Author Topic: With the 45th pick the C’s select..  (Read 19063 times)

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Re: With the 45th pick the C’s select..
« Reply #75 on: July 30, 2021, 01:32:21 PM »

Offline Rikibellevie

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When you see Maledon, an euroleague player and elite in youth french teams felt 34 and Madar was taken in the same range, it is funny that with this year supposed so loaded draft we took an unproven guy from PRO B a very poor league, with some clubs close from non pro organisation.

I get that the guy has some physical measurment that NBA like but he isn't at all a very big french talent. He comes from INSEP the national excellence formation, it is a good fondamental formation but offensively he is only a transition player. He shot 22 pct last year from FIBA 3. He is from Martinique like Gelabale or Beaubois but not at all the same potential offensively. I listened an interview he is a hard worker and will probably have a long career... But probably in Pro A or Europe mid pack teams. Not in NBA... or he has to cross big gaps... Wingspam isn't everything.

Thanks for the background.  I understand nothing about the different levels of these Euro leagues.  In Baseball, often players are drafted out of high school, but then play in the minor leagues for several years.  NBA used to draft out of high school but they had to go straight to the NBA.  One year of experience at a US College is still not that much to go on but it is a baseline that we all understand.  One year of French Pro B means nothing to me.  I guess it is something more than high school but something less than Division 1 College?

This is still a mid second round pick.  If the Celtics saw something there that they like, great.  A young man is going to develop a lot from age 18 to say 21.  He can stay in Europe or at some point come over as a G-League or 2-way player if he does continue to develop.  We are fans so we tend to get excited thinking this guy is going to be a steal.  The hidden gem we found in Europe.  Every once in a while, it turns out to be true.  There are steep odds to overcome for it to happen though.
 

Thank you. Pro B and pro A is a huge gap in France. Much more than in Spain, Italy or Russia just to quote some. Probably can t compare with high school given to age but the organisations and staff from most teams are barely pro. It is family teams with 1/3 M euro budget and 300 000 to 800 000 for salariés. Begarin came from one of the only pro A level teams but you can t conclue anything with his stats due to opposition.

Re: With the 45th pick the C’s select..
« Reply #76 on: July 30, 2021, 01:34:06 PM »

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When you see Maledon, an euroleague player and elite in youth french teams felt 34 and Madar was taken in the same range, it is funny that with this year supposed so loaded draft we took an unproven guy from PRO B a very poor league, with some clubs close from non pro organisation.

I get that the guy has some physical measurment that NBA like but he isn't at all a very big french talent. He comes from INSEP the national excellence formation, it is a good fondamental formation but offensively he is only a transition player. He shot 22 pct last year from FIBA 3. He is from Martinique like Gelabale or Beaubois but not at all the same potential offensively. I listened an interview he is a hard worker and will probably have a long career... But probably in Pro A or Europe mid pack teams. Not in NBA... or he has to cross big gaps... Wingspam isn't everything.

Thanks for the background.  I understand nothing about the different levels of these Euro leagues.  In Baseball, often players are drafted out of high school, but then play in the minor leagues for several years.  NBA used to draft out of high school but they had to go straight to the NBA.  One year of experience at a US College is still not that much to go on but it is a baseline that we all understand.  One year of French Pro B means nothing to me.  I guess it is something more than high school but something less than Division 1 College?

This is still a mid second round pick.  If the Celtics saw something there that they like, great.  A young man is going to develop a lot from age 18 to say 21.  He can stay in Europe or at some point come over as a G-League or 2-way player if he does continue to develop.  We are fans so we tend to get excited thinking this guy is going to be a steal.  The hidden gem we found in Europe.  Every once in a while, it turns out to be true.  There are steep odds to overcome for it to happen though.

And we get to hope for 3-4 years before giving up on him.

Re: With the 45th pick the C’s select..
« Reply #77 on: July 30, 2021, 02:20:47 PM »

Offline colincb

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His Paris team is being elevated to Pro A this year,

Re: With the 45th pick the C’s select..
« Reply #78 on: July 30, 2021, 02:47:49 PM »

Online Celtics2021

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His Paris team is being elevated to Pro A this year,

Yes.  Moving up a level is a reason to keep him over there.  The top French league will see him in an environment that's more difficult than college, at the same age as most freshmen prospects.  It should make his transition to the NBA easier, and also give the team a better feel for what level he should be at going forward.

Re: With the 45th pick the C’s select..
« Reply #79 on: July 30, 2021, 04:05:07 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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His Paris team is being elevated to Pro A this year,

Yes.  Moving up a level is a reason to keep him over there.  The top French league will see him in an environment that's more difficult than college, at the same age as most freshmen prospects.  It should make his transition to the NBA easier, and also give the team a better feel for what level he should be at going forward.

The European players I guess follow a different path or progression.  In the US, High School basketball is pretty structured for top players who often end up at private schools to play basketball, then there is the travel/AAU teams where they get more coaching and competition, then for the best, one or more years in college with top coaches and top competition.

For Juhann Begarin, I am guessing HS was not nearly as competitive so he goes to Pro B and then Pro A, then maybe G-League, then if all goes well, NBA.   Berarin is 18, turns 19 in August so I think he would be just finishing high school if he was in the US and heading to college.  He would be a fairly high recruit I would think.   So now, instead of a year of college after HS, he gets a year of Pro A in Europe after a year of Pro B.

I would guess that the HS-College path would result in more development as he would be a top player.  As a Pro B/Pro A, the teams are probably less concerned with his development but the competition is men, not boys.  I think it is great that he is going to get a year of Euro Pro A at age 19.  Let's see what he does with it.

I wonder why he declared this year and didn't wait a year.  He is not all that far off from the first round and maybe after a year in Pro A, he would have been in the first round, getting first round money.  At 19, he would still be plenty young for the draft.  Now there is no way he can get first round money.  Good for the Celtics though.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2021, 04:10:46 PM by Vermont Green »

Re: With the 45th pick the C’s select..
« Reply #80 on: July 30, 2021, 04:55:11 PM »

Offline CFAN38

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Begarin showed some flashes in the FIBA U18

15pts and 5stl vs turkey is pretty impressive

https://www.fiba.basketball/europe/u18/2019/game/0108/Turkey-France#|tab=boxscore
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Re: With the 45th pick the C’s select..
« Reply #81 on: July 30, 2021, 05:05:43 PM »

Online BitterJim

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His Paris team is being elevated to Pro A this year,

So basically the opposite of Yabu (iirc his team was relegated from the French A division shortly after we drafted him, which led to him being let out of his contract and signing in China)

Hopefully he has an opposite NBA career, too
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Re: With the 45th pick the C’s select..
« Reply #82 on: July 30, 2021, 05:08:43 PM »

Offline Rikibellevie

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His Paris team is being elevated to Pro A this year,

Yes.  Moving up a level is a reason to keep him over there.  The top French league will see him in an environment that's more difficult than college, at the same age as most freshmen prospects.  It should make his transition to the NBA easier, and also give the team a better feel for what level he should be at going

For Juhann Begarin, I am guessing HS was not nearly as competitive so he goes to Pro B and then Pro A, then maybe G-League, then if all goes well, NBA.   Berarin is 18, turns 19 in August so I think he would be just finishing high school if he was in the US and heading to college.  He would be a fairly high recruit I would think.   So now, instead of a year of college after HS, he gets a year of Pro A in Europe after a year of Pro B.

I would guess that the HS-College path would result in more development as he would be a top player.  As a Pro B/Pro A, the teams are probably less concerned with his development but the competition is men, not boys.  I think it is great that he is going to get a year of Euro Pro A at age 19.  Let's see what he does with it.


INSEP from where Parker and Diaw were formed is playing in N1 / 3rd division. So from 15 to 17 he played ag adults, some american BB travellers... Other players come from PRO team youth teams. Gobert in Cholet, Fournier in Nanterre and Poitiers, Maledon from ASVEL or NTilikina from my club and city of Strasbourg.

I also think that waiting a year could also make him undrafted. If he stays in Paris he will probably be a role player.

Re: With the 45th pick the C’s select..
« Reply #83 on: July 30, 2021, 05:08:52 PM »

Online Celtics2021

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His Paris team is being elevated to Pro A this year,

So basically the opposite of Yabu (iirc his team was relegated from the French A division shortly after we drafted him, which led to him being let out of his contract and signing in China)

Hopefully he has an opposite NBA career, too

Pretty much.  Hopefully the opposite of Yabu in every way for us.

Re: With the 45th pick the C’s select..
« Reply #84 on: July 30, 2021, 05:19:59 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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I did mind the pick, he is tall for a guard, I liked his speed and athletic ability.   He is not who I was pulling for but he has a load of potential and skills are easier to develop than natural talent which he has some folks.

He was blowing by guys in the tape I saw and seems to want to be in the NBA and play well.  That is encouraging.

I don't think he was first option, BS said they tried to move up some, but could not pull a deal.