CelticsStrong
Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: wildo05 on October 10, 2008, 07:47:40 AM
-
Michael Jordan has this to say:
Ray Allen said Michael Jordan told him during a golf outing this summer that the Celtics were lucky to win the championship. "MJ said we were lucky with the first one," Allen said. "[He said] the first championship is luck and if you want to build something, you guys have got to win it again. That's like his way of saying congratulations, because he's sitting on six of them. He said we won't get to six, but you guys were lucky." -- Boston Globe
-
He says that about ever team when they win their first one. He said he was lucky to win his first one too. Then the one you win after that show what kind of team you were. It's just his philosophy.
-
of course they were lucky - they were lucky in so many respects but especially no significant injuries to the big 3 all season.
I think they can do better with a season together under their belt
-
he's right, it's very rare for a team that was thrown together only months before hand to win it all. i've been saying this all summer, good teams win a championship, great teams repeat. i'm pretty sure our guys know that, and don't want to go down in history as just "forgetably good".
-
yea, as someone above me said, this is his personal mantra, even about his bulls.
the first one is lucky, the second one and beyond shows your a team worthy of being remebered.
personaly i agree with him, so lets go get 18 ;D
-
This may well turn out to be one
of the best motivational factors
for our team. When people like MJ
says things like this, we listen.
So, yeah, let's go get No. 18 as
well. Hopefully we'll beat the
Lakers (w/ a healthy Bynum) again,
so that all this talk about fluke
or luck will be laid to rest.
-
Agreed. Miami is a good example. I understand his perspective and hope that the team understands it as well.
-
I read the title and I was outraged, but now I like the angle of motivation we can use it as.
-
That's a great point and thats MJ's way of saying been there done that show me what else you guys have.
-
OK, so let's say the Celtics were "lucky"...Whoop-dee doo. Does that mean we have to give the trophy back? No banner? Use whatever adjective you want in front of 2008 World Champions and you can't take away the "2008 World Champions" part.
Try it: Boston Celtics: androgynous 2008 World Champions...See, still champs. Don't care what you call them, as long as you call them champs.
Any chance MJ is the first guy ever to try and get another guys goat over a game of golf?
-
Any chance MJ is the first guy ever to try and get another guys goat over a game of golf?
Tiger Woods
-
OK, so let's say the Celtics were "lucky"...Whoop-dee doo. Does that mean we have to give the trophy back? No banner? Use whatever adjective you want in front of 2008 World Champions and you can't take away the "2008 World Champions" part.
Try it: Boston Celtics: androgynous 2008 World Champions...See, still champs. Don't care what you call them, as long as you call them champs.
Any chance MJ is the first guy ever to try and get another guys goat over a game of golf?
I just thought about this:
If ever a team was supposed to
be lucky, which team would that
be? Us, of course. Look at our name:
CELTICS. A logo full of shamrocks!
These facts scream luck ;)
Let's just shut MJ up by winning this
upcoming season as well...
-
Tim Duncan has been lucky 4 times in his career.
With that said, I hope for a 3-4 year title run with this group.
-
It does take luck to get through 4 rounds of basketball without injury or losing your steam. Obviously it isn't all luck and MJ didn't say that.
Every time the team repeats or even just goes deep, it shows more and more how little luck is to thank.
-
"I'd rather be lucky than good." Red Auerbach
-
I was going to translate Michael's luck statement to:
"I bet on the Lakers"
But after reading the dialogue between him and Ray I understand what he's saying, which is:
"The first championship, you're in unfamiliar territory and basically things need to fall in place for you to win. Now you know what it takes and if luck isn't with you this year, we will find out what kind of team you really are"
I agree. Michael is really smart. He put together a good wizards team. And I beleive him when he said he didn't want to draft Kwame.
-
celts have to win three in a row. Thats prob the only way legends like jordan shuts up and gives us proper credit, kg and ray allen get their jersey raised possibly and lastly stump the 80's celts because they never won 3 in a row.
-
celts have to win three in a row. Thats prob the only way legends like jordan shuts up and gives us proper credit, kg and ray allen get their jersey raised possibly and lastly stump the 80's celts because they never won 3 in a row.
see, i dont see it as all that inflamatory, espically since he always says his first was lucky.
what he's trying to get across is, some teams (like the heat) only win once, and thus, will be forgotten. to get remebered, you have to win a few with basicaly the same team.
I don't really take it as a "shot" as some here have seemed to.
-
I was going to translate Michael's luck statement to:
"I bet on the Lakers"
Hahaha... nice one!
I need humor today, because I fail to smile when I check out my stock portfolio these days....
-
celts have to win three in a row. Thats prob the only way legends like jordan shuts up and gives us proper credit, kg and ray allen get their jersey raised possibly and lastly stump the 80's celts because they never won 3 in a row.
The Celts of the 80's didn't even repeat, let
alone win three in a row.
As far as I know, Boston is the only team to
do that (?) Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Correcting myself:
Chicago did it as well.
Oh, it just serves MJ right
that I totally forgot ;D
-
While I understand what MJ (mr carry the ball) is trying to say.
How about this say that to KG's face!
-
Jordan has a point behind his mantra...
Think about the last 10 years...the only team besides the Bulls to repeat has been the Lakers.
All the teams that have won since Chicago...
San Antonio..really good, arguably great, but not great enough to repeat back to back
Lakers...yeah, they did the threepeat.
Detroit..they were good, and still are since then, but not good enough to be great and win again
Miami..They won once and it was over. No greatness there
Boston..Good so far. In my own eyes great, but by this sequence of rules/probability, they must win this year and maybe even the year after..but it can happen
-
celts have to win three in a row. Thats prob the only way legends like jordan shuts up and gives us proper credit, kg and ray allen get their jersey raised possibly and lastly stump the 80's celts because they never won 3 in a row.
The Celts of the 80's didn't even repeat, let
alone win three in a row.
As far as I know, Boston is the only team to
do that (?) Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Correcting myself:
Chicago did it as well.
Oh, it just serves MJ right
that I totally forgot ;D
The Lakers won 3 in a row during the Shaw/Kobe dysfunctional marriage
The Bulls won 3 in a row twice (6 in 8 years) during MJ's era (the two years in between was when my was "retired")
The Lakers also did it in the 50's i think, when they were in minneapolis
-
I believe that had McHale taken half the shots in that game 6, of the '85 finals, we could have won and had our three-peat.
Bird's outside shots clearly weren't falling and McHale was having a finals MVP series, esp that last game. That time, however, Rambis exacted his revenge upon by getting him fouled out of the game. All and all, Bird and DJ should have setup every single possession for McHale, thus making Parish do more of the work on defense, and Bird, only taking it to the hoop since Cooper was on him, all the time and that's where Coop was less effective.
In essence, a 50-54 pt outing for McHale; yes, he was really on fire. Somehow, the Celts didn't use it and had him split his efforts on defense which were less effective esp with all the fouls.
-
MJ has a point on this one. Any team with a strong lineup has a chance to win the title every year. But winning straight titles or even multiple titles is a different animal. The season after winning your title is one of the hardest seasons a team can ever experience. Everybody wants to claim the scalp of the champs and you can be sure that they would double or even triple their preparation for you the following season.
Fans and basketball historians give high regards to teams who won multiple titles because this feat is not easily accomplished and only a blessed few have gone on to reach that stage in history. I don't want to remember the Big 3 of KG-PP-RA as a one-hit wonder team. I want to remember them as the team who beat the so-called experts' predictions year after year and went on to win multiple titles. I say the Celtics should take this comment to heart and use this as a motivation to reach out and grab banner 18 and beyond.
Thanks for the bulletin board material MJ ;)
-
Let us not forget that MJ was a master of 'Psy-Ops' with and against other players, as was our own Larry Bird. His comments to Ray Allen are clearly designed to be inflammatory and inspirational at the same time. I think Ray took them to heart and he will certainly share them with the team, if he hasnt already. 8)
-
You know what... I don't care if we were lucky, the memories I have of number #17 are priceless.
PS: Hey MJ you were LUCKY because the refs were with you so many times...
NF.
-
celts have to win three in a row. Thats prob the only way legends like jordan shuts up and gives us proper credit, kg and ray allen get their jersey raised possibly and lastly stump the 80's celts because they never won 3 in a row.
The Celts of the 80's didn't even repeat, let
alone win three in a row.
As far as I know, Boston is the only team to
do that (?) Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Correcting myself:
Chicago did it as well.
Oh, it just serves MJ right
that I totally forgot ;D
The Lakers won 3 in a row during the Shaw/Kobe dysfunctional marriage
The Bulls won 3 in a row twice (6 in 8 years) during MJ's era (the two years in between was when my was "retired")
The Lakers also did it in the 50's i think, when they were in minneapolis
You're absolutely right. Tommy Point.
But I'm not sad that I didn't remember.
We are, after all, talking about the
much hated Lakers here ;)
But thanks for the heads-up.
Anyways, no other team (other than Boston)
has ever won 8 times in a row and this I
am quite sure of ;D
-
There's always an element of luck in no matter what you do but you still have to be a great team to be in position for that luck to present itself and then capitalize on it.
The C's made the majority of their luck last year and for the most part they willed their defensive identity on every team throughout the year and made them play the style we wanted to play.
MJ can say every "first 'Ship" is lucky but what he really means is the next one you win legitimizes your Championship legacy.....he really wants to say "one isn't enough" but he's so [dang] competitive he just wants to demean your first win in the process.
-
A team has to have a certain amount of luck to win any championship. Staying healthy, which is a major component of winning is largely a matter of good fortune. How many would Chi have won if MJ or Pippen had
gotten hurt during one of their championship seasons? Russell badly sprained his ankle in 1958 or the Cs would have won that year too. You have to stay healthy to have any kind of shot of going far in the playoffs.
-
Ah sorry not buying it. We had the best defense, best team, best coaches no luck involved. Can we repeat I hope so.
-
MJ says C's Were Lucky to Win Title
That, coming from a drama queen who was the ONLY player of his era getting star calls..Not to mention the player who was given a title by the officials when he flagrantly pushed off in front of an official to get his game winning shot off. How many games did the Bulls win because Jordan was officiated completely different than any other player in the NBA?
Well, take it for what it's worth. ;D
-
MJ says C's Were Lucky to Win Title
That, coming from a drama queen who was the ONLY player of his era getting star calls..Not to mention the player who was given a title by the officials when he flagrantly pushed off in front of an official to get his game winning shot off. How many games did the Bulls win because Jordan was officiated completely different than any other player in the NBA?
Well, take it for what it's worth. ;D
I would agree. Luck is being able to push off and hit a game winning 3. I wonder if thats a "laces out" moment for Karl Malon?
-
MJ says C's Were Lucky to Win Title
That, coming from a drama queen who was the ONLY player of his era getting star calls..Not to mention the player who was given a title by the officials when he flagrantly pushed off in front of an official to get his game winning shot off. How many games did the Bulls win because Jordan was officiated completely different than any other player in the NBA?
Well, take it for what it's worth. ;D
i dont get how many people failed to get the context of his statement, but W/E, find slights to us where you can i guess.
fans need bulliten board material too i guess :D
-
He says that about ever team when they win their first one. He said he was lucky to win his first one too. Then the one you win after that show what kind of team you were. It's just his philosophy.
Exactly. I don't quite understand what he means, or I don't agree with what I think he means, but he has been saying this for years. It's not a bait on the Celtics at all.
-
I dont get how many people failed to get the context of his statement, but W/E, find slights to us where you can i guess.
I don't really care about the context. Jordan, like the NBA's messiah in Cleveland, were/are the most talented players of their era. They don't need any help. But both were/have been officiated completely different from any of their peers. With Jordan, it was so obvious for so many years. Exactly like the messiah today. The bias is so ridiculous that in spite of their amazing talent, their games aren't any fun to watch.
When Jordan is on a level playing field. As in being a GM, It's comical to see how inept he is. It's also comical to hear from a guy who never committed a foul and never traveled after his first two seasons in the NBA talk about anybody being lucky. Considering that Jordan, talent wise was on a whole different level from his peers, his entire championship run should have been earned. But for all intents and purposes, through little fault of his own, (Hello, Mr Stern) Jordan was the biggest fraud of his era.
-
I dont get how many people failed to get the context of his statement, but W/E, find slights to us where you can i guess.
I don't really care about the context. Jordan, like the NBA's messiah in Cleveland, were/are the most talented players of their era. They don't need any help. But both were/have been officiated completely different from any of their peers. With Jordan, it was so obvious for so many years. Exactly like the messiah today. The bias is so ridiculous that in spite of their amazing talent, their games aren't any fun to watch.
When Jordan is on a level playing field. As in being a GM, It's comical to see how inept he is. It's also comical to hear from a guy who never committed a foul and never traveled after his first two seasons in the NBA talk about anybody being lucky. Considering that Jordan, talent wise was on a whole different level from his peers, his entire championship run should have been earned. But for all intents and purposes, through little fault of his own, (Hello, Mr Stern) Jordan was the biggest fraud of his era.
so, you don't actually care about the article or qoute, you just wanted to go MJ bashing.
thats how you feel about jordan, but it doesn't relate to what he said at all. If you want to bash MJ, cool, bash MJ. but don't act like he dissed the celtics as your jumping off point, it didn't happen.
-
I read the article, Crownsy. It doesn't change what I think because some see Jordan't word as a complement or congratulations. I see what he said as at best, a backhanded complement. Jordan's first championship was probably his only championship won where the playing field was level. If he thinks he was lucky to win that one, then Jordan, himself should call his entire run a fraud. The following championship years for Jordan were a joke. David Stern should have read a disclaimer before every telecast about the WWE-type officiating that was about to take place in Jordan's games.
-
I read the article, Crownsy. It doesn't change what I think because some see Jordan't word as a complement or congratulations. I see what he said as at best, a backhanded complement. Jordan's first championship was probably his only championship won where the playing field was level. If he thinks he was lucky to win that one, then Jordan, himself should call his entire run a fraud. The following championship years for Jordan were a joke. David Stern should have read a disclaimer before every telecast about the WWE-type officiating that was about to take place in Jordan's games.
you and ray allen disagree then. because if he thought it was a backhanded compliment from his good friend he plays golf with, why releate it to the media and then say you understood what he ment, and that you were going to stay hungry as he suggested? if ray thought his friend (and they are good friends) was taking a shot at him, i doubt he'd talk to the media about it and how it will be good motivation.
and, as to your second paragraph, jordan DOESin fact call his first championship lucky. that was his ENTIRE POINT OF SAYING IT TO RAY ALLEN. that the first one is alot of luck, (which ours certainly was, and thiers nothing wrong with a bit of luck, all teams need it, and as redz said were named after it) and that the great teams dont settle for one, they keep working to get more.
take it as you did and blow it out of proportion to fit into your MJ bashing if ya want though. hate to let facts get in the way of a good character assaination heh. it certainly didn't while we were ripping apart kobe's oylimpic comments :)
and while i agree jordan did get the benifit of far to many calls, im not sure he should illicit the vitral level you've got him on here. thats just my personal opnion though. i do agree he was overrated, more so because the casts he played with were underrated.
to here some NBA guys talk, it was jordan and his sidekick pippen. there was alot more talent than that on those bulls teams.
-
I didn't rip Kobe's character, crownsy. Actually, I'm one of the few in here who defend Kobe. I think the whole olympic experience is a fraud. It's anything but patroitic. The officiating in every event is akin to watching a Jordan or James game. I'm glad to hear Kobe say what he said about playing in it. I just don't believe it. What he's saying, IMHO, is reputation rebuilding. It's totally unnecessary.
What I also said, if you read it, is that if Jordan thought his first championship was lucky, it's hard to imagine what he thinks of the others. Unless he's delusional. He has to know that he was the only NBA player who could take 4 steps without getting a traveling call.
So what Jordan says about much of anything carrys no weight with me.
-
I didn't rip Kobe's character, crownsy. Actually, I'm one of the few in here who defend Kobe. I think the whole olympic experience is a fraud. It's anything but patroitic. The officiating in every event is akin to watching a Jordan or James game. I'm glad to hear Kobe say what he said about playing in it. I just don't believe it. What he's saying, IMHO, is reputation rebuilding. It's totally unnecessary.
What I also said, if you read it, is that if Jordan thought his first championship was lucky, it's hard to imagine what he thinks of the others. Unless he's delusional. He has to know that he was the only NBA player who could take 4 steps without getting a traveling call.
So what Jordan says about much of anything carrys no weight with me.
i wasen't talkign about you with kobe, i was saying it can be fun to make reaches on people sometimes, i Did it with a few of kobe's comments too, though in the end i had to start getting his back as well, because some of the later threads got risiculous.
and i got that, you don't like MJ. thats fine, i don't particularly care for him either, but the point was, his comment didn't mean what you said it ment, like it was some sort of backhanded compliment. And, if it was, the only reason ray would go out of his way to bring up a private conversation between a friend of his and himself playing golf and then call that backhanded slap a complment and a call to stay motiviated would be if ray allen's an idiot and didnt realize MJ was taking a swipe at him.
I very much doubt ray is an idiot. His buddy who won multiple championships gave him some advice on how to stay focused during a golf match, and he chose to share it with the media. to me, this is the biggest non-issue of all time. I just find it funny that some posters (not just you, theres a bunch of em) seem to need to find an anti celtic message in a harmless comment.
-
Ok, Crownsy. I'll just call it bulletin board material. Except I don't play for the Celtics.
-
Ok, Crownsy. I'll just call it bulletin board material. Except I don't play for the Celtics.
whatever, i wasen't even arguing with you on anything, just pointing something out. im not getting your point and your not getting mine, truce. :D