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Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1500 on: May 01, 2018, 11:53:22 AM »

Offline Monkhouse

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I expect the Raptors to destroy the Cavs in Game 1, but I can still see LeBron pushing his body to the last limits to force game 6. I think the Raptors will win, but they will definitely be tired. They always seem to shrink underneath LeBron's aggression on the court, so we'll see if they have the inner resolve.
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Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1501 on: May 01, 2018, 11:54:09 AM »

Offline Moranis

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I expect the Raptors to win. LBJ exhausted himself to beat a lesser team in the Pacers. He's going to get worn down against the Raptors.

Meanwhile the Cavs defense is bad, and they aren't as susceptible to the junk high double like Oladipo was. If you try that against he Raptors as more than a change up mid game they'll pick you apart.
The Raptors are a jump shooting team.  They have no one with the ball skills that Oladipo has.  Thus, the Cavs below average defense will be much more suited to stopping the Raptors then they were to stopping the Pacers.  The Raptors also have no one that can even pretend to guard James.  The Pacers could give him a lot of strong and varied defensive looks, the Raptors can't. 
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Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1502 on: May 01, 2018, 12:18:05 PM »

Offline Green-18

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I expect the Raptors to win. LBJ exhausted himself to beat a lesser team in the Pacers. He's going to get worn down against the Raptors.

Meanwhile the Cavs defense is bad, and they aren't as susceptible to the junk high double like Oladipo was. If you try that against he Raptors as more than a change up mid game they'll pick you apart.
The Raptors are a jump shooting team.  They have no one with the ball skills that Oladipo has.  Thus, the Cavs below average defense will be much more suited to stopping the Raptors then they were to stopping the Pacers.  The Raptors also have no one that can even pretend to guard James.  The Pacers could give him a lot of strong and varied defensive looks, the Raptors can't.

This has nothing to do with your response but isn't Oladipo absolutely disgusting off the dribble?  It's like watching a composed version of Russell Westbrook.  As an NBA fan he's probably my favorite non-Celtic at the moment. 

Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1503 on: May 01, 2018, 01:01:34 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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I expect the Raptors to win. LBJ exhausted himself to beat a lesser team in the Pacers. He's going to get worn down against the Raptors.

Meanwhile the Cavs defense is bad, and they aren't as susceptible to the junk high double like Oladipo was. If you try that against he Raptors as more than a change up mid game they'll pick you apart.
The Raptors are a jump shooting team.  They have no one with the ball skills that Oladipo has.  Thus, the Cavs below average defense will be much more suited to stopping the Raptors then they were to stopping the Pacers.  The Raptors also have no one that can even pretend to guard James.  The Pacers could give him a lot of strong and varied defensive looks, the Raptors can't.

What do you think of the Cavs being 6.5 point underdogs tonight? 3.5 to 1 to win the east? I know you were regularly referencing the odds earlier in the season when Cleveland was the favorite. They now have the 3rd worst odds of winning the east of the teams left (only ahead of us and our missing 3 starters).

I am genuinely curious why you think the oddsmakers have turned on them when they have been the darlings of lines ever since Lebron returned to Cleveland.

Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1504 on: May 01, 2018, 01:08:41 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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I think Toronto will win game 1, however if the Cavs win I expect a sweep as that will absolutely break Toronto.  As I said I expect the Raptors to win game 1 (and also game 5), and that the Cavs will win the series in 6 (Games 2, 3, 4, 6)

I didn't see this before i wrote my last reply. If you really believe a Cleveland sweep is possible you should absolutely put a little juice behind this. The odds given for a Cavs Sweep are currently 30 to 1. You can win 3k on a hundred dollar bet. If you think it goes to a gentleman's Sweep the Cavs are still 15-1. You are about 100x more bullish on the Cavs than just about anyone. (Would certainly suck if you were right, I might have to put down 20 bucks myself to emotionally hedge how unbearable the board would become with a Cavs sweep.)

Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1505 on: May 01, 2018, 01:20:00 PM »

Offline Green-18

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I expect the Raptors to win. LBJ exhausted himself to beat a lesser team in the Pacers. He's going to get worn down against the Raptors.

Meanwhile the Cavs defense is bad, and they aren't as susceptible to the junk high double like Oladipo was. If you try that against he Raptors as more than a change up mid game they'll pick you apart.
The Raptors are a jump shooting team.  They have no one with the ball skills that Oladipo has.  Thus, the Cavs below average defense will be much more suited to stopping the Raptors then they were to stopping the Pacers.  The Raptors also have no one that can even pretend to guard James.  The Pacers could give him a lot of strong and varied defensive looks, the Raptors can't.

What do you think of the Cavs being 6.5 point underdogs tonight? 3.5 to 1 to win the east? I know you were regularly referencing the odds earlier in the season when Cleveland was the favorite. They now have the 3rd worst odds of winning the east of the teams left (only ahead of us and our missing 3 starters).

I am genuinely curious why you think the oddsmakers have turned on them when they have been the darlings of lines ever since Lebron returned to Cleveland.

I expect the Raptors to win. LBJ exhausted himself to beat a lesser team in the Pacers. He's going to get worn down against the Raptors.

Meanwhile the Cavs defense is bad, and they aren't as susceptible to the junk high double like Oladipo was. If you try that against he Raptors as more than a change up mid game they'll pick you apart.
The Raptors are a jump shooting team.  They have no one with the ball skills that Oladipo has.  Thus, the Cavs below average defense will be much more suited to stopping the Raptors then they were to stopping the Pacers.  The Raptors also have no one that can even pretend to guard James.  The Pacers could give him a lot of strong and varied defensive looks, the Raptors can't.

What do you think of the Cavs being 6.5 point underdogs tonight? 3.5 to 1 to win the east? I know you were regularly referencing the odds earlier in the season when Cleveland was the favorite. They now have the 3rd worst odds of winning the east of the teams left (only ahead of us and our missing 3 starters).

I am genuinely curious why you think the oddsmakers have turned on them when they have been the darlings of lines ever since Lebron returned to Cleveland.

They should be underdogs regardless but this is a case where I believes the odds are being heavily influenced by the public narrative.  The odds makers are trying to ensure that they can profit on both sides of the spread.  The Philly winning streak, Toronto being a convincing #1 seed, and the drama in Cleveland all came together to influence the betting lines.  ESPN coverage is painting a picture of LeBron having his back against the wall.  This is true but over exaggerated IMIO.
 
This is a flawed comparison on my part but the 2010 NBA playoff odds come to mind.  Deep down I always had faith in the Celtics ability to "flip the switch".  I also didn't think the competition in the East was particularly strong.  The regular season was mediocre by the Celtics standards and they went into the playoffs at +400 to win the East.  I don't bet on my own team but I thought those were excellent odds at the time.   

Realistically I think a +4.5 line would be more realistic for the Cavs on the road.   

Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1506 on: May 01, 2018, 01:22:28 PM »

Offline celticinorlando

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1. Cavs win tonight they will win the series

2. If the Cavs win the east...they might lose every game in the finals by 20 plus points.

Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1507 on: May 01, 2018, 01:27:09 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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I expect the Raptors to win. LBJ exhausted himself to beat a lesser team in the Pacers. He's going to get worn down against the Raptors.

Meanwhile the Cavs defense is bad, and they aren't as susceptible to the junk high double like Oladipo was. If you try that against he Raptors as more than a change up mid game they'll pick you apart.
The Raptors are a jump shooting team.  They have no one with the ball skills that Oladipo has.  Thus, the Cavs below average defense will be much more suited to stopping the Raptors then they were to stopping the Pacers.  The Raptors also have no one that can even pretend to guard James.  The Pacers could give him a lot of strong and varied defensive looks, the Raptors can't.

What do you think of the Cavs being 6.5 point underdogs tonight? 3.5 to 1 to win the east? I know you were regularly referencing the odds earlier in the season when Cleveland was the favorite. They now have the 3rd worst odds of winning the east of the teams left (only ahead of us and our missing 3 starters).

I am genuinely curious why you think the oddsmakers have turned on them when they have been the darlings of lines ever since Lebron returned to Cleveland.

I expect the Raptors to win. LBJ exhausted himself to beat a lesser team in the Pacers. He's going to get worn down against the Raptors.

Meanwhile the Cavs defense is bad, and they aren't as susceptible to the junk high double like Oladipo was. If you try that against he Raptors as more than a change up mid game they'll pick you apart.
The Raptors are a jump shooting team.  They have no one with the ball skills that Oladipo has.  Thus, the Cavs below average defense will be much more suited to stopping the Raptors then they were to stopping the Pacers.  The Raptors also have no one that can even pretend to guard James.  The Pacers could give him a lot of strong and varied defensive looks, the Raptors can't.

What do you think of the Cavs being 6.5 point underdogs tonight? 3.5 to 1 to win the east? I know you were regularly referencing the odds earlier in the season when Cleveland was the favorite. They now have the 3rd worst odds of winning the east of the teams left (only ahead of us and our missing 3 starters).

I am genuinely curious why you think the oddsmakers have turned on them when they have been the darlings of lines ever since Lebron returned to Cleveland.

They should be underdogs regardless but this is a case where I believes the odds are being heavily influenced by the public narrative.  The odds makers are trying to ensure that they can profit on both sides of the spread.  The Philly winning streak, Toronto being a convincing #1 seed, and the drama in Cleveland all came together to influence the betting lines.  ESPN coverage is painting a picture of LeBron having his back against the wall.  This is true but over exaggerated IMIO.
 
This is a flawed comparison on my part but the 2010 NBA playoff odds come to mind.  Deep down I always had faith in the Celtics ability to "flip the switch".  I also didn't think the competition in the East was particularly strong.  The regular season was mediocre by the Celtics standards and they went into the playoffs at +400 to win the East.  I don't bet on my own team but I thought those were excellent odds at the time.   

Realistically I think a +4.5 line would be more realistic for the Cavs on the road.   

You really think the odds makers have to give people better odds to get them to bet on Cleveland? Pretty interesting take...

Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1508 on: May 01, 2018, 01:27:14 PM »

Offline Green-18

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1. Cavs win tonight they will win the series

2. If the Cavs win the east...they might lose every game in the finals by 20 plus points.

lol It's so true.  I don't like anyone in the East against Golden State or Houston but the Cavs will definitely put up the worst fight in the Finals.  All of their bad habits and poor team play will get exposed.

Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1509 on: May 01, 2018, 01:29:51 PM »

Offline Moranis

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I expect the Raptors to win. LBJ exhausted himself to beat a lesser team in the Pacers. He's going to get worn down against the Raptors.

Meanwhile the Cavs defense is bad, and they aren't as susceptible to the junk high double like Oladipo was. If you try that against he Raptors as more than a change up mid game they'll pick you apart.
The Raptors are a jump shooting team.  They have no one with the ball skills that Oladipo has.  Thus, the Cavs below average defense will be much more suited to stopping the Raptors then they were to stopping the Pacers.  The Raptors also have no one that can even pretend to guard James.  The Pacers could give him a lot of strong and varied defensive looks, the Raptors can't.

What do you think of the Cavs being 6.5 point underdogs tonight? 3.5 to 1 to win the east? I know you were regularly referencing the odds earlier in the season when Cleveland was the favorite. They now have the 3rd worst odds of winning the east of the teams left (only ahead of us and our missing 3 starters).

I am genuinely curious why you think the oddsmakers have turned on them when they have been the darlings of lines ever since Lebron returned to Cleveland.
6.5 tonight seems about right for tonight given Cleveland got pushed to 7 games and the Raptors have been sitting at home for 4 days (which shouldn't be enough for rust to really set it, but is long enough to give them a real rest advantage). 

As for the overall odds, they are based on bettors and with the Cavs coming off of a tough series in which only James realized the Cavs were playing games, they just haven't looked that good of late, which sways bettors.  The Cavs and Raptors also have to go through each other and then likely Philly, while Philly "only" has the depleted Celtics.  Matchups matter to bettors. 

As I've been saying since last series, the Pacers are a horrid matchup for the Cavs given Oladipo's superb ball skills.  The Cavs, especially with Hill banged up, quite simply have no one that can pretend to defend Oladipo when he gets going to the basket.  With Oladipo having his way, he was able to find the open shooters which also affected how that series went, but make no mistake whatever the Cavs defensive troubles were with the Pacers, they were all because of Oladipo.  The Raptors have no one like Oladipo.  They won't be able to capitalize on that weakness of the Cavs because they just don't have anyone capable of capitalizing on it.  And as we've seen time and time again, the Raptors have no one that can even pretend to guard James.  James always has a field day against the Raptors and quite frankly I can't imagine that the rest of the Cavs play as consistently poorly as they did against the Pacers.  I mean in the 7 games, James was the only Cav with a  20 point game.  Love was the 2nd leading scorer at 11.4 a game and he generally played like crap (I think his hand is bothering him so that may continue). 

EDIT.  As I said, I think the series goes 6, but if the Cavs somehow pull out the win tonight, the series is over.  A loss tonight would break and destroy the Raptors. 
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Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1510 on: May 01, 2018, 01:34:07 PM »

Offline Green-18

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I expect the Raptors to win. LBJ exhausted himself to beat a lesser team in the Pacers. He's going to get worn down against the Raptors.

Meanwhile the Cavs defense is bad, and they aren't as susceptible to the junk high double like Oladipo was. If you try that against he Raptors as more than a change up mid game they'll pick you apart.
The Raptors are a jump shooting team.  They have no one with the ball skills that Oladipo has.  Thus, the Cavs below average defense will be much more suited to stopping the Raptors then they were to stopping the Pacers.  The Raptors also have no one that can even pretend to guard James.  The Pacers could give him a lot of strong and varied defensive looks, the Raptors can't.

What do you think of the Cavs being 6.5 point underdogs tonight? 3.5 to 1 to win the east? I know you were regularly referencing the odds earlier in the season when Cleveland was the favorite. They now have the 3rd worst odds of winning the east of the teams left (only ahead of us and our missing 3 starters).

I am genuinely curious why you think the oddsmakers have turned on them when they have been the darlings of lines ever since Lebron returned to Cleveland.

I expect the Raptors to win. LBJ exhausted himself to beat a lesser team in the Pacers. He's going to get worn down against the Raptors.

Meanwhile the Cavs defense is bad, and they aren't as susceptible to the junk high double like Oladipo was. If you try that against he Raptors as more than a change up mid game they'll pick you apart.
The Raptors are a jump shooting team.  They have no one with the ball skills that Oladipo has.  Thus, the Cavs below average defense will be much more suited to stopping the Raptors then they were to stopping the Pacers.  The Raptors also have no one that can even pretend to guard James.  The Pacers could give him a lot of strong and varied defensive looks, the Raptors can't.

What do you think of the Cavs being 6.5 point underdogs tonight? 3.5 to 1 to win the east? I know you were regularly referencing the odds earlier in the season when Cleveland was the favorite. They now have the 3rd worst odds of winning the east of the teams left (only ahead of us and our missing 3 starters).

I am genuinely curious why you think the oddsmakers have turned on them when they have been the darlings of lines ever since Lebron returned to Cleveland.

They should be underdogs regardless but this is a case where I believes the odds are being heavily influenced by the public narrative.  The odds makers are trying to ensure that they can profit on both sides of the spread.  The Philly winning streak, Toronto being a convincing #1 seed, and the drama in Cleveland all came together to influence the betting lines.  ESPN coverage is painting a picture of LeBron having his back against the wall.  This is true but over exaggerated IMIO.
 
This is a flawed comparison on my part but the 2010 NBA playoff odds come to mind.  Deep down I always had faith in the Celtics ability to "flip the switch".  I also didn't think the competition in the East was particularly strong.  The regular season was mediocre by the Celtics standards and they went into the playoffs at +400 to win the East.  I don't bet on my own team but I thought those were excellent odds at the time.   

Realistically I think a +4.5 line would be more realistic for the Cavs on the road.   

You really think the odds makers have to give people better odds to get them to bet on Cleveland? Pretty interesting take...

In this rare case I would say yes, at least for game 1 of the series.  All of the public headlines are along the lines of "can LeBron overcome the Raptors"?  I think you could argue that the Raptors historically mediocre game 1 performances should even things out to a certain degree.

LeBron also tends to rise to occasion in recent years unless he is faced with insurmountable odds. 

Who knows though.  I could be complete off base.  I pick the Raptors to win 104-101 tonight.

Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1511 on: May 01, 2018, 02:11:55 PM »

Offline Donoghus

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Kinda eye-opening

Quote
OddsShark

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Looking for a juicy betting nugget for tonight? How about this one: For his career, LeBron James is just 2-11 SU & ATS when playing Game 1 of a playoff series on the road.


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Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1512 on: May 01, 2018, 02:48:55 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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What's with these new start times for some of the upcoming games in Round 2?

Cavs-Raptors game starting at 6 PM EST on Thursday?

Our game 3 vs the Sixers starting at 6 PM EST on Monday?

Do they want to kill ratings for some of these games? A lot of people on the east coast won't be home in time from work for these tip-offs, and west coast people will still be at work!

Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1513 on: May 01, 2018, 02:50:56 PM »

Offline Green-18

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Kinda eye-opening

Quote
OddsShark

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Looking for a juicy betting nugget for tonight? How about this one: For his career, LeBron James is just 2-11 SU & ATS when playing Game 1 of a playoff series on the road.

That definitely justifies the spread tonight.  I decided to look at Lebron's record in road game 1's starting with his first year in Miami.

1. Lost to the Bulls in 2011
2. Lost to OKC in 2012
3. Lost to Indy in 2014
4. Lost to San Antonio in 2014
5. Beat Atlanta in 2015
6. Lost to the Warriors in 2015
7. Lost to Warriors in 2016
8. Beat Celtics in 2017
9. Lost to Warriors in 2017

He's 0-5 on the road in the Finals.  That puts him at 2-2 within the Eastern Conference.  The Celtics and Hawks were no doubt weaker opponents than Chicago or Indiana.  For some reason I really don't trust the Raptors with their game 1 struggles.  I think they will win but it will come down to the wire. 



Re: NBA 2018 Playoffs Thread
« Reply #1514 on: May 01, 2018, 08:11:22 PM »

Offline Moranis

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Lue is so bad. Thompson has a great game and they play a team with a big traditional center and a tall PF and he decides to start Love at center, LeBron, and 3 guards.
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