Deron Williams threatens to leave Utah in 2012 ( Can he play SG?)

[MBunge]

DWill might be a better rebuilding piece than Rondo, though I'm not sure about that.  But when it comes to who's the best PG for this Celtic team to win a title, it's no contest.

Rondo averages 10 shots about 2 ft attempts a game.  DWill averages over 15 shots and 7 ft attempts a game.  DWill would completely change the offensive chemistry of the team and I've seen nothing out of him that says he could play at the same high level when he's not allowed to score a lot.

Mike

That is much more a function of their  respective supporting casts then anything else.

That's simply not the case.  DWill is taking the most shots on this year's Jazz team and has taken about 160 more ft attempts than Al Jefferson.  He took the most shots on the Jazz last season, a few hundred more than Carlos Boozer, and he took the most shots on the Jazz two seasons ago.

In the NBA, and I suspect in college, DWill has NEVER played the pg role the way Rondo has.

Mike

Has Williams ever played with a perimeter scorer like Paul Pierce?  How about a clutch money outside shooter like Ray Allen?  If Rondo was in Utah under Sloan with the same roster he would more then likely be the leading attempt player on that team as well and if Williams was in Boston with the same system and supporting cast that Rondo has, he would be taking far fewer shots.

Uh, Williams has been playing with low-post scorers in Boozer and Jefferson who are far better in the post than anyone Rondo has ever played with.  He's also had guys like AK47, Kyle Korver, Wesley Matthews, Okur and let's not forget Milsap, who came out of nowhere to play at near all-star level.  The Jazz have had plenty of talent for a pass-first PG to work with.

But DWill has ALWAYS been a scoring PG.  He's taken more shots and more free throw attempts than any other Jazz player since his second year in the league and there's ZERO reason to believe he can play at a high level without taking a bunch of shots.

Mike

Deron Williams isn't a high usage player and his passing is excellent. He's taken 13.3 shots a game for his career with 4.6 FTA per game. That's not all that many.

He also doesn't ball hog nearly as much as CP3. I get that he takes the most shots on his team, but everyone on the Jazz gets their touches.

You're leaving out 3 pters.  Add them in and DWill is taking 16.5 shots a game, while Rondo takes only 9.6 for their careers.  And it's 2.8 ft attempts a game for Rondo vs. 4.6 for DWill.  An extra 7 shots and 2 ft attempts a game is a HUUUUUGE difference.

Mike

[Fan from VT]

You're leaving out 3 pters.  Add them in and DWill is taking 16.5 shots a game, while Rondo takes only 9.6 for their careers.  And it's 2.8 ft attempts a game for Rondo vs. 4.6 for DWill.  An extra 7 shots and 2 ft attempts a game is a HUUUUUGE difference.

Mike

If you have a TS% of .602...tied 29th in the league, you should be shooting. Shots aren't "selfish" if you make them at a high clip.

[Fan from VT]

As for Chris Paul (mentioned a few posts ago) he has a higher TS% than Williams, higher PER, and lower usage rate...hard to call him a ball hog, he's phenomenal.

[MBunge]

You're leaving out 3 pters.  Add them in and DWill is taking 16.5 shots a game, while Rondo takes only 9.6 for their careers.  And it's 2.8 ft attempts a game for Rondo vs. 4.6 for DWill.  An extra 7 shots and 2 ft attempts a game is a HUUUUUGE difference.

Mike

If you have a TS% of .602...tied 29th in the league, you should be shooting. Shots aren't "selfish" if you make them at a high clip.

Why are there quotes around the world "selfish"?  Have I called DWill selfish or criticized him for shooting the ball?  No.  My point is that the Celtic offense would, by necessity, be a completely different animal with DWill running the point instead of Rondo.

Mike

[MBunge]

As for Chris Paul (mentioned a few posts ago) he has a higher TS% than Williams, higher PER, and lower usage rate...hard to call him a ball hog, he's phenomenal.

Is anyone calling anyone a "ball hog"?

Mike

[Fan from VT]

You're leaving out 3 pters.  Add them in and DWill is taking 16.5 shots a game, while Rondo takes only 9.6 for their careers.  And it's 2.8 ft attempts a game for Rondo vs. 4.6 for DWill.  An extra 7 shots and 2 ft attempts a game is a HUUUUUGE difference.

Mike

If you have a TS% of .602...tied 29th in the league, you should be shooting. Shots aren't "selfish" if you make them at a high clip.

Why are there quotes around the world "selfish"?  Have I called DWill selfish or criticized him for shooting the ball?  No.  My point is that the Celtic offense would, by necessity, be a completely different animal with DWill running the point instead of Rondo.

Mike

no, sorry, did not mean to imply you did. However, Williams is a great player. there is no reason to think that a player like Williams who can do almost everything Rondo does as well as shoot with great accuracy wouldn't do anything but improve the team. I get a strong vibe around here that any shot a point guard takes is a bad one, which seems silly.

[Fafnir]

DWill might be a better rebuilding piece than Rondo, though I'm not sure about that.  But when it comes to who's the best PG for this Celtic team to win a title, it's no contest.

Rondo averages 10 shots about 2 ft attempts a game.  DWill averages over 15 shots and 7 ft attempts a game.  DWill would completely change the offensive chemistry of the team and I've seen nothing out of him that says he could play at the same high level when he's not allowed to score a lot.

Mike

That is much more a function of their  respective supporting casts then anything else.

That's simply not the case.  DWill is taking the most shots on this year's Jazz team and has taken about 160 more ft attempts than Al Jefferson.  He took the most shots on the Jazz last season, a few hundred more than Carlos Boozer, and he took the most shots on the Jazz two seasons ago.

In the NBA, and I suspect in college, DWill has NEVER played the pg role the way Rondo has.

Mike

Has Williams ever played with a perimeter scorer like Paul Pierce?  How about a clutch money outside shooter like Ray Allen?  If Rondo was in Utah under Sloan with the same roster he would more then likely be the leading attempt player on that team as well and if Williams was in Boston with the same system and supporting cast that Rondo has, he would be taking far fewer shots.

Uh, Williams has been playing with low-post scorers in Boozer and Jefferson who are far better in the post than anyone Rondo has ever played with.  He's also had guys like AK47, Kyle Korver, Wesley Matthews, Okur and let's not forget Milsap, who came out of nowhere to play at near all-star level.  The Jazz have had plenty of talent for a pass-first PG to work with.

But DWill has ALWAYS been a scoring PG.  He's taken more shots and more free throw attempts than any other Jazz player since his second year in the league and there's ZERO reason to believe he can play at a high level without taking a bunch of shots.

Mike

Deron Williams isn't a high usage player and his passing is excellent. He's taken 13.3 shots a game for his career with 4.6 FTA per game. That's not all that many.

He also doesn't ball hog nearly as much as CP3. I get that he takes the most shots on his team, but everyone on the Jazz gets their touches.

You're leaving out 3 pters.  Add them in and DWill is taking 16.5 shots a game, while Rondo takes only 9.6 for their careers.  And it's 2.8 ft attempts a game for Rondo vs. 4.6 for DWill.  An extra 7 shots and 2 ft attempts a game is a HUUUUUGE difference.

Mike

His overall FGAs includes his 3 point shots. On basketball reference and on US Box scores they aren't separate.

[Fafnir]

As for Chris Paul (mentioned a few posts ago) he has a higher TS% than Williams, higher PER, and lower usage rate...hard to call him a ball hog, he's phenomenal.

He is phenomenal, however he is also a ball hog. He pounds the air out of the basketball. He's been better this year about playing off the ball more often, but he still completely dominates the ball.

[Who]

Yes, the offense would change with Deron Williams. He is a different type of point guard to Rajon Rondo.

That would not be a problem.

Deron Williams would improve the Celtics offense.

[Eja117]

He'll stay in Utah because they can offer the most money, mystery solved.

Like Lebron, Bosh, Amare, Boozer, and possibly Carmelo?

Time to make an addition to the superloser watch list

[Eja117]

Rondo is the starting PG of the second best team (record wise)in the NBA right now. He has won a championship and has successfully been able to keep four future hall of fame players happy with his play making. Deron may be a better individual player, but Rondo has already earned the respect of Shaq and the Big 3, which is no easy feat. Trading him now would be a very reckless move. This current Celtic team is on a mission and we shouldn't even be talking of trades which could disrupt the team's chemistry.

I don't think we can beat the Lakers as presently constructed unless the Lakers have injuries, which is why I would make moves.

I think you are alone there. If we are healthy, we are BUILT to beat the Lakers.

As presently constructed & healthy, no one is beating this Celtics team in a 7 game series. No one.

They got that look this year.  They're locked in.  Injuries are the only thing that would be their undoing.  I say that with the utmost confidence. 

I'm hearing "We don't need Sheed"