Report: Hayward favouritism caused issues

[Never Nervous Pervis]

I also think it grew due to some delusions of grandeur from some of our guys, chiefly Rozier

I don't think it was even just Rozier, honestly. I could see Brown having issues - especially as Brad's had a short hook with him when he made mistakes. Same with Tatum. They're not entirely justified, but you can see how Gordon may have been viewed as the coach's pet.

Yeah, this is where I was going with the post I just made! Too many players thought they were due more than they were given

I think it was compounded by Brad's "hands off" coaching. There were reports right after the season ended that Brad generally let players police themselves and he tried to step in too late. This was the season where Brad really needed to adjust his coaching style to manage personalities and expectations in a way he hasn't before. He failed at it.

This is interesting to me. Usually college coaches enter the NBA and try to bring that same control and discipline over every little detail, and it alienates modern players. Brad did the opposite; he treated guys like professionals and it's not only been successful, it was universally praised across the league by coaches, executives and players alike. He was the boy genius. Now he's being criticized for not being more of a general.

I'm not saying you're wrong; it's just interesting.

But that's my point. You can't just assume what worked with one mix of players is going to work with a different mix of players. Some lockerrooms can police themselves while others can't. It's up to the coach - especially one dubbed boy genius - to understand and manage his team.

So you think Pop changes his coaching philosophy and manages his team differently each year depending on the vibe of the locker room? Did he fail managing Kawhi ⁠— since he's, you know, been dubbed best coach in the game?

[gouki88]

I also think it grew due to some delusions of grandeur from some of our guys, chiefly Rozier

I don't think it was even just Rozier, honestly. I could see Brown having issues - especially as Brad's had a short hook with him when he made mistakes. Same with Tatum. They're not entirely justified, but you can see how Gordon may have been viewed as the coach's pet.

Yeah, this is where I was going with the post I just made! Too many players thought they were due more than they were given

I think it was compounded by Brad's "hands off" coaching. There were reports right after the season ended that Brad generally let players police themselves and he tried to step in too late. This was the season where Brad really needed to adjust his coaching style to manage personalities and expectations in a way he hasn't before. He failed at it.

This is interesting to me. Usually college coaches enter the NBA and try to bring that same control and discipline over every little detail, and it alienates modern players. Brad did the opposite; he treated guys like professionals and it's not only been successful, it was universally praised across the league by coaches, executives and players alike. He was the boy genius. Now he's being criticized for not being more of a general.

I'm not saying you're wrong; it's just interesting.

But that's my point. You can't just assume what worked with one mix of players is going to work with a different mix of players. Some lockerrooms can police themselves while others can't. It's up to the coach - especially one dubbed boy genius - to understand and manage his team.

So you think Pop changes his coaching philosophy and manages his team differently each year depending on the vibe of the locker room? Did he fail managing Kawhi ⁠— since he's, you know, been dubbed best coach in the game?

Pop absolutely failed. From not reigning in Parker to seemingly not trusting Kawhi's judgement, he failed miserably.
However Pop has brought a handful of rings and 2 decades of success to that team, and his 2017-2018 period from a personal standpoint was tragic.

[Never Nervous Pervis]

I also think it grew due to some delusions of grandeur from some of our guys, chiefly Rozier

I don't think it was even just Rozier, honestly. I could see Brown having issues - especially as Brad's had a short hook with him when he made mistakes. Same with Tatum. They're not entirely justified, but you can see how Gordon may have been viewed as the coach's pet.

Yeah, this is where I was going with the post I just made! Too many players thought they were due more than they were given

I think it was compounded by Brad's "hands off" coaching. There were reports right after the season ended that Brad generally let players police themselves and he tried to step in too late. This was the season where Brad really needed to adjust his coaching style to manage personalities and expectations in a way he hasn't before. He failed at it.

This is interesting to me. Usually college coaches enter the NBA and try to bring that same control and discipline over every little detail, and it alienates modern players. Brad did the opposite; he treated guys like professionals and it's not only been successful, it was universally praised across the league by coaches, executives and players alike. He was the boy genius. Now he's being criticized for not being more of a general.

I'm not saying you're wrong; it's just interesting.

But that's my point. You can't just assume what worked with one mix of players is going to work with a different mix of players. Some lockerrooms can police themselves while others can't. It's up to the coach - especially one dubbed boy genius - to understand and manage his team.

So you think Pop changes his coaching philosophy and manages his team differently each year depending on the vibe of the locker room? Did he fail managing Kawhi ⁠— since he's, you know, been dubbed best coach in the game?

Pop absolutely failed. From not reigning in Parker to seemingly not trusting Kawhi's judgement, he failed miserably.
However Pop has brought a handful of rings and 2 decades of success to that team, and his 2017-2018 period from a personal standpoint was tragic.

You certainly have strong opinions for someone who has no idea what happened in the Spurs locker room.

[RJ87]

I also think it grew due to some delusions of grandeur from some of our guys, chiefly Rozier

I don't think it was even just Rozier, honestly. I could see Brown having issues - especially as Brad's had a short hook with him when he made mistakes. Same with Tatum. They're not entirely justified, but you can see how Gordon may have been viewed as the coach's pet.

Yeah, this is where I was going with the post I just made! Too many players thought they were due more than they were given

I think it was compounded by Brad's "hands off" coaching. There were reports right after the season ended that Brad generally let players police themselves and he tried to step in too late. This was the season where Brad really needed to adjust his coaching style to manage personalities and expectations in a way he hasn't before. He failed at it.

This is interesting to me. Usually college coaches enter the NBA and try to bring that same control and discipline over every little detail, and it alienates modern players. Brad did the opposite; he treated guys like professionals and it's not only been successful, it was universally praised across the league by coaches, executives and players alike. He was the boy genius. Now he's being criticized for not being more of a general.

I'm not saying you're wrong; it's just interesting.

But that's my point. You can't just assume what worked with one mix of players is going to work with a different mix of players. Some lockerrooms can police themselves while others can't. It's up to the coach - especially one dubbed boy genius - to understand and manage his team.

So you think Pop changes his coaching philosophy and manages his team differently each year depending on the vibe of the locker room? Did he fail managing Kawhi ⁠— since he's, you know, been dubbed best coach in the game?

Pop absolutely failed. From not reigning in Parker to seemingly not trusting Kawhi's judgement, he failed miserably.
However Pop has brought a handful of rings and 2 decades of success to that team, and his 2017-2018 period from a personal standpoint was tragic.

You certainly have strong opinions for someone who has no idea what happened in the Spurs locker room.

Lol you asked. Don't get snippy because people disagree.

And I agree. Pop failed. Kawhi is left, didn't he?

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

As ESPN.com's Jackie MacMullan explained Tuesday on Arbella Early Edition, the coaching staff created problems by pushing the former All-Star.

"You hate to pick on Gordon Hayward because he was coming back from injury and he was doing the best he could, but I really think that's where it started," MacMullan said (h/t Michael Deprisco of NBC Sports). "They were force-feeding him on his teammates. Brad [Stevens] knew Gordon well. He wanted to get his confidence back." ....

"He gave the benefit of the doubt over and over to a player that wasn't ready, to a guy who had history with him, and it rankled that locker room, and it bothered that locker room," MacMullan said.

Then the problems didn't start with Kyrie, they started with Brad.

[RPGenerate]

As ESPN.com's Jackie MacMullan explained Tuesday on Arbella Early Edition, the coaching staff created problems by pushing the former All-Star.

"You hate to pick on Gordon Hayward because he was coming back from injury and he was doing the best he could, but I really think that's where it started," MacMullan said (h/t Michael Deprisco of NBC Sports). "They were force-feeding him on his teammates. Brad [Stevens] knew Gordon well. He wanted to get his confidence back." ....

"He gave the benefit of the doubt over and over to a player that wasn't ready, to a guy who had history with him, and it rankled that locker room, and it bothered that locker room," MacMullan said.

Then the problems didn't start with Kyrie, they started with Brad.

They started when Hayward's ankle snapped in half.

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

As ESPN.com's Jackie MacMullan explained Tuesday on Arbella Early Edition, the coaching staff created problems by pushing the former All-Star.

"You hate to pick on Gordon Hayward because he was coming back from injury and he was doing the best he could, but I really think that's where it started," MacMullan said (h/t Michael Deprisco of NBC Sports). "They were force-feeding him on his teammates. Brad [Stevens] knew Gordon well. He wanted to get his confidence back." ....

"He gave the benefit of the doubt over and over to a player that wasn't ready, to a guy who had history with him, and it rankled that locker room, and it bothered that locker room," MacMullan said.

Then the problems didn't start with Kyrie, they started with Brad.

They started when Hayward's ankle snapped in half.

Ha! Yeah, too true. And that was really LeBron and Crowder's fault, so there's another reason to dislike LeBron.

[gouki88]

I also think it grew due to some delusions of grandeur from some of our guys, chiefly Rozier

I don't think it was even just Rozier, honestly. I could see Brown having issues - especially as Brad's had a short hook with him when he made mistakes. Same with Tatum. They're not entirely justified, but you can see how Gordon may have been viewed as the coach's pet.

Yeah, this is where I was going with the post I just made! Too many players thought they were due more than they were given

I think it was compounded by Brad's "hands off" coaching. There were reports right after the season ended that Brad generally let players police themselves and he tried to step in too late. This was the season where Brad really needed to adjust his coaching style to manage personalities and expectations in a way he hasn't before. He failed at it.

This is interesting to me. Usually college coaches enter the NBA and try to bring that same control and discipline over every little detail, and it alienates modern players. Brad did the opposite; he treated guys like professionals and it's not only been successful, it was universally praised across the league by coaches, executives and players alike. He was the boy genius. Now he's being criticized for not being more of a general.

I'm not saying you're wrong; it's just interesting.

But that's my point. You can't just assume what worked with one mix of players is going to work with a different mix of players. Some lockerrooms can police themselves while others can't. It's up to the coach - especially one dubbed boy genius - to understand and manage his team.

So you think Pop changes his coaching philosophy and manages his team differently each year depending on the vibe of the locker room? Did he fail managing Kawhi ⁠— since he's, you know, been dubbed best coach in the game?

Pop absolutely failed. From not reigning in Parker to seemingly not trusting Kawhi's judgement, he failed miserably.
However Pop has brought a handful of rings and 2 decades of success to that team, and his 2017-2018 period from a personal standpoint was tragic.

You certainly have strong opinions for someone who has no idea what happened in the Spurs locker room.

Rofl. Asks a question, and gets mad when someone has an opinion that differs from theirs. Nice.

Pop obviously failed

[BudweiserCeltic]

Report: Players who think too highly of themselves couldn't handle a better player getting minutes, which caused issues.

I gather that's the gist of it all.

[Never Nervous Pervis]

I also think it grew due to some delusions of grandeur from some of our guys, chiefly Rozier

I don't think it was even just Rozier, honestly. I could see Brown having issues - especially as Brad's had a short hook with him when he made mistakes. Same with Tatum. They're not entirely justified, but you can see how Gordon may have been viewed as the coach's pet.

Yeah, this is where I was going with the post I just made! Too many players thought they were due more than they were given

I think it was compounded by Brad's "hands off" coaching. There were reports right after the season ended that Brad generally let players police themselves and he tried to step in too late. This was the season where Brad really needed to adjust his coaching style to manage personalities and expectations in a way he hasn't before. He failed at it.

This is interesting to me. Usually college coaches enter the NBA and try to bring that same control and discipline over every little detail, and it alienates modern players. Brad did the opposite; he treated guys like professionals and it's not only been successful, it was universally praised across the league by coaches, executives and players alike. He was the boy genius. Now he's being criticized for not being more of a general.

I'm not saying you're wrong; it's just interesting.

But that's my point. You can't just assume what worked with one mix of players is going to work with a different mix of players. Some lockerrooms can police themselves while others can't. It's up to the coach - especially one dubbed boy genius - to understand and manage his team.

So you think Pop changes his coaching philosophy and manages his team differently each year depending on the vibe of the locker room? Did he fail managing Kawhi ⁠— since he's, you know, been dubbed best coach in the game?

Pop absolutely failed. From not reigning in Parker to seemingly not trusting Kawhi's judgement, he failed miserably.
However Pop has brought a handful of rings and 2 decades of success to that team, and his 2017-2018 period from a personal standpoint was tragic.

You certainly have strong opinions for someone who has no idea what happened in the Spurs locker room.

Lol you asked. Don't get snippy because people disagree.

And I agree. Pop failed. Kawhi is left, didn't he?

Kawhi can be a great player and also someone who was in the wrong for quitting on the Spurs last year (not saying that was the case; it's one possible narrative, though). That doesn't mean Pop "failed miserably."

And please don't tell me what to do.

[Never Nervous Pervis]

I also think it grew due to some delusions of grandeur from some of our guys, chiefly Rozier

I don't think it was even just Rozier, honestly. I could see Brown having issues - especially as Brad's had a short hook with him when he made mistakes. Same with Tatum. They're not entirely justified, but you can see how Gordon may have been viewed as the coach's pet.

Yeah, this is where I was going with the post I just made! Too many players thought they were due more than they were given

I think it was compounded by Brad's "hands off" coaching. There were reports right after the season ended that Brad generally let players police themselves and he tried to step in too late. This was the season where Brad really needed to adjust his coaching style to manage personalities and expectations in a way he hasn't before. He failed at it.

This is interesting to me. Usually college coaches enter the NBA and try to bring that same control and discipline over every little detail, and it alienates modern players. Brad did the opposite; he treated guys like professionals and it's not only been successful, it was universally praised across the league by coaches, executives and players alike. He was the boy genius. Now he's being criticized for not being more of a general.

I'm not saying you're wrong; it's just interesting.

But that's my point. You can't just assume what worked with one mix of players is going to work with a different mix of players. Some lockerrooms can police themselves while others can't. It's up to the coach - especially one dubbed boy genius - to understand and manage his team.

So you think Pop changes his coaching philosophy and manages his team differently each year depending on the vibe of the locker room? Did he fail managing Kawhi ⁠— since he's, you know, been dubbed best coach in the game?

Pop absolutely failed. From not reigning in Parker to seemingly not trusting Kawhi's judgement, he failed miserably.
However Pop has brought a handful of rings and 2 decades of success to that team, and his 2017-2018 period from a personal standpoint was tragic.

You certainly have strong opinions for someone who has no idea what happened in the Spurs locker room.

Rofl. Asks a question, and gets mad when someone has an opinion that differs from theirs. Nice.

Pop obviously failed

I didn't get mad. I just think your hyperbole is silly and misguided.

[SparzWizard]

Report: Players who think too highly of themselves couldn't handle a better player getting minutes, which caused issues.

I gather that's the gist of it all.

Making it to Game 7 of the Eastern Conference Finals (in the weak East at the time, mind you) can do that to ya.

[gouki88]

I also think it grew due to some delusions of grandeur from some of our guys, chiefly Rozier

I don't think it was even just Rozier, honestly. I could see Brown having issues - especially as Brad's had a short hook with him when he made mistakes. Same with Tatum. They're not entirely justified, but you can see how Gordon may have been viewed as the coach's pet.

Yeah, this is where I was going with the post I just made! Too many players thought they were due more than they were given

I think it was compounded by Brad's "hands off" coaching. There were reports right after the season ended that Brad generally let players police themselves and he tried to step in too late. This was the season where Brad really needed to adjust his coaching style to manage personalities and expectations in a way he hasn't before. He failed at it.

This is interesting to me. Usually college coaches enter the NBA and try to bring that same control and discipline over every little detail, and it alienates modern players. Brad did the opposite; he treated guys like professionals and it's not only been successful, it was universally praised across the league by coaches, executives and players alike. He was the boy genius. Now he's being criticized for not being more of a general.

I'm not saying you're wrong; it's just interesting.

But that's my point. You can't just assume what worked with one mix of players is going to work with a different mix of players. Some lockerrooms can police themselves while others can't. It's up to the coach - especially one dubbed boy genius - to understand and manage his team.

So you think Pop changes his coaching philosophy and manages his team differently each year depending on the vibe of the locker room? Did he fail managing Kawhi ⁠— since he's, you know, been dubbed best coach in the game?

Pop absolutely failed. From not reigning in Parker to seemingly not trusting Kawhi's judgement, he failed miserably.
However Pop has brought a handful of rings and 2 decades of success to that team, and his 2017-2018 period from a personal standpoint was tragic.

You certainly have strong opinions for someone who has no idea what happened in the Spurs locker room.

Rofl. Asks a question, and gets mad when someone has an opinion that differs from theirs. Nice.

Pop obviously failed

I didn't get mad. I just think your hyperbole is silly and misguided.

What hyperbole? Popovich should have stopped Tony Parker from publicly trashing Kawhi and saying that he'd endured a worse injury, but he just let it happen. Pop should have encouraged Kawhi to do what he wanted in terms of his injury, but he didn't, and it came off that the Spurs didn't care about his well-being.

This isn't hyperbole, this is publicly available knowledge.

[Never Nervous Pervis]

I also think it grew due to some delusions of grandeur from some of our guys, chiefly Rozier

I don't think it was even just Rozier, honestly. I could see Brown having issues - especially as Brad's had a short hook with him when he made mistakes. Same with Tatum. They're not entirely justified, but you can see how Gordon may have been viewed as the coach's pet.

Yeah, this is where I was going with the post I just made! Too many players thought they were due more than they were given

I think it was compounded by Brad's "hands off" coaching. There were reports right after the season ended that Brad generally let players police themselves and he tried to step in too late. This was the season where Brad really needed to adjust his coaching style to manage personalities and expectations in a way he hasn't before. He failed at it.

This is interesting to me. Usually college coaches enter the NBA and try to bring that same control and discipline over every little detail, and it alienates modern players. Brad did the opposite; he treated guys like professionals and it's not only been successful, it was universally praised across the league by coaches, executives and players alike. He was the boy genius. Now he's being criticized for not being more of a general.

I'm not saying you're wrong; it's just interesting.

But that's my point. You can't just assume what worked with one mix of players is going to work with a different mix of players. Some lockerrooms can police themselves while others can't. It's up to the coach - especially one dubbed boy genius - to understand and manage his team.

So you think Pop changes his coaching philosophy and manages his team differently each year depending on the vibe of the locker room? Did he fail managing Kawhi ⁠— since he's, you know, been dubbed best coach in the game?

Pop absolutely failed. From not reigning in Parker to seemingly not trusting Kawhi's judgement, he failed miserably.
However Pop has brought a handful of rings and 2 decades of success to that team, and his 2017-2018 period from a personal standpoint was tragic.

You certainly have strong opinions for someone who has no idea what happened in the Spurs locker room.

Rofl. Asks a question, and gets mad when someone has an opinion that differs from theirs. Nice.

Pop obviously failed

I didn't get mad. I just think your hyperbole is silly and misguided.

What hyperbole? Popovich should have stopped Tony Parker from publicly trashing Kawhi and saying that he'd endured a worse injury, but he just let it happen. Pop should have encouraged Kawhi to do what he wanted in terms of his injury, but he didn't, and it came off that the Spurs didn't care about his well-being.

This isn't hyperbole, this is publicly available knowledge.

It's hyperbolic to say the most respected coach in the game, known for getting along well with mercurial players, who's won multiple championship rings, "failed miserably" in dealing with Kawhi's situation. You don't know the true severity of the injury, and you don't know the chronology of how the relationship deteriorated or who was truly in the wrong. Maybe both sides had valid reasons for doing what they did, maybe both were stubborn, maybe there were no easy answers and once Kawhi felt wronged, real or imagined, there was no chance at reconciliation no matter who the coach was?

Maybe he had an agent or an uncle or some friends in his ear, giving him bad advice? Maybe he just wanted to play in LA?

I don't know what happened inside that player's only meeting. Tony Parker wasn't the only one who was vocal and questioned Kawhi's desire to play. How would you feel if Kyrie left the team to rehab on his own and his teammates questioned his loyalty?

It's not publicly available knowledge that Pop failed miserably. This is a hot take gone sideways.

[keevsnick]

This is silly. Trying to get an all star player back in form is not favoritism, it's common sense.

This.  If these players couldn’t understand the reason for the strategy, then we had a stupid team.

It was a stupid strategy. Gordons issues early on were obviously still partly physical, he looked like he was moving through mud. He got minutes he didn't deserve  and that understandably caused issues. Stevens very easily could have given him 15 minutes a night, or started him off the bench, and that would have gone just as far towards building him back up. But he let his personal attachment to the player override his better judgement. And it didn't even work in the end.

Bottom line is this, I keep seeing people say that Brad did the right thing trying to get Gordon back in shape. But it's not entirely obvious he did. I think he could have taken a much more gradual approach to bringing Gordon back, one that didn't involve starting Gordon right off the bat, upsetting the team, and causing the Celtics to start flat. Lets not forget that starting Gordon had negative on court effects as well, it immediately put us in a standings whole we never recovered from.