Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page 10

[ozgod]

Gary Washburn's thoughts:

There comes a time where you have to invest in your investments, you have to overpay players who are loyal and valuable. It may come back to haunt you in the end, but that’s how you keep an organization relevant. Everything in the NBA can’t be done with total ration, and the Celtics have been so rational over the past five years that they have been burned by their conservatism.

They didn’t want to invest enough assets to get Anthony Davis, which was the right move, but now they want to pay Horford exactly what they feel he’s worth and, of course, he believes he’s worth more.

There remains time. The Celtics could call Horford’s representatives and strike up a new deal, if they add a fourth year. Horford would be 37 at the end of such a deal, but he takes good care of himself and is capable of playing four productive years.

However, his salary in the final years of that contract would likely be a salary-cap anchor. That’s the way the NBA is. You pay your debts on the back end for services provided on the front end.

Forcing Horford into free agency may be an astute move for the Celtics, but right now it feels as if the family is bring broken up, the voice of reason is departing, the one player the Celtics could consistently rely upon is headed elsewhere because other teams appreciate him more.

It’s about time the Celtics take some chances. And this chance is the most likely to work in the end. Horford was a guaranteed 13 points and seven rebounds each night, and he fought off recurring knee pain and other ailments to become a staple in the lineup.

Of course, he will age. He won’t be the player at 35 that he was at 33, and that contract could be regrettable, but the alternative is watching quality veterans walk away with no compensation. To see Horford sign with an Eastern Conference contender and make a title run would be painful for Celtics faithful.

So the organization has about two weeks to make a decision. It can step up its offer and re-sign a player who truly enjoys Boston, and then chase other pieces to help maintain respectability.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/celtics/2019/06/18/celtics-must-take-chances-before-all-falls-apart/OGKTPFAWkcVd4QhVmlBgGK/story.html

[Roy H.]

What happened in a matter of three hours? Went from this is a good thing for both Al and boston to extended the term to he walked away. Makes no sense.

It could be that Danny low-balled him.  If you remember, that's the thing that really upset Al in his negotiations with Atlanta.

Or, it could be that another team leaked a big four-year offer to Horford's agent that changed his analysis completely.

Or, it could just be posturing.

[Kuberski33]

You don't opt out of 32 million dollars unless you know you can make it all up and then some.

He's got an agreement in place from another team.  That's the only way you abruptly walk away. Guessing it's either Milwaukee or the Clippers.

How can the Bucks afford him? They are cap strapped with multiple RFAs...

I was just thinking in terms of his relationship with Coach Bud plus he'd be a nice compliment to Giannis.  I'm too lazy to look up their cap situation lol.

[celticinorlando]

Thing about losing Al would be this team would have absolutely no steady leadership.

Smart is not level headed

Tatum and Brown have no idea how to be a leader

Rozier cares only about himself

Hayward wilted under the lights last year. Just disappeared. He is not a leader at all.

Then you throw in more rookies or guys new to Boston...going to be a rudderless ship.

[SparzWizard]

Gary Washburn's thoughts:

There comes a time where you have to invest in your investments, you have to overpay players who are loyal and valuable. It may come back to haunt you in the end, but that’s how you keep an organization relevant. Everything in the NBA can’t be done with total ration, and the Celtics have been so rational over the past five years that they have been burned by their conservatism.

They didn’t want to invest enough assets to get Anthony Davis, which was the right move, but now they want to pay Horford exactly what they feel he’s worth and, of course, he believes he’s worth more.

There remains time. The Celtics could call Horford’s representatives and strike up a new deal, if they add a fourth year. Horford would be 37 at the end of such a deal, but he takes good care of himself and is capable of playing four productive years.

However, his salary in the final years of that contract would likely be a salary-cap anchor. That’s the way the NBA is. You pay your debts on the back end for services provided on the front end.

Forcing Horford into free agency may be an astute move for the Celtics, but right now it feels as if the family is bring broken up, the voice of reason is departing, the one player the Celtics could consistently rely upon is headed elsewhere because other teams appreciate him more.

It’s about time the Celtics take some chances. And this chance is the most likely to work in the end. Horford was a guaranteed 13 points and seven rebounds each night, and he fought off recurring knee pain and other ailments to become a staple in the lineup.

Of course, he will age. He won’t be the player at 35 that he was at 33, and that contract could be regrettable, but the alternative is watching quality veterans walk away with no compensation. To see Horford sign with an Eastern Conference contender and make a title run would be painful for Celtics faithful.

So the organization has about two weeks to make a decision. It can step up its offer and re-sign a player who truly enjoys Boston, and then chase other pieces to help maintain respectability.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/celtics/2019/06/18/celtics-must-take-chances-before-all-falls-apart/OGKTPFAWkcVd4QhVmlBgGK/story.html

Yeah but you're talking about Big Al, a 33 year old PF/C who is on the back end of his career. Bigs fall apart more easily than guards or forwards with age and it is a hefty risk to take for a 4-year/$100M contract with this man.

[Fafnir]

Bigs actually age a lot better than guards. Especially bigs who aren't lumbering types, same with wings.

Though no one looks great at 37 compared to their prime.

[SparzWizard]

GULP.....we are officially back to 2013 again. Our best player will be soon to be 29 Hayward who we have no idea if he will ever be back to Utah form.

But atleast we have Tatum, Brown and Smart.


My oh my what a freakin reversal of fortunes between our beloved Cs and the freakin Fakers franchise.

And the worst thing is the Fakers didn't even do anything to deserve their good fortune this year. Their front office is a shambles.

And they still somehow ended up with LeBron James (last summer), Anthony Davis THIS summer, and max player #3. And there was a small Laker rally several weeks ago complaining why nobody comes here.

Maybe Celtics fans should start changing their attitude and tune and act like Lakers fans- pesky/deluded/whining/boaEdited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline.l but get all the stars here lol.

Sorry, can't help it. From LA so I probably got all the LA characteristics in me being a Celtics fan.

[celticinorlando]

Willing to give Hayward one more year. If he does not improve this season and is not Utah Gordon...cut him loose.

[jpotter33]

Gary Washburn's thoughts:

There comes a time where you have to invest in your investments, you have to overpay players who are loyal and valuable. It may come back to haunt you in the end, but that’s how you keep an organization relevant. Everything in the NBA can’t be done with total ration, and the Celtics have been so rational over the past five years that they have been burned by their conservatism.

They didn’t want to invest enough assets to get Anthony Davis, which was the right move, but now they want to pay Horford exactly what they feel he’s worth and, of course, he believes he’s worth more.

There remains time. The Celtics could call Horford’s representatives and strike up a new deal, if they add a fourth year. Horford would be 37 at the end of such a deal, but he takes good care of himself and is capable of playing four productive years.

However, his salary in the final years of that contract would likely be a salary-cap anchor. That’s the way the NBA is. You pay your debts on the back end for services provided on the front end.

Forcing Horford into free agency may be an astute move for the Celtics, but right now it feels as if the family is bring broken up, the voice of reason is departing, the one player the Celtics could consistently rely upon is headed elsewhere because other teams appreciate him more.

It’s about time the Celtics take some chances. And this chance is the most likely to work in the end. Horford was a guaranteed 13 points and seven rebounds each night, and he fought off recurring knee pain and other ailments to become a staple in the lineup.

Of course, he will age. He won’t be the player at 35 that he was at 33, and that contract could be regrettable, but the alternative is watching quality veterans walk away with no compensation. To see Horford sign with an Eastern Conference contender and make a title run would be painful for Celtics faithful.

So the organization has about two weeks to make a decision. It can step up its offer and re-sign a player who truly enjoys Boston, and then chase other pieces to help maintain respectability.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/celtics/2019/06/18/celtics-must-take-chances-before-all-falls-apart/OGKTPFAWkcVd4QhVmlBgGK/story.html

Yeah but you're talking about Big Al, a 33 year old PF/C who is on the back end of his career. Bigs fall apart more easily than guards or forwards with age and it is a hefty risk to take for a 4-year/$100M contract with this man.

Sounds like it’s more about that fourth year than the annual number.

If it’s something like $20M for 4 years, I think you do it. Al is a great guy to have around, and he’d be a great leader for the young guys, especially a young big like Williams. But if he’s really wanting something like $100/4 years, then I’m not sure that you do that.

[ozgod]

Gary Washburn's thoughts:

There comes a time where you have to invest in your investments, you have to overpay players who are loyal and valuable. It may come back to haunt you in the end, but that’s how you keep an organization relevant. Everything in the NBA can’t be done with total ration, and the Celtics have been so rational over the past five years that they have been burned by their conservatism.

They didn’t want to invest enough assets to get Anthony Davis, which was the right move, but now they want to pay Horford exactly what they feel he’s worth and, of course, he believes he’s worth more.

There remains time. The Celtics could call Horford’s representatives and strike up a new deal, if they add a fourth year. Horford would be 37 at the end of such a deal, but he takes good care of himself and is capable of playing four productive years.

However, his salary in the final years of that contract would likely be a salary-cap anchor. That’s the way the NBA is. You pay your debts on the back end for services provided on the front end.

Forcing Horford into free agency may be an astute move for the Celtics, but right now it feels as if the family is bring broken up, the voice of reason is departing, the one player the Celtics could consistently rely upon is headed elsewhere because other teams appreciate him more.

It’s about time the Celtics take some chances. And this chance is the most likely to work in the end. Horford was a guaranteed 13 points and seven rebounds each night, and he fought off recurring knee pain and other ailments to become a staple in the lineup.

Of course, he will age. He won’t be the player at 35 that he was at 33, and that contract could be regrettable, but the alternative is watching quality veterans walk away with no compensation. To see Horford sign with an Eastern Conference contender and make a title run would be painful for Celtics faithful.

So the organization has about two weeks to make a decision. It can step up its offer and re-sign a player who truly enjoys Boston, and then chase other pieces to help maintain respectability.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/celtics/2019/06/18/celtics-must-take-chances-before-all-falls-apart/OGKTPFAWkcVd4QhVmlBgGK/story.html

Yeah but you're talking about Big Al, a 33 year old PF/C who is on the back end of his career. Bigs fall apart more easily than guards or forwards with age and it is a hefty risk to take for a 4-year/$100M contract with this man.

Sounds like it’s more about that fourth year than the annual number.

If it’s something like $20M for 4 years, I think you do it. Al is a great guy to have around, and he’d be a great leader for the young guys, especially a young big like Williams. But if he’s really wanting something like $100/4 years, then I’m not sure that you do that.

Would you do 3yr/75m? I'd be tempted.

[tazzmaniac]

Willing to give Hayward one more year. If he does not improve this season and is not Utah Gordon...cut him loose.

How are you going to do that?  If he doesn't improve he'll pick up his 34M player option. 
So you'll have to give up a lot to get rid of him or take on bad contracts. 

[GreenFaith1819]

 

Let's go ahead and trade Smart, next.

He deserves BETTER.

[JSD]

What happened in a matter of three hours? Went from this is a good thing for both Al and boston to extended the term to he walked away. Makes no sense.

It could be that Danny low-balled him.  If you remember, that's the thing that really upset Al in his negotiations with Atlanta.

Or, it could be that another team leaked a big four-year offer to Horford's agent that changed his analysis completely.

Or, it could just be posturing.

Is there a better player to go to the Lakers to compliment Davis and James?

[CelticsElite]

What happened in a matter of three hours? Went from this is a good thing for both Al and boston to extended the term to he walked away. Makes no sense.

It could be that Danny low-balled him.  If you remember, that's the thing that really upset Al in his negotiations with Atlanta.

Or, it could be that another team leaked a big four-year offer to Horford's agent that changed his analysis completely.

Or, it could just be posturing.

Is there a better player to go to the Lakers to compliment Davis and James?

doesn't horford complement anyone? Lol

[celticinorlando]

Willing to give Hayward one more year. If he does not improve this season and is not Utah Gordon...cut him loose.

How are you going to do that?  If he doesn't improve he'll pick up his 34M player option. 
So you'll have to give up a lot to get rid of him or take on bad contracts.

I really want him to succeed in Boston. Get back to the guy that made the All Star team. But after this past season, I am having a hard time seeing it from him.

He needs to be 23 ppg 8 plus boards 3 plus assists kind of player for Boston and for that money