Five “most important” Lakers historically

[Celtics4ever]

Celtics
1. Auerbach
2. Russell
3. Pierce
4. Bird
5. Hondo

Lakers
1. George Mikan brought what 5  titles?
2. Kobe is next
3. Magic
4. Kareem
5.  West because he was a great player and GM for them

[nickagneta]

Regarding the Celtics, if it's the most "important" Celtics and not just best Celtic players, how can people not have Tommy Heinsohn on that list? 8 time champion in 9 years as a player. 2 time champion in 9 years as a coach. A 30 year career as a color commentator for the team. He will end up being a Hall of Famer 3 different times when he gets in as a television/media person.

1. Red
2. Russell
3. Bird
4. Cousy
5. Heinsohn

i think most people are judging this just based on their playing resume, at least i was.  If we're including coaching and front office accomplishments then yes that changes things.  I know Jerry West would move up on my lakers list.

As far as Tommy goes, I have a hard time regarding him as a most important player, yes, he was an 8 time champion, but how many of those go away if Russell isnt on the team?  If we swapped Tommy for another all star player, same position, do we still win 8 titles in 9 years.  If we lost Bill Russell but replaced him with another all star center are the celtics as successful?  I guarantee you we wouldnt be, not even close, not unless his name is Wilt.   I know this isnt a Russell/Heinsohn comparison but Im just trying to illustrate importance.  I love Tommy, but he was probably a replaceable componet on those teams

I think thats why no one mentioned James Worthy on their Lakers list, hes a great player, but I think if you swap him with another all star player, the Lakers dont lose too much.  But swap Magic Johnson with another all star and I dont think you can say the same thing

I think you're missing the point.

No, Heinsohn wasn't the most important player for the team's success during that run, but he was important. But then you couple that with him being the 2nd best coach in franchise history and 30 years in television broadcasting for the Celtics, being one of the 2 voices of the Celtics in the television era, and I think he hits top 5 most important. Regarding that last part, think about how important Johnny Most was to this franchise being the voice of the Celtics during the radio era. That's what Tommy is to recent generations of Celtics fans.

[Celtics4ever]

Yeah, I almost put Tommy in my top five and truly he was the soul of the franchise for many years.   You convinced me of my error, I drop Hondo for Tommy.

I do think Hondo is the sixth guy though because he bridged the champs of the 60s to the 70s but so did Tommy.

[liam]

Regarding the Celtics, if it's the most "important" Celtics and not just best Celtic players, how can people not have Tommy Heinsohn on that list? 8 time champion in 9 years as a player. 2 time champion in 9 years as a coach. A 30 year career as a color commentator for the team. He will end up being a Hall of Famer 3 different times when he gets in as a television/media person.

1. Red
2. Russell
3. Bird
4. Cousy
5. Heinsohn

i think most people are judging this just based on their playing resume, at least i was.  If we're including coaching and front office accomplishments then yes that changes things.  I know Jerry West would move up on my lakers list.

As far as Tommy goes, I have a hard time regarding him as a most important player, yes, he was an 8 time champion, but how many of those go away if Russell isnt on the team?  If we swapped Tommy for another all star player, same position, do we still win 8 titles in 9 years.  If we lost Bill Russell but replaced him with another all star center are the celtics as successful?  I guarantee you we wouldnt be, not even close, not unless his name is Wilt.   I know this isnt a Russell/Heinsohn comparison but Im just trying to illustrate importance.  I love Tommy, but he was probably a replaceable componet on those teams

I think thats why no one mentioned James Worthy on their Lakers list, hes a great player, but I think if you swap him with another all star player, the Lakers dont lose too much.  But swap Magic Johnson with another all star and I dont think you can say the same thing

I think you're missing the point.

No, Heinsohn wasn't the most important player for the team's success during that run, but he was important. But then you couple that with him being the 2nd best coach in franchise history and 30 years in television broadcasting for the Celtics, being one of the 2 voices of the Celtics in the television era, and I think he hits top 5 most important. Regarding that last part, think about how important Johnny Most was to this franchise being the voice of the Celtics during the radio era. That's what Tommy is to recent generations of Celtics fans.

Johnny Most taught us all how to hate the Pistons, Sixers, Lakers etc.....

[gouki88]

Regarding the Celtics, if it's the most "important" Celtics and not just best Celtic players, how can people not have Tommy Heinsohn on that list? 8 time champion in 9 years as a player. 2 time champion in 9 years as a coach. A 30 year career as a color commentator for the team. He will end up being a Hall of Famer 3 different times when he gets in as a television/media person.

1. Red
2. Russell
3. Bird
4. Cousy
5. Heinsohn

i think most people are judging this just based on their playing resume, at least i was.  If we're including coaching and front office accomplishments then yes that changes things.  I know Jerry West would move up on my lakers list.

As far as Tommy goes, I have a hard time regarding him as a most important player, yes, he was an 8 time champion, but how many of those go away if Russell isnt on the team?  If we swapped Tommy for another all star player, same position, do we still win 8 titles in 9 years.  If we lost Bill Russell but replaced him with another all star center are the celtics as successful?  I guarantee you we wouldnt be, not even close, not unless his name is Wilt.   I know this isnt a Russell/Heinsohn comparison but Im just trying to illustrate importance.  I love Tommy, but he was probably a replaceable componet on those teams

I think thats why no one mentioned James Worthy on their Lakers list, hes a great player, but I think if you swap him with another all star player, the Lakers dont lose too much.  But swap Magic Johnson with another all star and I dont think you can say the same thing

I think you're missing the point.

No, Heinsohn wasn't the most important player for the team's success during that run, but he was important. But then you couple that with him being the 2nd best coach in franchise history and 30 years in television broadcasting for the Celtics, being one of the 2 voices of the Celtics in the television era, and I think he hits top 5 most important. Regarding that last part, think about how important Johnny Most was to this franchise being the voice of the Celtics during the radio era. That's what Tommy is to recent generations of Celtics fans.

That's a good point about Tommy. His off-court contribution to the Celtics are insane. Been the voice of them for decades, alongside two handfuls of championship rings as a player and coach. What a man

[greg683x]

Regarding the Celtics, if it's the most "important" Celtics and not just best Celtic players, how can people not have Tommy Heinsohn on that list? 8 time champion in 9 years as a player. 2 time champion in 9 years as a coach. A 30 year career as a color commentator for the team. He will end up being a Hall of Famer 3 different times when he gets in as a television/media person.

1. Red
2. Russell
3. Bird
4. Cousy
5. Heinsohn

i think most people are judging this just based on their playing resume, at least i was.  If we're including coaching and front office accomplishments then yes that changes things.  I know Jerry West would move up on my lakers list.

As far as Tommy goes, I have a hard time regarding him as a most important player, yes, he was an 8 time champion, but how many of those go away if Russell isnt on the team?  If we swapped Tommy for another all star player, same position, do we still win 8 titles in 9 years.  If we lost Bill Russell but replaced him with another all star center are the celtics as successful?  I guarantee you we wouldnt be, not even close, not unless his name is Wilt.   I know this isnt a Russell/Heinsohn comparison but Im just trying to illustrate importance.  I love Tommy, but he was probably a replaceable componet on those teams

I think thats why no one mentioned James Worthy on their Lakers list, hes a great player, but I think if you swap him with another all star player, the Lakers dont lose too much.  But swap Magic Johnson with another all star and I dont think you can say the same thing

I think you're missing the point.

No, Heinsohn wasn't the most important player for the team's success during that run, but he was important. But then you couple that with him being the 2nd best coach in franchise history and 30 years in television broadcasting for the Celtics, being one of the 2 voices of the Celtics in the television era, and I think he hits top 5 most important. Regarding that last part, think about how important Johnny Most was to this franchise being the voice of the Celtics during the radio era. That's what Tommy is to recent generations of Celtics fans.

Not missing the point, Like I said in my post, I was judging this based on playing resume and I think a lot of others were as well. If we’re including coaching, front office and color commentary, I think that would change a lot of peoples top 5, the point you brought up about tommy definitely applies, and red would undoubtedly be #1.   You would then have to argue that KC Jones would have to make the list because of the titles he won as a player and as a coach spanning multiple eras.    That’s why I think all these other variables should be separated because when it’s all said and done there might not even be room for Larry Bird on the list bc he didn’t coach here.

[Lakers are the Best]

My list:
Mikan
West
Kareem
Magic
Kobe

Honorable mentions:
Shaq
LeBron

A few more:
Baylor
Wilt
Worthy
Gasol
AD

Coaching:
Riley
Phil

Commentating:
Hearn

[Lakers are the Best]

Celtics
1. Auerbach
2. Russell
3. Pierce
4. Bird
5. Hondo

Lakers
1. George Mikan brought what 5  titles?
2. Kobe is next
3. Magic
4. Kareem
5.  West because he was a great player and GM for them

I like the way you think. Our top 5 are identical.
Yes, Mikan brought 5, plus one additional uncounted NBL title in 1948, before the NBA was founded.

[Roy H.]

Celtics
1. Auerbach
2. Russell
3. Pierce
4. Bird
5. Hondo

Lakers
1. George Mikan brought what 5  titles?
2. Kobe is next
3. Magic
4. Kareem
5.  West because he was a great player and GM for them

I like the way you think. Our top 5 are identical.
Yes, Mikan brought 5, plus one additional uncounted NBL title in 1948, before the NBA was founded.

I don’t see how Kobe rates above Magic.  The kid road Shaw’s coattails to three titles and then contributed to breaking up a dynasty,  whereas Magic was the man for all five championships that he won.

[Roy H.]

Jerry West is salty about the list:

“I saw the other day Jeanie Buss made a statement, the five most important Lakers, one of the most offensive things I’ve ever heard in my life. I was there a lot of times, had a lot of success,” West told Vescey. “Be curious to know if they would have had that success if I hadn’t been there.”

“And I don’t ever take credit for stuff, I don’t. When I was around, maybe I was just a good luck charm,” West went on. “But I do know, that when this thing fell apart, there was a lot of years where they weren’t very good.”

My guess is that there is some long-standing personal beef there.

[Donoghus]

Jerry West is salty about the list:

“I saw the other day Jeanie Buss made a statement, the five most important Lakers, one of the most offensive things I’ve ever heard in my life. I was there a lot of times, had a lot of success,” West told Vescey. “Be curious to know if they would have had that success if I hadn’t been there.”

“And I don’t ever take credit for stuff, I don’t. When I was around, maybe I was just a good luck charm,” West went on. “But I do know, that when this thing fell apart, there was a lot of years where they weren’t very good.”

My guess is that there is some long-standing personal beef there.

There has to be. I just don't see how Jerry West doesn't make the top 5 list in any manner.  Obviously, as a player, he is one of the most significant figures in their history.  Then you add his achievements as a team executive?  No brainer to me.   He's had his hands involved, one way or another, in almost all the team's titles.

[slamtheking]

Celtics
1. Auerbach
2. Russell
3. Pierce
4. Bird
5. Hondo

Lakers
1. George Mikan brought what 5  titles?
2. Kobe is next
3. Magic
4. Kareem
5.  West because he was a great player and GM for them

I like the way you think. Our top 5 are identical.
Yes, Mikan brought 5, plus one additional uncounted NBL title in 1948, before the NBA was founded.

I don’t see how Kobe rates above Magic.  The kid road Shaw’s coattails to three titles and then contributed to breaking up a dynasty,  whereas Magic was the man for all five championships that he won.

that and Bird is #3 for the C's behind only Red and Russell.  3 titles, 2 other finals appearances.  Rescued this franchise from the lows of the Wicks/Lowe period.  I'd also argue Hondo at 4 and Heinsohn at 5 for his titles as a player and coach (not to mention decades as a broadcaster).

for the Lakers, I'd drop Kobe completely, shift everyone in that order up one spot and add Shaq as 5.  Shaq was the reason for the first 3 titles Kobe won and Pau was the reason for the last 2.

[Kernewek]

Celtics
1. Auerbach
2. Russell
3. Pierce
4. Bird
5. Hondo

Lakers
1. George Mikan brought what 5  titles?
2. Kobe is next
3. Magic
4. Kareem
5.  West because he was a great player and GM for them

I like the way you think. Our top 5 are identical.
Yes, Mikan brought 5, plus one additional uncounted NBL title in 1948, before the NBA was founded.

I don’t see how Kobe rates above Magic.  The kid road Shaw’s coattails to three titles and then contributed to breaking up a dynasty,  whereas Magic was the man for all five championships that he won.

Have to agree with this (presuming you mean Shaq and not the spellbinding Brian Shaw).

However, I don't agree with Mikan's placement on the quoted list but that's mostly because on-the-court accomplishments aren't what I would qualify as "most important". I can see why some would.

[Moranis]

Celtics
1. Auerbach
2. Russell
3. Pierce
4. Bird
5. Hondo

Lakers
1. George Mikan brought what 5  titles?
2. Kobe is next
3. Magic
4. Kareem
5.  West because he was a great player and GM for them

I like the way you think. Our top 5 are identical.
Yes, Mikan brought 5, plus one additional uncounted NBL title in 1948, before the NBA was founded.

I don’t see how Kobe rates above Magic.  The kid road Shaw’s coattails to three titles and then contributed to breaking up a dynasty,  whereas Magic was the man for all five championships that he won.

The simple truth is Kobe was there for ever.  He is 3rd in rebounds, 2nd in assists, and 5th in blocks, but basically is the franchise leader in every other category, and by a pretty wide margin in most of them.  He won 5 titles with 2 other Finals appearances and won 2 Finals MVP's.

And I certainly disagree that Magic was better than Kareem early on.  I mean Kareem was the League MVP in 1980.  He missed the last game in the Finals, which is why Magic won the Finals MVP, but the first 5 games, Kareem dominated Magic statistically and in the crucial game 5, Kareem went for 40 and 15 with 4 blocks.  In 82, they were of a pretty similar value.  And Kareem actually won the 85 Finals MVP, though Magic was the better player that year. 

I don't think there is a right answer when comparing the value of Magic, Kareem, and Kobe to the Lakers.  Without any of those guys, they probably don't have 10 of their titles as Magic did not win without Kareem

[Jamilmac99]

Here's my top five of Lakers/Celtics:

Celtics:
1) Russell
2) Bird
3) Cousy
4) McHale- he has to make this list. we're talking about one of the most dominant low post players of ALL-TIME.
5) Pierce (someone put Pierce above Bird, my God???- Pierce wins zero titles without KG, actually maybe KG should be here)

Honorable mention- Cowens, KG, Chief!

Lakers:

1) Jabbar- greatest center of ALL TIME
2) Magic- he's either 1 or 2 so I put him at 2
3) Kobe
4) Shaq
5) West

Honorable mention- Worthy!, Wilt (didn't play long enough), Lebron (with more titles he's in the discussion)

Absolutely does not count- Mikan!! He played for the Minneapolis Lakers. That does not count.