Heat, Spurs and Celtics express significant interest in Vucevic

[Roy H.]

For Vucevic

Danny would have to include Smart, Timelord, Langford or Nesmith and multiple 1sts. Something that hurts like this

Just can't see Ainge doing this. Not for a 30 year old center that is an OK but not very good defender

Based upon what?

Simple math.

Would you take either semi, grant williams, edwards, green, langford or all of them for vuc? I wouldn't and no team would.

That’s fairly non-responsive.

Lol ok...

I laid the other alternative at our disposal as you said the other one was based on nothing. Obviously one of those guys would have to be involved as those others guys combined are worthless.

Oops, maybe not completely worthless I'm sure there's some team out there that might give up a late 2nd rnd pick for one or two of those guys.

Again, non-responsive.

Statement:  It would take Smart, Timelord, Nesmith or Romeo, and multiple first rounders

Question:  Based upon what?

Statement:  Orlando isn’t trade Vuc for our 10th - 15th best players

You believe that that is a responsive answer?

Just because you didn't like the answer doesn't mean it wasn't a response.

"non responsive" would've been no post.


Better question what do you consider a better deal than what triboy stated?

I would like to see an alternative proposal as well. Instead of criticizing my guess as to what it would take to make a competitive offer for Vucevic

You didn’t label it a guess. You said that is what it would take, based on... nothing?

[Tr1boy]

For Vucevic

Danny would have to include Smart, Timelord, Langford or Nesmith and multiple 1sts. Something that hurts like this

Just can't see Ainge doing this. Not for a 30 year old center that is an OK but not very good defender

Based upon what?

Simple math.

Would you take either semi, grant williams, edwards, green, langford or all of them for vuc? I wouldn't and no team would.

That’s fairly non-responsive.

Lol ok...

I laid the other alternative at our disposal as you said the other one was based on nothing. Obviously one of those guys would have to be involved as those others guys combined are worthless.

Oops, maybe not completely worthless I'm sure there's some team out there that might give up a late 2nd rnd pick for one or two of those guys.

Again, non-responsive.

Statement:  It would take Smart, Timelord, Nesmith or Romeo, and multiple first rounders

Question:  Based upon what?

Statement:  Orlando isn’t trade Vuc for our 10th - 15th best players

You believe that that is a responsive answer?

Just because you didn't like the answer doesn't mean it wasn't a response.

"non responsive" would've been no post.


Better question what do you consider a better deal than what triboy stated?

I would like to see an alternative proposal as well. Instead of criticizing my guess as to what it would take to make a competitive offer for Vucevic

You didn’t label it a guess. You said that is what it would take, based on... nothing?

Its an educated guess

You can agree or disagree on the proposal, not sure why you want to get ultra technical about it

Nobody in this forum has inside knowledge.  Unless Woj or Sham are members

[johnnygreen]

I doubt Celtics are interested in Vuc.  He's great fit offensively, but poor fit defensively.

I'm even more skeptical that the Heat would have any interest.   Would they be moving Bam to power forward?  It makes little sense to me.

Probably coming from ORL or Vuc's agent to drum up interest.

Agreed.

Vuc only makes sense if you are in need of more offense from the 5 spot and were willing to expend more possessions to get it.  But we are getting overall decent production on modest utilization from our 3-headed Center rotation with arguably much better defense.

Vucevic would require more usage and be taking possessions out of the hands of our wings & guards.   That isn't necessarily going to be resulting in more total points.

What we need offensively is someone to fill in minutes at wings who has enough offensive gravity and capability to enhance the efficiency of our existing weapons without requiring a lot of possessions used.  Someone who can help create space by holding a defender on the perimeter.  Vucevic isn't going to help with that.

And defensively, we need someone who can switch and credibly defend on the perimeter.  We are 21st in opponent 3PT%.  Vucevic isn't going to help on that either.

I would rather have a guy that can operate in the paint, and create easy points. An offensive player that can work in the paint, also helps accumulate fouls on the defense, and helps his team get to the free throw line too. Jump shooters simply don't do that. Maybe the team gets to the bonus a little earlier each quarter than they do now with Vucevic. Even if that means an extra 6 attempts per game, that is fairly significant. The Celtics 3 headed monster they have now, is serviceable, but can't be relied upon from game to game from a scoring perspective.

But they can't, collectively, get played off the floor from a defensive perspective.  Late in games when teams go small, Vucevic would become a liability against the better offenses that spread the floor and those that play heavy pick & roll, forcing him onto a small.

And it's not just about taking jump shots.  A major point of having the _threat_ of outside shooting is to open up _space_ for attacking inside.   

The Celtics actually don't take an excess of outside shots.  They are 20th in percentage of shots that are 3PT shots.   Conversely, they are tied for 3rd in percentage of shots that are between 3-10 ft.

So, the Celtics are going to let other teams dictate how they should play? If the other team plays small, then that would mean a player like Vucevic would be defended by a smaller player, which is a mismatch in his favor.

I agree with the premise that outside shooting helps create space inside. However, a legitimate inside presence can help create open outside looks. To take is even further, any swing of the ball, after going inside out, could help create wipe open looks.

I don't understand why the team and fanbase seemingly diminish the center position from an offensive perspective.

[johnnygreen]

For Vucevic

Danny would have to include Smart, Timelord, Langford or Nesmith and multiple 1sts. Something that hurts like this

Just can't see Ainge doing this. Not for a 30 year old center that is an OK but not very good defender

Based upon what?

Simple math.

Would you take either semi, grant williams, edwards, green, langford or all of them for vuc? I wouldn't and no team would.

That’s fairly non-responsive.

Lol ok...

I laid the other alternative at our disposal as you said the other one was based on nothing. Obviously one of those guys would have to be involved as those others guys combined are worthless.

Oops, maybe not completely worthless I'm sure there's some team out there that might give up a late 2nd rnd pick for one or two of those guys.

Again, non-responsive.

Statement:  It would take Smart, Timelord, Nesmith or Romeo, and multiple first rounders

Question:  Based upon what?

Statement:  Orlando isn’t trade Vuc for our 10th - 15th best players

You believe that that is a responsive answer?

Just because you didn't like the answer doesn't mean it wasn't a response.

"non responsive" would've been no post.


Better question what do you consider a better deal than what triboy stated?

I would like to see an alternative proposal as well. Instead of criticizing my guess as to what it would take to make a competitive offer for Vucevic

You didn’t label it a guess. You said that is what it would take, based on... nothing?

Isn't any trade proposal on this forum, just a guess?

I would guess, the Celtics would offer Smart, Tristan Thompson, and Nesmith. It's virtually a push salary wise, which I think would be needed if the team is hard capped. Am I wrong in that line of thinking, or could the team offer slightly less in salary and increase their cap number?

[Roy H.]

For Vucevic

Danny would have to include Smart, Timelord, Langford or Nesmith and multiple 1sts. Something that hurts like this

Just can't see Ainge doing this. Not for a 30 year old center that is an OK but not very good defender

Based upon what?

Simple math.

Would you take either semi, grant williams, edwards, green, langford or all of them for vuc? I wouldn't and no team would.

That’s fairly non-responsive.

Lol ok...

I laid the other alternative at our disposal as you said the other one was based on nothing. Obviously one of those guys would have to be involved as those others guys combined are worthless.

Oops, maybe not completely worthless I'm sure there's some team out there that might give up a late 2nd rnd pick for one or two of those guys.

Again, non-responsive.

Statement:  It would take Smart, Timelord, Nesmith or Romeo, and multiple first rounders

Question:  Based upon what?

Statement:  Orlando isn’t trade Vuc for our 10th - 15th best players

You believe that that is a responsive answer?

Just because you didn't like the answer doesn't mean it wasn't a response.

"non responsive" would've been no post.


Better question what do you consider a better deal than what triboy stated?

I would like to see an alternative proposal as well. Instead of criticizing my guess as to what it would take to make a competitive offer for Vucevic

You didn’t label it a guess. You said that is what it would take, based on... nothing?

Isn't any trade proposal on this forum, just a guess?

I would guess, the Celtics would offer Smart, Tristan Thompson, and Nesmith. It's virtually a push salary wise, which I think would be needed if the team is hard capped. Am I wrong in that line of thinking, or could the team offer slightly less in salary and increase their cap number?

Jesus Christ.  Declaring something as an absolute fact is not the same as venturing something as a guess, no.  And it’s not offensive if somebody asks you what your statement of fact is based upon.  I know that the hot take culture has sapped any ounce of nuance out of sports talk, but our membership can do a little better.

One of the purported goals of the Celtics the season is to stay below the luxury tax.  I think that we can take on around $14-$15 million and still stay below the tax.

[wiley]

For Vucevic

Danny would have to include Smart, Timelord, Langford or Nesmith and multiple 1sts. Something that hurts like this

Just can't see Ainge doing this. Not for a 30 year old center that is an OK but not very good defender

Smart, Timelord, Nesmith and multiple firsts is worth 2 Vuceviches in my opinion.  Not one.  Age is part of it, and the other part of is the high value of Smart and Robert Wlliams. 

Your offer seems better suited to something along the lines of Paul George when he was with Ok. City.

[perks-a-beast]

For Vucevic

Danny would have to include Smart, Timelord, Langford or Nesmith and multiple 1sts. Something that hurts like this

Just can't see Ainge doing this. Not for a 30 year old center that is an OK but not very good defender

Smart, Timelord, Nesmith and multiple firsts is worth 2 Vuceviches in my opinion.  Not one.  Age is part of it, and the other part of is the high value of Smart and Robert Wlliams. 

Your offer seems better suited to something along the lines of Paul George when he was with Ok. City.

I agree. I know as Celtics fans we tend to massively overrate how much our players are worth, but that's still way too much to give up for a 30 year old center whose known for his defensive shortcomings and hasn't won anything.

[SHAQATTACK]

For Vucevic

Danny would have to include Smart, Timelord, Langford or Nesmith and multiple 1sts. Something that hurts like this

Just can't see Ainge doing this. Not for a 30 year old center that is an OK but not very good defender

Smart, Timelord, Nesmith and multiple firsts is worth 2 Vuceviches in my opinion.  Not one.  Age is part of it, and the other part of is the high value of Smart and Robert Wlliams. 

Your offer seems better suited to something along the lines of Paul George when he was with Ok. City.

I agree. I know as Celtics fans we tend to massively overrate how much our players are worth, but that's still way too much to give up for a 30 year old center whose known for his defensive shortcomings and hasn't won anything.

my thoughts too   another guy on the backside of his career , how ever much is left ,  seems like a never ending cycle trying to squeeze out a couple more years before they fall to pieces .

I wouldn’t sink much into him without a solid plan as a contender under three years . 

[greg683x]

It’s hilarious to see a proposed trade that would bring an all star here that averages 20+ points, 11 boards, 4 assists and we are balking at the trade because we have to include Rob Williams who has really only stepped up his game a modest level over the last two weeks, our two previous first round picks, one who can’t play himself into the floor, the other, who just can’t play Bc he’s always injured. 

That leaves Marcus Smart, who I love and personally would prefer to keep on the team, but has been out injured for what? Almost 2 months now?? (If not it feels like it at least). And also, as much as we love Marcus, it’s common knowledge that we value him a lot more than the rest of the league does.

But this is all too much to give up?  Someone said we should get two centers that average 20/10/5 for this price?  Really?

If we want anything of value, we have to give up SOMETHING that’s of value to the rest of the league, not just us.  This is why teams don’t like negotiating trades with us anymore

[Birdman]

Who u rather have Robert Williams or Vucevic?? I take Vucevic anyday

[Roy H.]

Who u rather have Robert Williams or Vucevic?? I take Vucevic anyday

It gets harder if that price becomes Williams, Smart, one or two recent lottery picks, and multiple future #1s.

[Birdman]

Smart, Grant & Theis for V works in trade machine..go get Ellington or another vet somewhere

[johnnygreen]

How do we have all these untouchable players, yet are still 19-17? With all these untouchable players on the Celtics, you would think they'd be 36-0.

We are talking about a center, that is so skilled, he participated in the skills challenge at All-Star weekend. There have been constant complaints that the Celtics bench is the worst in the league. It seems the consensus in this thread is to trade some of those bench players for one of the elite centers in the league (and forgetting we need to match salaries). If Danny isn't willing to trade at least Smart, and one of Robert Williams, Langford, or Nesmith, and at least a first round pick, then why are we even discussing a trade possibility?

[Birdman]

I trade anyone not named Tatum or Brown for Vucevic..

[Moranis]

I just don't know what the Celts can really offer to beat what other teams are likely to offer.

Especially big problem that for cap reasons it will be difficult to trade for Vooch without including either Smart or Kemba, which would seriously undermine the benefit of such a trade.

He fits into the TPE so just need to find a team to take Thompson and you get below the hard cap.  Maybe you even get Orlando to take him.