The Hayward S&T: Missed Opportunity? (Merged)

[Big333223]

I was in favor of bringing in Turner. I thought he'd look a lot better playing his natural position in Boston and would be a defensive anchor.

That said, I'm confused (as others have voiced) as to why this is a conversation when Hayward was a free agent? Even if Ainge had agreed to the Pacer's deal, Hayward was still going to Charlotte because they offered him more money than the Pacers were willing to pay. Ainge's acceptance or refusal of a deal doesn't factor in.

Charlotte came in a little late out of nowhere. No one thought they would stretch Batums $27M deal to open cap space. If Danny agreed to the trade on day one of free agency Turner would be a Celtic .

My understanding is that you're wrong about that. Even if the Celtics and Pacers had agreed on a deal, they couldn't have executed the deal yet. When Charlotte made their offer, it was before any deal could officially have been, technically, finalized. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here but my understanding is that as long as Indy wasn't going to agree to a larger deal, Hayward was going to Charlotte and there isn't anything the Celts could've done about it.

Incidentally, I just read someone call Myles Turner, Jeff Green and I almost died. I like Turner but this feels very apt.

Nope. Ainge asked for better assets coming in and or hesitated so Charlotte came in a day or two after free agency started. So the window to get a deal done was tight that’s why Indy overpaid ( then Edited for profanity.  Please do not do it again.ed about it lol)..

Nope - Jordan and Hayward spoke the 1st night of FA to 'close the deal'. That means other discussions had at least taken place when FA opened. I get it, it sucks that IND wouldn't match CHA's deal, but to pretend that you can trade and UFA to any team you desire just isn't true. Danny might have wanted more assets, but that is irrelevant if Hayward was able to accept a bigger deal elsewhere.

It is fine to talk about how Turner could have helped the Cs. Obviously he is a million times better than Thompson, but it is getting pretty annoying that people keep casually tossing out opinion as fact on the matter. If Hayward's agent was just immediately going to jump on the 1st offer without doing his due diligence, then he would have been doing a terrible job.

Besides, the same problem would have existed in IND as with the Cs. They already had Sabonis, Brogdon, Oladipo, and Warren. There were no guarantees he was going to be the top dog there. Going to CHA guaranteed him the #1 spot and they were offering the most money.

All I was pointing is that from everything out there being said publicly by figures involved in the discussions it sounded that: had Danny decided right away he would have had a deal done. The hornets landing Hayward news came 30hrs after free agency began. At the very beginning the Indy offer was the best for Hayward unless he told everyone involved that he is still waiting on charlotte to up his offer I don’t believe what you’re saying. I can see how Hayward would jump on Michael Jordan’s offer right away because that eliminates the uncertainty of sign and trades where 3 parties have to agree plus whatever has to be exchanged adds more uncertainty.
In Hayward signing with Charlotte he got comparable even more money and eliminated all uncertainty. If you account for taxes in Charlotte vs INdy it almost becomes a wash what he gets after tax.
Everything that Danny has said about this debacle is generic stuff he says when something doesn’t go thru. He won’t say we could have had a decent haul for Hayward but things happened out of nowhere.

In the end of the day it won’t matter that much because we would be getting a late first round pick - a player who wouldn’t have seen much playing time plus whatever limited minutes Turner would be getting if it’s true that Danny and Brad didn’t like his game.
McDermott can’t play defense so he would not be playing much either.

I'm not sure what sources you're citing here because I think that's wrong. Even if the C's and Indy had agree on a deal, it wouldn't have mattered because Hayward wasn't signed with the Celtics and never did. Charlotte was always going to offer more than Indy and so the C's were never going to have Hayward to trade, no matter how quickly Ainge agreed to a deal.

So you’re saying if all three parties to the sign and trade deal agreed when free agency started Hayward would renege on his word and sign with Charlotte? He’s not deandre Jordan lol

Hayward never agreed to anything so saying that he might "renege" doesn't make sense. Hayward knew Charlotte was making an offer and was always going to wait to see what all his options were.

And since he was a FA, as long as Charlotte makes the offer and Indy didn't want to match, Ainge's willingness to trade was irrelevant because Hayward wasn't a Celtic.

[nickagneta]

I was in favor of bringing in Turner. I thought he'd look a lot better playing his natural position in Boston and would be a defensive anchor.

That said, I'm confused (as others have voiced) as to why this is a conversation when Hayward was a free agent? Even if Ainge had agreed to the Pacer's deal, Hayward was still going to Charlotte because they offered him more money than the Pacers were willing to pay. Ainge's acceptance or refusal of a deal doesn't factor in.

Charlotte came in a little late out of nowhere. No one thought they would stretch Batums $27M deal to open cap space. If Danny agreed to the trade on day one of free agency Turner would be a Celtic .

My understanding is that you're wrong about that. Even if the Celtics and Pacers had agreed on a deal, they couldn't have executed the deal yet. When Charlotte made their offer, it was before any deal could officially have been, technically, finalized. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here but my understanding is that as long as Indy wasn't going to agree to a larger deal, Hayward was going to Charlotte and there isn't anything the Celts could've done about it.

Incidentally, I just read someone call Myles Turner, Jeff Green and I almost died. I like Turner but this feels very apt.

Nope. Ainge asked for better assets coming in and or hesitated so Charlotte came in a day or two after free agency started. So the window to get a deal done was tight that’s why Indy overpaid ( then Edited for profanity.  Please do not do it again.ed about it lol)..

Nope - Jordan and Hayward spoke the 1st night of FA to 'close the deal'. That means other discussions had at least taken place when FA opened. I get it, it sucks that IND wouldn't match CHA's deal, but to pretend that you can trade and UFA to any team you desire just isn't true. Danny might have wanted more assets, but that is irrelevant if Hayward was able to accept a bigger deal elsewhere.

It is fine to talk about how Turner could have helped the Cs. Obviously he is a million times better than Thompson, but it is getting pretty annoying that people keep casually tossing out opinion as fact on the matter. If Hayward's agent was just immediately going to jump on the 1st offer without doing his due diligence, then he would have been doing a terrible job.

Besides, the same problem would have existed in IND as with the Cs. They already had Sabonis, Brogdon, Oladipo, and Warren. There were no guarantees he was going to be the top dog there. Going to CHA guaranteed him the #1 spot and they were offering the most money.

All I was pointing is that from everything out there being said publicly by figures involved in the discussions it sounded that: had Danny decided right away he would have had a deal done. The hornets landing Hayward news came 30hrs after free agency began. At the very beginning the Indy offer was the best for Hayward unless he told everyone involved that he is still waiting on charlotte to up his offer I don’t believe what you’re saying. I can see how Hayward would jump on Michael Jordan’s offer right away because that eliminates the uncertainty of sign and trades where 3 parties have to agree plus whatever has to be exchanged adds more uncertainty.
In Hayward signing with Charlotte he got comparable even more money and eliminated all uncertainty. If you account for taxes in Charlotte vs INdy it almost becomes a wash what he gets after tax.
Everything that Danny has said about this debacle is generic stuff he says when something doesn’t go thru. He won’t say we could have had a decent haul for Hayward but things happened out of nowhere.

In the end of the day it won’t matter that much because we would be getting a late first round pick - a player who wouldn’t have seen much playing time plus whatever limited minutes Turner would be getting if it’s true that Danny and Brad didn’t like his game.
McDermott can’t play defense so he would not be playing much either.

I'm not sure what sources you're citing here because I think that's wrong. Even if the C's and Indy had agree on a deal, it wouldn't have mattered because Hayward wasn't signed with the Celtics and never did. Charlotte was always going to offer more than Indy and so the C's were never going to have Hayward to trade, no matter how quickly Ainge agreed to a deal.

So you’re saying if all three parties to the sign and trade deal agreed when free agency started Hayward would renege on his word and sign with Charlotte? He’s not deandre Jordan lol

Hayward never agreed to anything so saying that he might "renege" doesn't make sense. Hayward knew Charlotte was making an offer and was always going to wait to see what all his options were.

And since he was a FA, as long as Charlotte makes the offer and Indy didn't want to match, Ainge's willingness to trade was irrelevant because Hayward wasn't a Celtic.

And Charlotte wasn't the only team vying for Gordon. Ainge said there were three or four besides Boston looking into Hayward. Clearly, there was a lot of talk going on between Hayward's representatives and several teams. Gordon's agent was shopping the 4 year $100 million price. Charlotte beat it and Indy didn't match. End of story

[keevsnick]

I was in favor of bringing in Turner. I thought he'd look a lot better playing his natural position in Boston and would be a defensive anchor.

That said, I'm confused (as others have voiced) as to why this is a conversation when Hayward was a free agent? Even if Ainge had agreed to the Pacer's deal, Hayward was still going to Charlotte because they offered him more money than the Pacers were willing to pay. Ainge's acceptance or refusal of a deal doesn't factor in.

Charlotte came in a little late out of nowhere. No one thought they would stretch Batums $27M deal to open cap space. If Danny agreed to the trade on day one of free agency Turner would be a Celtic .

My understanding is that you're wrong about that. Even if the Celtics and Pacers had agreed on a deal, they couldn't have executed the deal yet. When Charlotte made their offer, it was before any deal could officially have been, technically, finalized. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here but my understanding is that as long as Indy wasn't going to agree to a larger deal, Hayward was going to Charlotte and there isn't anything the Celts could've done about it.

Incidentally, I just read someone call Myles Turner, Jeff Green and I almost died. I like Turner but this feels very apt.

Nope. Ainge asked for better assets coming in and or hesitated so Charlotte came in a day or two after free agency started. So the window to get a deal done was tight that’s why Indy overpaid ( then Edited for profanity.  Please do not do it again.ed about it lol)..

Nope - Jordan and Hayward spoke the 1st night of FA to 'close the deal'. That means other discussions had at least taken place when FA opened. I get it, it sucks that IND wouldn't match CHA's deal, but to pretend that you can trade and UFA to any team you desire just isn't true. Danny might have wanted more assets, but that is irrelevant if Hayward was able to accept a bigger deal elsewhere.

It is fine to talk about how Turner could have helped the Cs. Obviously he is a million times better than Thompson, but it is getting pretty annoying that people keep casually tossing out opinion as fact on the matter. If Hayward's agent was just immediately going to jump on the 1st offer without doing his due diligence, then he would have been doing a terrible job.

Besides, the same problem would have existed in IND as with the Cs. They already had Sabonis, Brogdon, Oladipo, and Warren. There were no guarantees he was going to be the top dog there. Going to CHA guaranteed him the #1 spot and they were offering the most money.

All I was pointing is that from everything out there being said publicly by figures involved in the discussions it sounded that: had Danny decided right away he would have had a deal done. The hornets landing Hayward news came 30hrs after free agency began. At the very beginning the Indy offer was the best for Hayward unless he told everyone involved that he is still waiting on charlotte to up his offer I don’t believe what you’re saying. I can see how Hayward would jump on Michael Jordan’s offer right away because that eliminates the uncertainty of sign and trades where 3 parties have to agree plus whatever has to be exchanged adds more uncertainty.
In Hayward signing with Charlotte he got comparable even more money and eliminated all uncertainty. If you account for taxes in Charlotte vs INdy it almost becomes a wash what he gets after tax.
Everything that Danny has said about this debacle is generic stuff he says when something doesn’t go thru. He won’t say we could have had a decent haul for Hayward but things happened out of nowhere.

In the end of the day it won’t matter that much because we would be getting a late first round pick - a player who wouldn’t have seen much playing time plus whatever limited minutes Turner would be getting if it’s true that Danny and Brad didn’t like his game.
McDermott can’t play defense so he would not be playing much either.

I'm not sure what sources you're citing here because I think that's wrong. Even if the C's and Indy had agree on a deal, it wouldn't have mattered because Hayward wasn't signed with the Celtics and never did. Charlotte was always going to offer more than Indy and so the C's were never going to have Hayward to trade, no matter how quickly Ainge agreed to a deal.

So you’re saying if all three parties to the sign and trade deal agreed when free agency started Hayward would renege on his word and sign with Charlotte? He’s not deandre Jordan lol

Hayward never agreed to anything so saying that he might "renege" doesn't make sense. Hayward knew Charlotte was making an offer and was always going to wait to see what all his options were.

And since he was a FA, as long as Charlotte makes the offer and Indy didn't want to match, Ainge's willingness to trade was irrelevant because Hayward wasn't a Celtic.

And Charlotte wasn't the only team vying for Gordon. Ainge said there were three or four besides Boston looking into Hayward. Clearly, there was a lot of talk going on between Hayward's representatives and several teams. Gordon's agent was shopping the 4 year $100 million price. Charlotte beat it and Indy didn't match. End of story

Except there are a lot of people who don't think that is the end of the story. Zach Lowe  has said a couple times on his podcast that he thinks if Boston wanted Myles Turner that deal would have gotten done.

Is it possible Hayward just took the most money? Sure. I think its also possible he would have taken less to go to IND but saw Ainge was never gonna pull the trigger. Or that if BOS-PHI negotiations out take so long CHA never really gets involved. It was pretty heavily reported IND was his first choice.

Honestly I don't really buy the narrative he just took the most money, I'm more in the camp that if BOS had taken the Turner+Rotation Player offer he'd be in IND, that he wanted to be there, and that when it started to look like BOS wasn't gonna play ball he took the money.

But thats one man's opinion.

[dannyboy35]

 Either way we should not want Turner  He doesn’t do enough on offense to make up for his poor defense. Just look at the way this game ended. It was all about exploiting Turner’s lack of mobility. This DPOY talk is crazy to me.

[liam]

I was in favor of bringing in Turner. I thought he'd look a lot better playing his natural position in Boston and would be a defensive anchor.

That said, I'm confused (as others have voiced) as to why this is a conversation when Hayward was a free agent? Even if Ainge had agreed to the Pacer's deal, Hayward was still going to Charlotte because they offered him more money than the Pacers were willing to pay. Ainge's acceptance or refusal of a deal doesn't factor in.

Charlotte came in a little late out of nowhere. No one thought they would stretch Batums $27M deal to open cap space. If Danny agreed to the trade on day one of free agency Turner would be a Celtic .

My understanding is that you're wrong about that. Even if the Celtics and Pacers had agreed on a deal, they couldn't have executed the deal yet. When Charlotte made their offer, it was before any deal could officially have been, technically, finalized. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here but my understanding is that as long as Indy wasn't going to agree to a larger deal, Hayward was going to Charlotte and there isn't anything the Celts could've done about it.

Incidentally, I just read someone call Myles Turner, Jeff Green and I almost died. I like Turner but this feels very apt.

Nope. Ainge asked for better assets coming in and or hesitated so Charlotte came in a day or two after free agency started. So the window to get a deal done was tight that’s why Indy overpaid ( then Edited for profanity.  Please do not do it again.ed about it lol)..

Nope - Jordan and Hayward spoke the 1st night of FA to 'close the deal'. That means other discussions had at least taken place when FA opened. I get it, it sucks that IND wouldn't match CHA's deal, but to pretend that you can trade and UFA to any team you desire just isn't true. Danny might have wanted more assets, but that is irrelevant if Hayward was able to accept a bigger deal elsewhere.

It is fine to talk about how Turner could have helped the Cs. Obviously he is a million times better than Thompson, but it is getting pretty annoying that people keep casually tossing out opinion as fact on the matter. If Hayward's agent was just immediately going to jump on the 1st offer without doing his due diligence, then he would have been doing a terrible job.

Besides, the same problem would have existed in IND as with the Cs. They already had Sabonis, Brogdon, Oladipo, and Warren. There were no guarantees he was going to be the top dog there. Going to CHA guaranteed him the #1 spot and they were offering the most money.

All I was pointing is that from everything out there being said publicly by figures involved in the discussions it sounded that: had Danny decided right away he would have had a deal done. The hornets landing Hayward news came 30hrs after free agency began. At the very beginning the Indy offer was the best for Hayward unless he told everyone involved that he is still waiting on charlotte to up his offer I don’t believe what you’re saying. I can see how Hayward would jump on Michael Jordan’s offer right away because that eliminates the uncertainty of sign and trades where 3 parties have to agree plus whatever has to be exchanged adds more uncertainty.
In Hayward signing with Charlotte he got comparable even more money and eliminated all uncertainty. If you account for taxes in Charlotte vs INdy it almost becomes a wash what he gets after tax.
Everything that Danny has said about this debacle is generic stuff he says when something doesn’t go thru. He won’t say we could have had a decent haul for Hayward but things happened out of nowhere.

In the end of the day it won’t matter that much because we would be getting a late first round pick - a player who wouldn’t have seen much playing time plus whatever limited minutes Turner would be getting if it’s true that Danny and Brad didn’t like his game.
McDermott can’t play defense so he would not be playing much either.

I'm not sure what sources you're citing here because I think that's wrong. Even if the C's and Indy had agree on a deal, it wouldn't have mattered because Hayward wasn't signed with the Celtics and never did. Charlotte was always going to offer more than Indy and so the C's were never going to have Hayward to trade, no matter how quickly Ainge agreed to a deal.

So you’re saying if all three parties to the sign and trade deal agreed when free agency started Hayward would renege on his word and sign with Charlotte? He’s not deandre Jordan lol

Hayward never agreed to anything so saying that he might "renege" doesn't make sense. Hayward knew Charlotte was making an offer and was always going to wait to see what all his options were.

And since he was a FA, as long as Charlotte makes the offer and Indy didn't want to match, Ainge's willingness to trade was irrelevant because Hayward wasn't a Celtic.

And Charlotte wasn't the only team vying for Gordon. Ainge said there were three or four besides Boston looking into Hayward. Clearly, there was a lot of talk going on between Hayward's representatives and several teams. Gordon's agent was shopping the 4 year $100 million price. Charlotte beat it and Indy didn't match. End of story

Indiana needed to step up their money for Hayward and their offer to Boston to get Hayward. What they they were offering to Hayward and or The Celtics wasn't enough to get the job done. Indiana had to satisfy both Hayward and The Celtics front office to get the deal done. They might have been able to get a team with space to sign and trade Hayward to them for Turner and whatever else but they didn't get that done either. It needed to be an all in move for Indiana but they didn't want to go all in on Hayward and Charlotte did.

[Neurotic Guy]

I was in favor of bringing in Turner. I thought he'd look a lot better playing his natural position in Boston and would be a defensive anchor.

That said, I'm confused (as others have voiced) as to why this is a conversation when Hayward was a free agent? Even if Ainge had agreed to the Pacer's deal, Hayward was still going to Charlotte because they offered him more money than the Pacers were willing to pay. Ainge's acceptance or refusal of a deal doesn't factor in.

Charlotte came in a little late out of nowhere. No one thought they would stretch Batums $27M deal to open cap space. If Danny agreed to the trade on day one of free agency Turner would be a Celtic .

My understanding is that you're wrong about that. Even if the Celtics and Pacers had agreed on a deal, they couldn't have executed the deal yet. When Charlotte made their offer, it was before any deal could officially have been, technically, finalized. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here but my understanding is that as long as Indy wasn't going to agree to a larger deal, Hayward was going to Charlotte and there isn't anything the Celts could've done about it.

Incidentally, I just read someone call Myles Turner, Jeff Green and I almost died. I like Turner but this feels very apt.

Nope. Ainge asked for better assets coming in and or hesitated so Charlotte came in a day or two after free agency started. So the window to get a deal done was tight that’s why Indy overpaid ( then Edited for profanity.  Please do not do it again.ed about it lol)..

Nope - Jordan and Hayward spoke the 1st night of FA to 'close the deal'. That means other discussions had at least taken place when FA opened. I get it, it sucks that IND wouldn't match CHA's deal, but to pretend that you can trade and UFA to any team you desire just isn't true. Danny might have wanted more assets, but that is irrelevant if Hayward was able to accept a bigger deal elsewhere.

It is fine to talk about how Turner could have helped the Cs. Obviously he is a million times better than Thompson, but it is getting pretty annoying that people keep casually tossing out opinion as fact on the matter. If Hayward's agent was just immediately going to jump on the 1st offer without doing his due diligence, then he would have been doing a terrible job.

Besides, the same problem would have existed in IND as with the Cs. They already had Sabonis, Brogdon, Oladipo, and Warren. There were no guarantees he was going to be the top dog there. Going to CHA guaranteed him the #1 spot and they were offering the most money.

All I was pointing is that from everything out there being said publicly by figures involved in the discussions it sounded that: had Danny decided right away he would have had a deal done. The hornets landing Hayward news came 30hrs after free agency began. At the very beginning the Indy offer was the best for Hayward unless he told everyone involved that he is still waiting on charlotte to up his offer I don’t believe what you’re saying. I can see how Hayward would jump on Michael Jordan’s offer right away because that eliminates the uncertainty of sign and trades where 3 parties have to agree plus whatever has to be exchanged adds more uncertainty.
In Hayward signing with Charlotte he got comparable even more money and eliminated all uncertainty. If you account for taxes in Charlotte vs INdy it almost becomes a wash what he gets after tax.
Everything that Danny has said about this debacle is generic stuff he says when something doesn’t go thru. He won’t say we could have had a decent haul for Hayward but things happened out of nowhere.

In the end of the day it won’t matter that much because we would be getting a late first round pick - a player who wouldn’t have seen much playing time plus whatever limited minutes Turner would be getting if it’s true that Danny and Brad didn’t like his game.
McDermott can’t play defense so he would not be playing much either.

I'm not sure what sources you're citing here because I think that's wrong. Even if the C's and Indy had agree on a deal, it wouldn't have mattered because Hayward wasn't signed with the Celtics and never did. Charlotte was always going to offer more than Indy and so the C's were never going to have Hayward to trade, no matter how quickly Ainge agreed to a deal.

So you’re saying if all three parties to the sign and trade deal agreed when free agency started Hayward would renege on his word and sign with Charlotte? He’s not deandre Jordan lol

Hayward never agreed to anything so saying that he might "renege" doesn't make sense. Hayward knew Charlotte was making an offer and was always going to wait to see what all his options were.

And since he was a FA, as long as Charlotte makes the offer and Indy didn't want to match, Ainge's willingness to trade was irrelevant because Hayward wasn't a Celtic.

And Charlotte wasn't the only team vying for Gordon. Ainge said there were three or four besides Boston looking into Hayward. Clearly, there was a lot of talk going on between Hayward's representatives and several teams. Gordon's agent was shopping the 4 year $100 million price. Charlotte beat it and Indy didn't match. End of story

Indiana needed to step up their money for Hayward and their offer to Boston to get Hayward. What they they were offering to Hayward and or The Celtics wasn't enough to get the job done. Indiana had to satisfy both Hayward and The Celtics front office to get the deal done. They might have been able to get a team with space to sign and trade Hayward to them for Turner and whatever else but they didn't get that done either. It needed to be an all in move for Indiana but they didn't want to go all in on Hayward and Charlotte did.

I agree. 

If I were an Indy fan I’d be thinking of this much more as a “missed opportunity” for Indy than a missed opportunity fo the C’s.  Watching GH on Charlotte must be agonizing for Pacers front office and for fans. How do they find another Hayward? Watching Turner and McDermott doesn’t really make me think we can’t find their equivalent talent elsewhere.

[Csfan1984]

Does this whole Hayward S&T impact how DA approaches the TPE in the offseason? Will he overpay to secure a S&T the way he tried to force Pacers? Will other teams feel they have a stronger position to demand more because C's demanded so much? This thing has other draw backs. Some already say DA won't be dealt with for trying to trade damaged Kemba.

[todd_days_41]

I stated at the time I was fine with Ainge not reaching for Turner / McDermott in exchange for Hayward, and I stand by that. Both players are overrated / overpaid, IMO.

I believe Ainge knew / knows exactly what he plans to do with the TPE he got this summer, otherwise he'd not have given up picks to get it.

Now, I wish Ainge had made better use of the mid-level exception once he didn't do the trade, but that's a separate topic.

[Wretch]

I stated at the time I was fine with Ainge not reaching for Turner / McDermott in exchange for Hayward, and I stand by that. Both players are overrated / overpaid, IMO.

I believe Ainge knew / knows exactly what he plans to do with the TPE he got this summer, otherwise he'd not have given up picks to get it.

Now, I wish Ainge had made better use of the mid-level exception once he didn't do the trade, but that's a separate topic.

TT has been just Ok, but I think he was brought in with playoff matchups in mind.  He's big enough to body up larger bigs, This is great but he really struggled against real size in the bubble.

[Neurotic Guy]

I stated at the time I was fine with Ainge not reaching for Turner / McDermott in exchange for Hayward, and I stand by that. Both players are overrated / overpaid, IMO.

I believe Ainge knew / knows exactly what he plans to do with the TPE he got this summer, otherwise he'd not have given up picks to get it.

Now, I wish Ainge had made better use of the mid-level exception once he didn't do the trade, but that's a separate topic.

TT has been just Ok, but I think he was brought in with playoff matchups in mind.  He's big enough to body up larger bigs, This is great but he really struggled against real size in the bubble.

He looked like Mugsey Bogues v. Jokic.

[NKY fan]

I stated at the time I was fine with Ainge not reaching for Turner / McDermott in exchange for Hayward, and I stand by that. Both players are overrated / overpaid, IMO.

I believe Ainge knew / knows exactly what he plans to do with the TPE he got this summer, otherwise he'd not have given up picks to get it.

Now, I wish Ainge had made better use of the mid-level exception once he didn't do the trade, but that's a separate topic.

He doesn’t know what he will do with it. It’s all about being opportunistic. He has to use it only if it is the right deal or deals. Warriors had a TPE about to expire so they kind of forced the Oubre trade... though his price will end up being a pick in the 21-33 range most likely 31st pick. They could have done worse but for a while that trade looked bad given Oubre struggles. So my point it there are so many contingencies that you can’t know exactly what you will do with the tpe. It’s possible it goes to waste.

[todd_days_41]

I stated at the time I was fine with Ainge not reaching for Turner / McDermott in exchange for Hayward, and I stand by that. Both players are overrated / overpaid, IMO.

I believe Ainge knew / knows exactly what he plans to do with the TPE he got this summer, otherwise he'd not have given up picks to get it.

Now, I wish Ainge had made better use of the mid-level exception once he didn't do the trade, but that's a separate topic.

He doesn’t know what he will do with it. It’s all about being opportunistic.

I said what he plans to do with it. I think that has been and continues to be a summer 2021 plan, short of getting a great deal on a all-star caliber player at the deadline (which i think is very unlikely).

[Wretch]

I stated at the time I was fine with Ainge not reaching for Turner / McDermott in exchange for Hayward, and I stand by that. Both players are overrated / overpaid, IMO.

I believe Ainge knew / knows exactly what he plans to do with the TPE he got this summer, otherwise he'd not have given up picks to get it.

Now, I wish Ainge had made better use of the mid-level exception once he didn't do the trade, but that's a separate topic.

TT has been just Ok, but I think he was brought in with playoff matchups in mind.  He's big enough to body up larger bigs, This is great but he really struggled against real size in the bubble.

He looked like Mugsey Bogues v. Jokic.

I didn't say he was brought in to win those matchups, just not lose them as badly.  Jokic also make a lot of centers look silly, same with Zion.

[gouki88]

Either way we should not want Turner  He doesn’t do enough on offense to make up for his poor defense. Just look at the way this game ended. It was all about exploiting Turner’s lack of mobility. This DPOY talk is crazy to me.

Whiteside 2.0 on defence. Bad defender who racks up stats

[Roy H.]

Either way we should not want Turner  He doesn’t do enough on offense to make up for his poor defense. Just look at the way this game ended. It was all about exploiting Turner’s lack of mobility. This DPOY talk is crazy to me.

Whiteside 2.0 on defence. Bad defender who racks up stats

This is just wrong.  He leads the Pacers in Defensive Rating.

The impact Turner makes on Indiana's defense is stark. When he's on the court, the Pacers give up a stingy 104.3 points per 100 possessions, better than the league-leading 104.8 mark of the Los Angeles Lakers. When he sits, the Pacers allow opponents to score 113.8 points per 100 possessions, a mark that would rank 28th in the league. Opponents are also shooting 8 percentage points worse from the field when Turner plays.

Overall, Turner is contesting 13.7 shots per game this season, fifth most in the NBA. The only other Pacers player contesting more than six shots per game is All-Star Domantas Sabonis (11.2).

He’s allowing opponents to shoot 40.9%, which is 7.6 percentage points below their average.  That’s one of the best marks in the NBA, 0.1 behind Gobert.

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/defense-dash-overall/?sort=D_FGA&dir=1