Hayward sign-and-trade completed

[Bobshot]

I don't know if any sign and trade is going to happen with Charlotte, but it's clear that Ainge blew it by not taking Indiana's sign and trade for Turner and McDermott.
That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

Danny got picky, as usual, not recognizing he had no leverage--GH had opted out. Holding out for somebody else other than McDermott. Cripes, Indiana was doing him a favor!
Instead, Charlotte swooped in, offered GH more dough, and he was gone.

Now he did manage to pull himself out of a hole signing Thompson and Teague. But he could have had a much bigger exception with Indiana's offer.
 
If I were Wyc, I'd be frustrated at Danny's inability to carpe diem. Maybe also about the failure to win another title after 12 years.

Ainge is a good B student, but not an A.

[hpantazo]

https://twitter.com/AdamMKaufman/status/1330962598104231936

[liam]

I don't know if any sign and trade is going to happen with Charlotte, but it's clear that Ainge blew it by not taking Indiana's sign and trade for Turner and McDermott.
That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

Danny got picky, as usual, not recognizing he had no leverage--GH had opted out. Holding out for somebody else other than McDermott. Cripes, Indiana was doing him a favor!
Instead, Charlotte swooped in, offered GH more dough, and he was gone.

Now he did manage to pull himself out of a hole signing Thompson and Teague. But he could have had a much bigger exception with Indiana's offer.
 
If I were Wyc, I'd be frustrated at Danny's inability to carpe diem. Maybe also about the failure to win another title after 12 years.

Ainge is a good B student, but not an A.

I don’t think Indiana was doing a trade with out Hayward signing a new contract. The hold up might very well have been about Hayward’s contract. Indy wanted Hayward at 20 million per on a two year I heard.

[liam]

https://twitter.com/AdamMKaufman/status/1330962598104231936

I believe the hornets were offering the most money per year and a guarantee on four years.

[Sketch5]

I don't know if any sign and trade is going to happen with Charlotte, but it's clear that Ainge blew it by not taking Indiana's sign and trade for Turner and McDermott.
That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

Danny got picky, as usual, not recognizing he had no leverage--GH had opted out. Holding out for somebody else other than McDermott. Cripes, Indiana was doing him a favor!
Instead, Charlotte swooped in, offered GH more dough, and he was gone.

Now he did manage to pull himself out of a hole signing Thompson and Teague. But he could have had a much bigger exception with Indiana's offer.
 
If I were Wyc, I'd be frustrated at Danny's inability to carpe diem. Maybe also about the failure to win another title after 12 years.

Ainge is a good B student, but not an A.

Who said this is all on DA. Hayward may have wanted more money and Indy rightfully so didn't feel comfortable paying gun that much. And Jordan payed more than anyone else wanted too.

Also I don't blame DA for pushing for Warren instead of mcbuckets. He's limited in getting guys with out trading for them so I don't blame DA for swinging for a starting wing.

[Roy H.]

That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

Almost never a good decision to hitch your horse to WEEI’s wagon.

[Donoghus]

That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

Almost never a good decision to hitch your horse to WEEI’s wagon.

Boston sports radio, in general.

[Tr1boy]

I don't know if any sign and trade is going to happen with Charlotte, but it's clear that Ainge blew it by not taking Indiana's sign and trade for Turner and McDermott.
That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

Danny got picky, as usual, not recognizing he had no leverage--GH had opted out. Holding out for somebody else other than McDermott. Cripes, Indiana was doing him a favor!
Instead, Charlotte swooped in, offered GH more dough, and he was gone.

Now he did manage to pull himself out of a hole signing Thompson and Teague. But he could have had a much bigger exception with Indiana's offer.
 
If I were Wyc, I'd be frustrated at Danny's inability to carpe diem. Maybe also about the failure to win another title after 12 years.

Ainge is a good B student, but not an A.

How do you know its not Wyc who instructed Danny to not take salary back?

We will never know the real answer.

[PhoSita]

I don't know if any sign and trade is going to happen with Charlotte, but it's clear that Ainge blew it by not taking Indiana's sign and trade for Turner and McDermott.

That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

From what (little) we know, Indiana wasn't offering as much money as Charlotte.  Maybe Gordon was willing to go there for less, but it seems that Ainge determined that Turner was not valuable enough.  I think there's good reason to think that he was correct in that assessment.  Indiana wouldn't give up Warren or Oladipo, so they couldn't get a deal done.

We don't know yet if Ainge will get a TPE from Charlotte, but it seems very likely that a TPE could be more useful than Turner and McDermott.


Honestly I'd rather have Tristan Thompson on a 2 year / $19 million deal than Myles Turner for 4 years at $18 million per.

[BitterJim]

Who would be willing to take back Cody Zeller (1 yr, $15M) and a future protected first in a sign and trade?

By taking on Zeller, we get an exemption (Probably around $13M) and a future pick.  For Charlotte, it is the cost of dumping some salary.  Feels like a fair compromise to me.

Why would Charlotte give up their starting center and a 1st just so they avoid stretching Batum (who isn't going to play)?  They might move Zeller in this sort of trade, but it would be Boston giving up the 1st round pick, not Charlotte.

I don't think either team would want to give up a 1st in this scenario. You have to be kidding if you think the Cs would give up a 1st as well as losing half of their potential ~$30M TPE. I understand CHA doesn't want to give up an asset either, but they are the ones that would be saving a good chunk of money over the next 3 years to do this...and it's not like Cody Zeller isn't easily replaceable. I honestly prefer all 4 of our Centers (Theis, TT, both Williams') over Zeller.

More likely is Zeller goes to a 3rd team, with us getting a slightly cheaper, more useful player, and a decent sized TPE; or Zeller fitting into some other team's TPE and us getting the full TPE.

Zeller has an expiring contract that can be used in a trade this year and saving the TPE for the summer.  In addition, to Zeller actually being a decent big 11/7 in 23 mpg.  It is fine if you don't want to acquire Zeller, then you don't get a TPE because Charlotte has no real incentive to do that.  They are perfectly fine just stretching Batum and then Boston gets nothing.  I'd rather have the useful player on a good sized expiring contract and a good sized TPE to use later, then nothing, even at the expense of a protected 1st because quite frankly, Boston doesn't need any more mid to late 1st rounders on the team anyway.

Strongly agree with this. I would easily give up a mid to late 1st for a 28 million dollar trade exception. That's a no-brainer for a team already loaded with recent draft picks on the roster who is trying to contend.

I don't think you quite understood his post. He said that he would like us to give up a 1st for Zeller and a $13-15M TPE, not a 1st for just the $28-30M TPE. If we took on Zeller, the TPE would be pretty much useless anyway since ownership probably doesn't want to go into the tax this season for Zeller and whatever they could get with the other TPE.

I also think you are being very generous with handing out picks. We literally facilitated a s&t w/ CHA just last year in order to let them acquire/sign Rozier, and the only thing CHA gave up was a 2nd round pick swap (not even a whole 2nd rounder). Jordan would have to be a real jerk not to return the favor. I can see offering a 2nd, but we need to save the 1st(s) for whatever trade we use the hypothetical TPE in later on.

The TPE will be good for a full year, it can be used next off season.  Zeller is still available to trade this year if you don't use him.  So you get a large expiring contract on a decent player (again 11/7 in 23 mpg) and a TPE that you can use next summer.  That seems like a good value move rather than adding yet another pick in the 20's to the roster, which given Ainge keeps selling those off we might do anyway.

If the team's center position is all filled with three guys already and a project center as a possible 2 way player, why would the Celtics bring in Zeller. There is just no incentive.

If Batum has been stretched, just ask Charlotte to do the S&T for a couple second rounders or a future 1st with protections that descend down to two second rounders

As the roster currently stands it's filled.  They can open a spot for a player by releasing Green.  They can free up two more spots by trading Semi and Edwards.  We still don't know if Tacko and Tremont are signing their tenders becoming 2 way players again.  Lot's of moving parts to take players back.  I'm sure the C's just want the TPE without taking on any players.  The only ones interesting are Monk and Bridges and there is no way Charlotte is giving up two young pieces.

I think Monk is expiring and Charlotte has guards already. I’d take a chance on Monk.

I liked Monk as a prospect and I think if realized he could provide a scoring punch to our second unit. However, he did get suspended for doing coke last year not sure we could count on him long term.

I think that the hold up right now is coming up with a deal of Rozier to NYK and some sort of salary coming to Boston with the TPE.

I am game for that as long as the salary returning would leave enough room in the TPE to try and nab Barnes from Sactown.

Hayward to Charlotte
Rozier and a TPE to NYK
TPE and Romeo to Sacramento
Knox, Barnes and Ramsey to Boston.

I don't think such a trade is likely, but ideally you would take in salary that can fit into the Kanter TPE. That would help keep the Hayward TPE as large as possible

[tonydelk]

I don't know if any sign and trade is going to happen with Charlotte, but it's clear that Ainge blew it by not taking Indiana's sign and trade for Turner and McDermott.

That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

From what (little) we know, Indiana wasn't offering as much money as Charlotte.  Maybe Gordon was willing to go there for less, but it seems that Ainge determined that Turner was not valuable enough.  I think there's good reason to think that he was correct in that assessment.  Indiana wouldn't give up Warren or Oladipo, so they couldn't get a deal done.

We don't know yet if Ainge will get a TPE from Charlotte, but it seems very likely that a TPE could be more useful than Turner and McDermott.


Honestly I'd rather have Tristan Thompson on a 2 year / $19 million deal than Myles Turner for 4 years at $18 million per.

Count me in on hating the package Indy was offering.  People wanted Ainge to take players the team didn't want just to have an asset out of it.   Turner isn't a great player.  The deal was a bad deal but people are p---ed we didn't get Mcdermott who is terrible and an expiring contract and a Big who doesn't move us over the top and is signed at 18m for 3 more years.  If danny can get the TPE it's the best case scenario to add talent.   

[jbpats]

I don't know if any sign and trade is going to happen with Charlotte, but it's clear that Ainge blew it by not taking Indiana's sign and trade for Turner and McDermott.

That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

From what (little) we know, Indiana wasn't offering as much money as Charlotte.  Maybe Gordon was willing to go there for less, but it seems that Ainge determined that Turner was not valuable enough.  I think there's good reason to think that he was correct in that assessment.  Indiana wouldn't give up Warren or Oladipo, so they couldn't get a deal done.

We don't know yet if Ainge will get a TPE from Charlotte, but it seems very likely that a TPE could be more useful than Turner and McDermott.


Honestly I'd rather have Tristan Thompson on a 2 year / $19 million deal than Myles Turner for 4 years at $18 million per.

The problem with this logic, and what a lot here fail to recognize is, we lost Hayward’s cap space by Ainge not making the trade. Despite how you feel about turner that’s an asset we would have got in return for Hayward instead of nothing.

We still could have signed Thompson, or used that money to sign somebody else. We could have flipped turner for picks or another player.

Instead Ainge stubbornness got us nothing.

More importantly, and as I said before, it’s an extremely bad look for Ainge from a PR standpoint for not letting Hayward go home.

Right now the national narrative is Ainge overplayed his hand, Hayward would have taken the hometown discount for the pacers and Ainge blew it for him. That’s not a good look for Ainge, I’ll tell you this much if I played in the NBA he is not a GM I’d want to do business with given his track record.. and I’m a diehard Celtics fan.

[hpantazo]

I don't know if any sign and trade is going to happen with Charlotte, but it's clear that Ainge blew it by not taking Indiana's sign and trade for Turner and McDermott.

That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

From what (little) we know, Indiana wasn't offering as much money as Charlotte.  Maybe Gordon was willing to go there for less, but it seems that Ainge determined that Turner was not valuable enough.  I think there's good reason to think that he was correct in that assessment.  Indiana wouldn't give up Warren or Oladipo, so they couldn't get a deal done.

We don't know yet if Ainge will get a TPE from Charlotte, but it seems very likely that a TPE could be more useful than Turner and McDermott.


Honestly I'd rather have Tristan Thompson on a 2 year / $19 million deal than Myles Turner for 4 years at $18 million per.

Count me in on hating the package Indy was offering.  People wanted Ainge to take players the team didn't want just to have an asset out of it.   Turner isn't a great player.  The deal was a bad deal but people are p---ed we didn't get Mcdermott who is terrible and an expiring contract and a Big who doesn't move us over the top and is signed at 18m for 3 more years.  If danny can get the TPE it's the best case scenario to add talent.   

I agree. Also paying Hayward 30 million a year for 4 more years would have crippled the franchise into the prime years of Tatum and Brown

[hpantazo]

I don't know if any sign and trade is going to happen with Charlotte, but it's clear that Ainge blew it by not taking Indiana's sign and trade for Turner and McDermott.

That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

From what (little) we know, Indiana wasn't offering as much money as Charlotte.  Maybe Gordon was willing to go there for less, but it seems that Ainge determined that Turner was not valuable enough.  I think there's good reason to think that he was correct in that assessment.  Indiana wouldn't give up Warren or Oladipo, so they couldn't get a deal done.

We don't know yet if Ainge will get a TPE from Charlotte, but it seems very likely that a TPE could be more useful than Turner and McDermott.


Honestly I'd rather have Tristan Thompson on a 2 year / $19 million deal than Myles Turner for 4 years at $18 million per.

The problem with this logic, and what a lot here fail to recognize is, we lost Hayward’s cap space by Ainge not making the trade. Despite how you feel about turner that’s an asset we would have got in return for Hayward instead of nothing.

We still could have signed Thompson, or used that money to sign somebody else. We could have flipped turner for picks or another player.

Instead Ainge stubbornness got us nothing.

More importantly, and as I said before, it’s an extremely bad look for Ainge from a PR standpoint for not letting Hayward go home.

Right now the national narrative is Ainge overplayed his hand, Hayward would have taken the hometown discount for the pacers and Ainge blew it for him. That’s not a good look for Ainge, I’ll tell you this much if I played in the NBA he is not a GM I’d want to do business with given his track record.. and I’m a diehard Celtics fan.

The Celtics reportedly did their research on how valuable Turner is viewed around the league and did not like what they saw. They would have been stuck with an overpaid center who Stevens wouldn't want to use and who they would have trouble offloading.

Sound like the league is well aware of Turner's defensive limitations which in the current NBA are a legit problem.

[Darth_Yoda]

I don't know if any sign and trade is going to happen with Charlotte, but it's clear that Ainge blew it by not taking Indiana's sign and trade for Turner and McDermott.
That's WEEI's position, and I agree with it.

Danny got picky, as usual, not recognizing he had no leverage--GH had opted out. Holding out for somebody else other than McDermott. Cripes, Indiana was doing him a favor!
Instead, Charlotte swooped in, offered GH more dough, and he was gone.

Now he did manage to pull himself out of a hole signing Thompson and Teague. But he could have had a much bigger exception with Indiana's offer.
 
If I were Wyc, I'd be frustrated at Danny's inability to carpe diem. Maybe also about the failure to win another title after 12 years.

Ainge is a good B student, but not an A.

Turner is not good. Get similar production out of theis at less than a third the cost.

There is a whole thread I srarted about it.

Thompson and teague at 11 mill combined is better than turner andcdermott at 25 mill a season combined.

And we will still most likely get a tpe to add to the team.