Heat, Spurs and Celtics express significant interest in Vucevic

[hwangjini_1]

For Vucevic

Danny would have to include Smart, Timelord, Langford or Nesmith and multiple 1sts. Something that hurts like this

Just can't see Ainge doing this. Not for a 30 year old center that is an OK but not very good defender

Based upon what?

Simple math.

Would you take either semi, grant williams, edwards, green, langford or all of them for vuc? I wouldn't and no team would.

That’s fairly non-responsive.

Lol ok...

I laid the other alternative at our disposal as you said the other one was based on nothing. Obviously one of those guys would have to be involved as those others guys combined are worthless.

Oops, maybe not completely worthless I'm sure there's some team out there that might give up a late 2nd rnd pick for one or two of those guys.

Again, non-responsive.

Statement:  It would take Smart, Timelord, Nesmith or Romeo, and multiple first rounders

Question:  Based upon what?

Statement:  Orlando isn’t trade Vuc for our 10th - 15th best players

You believe that that is a responsive answer?

Just because you didn't like the answer doesn't mean it wasn't a response.

"non responsive" would've been no post.


Better question what do you consider a better deal than what triboy stated?

I would like to see an alternative proposal as well. Instead of criticizing my guess as to what it would take to make a competitive offer for Vucevic

You didn’t label it a guess. You said that is what it would take, based on... nothing?

Isn't any trade proposal on this forum, just a guess?

I would guess, the Celtics would offer Smart, Tristan Thompson, and Nesmith. It's virtually a push salary wise, which I think would be needed if the team is hard capped. Am I wrong in that line of thinking, or could the team offer slightly less in salary and increase their cap number?

Jesus Christ.  Declaring something as an absolute fact is not the same as venturing something as a guess, no.  And it’s not offensive if somebody asks you what your statement of fact is based upon.  I know that the hot take culture has sapped any ounce of nuance out of sports talk, but our membership can do a little better.

One of the purported goals of the Celtics the season is to stay below the luxury tax.  I think that we can take on around $14-$15 million and still stay below the tax.

well argued and well stated, roy. we can, and should, be better than so much of the trash, assertions, and yelling that parades itself as intelligent discussion online.

you now have one less negative tp roy. 

[Big333223]

It's all dependent on price but I think I'd rather try to pry Aaron Gordon away from Orlando.

For this Celtic team, I like the idea of a switchy defender who can score opportunistically but doesn't need the ball. He can play small-ball 5 but can also play next to Timelord (wouldn't that be fun?).

I like the Celtics' core. I'm not in favor of a huge overhaul but if the price can be picks and young players (maybe get another pick routing Thompson or Theis somewhere else?) Gordon is more my target. Although Vuc would be a definite upgrade.

[GreenEnvy]

I’ve been wanting Vuc for over 3 seasons now, and his price tag is only going up. The price may be very high now, but anything outside of Tatum, Brown, and Smart is one I might be willing to pay. Matching salaries would be tricky if attaching players instead of the TPE, but I’d give up a couple firsts for him no doubt.

[Moranis]

3 Team Trade

Boston - Vucevic, Collins
Orlando - Snell, Nesmith, G. Williams, BOS 21 1st
Atlanta - Smart, Theis, BOS 23 1st (top 5)

Seems like reasonable enough value for all 3 teams.

Post-Trade with 2 open roster spots
Starters - Walker, Brown, Tatum, Collins, Vucevic
Main Rotation - Pritchard, Teague, Langford, Ojeleye, R. Williams, Thompson
Suits - Edwards, Green, Waters, Fall

Now that strikes me as a team on the brink and with the right luck could make a run to the Finals.

[PhoSita]

I doubt Celtics are interested in Vuc.  He's great fit offensively, but poor fit defensively.

I'm even more skeptical that the Heat would have any interest.   Would they be moving Bam to power forward?  It makes little sense to me.

Probably coming from ORL or Vuc's agent to drum up interest.

Agreed.

Vuc only makes sense if you are in need of more offense from the 5 spot and were willing to expend more possessions to get it.  But we are getting overall decent production on modest utilization from our 3-headed Center rotation with arguably much better defense.

Vucevic would require more usage and be taking possessions out of the hands of our wings & guards.   That isn't necessarily going to be resulting in more total points.

What we need offensively is someone to fill in minutes at wings who has enough offensive gravity and capability to enhance the efficiency of our existing weapons without requiring a lot of possessions used.  Someone who can help create space by holding a defender on the perimeter.  Vucevic isn't going to help with that.

And defensively, we need someone who can switch and credibly defend on the perimeter.  We are 21st in opponent 3PT%.  Vucevic isn't going to help on that either.

I think Brad's offense works far better when there's a big at the center of it who can pass, shoot, and post up a bit.  Vooch would be a nice fit, at least on offense.

But I agree that the cost is probably not worth it since this Celtics team with Vucevic but minus Smart or Kemba is almost certainly not a significant threat to make the Finals.

[Phantom255x]

I wouldn't do an in-season move for him, nor do I think he gets moved at the deadline anyways

But in the offseason if we still have the TPE, he'd be one of my top targets. Some of it will also depend on how we do in the playoffs and how guys perform then.

[Big333223]

3 Team Trade

Boston - Vucevic, Collins
Orlando - Snell, Nesmith, G. Williams, BOS 21 1st
Atlanta - Smart, Theis, BOS 23 1st (top 5)

Seems like reasonable enough value for all 3 teams.

Orlando hangs up the phone.

[Moranis]

3 Team Trade

Boston - Vucevic, Collins
Orlando - Snell, Nesmith, G. Williams, BOS 21 1st
Atlanta - Smart, Theis, BOS 23 1st (top 5)

Seems like reasonable enough value for all 3 teams.

Orlando hangs up the phone.

Maybe.  They get a recent lottery pick, recent 1st rounder, and a pick in the next draft along with salary relief.  That seems like decent value for Vucevic who clearly is being shopped. 

[colincb]

Three tweets from Keith Smith @KeithSmithNBA

Not surprised at all
·

Here is the sense other teams are getting from the Orlando Magic:

Vucevic - Not really available. Would take a monster package.

Gordon - More available, but Orlando still wants a healthy return

Fournier - Available, won't take all that much due to expiring

Ross - See Gordon
·
The indication from Orlando is that they have no intention of blowing their team up. They see this season as a step back because of injuries. They plan to be right back in as a playoff team next season, thus won't deal away all of their vets. Teams will have to blow them away.

One other player who is starting to get traction from Orlando is Khem Birch. Teams like him as an affordable, acquirable backup big. Magic would like to continue to give backup C minutes to Mo Bamba behind Nikola Vucevic. Birch probably not in long-term plans and UFA this summer.

[tstorey_97]

Vuc isn't going to put this team over the top.

Walker
Smart
Brown
Tatum
Robert

This bunch with the bench the Celtics has right now has a shot.

Nets
76'ers 
Bux
Raps

Are all unproven in the playoffs. None of them are dominant. The Celtics will have to play two of them. I like their chances.

Not trading Robert for a player that isn't a top defender.

[gouki88]

3 Team Trade

Boston - Vucevic, Collins
Orlando - Snell, Nesmith, G. Williams, BOS 21 1st
Atlanta - Smart, Theis, BOS 23 1st (top 5)

Seems like reasonable enough value for all 3 teams.

Post-Trade with 2 open roster spots
Starters - Walker, Brown, Tatum, Collins, Vucevic
Main Rotation - Pritchard, Teague, Langford, Ojeleye, R. Williams, Thompson
Suits - Edwards, Green, Waters, Fall

Now that strikes me as a team on the brink and with the right luck could make a run to the Finals.

If I'm Orlando I need either Langford or another first to consider it. That being said, that would be an absolute home run

[colincb]

3 Team Trade

Boston - Vucevic, Collins
Orlando - Snell, Nesmith, G. Williams, BOS 21 1st
Atlanta - Smart, Theis, BOS 23 1st (top 5)

Seems like reasonable enough value for all 3 teams.

Orlando hangs up the phone.

Maybe.  They get a recent lottery pick, recent 1st rounder, and a pick in the next draft along with salary relief.  That seems like decent value for Vucevic who clearly is being shopped.

ORL gets three deep bench players whose combined minutes and combined PERs do not exceed those of a 2021 all-star with a decent contract on a non-taxpaying team.

ORL hangs up.

It's not clear that Vucevic is being shopped either.

[Moranis]

3 Team Trade

Boston - Vucevic, Collins
Orlando - Snell, Nesmith, G. Williams, BOS 21 1st
Atlanta - Smart, Theis, BOS 23 1st (top 5)

Seems like reasonable enough value for all 3 teams.

Orlando hangs up the phone.

Maybe.  They get a recent lottery pick, recent 1st rounder, and a pick in the next draft along with salary relief.  That seems like decent value for Vucevic who clearly is being shopped.

ORL gets three deep bench players whose combined minutes and combined PERs do not exceed those of a 2021 all-star with a decent contract on a non-taxpaying team.

ORL hangs up.

It's not clear that Vucevic is being shopped either.

Fair point on him not being shopped, but that is the epitome of a rebuilding trade.  You get an expiring contract, a rookie near lottery pick, a 2nd year player, and an unprotected draft pick.  It might take another young player like Langford or R. Williams, but I'm not sure the Magic are going to do much better than that for Vucevic because while he is a nice quality player, he doesn't move the needle much for winning and losing (and we know this because the Magic are a very bad team this year and have never been very good with Vucevic).  He is now in year 10 and 30, so is probably on the downside of his career as well. 

I think he would be a fine 3rd or 4th option type player, and those players don't get huge hauls in trades.  That all may very well be why Orlando doesn't trade him, but Vucevic most certainly isn't a #1 or #2 option on a contender.  I mean look at the true contenders, he is 4th on the Nets, probably 4th on the Bucks and Sixers, he'd be 3rd or 4th on the Lakers, 3rd on the Clippers, 3rd on the Nuggets, 3rd on the Jazz, etc.  Even going the next tier down, he is probably 4th on the C's, 3rd or 4th on the Heat, 3rd or 4th on a healthy Blazers, 3rd or 4th on the Suns, etc.  No one will sell the farm for a 3rd or 4th option.

[Irish Stew]

3 Team Trade

Boston - Vucevic, Collins
Orlando - Snell, Nesmith, G. Williams, BOS 21 1st
Atlanta - Smart, Theis, BOS 23 1st (top 5)

Seems like reasonable enough value for all 3 teams.

Post-Trade with 2 open roster spots
Starters - Walker, Brown, Tatum, Collins, Vucevic
Main Rotation - Pritchard, Teague, Langford, Ojeleye, R. Williams, Thompson
Suits - Edwards, Green, Waters, Fall

Now that strikes me as a team on the brink and with the right luck could make a run to the Finals.

If I'm Orlando I need either Langford or another first to consider it. That being said, that would be an absolute home run

Isn't that likely going to be over $140 million for just our five starters in 2021-2022?  Yikes! I'm not objecting but will ownership feel the same?

[Big333223]

3 Team Trade

Boston - Vucevic, Collins
Orlando - Snell, Nesmith, G. Williams, BOS 21 1st
Atlanta - Smart, Theis, BOS 23 1st (top 5)

Seems like reasonable enough value for all 3 teams.

Orlando hangs up the phone.

Maybe.  They get a recent lottery pick, recent 1st rounder, and a pick in the next draft along with salary relief.  That seems like decent value for Vucevic who clearly is being shopped.

ORL gets three deep bench players whose combined minutes and combined PERs do not exceed those of a 2021 all-star with a decent contract on a non-taxpaying team.

ORL hangs up.

It's not clear that Vucevic is being shopped either.

Fair point on him not being shopped, but that is the epitome of a rebuilding trade.  You get an expiring contract, a rookie near lottery pick, a 2nd year player, and an unprotected draft pick.  It might take another young player like Langford or R. Williams, but I'm not sure the Magic are going to do much better than that for Vucevic because while he is a nice quality player, he doesn't move the needle much for winning and losing (and we know this because the Magic are a very bad team this year and have never been very good with Vucevic).  He is now in year 10 and 30, so is probably on the downside of his career as well. 

I think he would be a fine 3rd or 4th option type player, and those players don't get huge hauls in trades.  That all may very well be why Orlando doesn't trade him, but Vucevic most certainly isn't a #1 or #2 option on a contender.  I mean look at the true contenders, he is 4th on the Nets, probably 4th on the Bucks and Sixers, he'd be 3rd or 4th on the Lakers, 3rd on the Clippers, 3rd on the Nuggets, 3rd on the Jazz, etc.  Even going the next tier down, he is probably 4th on the C's, 3rd or 4th on the Heat, 3rd or 4th on a healthy Blazers, 3rd or 4th on the Suns, etc.  No one will sell the farm for a 3rd or 4th option.

Vuc is a 2-time all star in his absolute prime. Your offer doesn't include a single NBA starter or lottery pick. There's just no way Orlando even entertains it.