Author Topic: Phoenix shopping pick 6 for Vets?  (Read 4193 times)

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Re: Phoenix shopping pick 6 for Vets?
« Reply #15 on: May 23, 2019, 09:13:53 PM »

Offline wiley

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Nothing I've heard about this draft suggests that it would be worth giving up much value to move from 14 to 6.
Bingo. And Phoenix saying they want to move back pretty much shows they feel the same way. After Zion and Morant, I do not see much of anything in this draft.


I would point out that people said much the same thing about the 2013 draft, and a couple of All-NBA caliber talents ended up being drafted outside the top 10 in that draft.

There are probably really valuable players that will be available in range of where the Celts are picking in this draft.

In that sense, having three picks plus #51 is a positive, because they'll have multiple chances to snag a diamond in the rough.


That's assuming they end up keeping all the picks, though, which seems pretty unlikely.  But who knows.
I can just as easily point to other years that were thought to be bad drafts and were.

It's a bad draft. That's pretty much a consensus from draftniks, media and leaked comments from front office type people.

The chances of landing someone later in the draft that might be a great to good player is a complete crapshoot in years where the talent is good. It's even less likely in years with limited talent.
Yeah, after the top 3 it’s a bit of a mess. The only others with observable All-Star potential are in my mind Garland and Bol, and both have injury concerns & Bol has motor issues.

This draft seems rife with guys who can be your 7-9th man in the rotation down the track though, depending on the quality of your team

I don't know.  It's not a star draft for sure.  But it seems like a good draft to me if you're not talking about stars.  Seems to my a guy like Thybulle could have an Avery Bradley like career, but with more size and even better defense.  That would be quite a get (if correct) at pick 22. 

And the other thing to consider is not who will be good next year, but who will be starting to sniff all star territory 4 years down the road.  That can be very satisfying to a team as far as picking the right guy, a guy who does nothing much for a couple of year, or is just a solid role player, then really blossoms. 

Here's a list of guys under the theme of---how good will they be in 4 years?---

Jarret Culver--IMO the clear #4 player in the draft and the guy who has a chance to be better than Barrett in the long run.  Worth moving up to 6 if he is there at 6.

Kevin Porter Jr. --  right now a negative in the intangibles department due to behavior concerns.  How about 4 years from now?  He might be a genuine stud basketball player.  A definite gamble pick.

Doumbouya -- in 4 years what will be?  Can he make teams who don't take him regret? 

Garland--Are we sure he's not worth drafting at pick 6? 

To me to just call it a bad draft is a cop out....an example of team's not taking responsibility for picking the wrong guy(s).  If GM's are honest...they would just admit that there's bound to be some eventual all stars and/or specialist studs (Bruce Bowen before becoming an all-star, the next Siakam, the next Jimmy Butler, etc.) in this draft, but in fact they have no clue who that might be.  Not a knock against GM's or scouts....but more truthful than just saying the draft sucks.

Superstars are so hard to come by.  To focus only on them is a mistake imo....

I think it's worth it to try for the great role players in a draft like this and hope you get lucky...(then call it a mix of drafting skill, diligence and luck)
We're not picking at #6.  We're picking at #14.  A few years ago the Kings #10 cost the #15 and the #20.  So lets say #14 and #22 gets us to #10.  How do we get to #6? 

Jumping to #6 isn't realistic.  What you're hoping for is that the 5th or 6th player on your big board drops to #10 and then you trade up.  Of course that assumes there is no AD trade. 

Edit:  Wasn't the last time Danny traded up in a similar situation when he took Olynyk over Giannis?

I wasn't talking about the Celtics....just responding to the above conversation about the draft and whether any team should try to move up to 6 or not.  I agree in theory that the draft is quite even from pick 4-20, but that doesn't mean a GM with a binkie that he believes in shouldn't go for it if he thinks he has to be at 6 in order to be sure to nab him....

Yes.  I never criticize Ainge...but moving up 3 spots for Olynyck was one of those moment where I did.  Kelly wasn't so shabby, but still...not fun on draft night hehehe.

Re: Phoenix shopping pick 6 for Vets?
« Reply #16 on: May 23, 2019, 09:14:08 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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I'm not sure that I agree with the sentiment that this draft dies at 3. I have the tiers looking something like.

S Tier
Zion

AAA Tier
No one

AA tier
Ja Morant

A Tier
RJ Barrett

B+ Tier
Jarrett Culver
Darius Garland(if his medicals are solid)
Cam Reddish(has risen back up as a prospect in my eyes might be A- tier by draft night)

B Tier
DeAndre Hunter
Sekou Doumboyah

B- Tier
Coby White

C+ Tier
Nassir Little
Bol Bol
Rui Hachimura
Brandon Clarke
Goga Biadtze
Romeo Langford

C- Tier
Everyone else until about pick 22

The point is that walking away with one of Hunter, Reddish, Garland or Doumboyah would absolutely be worth giving up assets to move up to 6.
I miss Chad Ford

Don’t worry. He is still out there retroactively adjusting his draft boards

Re: Phoenix shopping pick 6 for Vets?
« Reply #17 on: May 23, 2019, 09:44:27 PM »

Offline jambr380

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I'm not sure that I agree with the sentiment that this draft dies at 3. I have the tiers looking something like.

S Tier
Zion

AAA Tier
No one

AA tier
Ja Morant

A Tier
RJ Barrett

B+ Tier
Jarrett Culver
Darius Garland(if his medicals are solid)
Cam Reddish(has risen back up as a prospect in my eyes might be A- tier by draft night)

B Tier
DeAndre Hunter
Sekou Doumboyah

B- Tier
Coby White

C+ Tier
Nassir Little
Bol Bol
Rui Hachimura
Brandon Clarke
Goga Biadtze
Romeo Langford

C- Tier
Everyone else until about pick 22

The point is that walking away with one of Hunter, Reddish, Garland or Doumboyah would absolutely be worth giving up assets to move up to 6.
I miss Chad Ford

Nothing against Smartacus and his rankings, but your response made me lol. Good one, LB

Re: Phoenix shopping pick 6 for Vets?
« Reply #18 on: May 24, 2019, 06:12:14 PM »

Offline Smartacus

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I'm not sure that I agree with the sentiment that this draft dies at 3. I have the tiers looking something like.

S Tier
Zion

AAA Tier
No one

AA tier
Ja Morant

A Tier
RJ Barrett

B+ Tier
Jarrett Culver
Darius Garland(if his medicals are solid)
Cam Reddish(has risen back up as a prospect in my eyes might be A- tier by draft night)

B Tier
DeAndre Hunter
Sekou Doumboyah

B- Tier
Coby White

C+ Tier
Nassir Little
Bol Bol
Rui Hachimura
Brandon Clarke
Goga Biadtze
Romeo Langford

C- Tier
Everyone else until about pick 22

The point is that walking away with one of Hunter, Reddish, Garland or Doumboyah would absolutely be worth giving up assets to move up to 6.
I miss Chad Ford

Nothing against Smartacus and his rankings, but your response made me lol. Good one, LB

Heh none taken, Chad had his place in the draft analysis world. The retroactively adjusting his rankings scandal was the saddest thing I've seen in NBA journalism though. No coming back from that.

Re: Phoenix shopping pick 6 for Vets?
« Reply #19 on: May 24, 2019, 07:06:35 PM »

RazzelnoDazzel

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I'm not sure that I agree with the sentiment that this draft dies at 3. I have the tiers looking something like.

S Tier
Zion

AAA Tier
No one

AA tier
Ja Morant

A Tier
RJ Barrett

B+ Tier
Jarrett Culver
Darius Garland(if his medicals are solid)
Cam Reddish(has risen back up as a prospect in my eyes might be A- tier by draft night)

B Tier
DeAndre Hunter
Sekou Doumboyah

B- Tier
Coby White

C+ Tier
Nassir Little
Bol Bol
Rui Hachimura
Brandon Clarke
Goga Biadtze
Romeo Langford

C- Tier
Everyone else until about pick 22

The point is that walking away with one of Hunter, Reddish, Garland or Doumboyah would absolutely be worth giving up assets to move up to 6.
I miss Chad Ford

Nothing against Smartacus and his rankings, but your response made me lol. Good one, LB

Heh none taken, Chad had his place in the draft analysis world. The retroactively adjusting his rankings scandal was the saddest thing I've seen in NBA journalism though. No coming back from that.

So either it dies at 1 or 3 according to this.

Re: Phoenix shopping pick 6 for Vets?
« Reply #20 on: May 24, 2019, 07:25:28 PM »

Offline Pvictor11

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I think it makes sense for Phoenix and Memphis a trade of Mike Conley for the 6th pick. The suns need a PG and Memphis won't need Conley with Morant there. What do you guys think?
Brazilian Celtic Fan!

Re: Phoenix shopping pick 6 for Vets?
« Reply #21 on: May 24, 2019, 09:26:15 PM »

RazzelnoDazzel

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I think it makes sense for Phoenix and Memphis a trade of Mike Conley for the 6th pick. The suns need a PG and Memphis won't need Conley with Morant there. What do you guys think?

He doesn’t fit their timeline, and I don’t think that’s a team he’s happy to be with. Plus he has 1 year left which would be a waste of a pick.

Re: Phoenix shopping pick 6 for Vets?
« Reply #22 on: May 24, 2019, 11:17:14 PM »

Offline jambr380

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I'm not sure that I agree with the sentiment that this draft dies at 3. I have the tiers looking something like.

S Tier
Zion

AAA Tier
No one

AA tier
Ja Morant

A Tier
RJ Barrett

B+ Tier
Jarrett Culver
Darius Garland(if his medicals are solid)
Cam Reddish(has risen back up as a prospect in my eyes might be A- tier by draft night)

B Tier
DeAndre Hunter
Sekou Doumboyah

B- Tier
Coby White

C+ Tier
Nassir Little
Bol Bol
Rui Hachimura
Brandon Clarke
Goga Biadtze
Romeo Langford

C- Tier
Everyone else until about pick 22

The point is that walking away with one of Hunter, Reddish, Garland or Doumboyah would absolutely be worth giving up assets to move up to 6.
I miss Chad Ford

Nothing against Smartacus and his rankings, but your response made me lol. Good one, LB

Heh none taken, Chad had his place in the draft analysis world. The retroactively adjusting his rankings scandal was the saddest thing I've seen in NBA journalism though. No coming back from that.

Absolutely - that ridiculous. I should elaborate, though. I really have very little knowledge of the draft or where players should be ranked. I always tell myself I am going to do more research on rookie draft classes, and I suppose I have done better when the Cs have had higher picks; but this year I don't really know anybody outside of Zion, Morant, or Bol.

What I thought was funny was LB missing Chad Ford and his tiers. He used to reference them often on this site (I remember Jaylen Brown being a point of contention). His succinct response made me laugh in reference to somebody else doing his own tiers...and I am sure yours are at least as valid as Chad Ford.