also

Tatum in that 15 to 24 range

I would say probably around 15 is accurate

It can be argued between Tatum, Mitchell, Bam... its pretty close

Gotta read the original post. Taking Mitchell or Bam over Tatum is insane.

How is it insane?

Bam was the 2nd best player in the Celts Heat series. Top calibre defensive player

Mitchell is one of the best clutch/4th quarter players in the league

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #42 on: May 19, 2021, 10:52:50 AM »

Offline wiley

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Love Tatum!  In the Doncic part of the thread though people kind of discounted Doncic's passing.
being 500 in the West is not a bad feat with no real stars next to him...

Tatum must improve:

-finishing through contact (seeking contact)
-moving the ball (generally sound passing and distribution, though he's not bad, just not great yet)
-limit turnovers and going iso too much.

Then he'll turn into God. ;D

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #43 on: May 19, 2021, 11:00:34 AM »

Offline tonydelk

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This is tough but I believe next year we will see where Tatum's ceiling is.  Right now it's hard to fathom that he will get better but the crazy part is he absolutely will.  He's still going to get stronger.  He's still going to become a better passer.  He will improve his handles even more.  I think if Tatum takes another leap next year then he will be at the top of the list.  Man It's still hard to believe Ainge traded out of the #1 overall pick, grabbed Tatum at 3.  How was this guy not drafted at 1?

Re: Who better than Tatum?
« Reply #44 on: May 19, 2021, 11:06:25 AM »

Offline Goldstar88

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Nick Wright says 11 clearly ahead. With Butler and 2 others also

Tatum in that 15 to 24 range

I would say probably around 15 is accurate

It can be argued between Tatum, Mitchell, Bam... its pretty close

Gotta read the original post. Taking Mitchell or Bam over Tatum is insane.

How is it insane?

Bam was the 2nd best player in the Celts Heat series. Top calibre defensive player

Mitchell is one of the best clutch/4th quarter players in the league

Bam is still raw offensively and he doesn’t space the floor. Mitchell is an undersized SG at 6’1”. Tatum is a better two way player than both of those guys.
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.