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A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« on: January 16, 2019, 09:02:31 PM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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 Out Semi, Rozier, Morris, Bird for Salary matching.

 In The Big Slow skilled Guy. Vucevic. 20 PPG 12 RPG.

Vuvecic
Horford
Tatum
Smart
Irving

 Brown,  Hayward, Baynes, Yabu, Williams, Theis,
Wanamaker


 For Orlando if they can resign Rozier and Morris it's a win. if they can't resign those guys at least they have the rights to 🐦

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2019, 09:04:56 PM »

Offline gouki88

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Only problem is that Rozier, Morris and Semi make them a more balanced, and in turn might help them win. Not sure how much they want that
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2019, 09:18:58 PM »

Offline Jvalin

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Only problem is that Rozier, Morris and Semi make them a more balanced, and in turn might help them win. Not sure how much they want that
Another problem is that the Magic would have to cut 3 players from their current roster to make this deal work (or 2 assuming we take back Briscoe as well). Not saying it would be a dealbreaker, it's just that it wouldn't be an ideal situation from their point of view.

edit: I guess they could cut 2 out of Khem Birch, Jarell Martin and Jerian Grant. They are on team-friendly contracts that are about to expire in a few months time.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2019, 09:39:32 PM by Jvalin »

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2019, 09:28:26 PM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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Only problem is that Rozier, Morris and Semi make them a more balanced, and in turn might help them win. Not sure how much they want that



 Vucevic, Tatum, Irving gives you a Guard, Wing, and a big that are the 3 leading scoring options.

 Smart and Horford are just perfect role players to play with the 3 ball dominate scorers.

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2019, 09:40:59 PM »

Offline rondofan1255

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Nice idea

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2019, 09:43:28 PM »

Offline gouki88

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Only problem is that Rozier, Morris and Semi make them a more balanced, and in turn might help them win. Not sure how much they want that



 Vucevic, Tatum, Irving gives you a Guard, Wing, and a big that are the 3 leading scoring options.

 Smart and Horford are just perfect role players to play with the 3 ball dominate scorers.
Don’t get me wrong, I like the deal for us. I’m a big Vucevic fan. Just think the Magic would need some convincing
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2019, 09:48:26 PM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2019, 09:48:56 PM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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Only problem is that Rozier, Morris and Semi make them a more balanced, and in turn might help them win. Not sure how much they want that



 Vucevic, Tatum, Irving gives you a Guard, Wing, and a big that are the 3 leading scoring options.

 Smart and Horford are just perfect role players to play with the 3 ball dominate scorers.
Don’t get me wrong, I like the deal for us. I’m a big Vucevic fan. Just think the Magic would need some convincing


 Like what? Celtics 2019 first?

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #8 on: January 16, 2019, 09:54:48 PM »

Offline gouki88

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Only problem is that Rozier, Morris and Semi make them a more balanced, and in turn might help them win. Not sure how much they want that



 Vucevic, Tatum, Irving gives you a Guard, Wing, and a big that are the 3 leading scoring options.

 Smart and Horford are just perfect role players to play with the 3 ball dominate scorers.
Don’t get me wrong, I like the deal for us. I’m a big Vucevic fan. Just think the Magic would need some convincing


 Like what? Celtics 2019 first?
I dunno, but as another poster said, the Magic would have to cut a few guys for this to work
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2019, 10:49:35 PM »

Offline Jvalin

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Don't think the Magic would do this, but that's not the point.

To all you guys wanting us to go after Vucevic: What happens with Vuc in the off-season? Do we pay him north of 20 million a year or do we let him walk? Cause if we pay him, the luxury tax is gonna explode through the roof (assuming Kyrie re-signs and Horford opts in).
« Last Edit: January 16, 2019, 11:22:08 PM by Jvalin »

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2019, 12:14:59 AM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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Don't think the Magic would do this, but that's not the point.

To all you guys wanting us to go after Vucevic: What happens with Vuc in the off-season? Do we pay him north of 20 million a year or do we let him walk? Cause if we pay him, the luxury tax is gonna explode through the roof (assuming Kyrie re-signs and Horford opts in).


 It's a half season and a playoff run audition, if the Celtics play great. Than yes pay the taxes and pay the man.

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2019, 01:32:29 AM »

Offline Jvalin

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Don't think the Magic would do this, but that's not the point.

To all you guys wanting us to go after Vucevic: What happens with Vuc in the off-season? Do we pay him north of 20 million a year or do we let him walk? Cause if we pay him, the luxury tax is gonna explode through the roof (assuming Kyrie re-signs and Horford opts in).


 It's a half season and a playoff run audition, if the Celtics play great. Than yes pay the taxes and pay the man.
Let's assume that
--> Semi + Rozier + Morris + Bird are all traded to Orlando
--> Vucevic's next contract starts at 25 million on year 1
--> Kyrie opts out and re-signs with the C's for the max
--> Horford, Baynes opt in
--> all the picks end up at where they are right now
   - Grizlies at #7 (top 8 protected)
   - Kings at #13
   - Clips at #19
   - Celtics at #23
--> the C's don't use the MLE
--> they fill up the remaining roster spots with vet minimum guys


Here's our payroll for 2019-20

1. Hayward $32,700,690
2. Kyrie $32,700,000 (cap projected to be $109 million, 8-year veteran --> 30% of the cap)
3. Horford $30,123,014
4. Vucevic $25,000,000
5. Smart $ 12,553,471
6. Tatum $ 7,830,000
7. Brown $ 6,534,829
8. Baynes $ 5,453,280
9. Yabu $ 3,117,240
10. Williams $ 1,937,520
11. Kings pick $3,635,520
12. Clips pick $2,686,440
13. Celtics pick $2,281,800
14. vet min $1,618,486
15. vet min $1,618,486
Jackson $ 92,858

SUM: $169,883,634

If projections hold, the luxury tax threshold in 2019-20 will fall at approximately $132 million.

$169,883,634 - $132,000,000 = $37,883,634 over the luxury tax threshold

For a non-repeater, the tax breaks down like this:

$7.5m for the first $5m over.
$8.75m for the next $5m.
$12.5m for the next $5m.
$16.25m for the next $5m.
$18.75m for the next $5m.
$21.25m for the next $5m.
$23.75m for the next $5m.
$26.25m for the next $5m.

$7,500,000 + $8,750,000 + $12,500,000 + $16,250,000 + $18,750,000 + $21,250,000 + $23,750,000 + $15,139,078.5 = $123,889,078.5

We are talking about ~$124 million in luxury tax!!!!

The total amount the Celtics have paid in luxury tax throughout their history is $47.3 million.

Are the owners gonna pay $124 million in luxury tax next year? Highly doubt it.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2019, 01:42:56 AM by Jvalin »

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2019, 01:49:32 AM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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 Nice job, but Baynes won't be back with Vucevic. He won't get 25 million per next year IMO.

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #13 on: January 17, 2019, 02:02:01 AM »

Offline perks-a-beast

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Don't think the Magic would do this, but that's not the point.

To all you guys wanting us to go after Vucevic: What happens with Vuc in the off-season? Do we pay him north of 20 million a year or do we let him walk? Cause if we pay him, the luxury tax is gonna explode through the roof (assuming Kyrie re-signs and Horford opts in).


 It's a half season and a playoff run audition, if the Celtics play great. Than yes pay the taxes and pay the man.
Let's assume that
--> Semi + Rozier + Morris + Bird are all traded to Orlando
--> Vucevic's next contract starts at 25 million on year 1
--> Kyrie opts out and re-signs with the C's for the max
--> Horford, Baynes opt in
--> all the picks end up at where they are right now
   - Grizlies at #7 (top 8 protected)
   - Kings at #13
   - Clips at #19
   - Celtics at #23
--> the C's don't use the MLE
--> they fill up the remaining roster spots with vet minimum guys


Here's our payroll for 2019-20

1. Hayward $32,700,690
2. Kyrie $32,700,000 (cap projected to be $109 million, 8-year veteran --> 30% of the cap)
3. Horford $30,123,014
4. Vucevic $25,000,000
5. Smart $ 12,553,471
6. Tatum $ 7,830,000
7. Brown $ 6,534,829
8. Baynes $ 5,453,280
9. Yabu $ 3,117,240
10. Williams $ 1,937,520
11. Kings pick $3,635,520
12. Clips pick $2,686,440
13. Celtics pick $2,281,800
14. vet min $1,618,486
15. vet min $1,618,486
Jackson $ 92,858

SUM: $169,883,634

If projections hold, the luxury tax threshold in 2019-20 will fall at approximately $132 million.

$169,883,634 - $132,000,000 = $37,883,634 over the luxury tax threshold

For a non-repeater, the tax breaks down like this:

$7.5m for the first $5m over.
$8.75m for the next $5m.
$12.5m for the next $5m.
$16.25m for the next $5m.
$18.75m for the next $5m.
$21.25m for the next $5m.
$23.75m for the next $5m.
$26.25m for the next $5m.

$7,500,000 + $8,750,000 + $12,500,000 + $16,250,000 + $18,750,000 + $21,250,000 + $23,750,000 + $15,139,078.5 = $123,889,078.5

We are talking about ~$124 million in luxury tax!!!!

The total amount the Celtics have paid in luxury tax throughout their history is $47.3 million.

Are the owners gonna pay $124 million in luxury tax next year? Highly doubt it.

TP for the terrific salary breakdown.

I’m all for a quantity for quality trade, but I don’t think this is the one to be made. Vucevic is an excellent player, but he’s still soft as baby crap on the defensive side of the floor. Celts need to get tougher inside. Baynes isn’t the sexiest player but he’s a fiery competitor and absolutely instrumental in guarding the likes of Embiid, Drummond, etc..

Re: A Realistic trade That could help both Teams
« Reply #14 on: January 17, 2019, 02:09:09 AM »

Offline Jvalin

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 Nice job, but Baynes won't be back with Vucevic. He won't get 25 million per next year IMO.
Baynes has a player option. It he opts in, then his salary counts against the cap. In this case, best thing we can do is trade him to a team under the cap willing to absorb his contract (but we probably give up a pick in the process).

Vucevic is gonna be an unprotected free agent. He can easily find north of 20 mil on the open market. If he opts for a short term deal, I would argue he can find considerably more than that. It only takes one team to offer him that kind of money.

Regardless of any of that, I didn't even include the Memphis pick or the MLE. Hopefully the Kings pick is gonna be higher than #13. For instance, if we somehow end up picking at #3 once again (pipe dream), the cap hit is gonna be $7,829,880 (instead of $3,635,520). All things considered, it's possible that the tax bill ends up even higher than 124 mil.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2019, 02:41:34 AM by Jvalin »