CelticsStrong
Around the League => Transaction Ideas and Rumors => Topic started by: Tr1boy on July 19, 2017, 10:39:45 AM
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Jumping the gun a little here... But hypothetically if either Davis or Leonard are availble after this seasom and both Pelicans/Spurs are willing to take Celts offer (Tatum, Brown, IT4 (sign and trade))..
Which player would you choose?
Scenerio for 2017/2018 season - Celts lose to the Cavs in a convincing fashion again or dont make it to the ECF.
Pelicans season ends up a mess and want to clean house. Trade or plan to everyone on the roster for the purpose to rebuild...
The Spurs drop to a middle of the pack team. Popovich will not return after his contract expires. As well the team is thinking about cleanning house to rebuild
Which player would bring the Celts closer to a championship?
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I'll ignore the awful trade idea and focus on the Leonard vs. Davis:
Leonard 100%, final answer. Davis looks like he could turn into an MVP candidate someday, but Leonard already is one and has great playoff experience. He's the best 2-way player in the league and the perfect player for defending both Lebron and Durant. You put him on the current team (minus rookies/picks) and we would be the favorites in the east, with a good chance at unseating GSW as well
Edit: That said, he should not and will not be traded
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I'll ignore the awful trade idea and focus on the Leonard vs. Davis:
Leonard 100%, final answer. Davis looks like he could turn into an MVP candidate someday, but Leonard already is one and has great playoff experience. He's the best 2-way player in the league and the perfect player for defending both Lebron and Durant. You put him on the current team (minus rookies/picks) and we would be the favorites in the east, with a good chance at unseating GSW as well
Edit: That said, he should not and will not be traded
Unless Pop quits coaching. No spring chicken. He'd probably demand trade to Eastern Conference the next day.
A guy can dream right??
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They won't be trading Leonard. Davis has a chance to be disgruntled.
The answer is always if the price is fair
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I'll ignore the awful trade idea and focus on the Leonard vs. Davis:
Leonard 100%, final answer. Davis looks like he could turn into an MVP candidate someday, but Leonard already is one and has great playoff experience. He's the best 2-way player in the league and the perfect player for defending both Lebron and Durant. You put him on the current team (minus rookies/picks) and we would be the favorites in the east, with a good chance at unseating GSW as well
Edit: That said, he should not and will not be traded
Unless Pop quits coaching. No spring chicken. He'd probably demand trade to Eastern Conference the next day.
A guy can dream right??
I can't see Pop retiring without essentially crowning a successor. And I think that would be enough to get Leonard to stay (or, at least not demand a trade), along with having the chance to be a lifetime Spur like Duncan, Manu, and Parker
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Jumping the gun a little here... But hypothetically if either Davis or Leonard are availble after this seasom and both Pelicans/Spurs are willing to take Celts offer (Tatum, Brown, IT4 (sign and trade))..
Which player would you choose?
Scenerio for 2017/2018 season - Celts lose to the Cavs in a convincing fashion again or dont make it to the ECF.
Pelicans season ends up a mess and want to clean house. Trade or plan to everyone on the roster for the purpose to rebuild...
The Spurs drop to a middle of the pack team. Popovich will not return after his contract expires. As well the team is thinking about cleanning house to rebuild
Which player would bring the Celts closer to a championship?
I wouldn't give up this for Davis, I'd go the pick route; All three 2018 picks, plus salary to match.
This still leaves us Brown/Tatum/Davis/Hayward for the future.
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Kawhi 100%
In my opinion he's the best two way player in the league, and I'd even take him over Durant (probably in the minority on that one, :P ).
Davis is no doubt a beast, but Kawhi is next level.
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Davis = more talented than Kawhi. Most gifted player in the league alongside LeBron.
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Kawhi injury history and less size are enough to not go for him
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My initial reaction would be the franchise big man. But looking over the last decade of NBA champions, you can argue none if them really had a legit franchise big man (you can argue SA with Duncan).
So I would probably go with the elite 2 way wing player.
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Kawhi 100%
In my opinion he's the best two way player in the league, and I'd even take him over Durant (probably in the minority on that one, :P ).
Davis is no doubt a beast, but Kawhi is next level.
I pretty much agree with this. Davis is awesome but kawhi knows how to win and he is much sturdier health wise.
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Leonard is the best player in the NBA.... which is probably why he will never be traded, they will do everything possible to keep him, even if it meant making him a player-coach.
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Leonard is the best player in the NBA.... which is probably why he will never be traded, they will do everything possible to keep him, even if it meant making him a player-coach.
KG once was the best player in the league or top 5 and we got him via trade
Maybe Leonard doesnt mind staying in the middle of the pack but the Spurs organization will...
Unless the Spurs can replace Manu, Parker type talents...they wont be relevant in the west
SA is also not a top destination for FAs. They have built their success through the draft
By the time this happens again, Leonard is 38 years old and irrelevant
This is why I think he could be traded for... Especially if Popovich is not back as coach after his contract which ends soon. I think he is going to retire
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I wouldn't do that deal for either, but if I had to Davis
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I'll ignore the awful trade idea and focus on the Leonard vs. Davis:
Leonard 100%, final answer. Davis looks like he could turn into an MVP candidate someday, but Leonard already is one and has great playoff experience. He's the best 2-way player in the league and the perfect player for defending both Lebron and Durant. You put him on the current team (minus rookies/picks) and we would be the favorites in the east, with a good chance at unseating GSW as well
Edit: That said, he should not and will not be traded
So what type of offer works then?
Pelicans and Spurs wont let these players go easily. Overpayment is likely in order
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AD fits us better, but if we want to matchup with Lebron and KD, Leonard is better. Add the fact that Leonard has been healthier than AD and I say its Leonard.
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I'll ignore the awful trade idea and focus on the Leonard vs. Davis:
Leonard 100%, final answer. Davis looks like he could turn into an MVP candidate someday, but Leonard already is one and has great playoff experience. He's the best 2-way player in the league and the perfect player for defending both Lebron and Durant. You put him on the current team (minus rookies/picks) and we would be the favorites in the east, with a good chance at unseating GSW as well
Edit: That said, he should not and will not be traded
So what type of offer works then?
Pelicans and Spurs wont let these players go easily. Overpayment is likely in order
The issue is that you didn't overpay. Like, at all. Signing and trading a player is not the same as trading them. It requires the other player to want to go there and the other team to come to an agreement with them on salary (aka enough for them to just sign the player without giving up an AD or a Kawhi). For this trade to even remotely make sense, you'd need to take out IT and throw in the Nets pick at a minimum (and likely the LAL pick as well), plus Crowder and/or Morris to match salaries. You may be able to take out either Tatum or Brown in that case, but one will still be there.
Not only that, but why would we trade IT in an all-in move like trading all our future assets for Kawhi/AD? Smart certaiy isn't ready to take over, and we'd have zero cap space, so how would we win with that team?
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Trading for either makes no sense if we have to give up most of our value otherwise. Neither player is good enough to beat GSW if we give away most of our talent and picks. Those pining for such a trade would doom our chances for years to come, with no picks and no young players to turn into stars.
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Leonard is the best player in the NBA.... which is probably why he will never be traded, they will do everything possible to keep him, even if it meant making him a player-coach.
KG once was the best player in the league or top 5 and we got him via trade
Maybe Leonard doesnt mind staying in the middle of the pack but the Spurs organization will...
Unless the Spurs can replace Manu, Parker type talents...they wont be relevant in the west
SA is also not a top destination for FAs. They have built their success through the draft
By the time this happens again, Leonard is 38 years old and irrelevant
This is why I think he could be traded for... Especially if Popovich is not back as coach after his contract which ends soon. I think he is going to retire
So because a top 5 player once left then they all will? Got it...
I think when Pop is ready he will move to the front office and pick his replacement, I dont see the Spurs getting rid of their best player, if they do I will load you up with TP's as you were the first to suggest it that I have seen.
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Davis. solidifies a soft front court and we already have an all-star wing. Can't go wrong with either talent wise but Davis supplements this roster whereas Kawhi duplicates where we have a lot of current talent.
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Just had a dream that Leonard started his career in the Clips with Melo and "Linsanity". And they were a contender.
Never combine heavy food with the Forums before bed.
Back to the question. Leonard could well be the best player in basketball terms, but AD is the unicorn big that is good on both ends. I recall Ainge talking about how important these players are in a recent interview. It's hard to pass an opportunity to take such a player in his prime.
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I'll ignore the awful trade idea and focus on the Leonard vs. Davis:
Leonard 100%, final answer. Davis looks like he could turn into an MVP candidate someday, but Leonard already is one and has great playoff experience. He's the best 2-way player in the league and the perfect player for defending both Lebron and Durant. You put him on the current team (minus rookies/picks) and we would be the favorites in the east, with a good chance at unseating GSW as well
Edit: That said, he should not and will not be traded
So what type of offer works then?
Pelicans and Spurs wont let these players go easily. Overpayment is likely in order
The issue is that you didn't overpay. Like, at all. Signing and trading a player is not the same as trading them. It requires the other player to want to go there and the other team to come to an agreement with them on salary (aka enough for them to just sign the player without giving up an AD or a Kawhi). For this trade to even remotely make sense, you'd need to take out IT and throw in the Nets pick at a minimum (and likely the LAL pick as well), plus Crowder and/or Morris to match salaries. You may be able to take out either Tatum or Brown in that case, but one will still be there.
Not only that, but why would we trade IT in an all-in move like trading all our future assets for Kawhi/AD? Smart certaiy isn't ready to take over, and we'd have zero cap space, so how would we win with that team?
You cant have maxed out horford, hayward, IT4 and Leonard or Davis moving fwd
And yes the opposing teams would entertain a sign and trade bc IT4 is a good talent plus they get Tatum and Brown in return
The uncertainty as to where the 2018/2019 picks land wont do the trick. Higher risk for Pelicans/Spurs
I would be on the fence .... Hate to give up tatum and brown but if IT4 is no longer in the Celts future plans but pelicans/spurs want to rebuild... Need to think about it
Hayward plus leonard alone would be a deadly 1 2 punch