Poll: Who should be the starting PF

[SHAQATTACK]

haywards mental healing needs to be complete ,pro s  can't compete  at the highest level thinking about getting hurt all the time. , might as well retire if you do. PF is no place for fearing contact ,  no more KO 's please .

Grant is young and inexperienced  , but he loves the contact , he is smart , hard worker and will learn fast . .

[fairweatherfan]

I don't really know which way it will go but here's an interesting question: what's our 4/5 rotation? Kanter, and....

Timelord?
Grant?
Theis?
Poirier?
Wings (Hayward/Tatum)?

Seems like Wings+Williams to me with Theis as the 4th big or taking Grant's spot if he's not ready yet. But how does Poirier fit in?

[PhoSita]

I don't really know which way it will go but here's an interesting question: what's our 4/5 rotation? Kanter, and....

Timelord?
Grant?
Theis?
Poirier?
Wings (Hayward/Tatum)?

Seems like Wings+Williams to me with Theis as the 4th big or taking Grant's spot if he's not ready yet. But how does Poirier fit in?

Kanter starts, plays 20-24 mpg

Hayward starts at the 4 but ends up spending a lot of time at the 3 on the second unit, maybe 20-24 mpg at the 4.

I think Grant earns some time purely at the 4 straight away.  16-18 mpg.

Theis - Williams - Poirier will be a bit of a carousel depending on matchups and who is gaining the trust of the coaching staff in practice and whatever time they get, I think.  They'll make up the remaining 24-28 mpg at center.

Theis and Semi will probably get whatever minutes are left over at the 4.  Maybe Tatum will get some time there in smaller lineups.



That's my guess.

[Vermont Green]

I think people are overthinking the PF spot in regard to this roster.  The Celtics were a solid defensive team with Irving, Brown, Tatum, Hayward, and Horford on the court.  Unfortunately, their offensive rating was absolutely atrocious.

As I mentioned earlier, the success of this group largely boils down to their ability to score at a high level.  Concerns about the PF spot will become more of an issue in a playoff series against teams like Milwaukee or Philly.  Stevens will make things work during the regular season.

I checked 82games and that unit was only on the court for about 142 minutes last season and they weren't that good.  The most common unit was Irving-Smart-Tatum-Morris-Horford (495 min) and did better in terms of differential.  There were other good differential result units and most of then had Horford and another big (Theis, Baynes). 

The one "small" unit that did well had Smart in for Brown.

http://www.82games.com/1819/1819BOS2.HTM

[wdleehi]

I think Semi will start with G. Williams and Theis getting their chance to win the job.


But I also think whoever starts at PF at the start of the game will not be in the crunch time lineup (unless they can play C)



I still think the three swingmen are going to be staggered through out the game with all three playing together during the big moments at the end of halves. 

[saltlover]

I think people are overthinking the PF spot in regard to this roster.  The Celtics were a solid defensive team with Irving, Brown, Tatum, Hayward, and Horford on the court.  Unfortunately, their offensive rating was absolutely atrocious.

As I mentioned earlier, the success of this group largely boils down to their ability to score at a high level.  Concerns about the PF spot will become more of an issue in a playoff series against teams like Milwaukee or Philly.  Stevens will make things work during the regular season.

I checked 82games and that unit was only on the court for about 142 minutes last season and they weren't that good.  The most common unit was Irving-Smart-Tatum-Morris-Horford (495 min) and did better in terms of differential.  There were other good differential result units and most of then had Horford and another big (Theis, Baynes). 

The one "small" unit that did well had Smart in for Brown.

http://www.82games.com/1819/1819BOS2.HTM

The biggest takeaway should be that only two Celtics lineups saw 100 minutes together last season, so whatever lineups we’re debating here, we probably will see it for a little bit, but not for very long, because that just isn’t how Stevens operates with his regular season rotations.

[Vermont Green]

I think people are overthinking the PF spot in regard to this roster.  The Celtics were a solid defensive team with Irving, Brown, Tatum, Hayward, and Horford on the court.  Unfortunately, their offensive rating was absolutely atrocious.

As I mentioned earlier, the success of this group largely boils down to their ability to score at a high level.  Concerns about the PF spot will become more of an issue in a playoff series against teams like Milwaukee or Philly.  Stevens will make things work during the regular season.

I checked 82games and that unit was only on the court for about 142 minutes last season and they weren't that good.  The most common unit was Irving-Smart-Tatum-Morris-Horford (495 min) and did better in terms of differential.  There were other good differential result units and most of then had Horford and another big (Theis, Baynes). 

The one "small" unit that did well had Smart in for Brown.

http://www.82games.com/1819/1819BOS2.HTM

The biggest takeaway should be that only two Celtics lineups saw 100 minutes together last season, so whatever lineups we’re debating here, we probably will see it for a little bit, but not for very long, because that just isn’t how Stevens operates with his regular season rotations.

I agree with this but to me, the fact that the one unit that did have nearly 500 min. was the Morris-Horford front court, not a unit with a Tatum-Horford front courtj is what is telling.  That is the point relative to this thread for who will start at PF.  If Tatum does start at PF as many people predict, it will not be because it was so successful last season.

[seancally]

Walker-Brown-Hayward-Tatum-Kanter (or some other big at the 5).

Tatum will probably be more muscular next season, too.

[Green-18]

I think people are overthinking the PF spot in regard to this roster.  The Celtics were a solid defensive team with Irving, Brown, Tatum, Hayward, and Horford on the court.  Unfortunately, their offensive rating was absolutely atrocious.

As I mentioned earlier, the success of this group largely boils down to their ability to score at a high level.  Concerns about the PF spot will become more of an issue in a playoff series against teams like Milwaukee or Philly.  Stevens will make things work during the regular season.

I checked 82games and that unit was only on the court for about 142 minutes last season and they weren't that good.  The most common unit was Irving-Smart-Tatum-Morris-Horford (495 min) and did better in terms of differential.  There were other good differential result units and most of then had Horford and another big (Theis, Baynes). 

The one "small" unit that did well had Smart in for Brown.

http://www.82games.com/1819/1819BOS2.HTM

The 82 games data reinforces my point, unless I'm reading things incorrectly.  The original starting lineup posted a solid defensive rating.  People seem to be concerned about our defense in a lineup that features Tatum or Hayward at the 4.  I was trying to say that defense was not the reason for the failures of the Irving, Brown, Hayward, Tatum, and Horford lineup.  It was their inability to execute on offense that hurt them the most.

This brings me to the same conclusion, which is that our offensive efficiency will dictate whether or not a similar lineup can work next season.     

[wiley]

I think Semi will start with G. Williams and Theis getting their chance to win the job.


But I also think whoever starts at PF at the start of the game will not be in the crunch time lineup (unless they can play C)



I still think the three swingmen are going to be staggered through out the game with all three playing together during the big moments at the end of halves.

Kind of what I'm hoping.  Start Semi there for 5 minutes at the beginning of each half.  Any minutes beyond that for him dictated by his level of play...and then as you say whether he keeps that stint or has it taken by G. Williams or Theis is to be seen.

And then I think Brad will put Kemba, Smart, Brown, Hayward and Tatum on the floor sometimes at the end of games....with one of those wings on the bench and a true center (or G. Will/Theis)/Semi) depending on the situation. 

Hoping Semi makes a jump.  But it won't be easy as G. Williams really knows how to play. 

I don't like starting the game small and with poor defense. 

[Vermont Green]

I think people are overthinking the PF spot in regard to this roster.  The Celtics were a solid defensive team with Irving, Brown, Tatum, Hayward, and Horford on the court.  Unfortunately, their offensive rating was absolutely atrocious.

As I mentioned earlier, the success of this group largely boils down to their ability to score at a high level.  Concerns about the PF spot will become more of an issue in a playoff series against teams like Milwaukee or Philly.  Stevens will make things work during the regular season.

I checked 82games and that unit was only on the court for about 142 minutes last season and they weren't that good.  The most common unit was Irving-Smart-Tatum-Morris-Horford (495 min) and did better in terms of differential.  There were other good differential result units and most of then had Horford and another big (Theis, Baynes). 

The one "small" unit that did well had Smart in for Brown.

http://www.82games.com/1819/1819BOS2.HTM

The 82 games data reinforces my point, unless I'm reading things incorrectly.  The original starting lineup posted a solid defensive rating.  People seem to be concerned about our defense in a lineup that features Tatum or Hayward at the 4.  I was trying to say that defense was not the reason for the failures of the Irving, Brown, Hayward, Tatum, and Horford lineup.  It was their inability to execute on offense that hurt them the most.

This brings me to the same conclusion, which is that our offensive efficiency will dictate whether or not a similar lineup can work next season.     

Don't disagree.  My point is just that the Tatum at PF line ups were not very common last season nor were they very successful, for whatever reason.  This is all just single season aggregated numbers and no one should be forming broad opinions based on them.  I just really don't like seeing Tatum play out of position.  He is a wing and we should play him as a wing with two bigs on the court with him in most cases, just like last season.  To the extent that these numbers show anything though they show in general our best line-ups were Horford with another big, not Horford and Tatum.

[Bobshot]

Tatum's left out, and he's the logical choice for the 4. He has the size for the 4, and should be stronger this year. Hayward is a 3. Robert is a 5. The others should come off the bench as 4s.

[rondofan1255]

I voted for Grant Williams, 15 minutes per game. Comparable to LAC starting Zubac last year and having backups play the majority of the minutes.

[liam]

Tacko should be the power forward with someone taller at Center!

[Who]

I voted for Grant Williams, 15 minutes per game. Comparable to LAC starting Zubac last year and having backups play the majority of the minutes.

I would have been open to that if we had a jump-shooting center (like Vucevic) next to him but I just do not believe Grant Williams and Enes Kanter or Poirier can provide enough floor spacing to be effective enough together.