Celtics (37-15) at Rockets (33-20) Game #53 2/11/20

[Tr1boy]

can someone also explain how the "Paul Pierce foul draw" is still allowed in the NBA?  I thought they got rid of it a few years ago

Where the D jumps straight up and down, but players like Lowry/Harden see this and jump into them or arms flaling outward trying to initiate contact

Its terrible

[liam]

can someone also explain how the "Paul Pierce foul draw" is still allowed in the NBA?  I thought they got rid of it a few years ago

Where the D jumps straight up and down, but players like Lowry/Harden see this and jump into them or arms flaling outward trying to initiate contact

Its terrible

So called "Stars" ( who haven't won anything...) can still do it. It's an ugly look for The NBA.

[liam]

That is the thing about the league today. You can play physical defense in the paint but you can't play physical defense on the perimeter against ball-handlers.

That is why it is a lot easier for Houston to play physical defense against their opponents (against players in the paint) than it is for opponents to play physical defense against Houston style of offense - iso ball ball-handlers 25 feet from the hoop.

The Rockets get to dictate physicality. It is hard for opponents to match that / to counter that because of the rules and how things are called on the perimeter (which is Houston's entire offense).

The issue for Boston is our scorers aren't as good at driving to the basket as Westbrook or Harden. Not as dynamic off the bounce. Do not put the same offensive pressure on. They can do it (score the ball) in other ways but those ways cause less foul-happy situations. Houston always likely to get the benefit of the whistle because their team is more built to exploit the rules.

I think it's a good point about perimeter versus paint defense. I also think Houston is actually pretty physical on the perimeter but they're smart about it - and teams that aren't used to attacking a switching defense have trouble beating them.

Example - Boston normally thrives on high picks and pick and rolls. Against Houston's switching defense that lets the Rockets build a wall of two or three players that our ballhandlers can't get past. The horns set is especially useless - or worse - by bunching up six players, unless our guys are very smart about slipping and the defenders blow a switch. The Cs' wings really struggled with the traffic jams. The one time they really did well was in the second part of the 2d quarter, where there was more straight attack off the dribble, where the blowby forced Houston to start rotating and we bent their defense into giving us an open shot. I think in a longer series they would figure it out - and Tatum and Kemba won't shoot 1-13 from 3! It also wouldn't hurt to have Rob Williams available. Kanter is just an absolute disaster against Houston.

I do have to give credit to Houston's D, though. They were very good.

I give credit to refs who let Houston play physical and called a bunch of non fouls or tacky tacky fouls on us. They really controlled the game.

[nickagneta]

Celts should of had Smart on Harden 24/7

right up in his face

Also back the way up on Westbrook who can't shoot

Layoff on the rest of the players and make them earn their shots

very very poor game plan by Brad Stevens

So you didn't notice that as soon as Smart or Brown D'ed up on Harden Houston ran a screen to force a switch and get someone else on Harden?

Or the fact, when we got up in his face, we got called a foul?

Or the fact when players backed up on Westbrook, because we had no one in the paint Westbrook just barrelled his way past his man anyway or got fouled? There was a reason Stevens went zone for a while and it was because of having no one as a last line of defense on Westbrook and Harden.

The team played okay but needed to play better to win against a good team on the road. Really not seeing this loss as a coaching loss. The players turned the ball over too much, got tentative on defense once the refs started whistling like crazy and instead of playing their game, they played Houston's game.

[Sophomore]

Celts should of had Smart on Harden 24/7

right up in his face

Also back the way up on Westbrook who can't shoot

Layoff on the rest of the players and make them earn their shots

very very poor game plan by Brad Stevens

I think that is part of the problem of last night's officiating. Anytime we were up on his face, they'd give Harden the foul. Even when we barely touch the player, as long as there's any resemblance of shooting, then it's a foul. That was pretty frustrating.

To be fair we also bit on their pump fakes a lot, we did get some BS calls but it wasn't all about the refs.

I agree to this. And we definitely benefited from some phantom foul calls against them as well.

[nickagneta]

Refs were atrocious. My guess is Houston fans were complaining in a game thread last night about the officiating as much as we were(okay, maybe not quite as much but...a lot).

[nickagneta]

I wonder when the last time two Celtics combined for 31 free throws in one game like Westbrook and Harden had last night. TPs to anyone that wants to look it up. I am guessing maybe during an IT game but if not then, when?

[seancally]

Commented earlier in the thread that we should have kept getting Tatum in a top-of-key iso against Harden in the middle of the 4th and gotten that 6th foul on him. When the starters came back in we started running our balanced offense, which is great, but Tatum got to the line a few possession in a row and Harden was playing with 5. Would have loved to foul him out with 6 minutes to go.

[86MaxwellSmart]

Crybaby Dantoni got all those BS calls.

[86MaxwellSmart]

That is the thing about the league today. You can play physical defense in the paint but you can't play physical defense on the perimeter against ball-handlers.

That is why it is a lot easier for Houston to play physical defense against their opponents (against players in the paint) than it is for opponents to play physical defense against Houston style of offense - iso ball ball-handlers 25 feet from the hoop.

The Rockets get to dictate physicality. It is hard for opponents to match that / to counter that because of the rules and how things are called on the perimeter (which is Houston's entire offense).

The issue for Boston is our scorers aren't as good at driving to the basket as Westbrook or Harden. Not as dynamic off the bounce. Do not put the same offensive pressure on. They can do it (score the ball) in other ways but those ways cause less foul-happy situations. Houston always likely to get the benefit of the whistle because their team is more built to exploit the rules.

I think it's a good point about perimeter versus paint defense. I also think Houston is actually pretty physical on the perimeter but they're smart about it - and teams that aren't used to attacking a switching defense have trouble beating them.

Example - Boston normally thrives on high picks and pick and rolls. Against Houston's switching defense that lets the Rockets build a wall of two or three players that our ballhandlers can't get past. The horns set is especially useless - or worse - by bunching up six players, unless our guys are very smart about slipping and the defenders blow a switch. The Cs' wings really struggled with the traffic jams. The one time they really did well was in the second part of the 2d quarter, where there was more straight attack off the dribble, where the blowby forced Houston to start rotating and we bent their defense into giving us an open shot. I think in a longer series they would figure it out - and Tatum and Kemba won't shoot 1-13 from 3! It also wouldn't hurt to have Rob Williams available. Kanter is just an absolute disaster against Houston.

I do have to give credit to Houston's D, though. They were very good.

I give credit to refs who let Houston play physical and called a bunch of non fouls or tacky tacky fouls on us. They really controlled the game.

Yup.

[gouki88]

I wonder when the last time two Celtics combined for 31 free throws in one game like Westbrook and Harden had last night. TPs to anyone that wants to look it up. I am guessing maybe during an IT game but if not then, when?

In 05-06 Pierce combined with Ricky Davis for 32 FTA against the Knicks, and with Gomes for 32 against the Raps. The closest I could find for IT (at least in the regular season) were numbers in the low-mid 20’s

[Donoghus]

I wonder when the last time two Celtics combined for 31 free throws in one game like Westbrook and Harden had last night. TPs to anyone that wants to look it up. I am guessing maybe during an IT game but if not then, when?

In 05-06 Pierce combined with Ricky Davis for 32 FTA against the Knicks, and with Gomes for 32 against the Raps. The closest I could find for IT (at least in the regular season) were numbers in the low-mid 20’s

What a hot mess that '05-'06 team was.  The 3 headed monster of Pierce, Ricky, & Wally World.

[gouki88]

I wonder when the last time two Celtics combined for 31 free throws in one game like Westbrook and Harden had last night. TPs to anyone that wants to look it up. I am guessing maybe during an IT game but if not then, when?

In 05-06 Pierce combined with Ricky Davis for 32 FTA against the Knicks, and with Gomes for 32 against the Raps. The closest I could find for IT (at least in the regular season) were numbers in the low-mid 20’s

What a hot mess that '05-'06 team was.  The 3 headed monster of Pierce, Ricky, & Wally World.

Yeah, definitely a mess. Delonte was solid that year (if I recall right), but there wasn’t much else joy outside of PP

[wiley]

terrible game....worst of it was the refs, number of calls...terrible watching.

as far as criticism, I did think that the two jays, while giving good effort, got a little caught up with their own star status..perhaps in response to playing against Harden/Westbrook...and as a result they were both forcing play on offense rather than probing patiently.

Overall that was the most individual oriented game the C's have played on offense in quite some time.

[RockinRyA]

Commented earlier in the thread that we should have kept getting Tatum in a top-of-key iso against Harden in the middle of the 4th and gotten that 6th foul on him. When the starters came back in we started running our balanced offense, which is great, but Tatum got to the line a few possession in a row and Harden was playing with 5. Would have loved to foul him out with 6 minutes to go.

Harden basically switched out of whoever was handling the ball, even to the point of conceding a basket