Author Topic: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series  (Read 18738 times)

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Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #15 on: June 10, 2008, 07:46:15 PM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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Jeff Van Gundy ultimately backed off comments that a referee told him officials had targeted Yao Ming in the Houston Rockets' 2005 first-round playoff series against the Dallas Mavericks. Maybe Van Gundy was right after all.

A letter sent to the sentencing court on behalf of convicted former referee Tim Donaghy outlines just such a plan. ...

The letter alleging referees altered games mentions only the year 2005, but the circumstances make it apparent that it is referring to the Rockets-Mavs series.

"Team 3 lost the first two games in the series and Team 3's owner complained to NBA officials," the letter says. "Team 3's owner alleged that referees were letting a Team 4 player get away with illegal screens. NBA Executive Y told Referee Supervisor Z that the referees for that game were to enforce the screening rules strictly against that Team 4 player. Referee Supervisor Z informed the referees about his instructions. As an alternate referee for that game, Tim also received these instructions."

Mavs owner Mark Cuban complained after his team lost the first two games of the series, and Dallas went on to beat Houston in seven games. Van Gundy said that a working referee had told him about the league's plan. Donaghy's letter claims that Supervisor Z contacted the coach. Van Gundy was fined $100,000.

Looking at box scores from the series, however, the only game in which Yao fouled out was Game 1. He did average 4.4 fouls per game in the series.

Link.

I remember this when it came out a few years ago, and I heard it spun a bunch of different ways, but I see nothing wrong with this one.  Say Kobe palmed the ball on every single play, and Danny or Wyc called the league and complained, and after reviewing the games the Referee Supervisor thought that the refs weren't making the right calls and instructed the refs working the games that this is the NBA's view on palming, make sure you watch for this because we don't think it has been called the right way, especially in regards to Kobe.  I think this is absolutely the right thing to do, and that's how I believe the Houston/Dallas situation went down.  Mark Cuban said Yao was setting illegal screens, the NBA reviewed and agreed, so they instructed the refs to be on the lookout for illegal screens from Yao because the refs hadn't been calling it like they should have.  This does not come off as shady to me at all, only when some angry anti-NBA writer spins it that way does it sound bad.

The only issue I have there is the allegation that the league directed the officials to specifically tighten up the calls on Yao, rather than on illegal screens in general.  That doesn't mean that's how it went down, but it's what Donaghy alleges.

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Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #16 on: June 10, 2008, 08:07:11 PM »

Offline jchamorro

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Phil Jackson of all people had a great idea,  create a separate rereree organization outside of the NBA, away from Stern's hands.  Maybe the new commissioner will do this once a disgraced Stern resigns.

Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #17 on: June 10, 2008, 08:19:35 PM »

Offline wdleehi

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Bad for the NBA.


Good for the Celtics.


1) they are asking Phil Jackson about it.  Distraction


2) The NBA officials could very well overreact and allow for a game where players are allowed to play.  That helps the Celtics defense. 

Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #18 on: June 10, 2008, 08:22:09 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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I'm not claiming that any of what has been brought forth is true or not but it leaves a very bad taste in my mouth when I couple it all together with the way Stern handled the entire Donaghy situation when it arose.

He was very quiet at first and once he did start to react he seemed to do everything in his power to ensure that people believed that this was a solitary incident. When reporters questioned him regarding the possibility of needing to look into the entire officiating situation he seem put off by it. At least that is what I retained about the aftermath.

But I am a business owner. If it came to light that someone in my accounting area was doing illegal things and then accused others of doing the same, I would put business to a halt and call into question every employee and transaction that occured in that area. I would bring in a separate CPA with forensic experience to see if anything was arry.

I would never in my life go and make a public statement that it was an isolated incident, that the culprit was lying and that no further action was going to be taken.

Unless of course I had something to hide and didn't want other people to find out.

Donaghy's statements do seem to call into question quite a bit of strange happenings in the NBA since the decline of their television ratings and subjucation of the NBA to the third most popular sports league in America.

And the fact that the statements are being released during a time when the national media is calling into question the league's officiating and possible motives behind a poorly refereed game can not be just a coincidence. Someone knew sooner or later that a game might look awfully shady this postseason because of the obvious perks to the league to having Boston face LA in a seven game series.

Now this info is released at the perfect time to make it appear credible.

Big surprise.

Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #19 on: June 10, 2008, 08:33:11 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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Rasheed Wallace is right...the league is just like the WWF.

Maybe Im overreacting but does anyone else think this could eventually become basketball's version of steriods? The Tim Donaghy scandal is the Mitchell report of the NBA?

Im probably overreacting but I am totally and utterly disgusted right now. Sports captivate our (at least my) minds because it is simple, its cut and dry. Its beyond morality, neither good nor bad, but infallibly neutral. To quote athletes and coaches of today "It is what it is" in which one side faces off against another side in a contest of non-negotiable rules in as fair and equal an arena as possible. To wit, may the best man (or team) win.

From the time I was 5 years old I have been raised to beleive this, from my peewee football and T-ball games to college football and rugby, we know these things as players and fans: that nothing will sway the outcome of this game other than our own players and the players of the other team. We all understand the rules, and if by some circumstance we break them, its our fault and thus we should bear the consequences of penalty. Assessing and delivering these penalties is the referees responsibility, to preserve the neutrality of the game. Otherwise, the teams would just referee themselves. Without neutrality this is no longer sport, but merely a story, with a script, an illusion.

Im not sure what to say right now beyond that I hope by some grace its not true, but I almost certainly believe it is. More later when the picture becomes more clear.

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Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #20 on: June 10, 2008, 08:44:51 PM »

Offline cordobes

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Anyone with eyes knew that series was either fixed or the refs were affected by some kind of insanity during game 6. I still prefer to believe in the later. But Stern needs to take action.

Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #21 on: June 11, 2008, 12:55:05 PM »

Offline Finkelskyhook

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Donaghy's situation compares to Canseco's in a lot of ways.  Both come up with these allegations when they no longer could perform in their profession.   Both seem believable based on what even the casual fan can observe.  Canseco is nuts so it's harder to believe what he says.   

What is most striking to me is the suddenly strange number of traveling calls since these new revelations came up.   It's entertaining to watch the flabberghasted look on Kobe, Garnett, and Paul's faces when they get called.  Those 3 could get traveling called every time they handle the ball.  But they hardly ever do.  I can't imagine how the Messiah would respond if the rulebook actually applied to him. 

Stern couldn't be more in a no-win situation than he is now.  If the officials appear to be reacting by suddenly applying the rulebook to every player on the court the same way, Donaghy looks like he knows what he's talking about.  If things stay the same, the games look fixed (not necessarily the end result, but how the same rules are applied differently to different players)  Donaghy looks like he knows what he's talking about.  Either way, Stern looks like he's complicit in manipulating the way the games are officiated.  What Donaghy did is directly on Stern. 

I hate the thought of finding what a criminal Donaghy alleges to be believable.  But it's right in front of us. 


Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #22 on: June 11, 2008, 01:14:39 PM »

Offline ruben_wolkowyski

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Stern needs to take action.

That's a little like asking the Vatican to investigate the Church abuse scandals, don't you think? I.E., leaving the fox to guard the henhouse.

Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #23 on: June 11, 2008, 01:29:17 PM »

Offline BballTim

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Stern needs to take action.

That's a little like asking the Vatican to investigate the Church abuse scandals, don't you think? I.E., leaving the fox to guard the henhouse.

  Agreed. The refs are doing just what Stern wants them to. He's pretty much said so.

  As for last night's game, after everybody and their brother predicted that the Lakers would get a big advantage in calls, they did. And they weren't even subtle about it. There's not much plausible deniability for the league. Can they point to this series as proof that the reffing's on the up and up?

Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #24 on: June 11, 2008, 01:38:33 PM »

Offline Finkelskyhook

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Stern needs to take action.

That's a little like asking the Vatican to investigate the Church abuse scandals, don't you think? I.E., leaving the fox to guard the henhouse.

  Agreed. The refs are doing just what Stern wants them to. He's pretty much said so.

  As for last night's game, after everybody and their brother predicted that the Lakers would get a big advantage in calls, they did. And they weren't even subtle about it. There's not much plausible deniability for the league. Can they point to this series as proof that the reffing's on the up and up?

Nobody got calls last night.  Stars actually got called for traveling.
I saw no advantage for either team in calls last night.  The Lakers were agressive.  We weren't.  That's it.  There were missed calls on both sides.  But it was probably the most evenly officiated game in the series.  We're not going to get calls when we're settling for 18 footers and out.  One team played a lot harder than the other team.  The officials will not determine who wins this series.

Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #25 on: June 11, 2008, 01:46:31 PM »

Offline Kuberski33

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Stern needs to take action.

No, the owners need to take action -- because Stern works for them.  Whether they like it or not, there's a serious perception problem out there that they need to address.

I found Stern's smugness last night aggravating.

Someone needs to tell this idiot that his league has a significant problem on its hands.  Jose Canseco wasn't exactly the most trustworthy of sources, but lo and behold, he was right.

The 'where there's smoke, there's fire' thing applies here.

Prediction:
Some lawyer looking to give himself some national headlines files a class action lawsuit against the NBA over all this -- on behalf of Sacramento or Dallas fans.

Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #26 on: June 11, 2008, 01:47:21 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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Stern needs to take action.

That's a little like asking the Vatican to investigate the Church abuse scandals, don't you think? I.E., leaving the fox to guard the henhouse.

  Agreed. The refs are doing just what Stern wants them to. He's pretty much said so.

  As for last night's game, after everybody and their brother predicted that the Lakers would get a big advantage in calls, they did. And they weren't even subtle about it. There's not much plausible deniability for the league. Can they point to this series as proof that the reffing's on the up and up?

Nobody got calls last night.  Stars actually got called for traveling.
I saw no advantage for either team in calls last night.  The Lakers were agressive.  We weren't.  That's it.  There were missed calls on both sides.  But it was probably the most evenly officiated game in the series.  We're not going to get calls when we're settling for 18 footers and out.  One team played a lot harder than the other team.  The officials will not determine who wins this series.

I agree, last night's game was called evenly, we just blew it. The lakers went to the hoop a lot more than us. Time for us to man up, admit we played awful, and come back and whip them in game 4. This had nothing to do with the refs. They missed calls on both teams last night.

Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #27 on: June 11, 2008, 02:04:56 PM »

Offline Redz

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Anyone take notice of the offensive foul called on Odom with 6 seconds to go and the Lakers up 6?   The call had no bearing on the game...but...It negated a hoop in a potential "and-1" situation that could have given a push on a 9-point spread.

Just pointing it out ::)
Yup

Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #28 on: June 11, 2008, 02:08:11 PM »

Offline BballTim

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Stern needs to take action.

That's a little like asking the Vatican to investigate the Church abuse scandals, don't you think? I.E., leaving the fox to guard the henhouse.

  Agreed. The refs are doing just what Stern wants them to. He's pretty much said so.

  As for last night's game, after everybody and their brother predicted that the Lakers would get a big advantage in calls, they did. And they weren't even subtle about it. There's not much plausible deniability for the league. Can they point to this series as proof that the reffing's on the up and up?

Nobody got calls last night.  Stars actually got called for traveling.
I saw no advantage for either team in calls last night.  The Lakers were agressive.  We weren't.  That's it.  There were missed calls on both sides.  But it was probably the most evenly officiated game in the series.  We're not going to get calls when we're settling for 18 footers and out.  One team played a lot harder than the other team.  The officials will not determine who wins this series.

  Even the traveling calls went 5-1 in LA's favor.

  If you think that the FT differential, which at one time was about 20-2, was completely unrelated to anything that happened in game 2 or which team was playing at home, fine. If you think that it's a coincidence that everyone predicted a big FT advantage for the Lakers and they got one, fine. I won't argue with you. But I think you're in the minority. Not on these boards, but among fans in general. And in this situation, perception is everything.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2008, 02:14:42 PM by BballTim »

Re: Donaghy says the league fixed 2002 playoff series
« Reply #29 on: June 11, 2008, 02:27:24 PM »

Offline kenmaine

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Big C's fan here, but not always interested in other teams once the C's are out of the playoffs. But, for some reason I was watching that Lakers-Kings series and, even though I had no rooting or betting interest, it was shocking how blatantly the refs stole two games from the Kings.
And last night was just a 48 minute make-up call, IMO. Maybe Pierce and Garnett failed to show up because subconsciously they realized they weren't going to be allowed to win that game no matter what. Yes, I'm cynical. After all, there are some places in the world where even the presidency can be stolen, so why doubt that sporting events can be fixed?