It's hilarious how the fanbase has turned 180 and would "rather have" Wallace

[D.o.s.]

Here's the thing:

Optimists around here like to talk about how young our team is.  How the team is succeeding despite having all of these young guys with a bright future.

Yet, we're currently on track to give significant minutes and major roles to Isaiah Thomas, Avery Bradley, Evan Turner, David Lee, and Amir Johnson.

A veritable parade of guys who are what they are and whose main value to the team is that they might fetch some value in a trade.

If this sounds familiar, it's basically the same spot the team was in heading into last season.  So we've gone through a full year of rebuild and the team is, if anything, more cluttered with "assets" and we can't even place our hopes on a top 10 picking coming our way.


The saving grace of a rebuilding team is typically that there are a handful of young guys who occasionally flash the potential to turn into something special, guys you can grow attached to and imagine as the future of the franchise. 

No such luck here.


Basically, refer to my "Revolving Door" post.

No way man our team is so good dude they're gonna be stars we just gotta let 'em develop why do you hate the Celtics you evil man you.

Lee averaged 18.2 points and 9.3 rebounds per game on 52.3-percent shooting in the 2013-14 season and then got hurt . Now all of a sudden he is suppose to suck? I don't get it.

His offense is mitigated by his defense, and his numbers are empty. He has consistently struggled to find playing time on a championship-caliber team, and he has never been the primary player on a winning team.

If you want more evidence of his greatness, look at his tenure with the Knicks. Contrast that with their win-loss ratio.

He struggled to get back into the rotation because he got hurt and Draymond Green took his place.
Throwing out that he isn't good at defense is just one of those blanket statements of the uninformed.
Because the Knicks were bad with him there means absolutely nothing. This is a very weak argument.  With that logic, Kevin Garnett stunk because Minnesota stunk, Pierce stunk because the pre "Big Three" Celtics stunk.  Ray Allen must of been bad because Seattle and Milwaukee stunk. 

This theory make no sense.
D. Lee isn't those players but he is a walking double double.  A very solid player

You can find a few well-researched articles on David Lee's defense in the first post of this thread:
http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=79651.0

I believe you will find that there is significantly more evidence for Lee being, at absolute best, a general nonfactor because of his defense and offensive contributions, than you will of your position.

But, of course, I shouldn't ask you for evidence of your claims, because you're the one throwing out phrases like "uninformed", right? You must know what you're talking about.

[KeepRondo]

Here's the thing:

Optimists around here like to talk about how young our team is.  How the team is succeeding despite having all of these young guys with a bright future.

Yet, we're currently on track to give significant minutes and major roles to Isaiah Thomas, Avery Bradley, Evan Turner, David Lee, and Amir Johnson.

A veritable parade of guys who are what they are and whose main value to the team is that they might fetch some value in a trade.

If this sounds familiar, it's basically the same spot the team was in heading into last season.  So we've gone through a full year of rebuild and the team is, if anything, more cluttered with "assets" and we can't even place our hopes on a top 10 picking coming our way.


The saving grace of a rebuilding team is typically that there are a handful of young guys who occasionally flash the potential to turn into something special, guys you can grow attached to and imagine as the future of the franchise. 

No such luck here.


Basically, refer to my "Revolving Door" post.

No way man our team is so good dude they're gonna be stars we just gotta let 'em develop why do you hate the Celtics you evil man you.

Lee averaged 18.2 points and 9.3 rebounds per game on 52.3-percent shooting in the 2013-14 season and then got hurt . Now all of a sudden he is suppose to suck? I don't get it.

His offense is mitigated by his defense, and his numbers are empty. He has consistently struggled to find playing time on a championship-caliber team, and he has never been the primary player on a winning team.

If you want more evidence of his greatness, look at his tenure with the Knicks. Contrast that with their win-loss ratio.

He struggled to get back into the rotation because he got hurt and Draymond Green took his place.
Throwing out that he isn't good at defense is just one of those blanket statements of the uninformed.
Because the Knicks were bad with him there means absolutely nothing. This is a very weak argument.  With that logic, Kevin Garnett stunk because Minnesota stunk, Pierce stunk because the pre "Big Three" Celtics stunk.  Ray Allen must of been bad because Seattle and Milwaukee stunk. 

This theory make no sense.
D. Lee isn't those players but he is a walking double double.  A very solid player

You can find a few well-researched articles on David Lee's defense in the first post of this thread:
http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=79651.0

I believe you will find that there is significantly more evidence for Lee being, at absolute best, a general nonfactor because of his defense and offensive contributions, than you will of your position.

But, of course, I shouldn't ask you for evidence of your claims, because you're the one throwing out phrases like "uninformed", right? You must know what you're talking about.

He probably is still an upgrade over Olynyk and Sullinger.

[harrisun37]

"It's hilarious" in the thread title? Is it that necessary for you to tell us how much better you are than us? Thanks, thanks man for kicking us when we are down. Nice downer/negative thread making fun of us, you are an amazing human being, noble prize worthy individual here. At least I feel much worse about myself after reading this thread title than I did before so I have that going for me now.

This post justifies having "it's hilarious" in the thread title.  What would we do without being entertained by people like you?

you get TP. Mandatory.

[D.o.s.]

Here's the thing:

Optimists around here like to talk about how young our team is.  How the team is succeeding despite having all of these young guys with a bright future.

Yet, we're currently on track to give significant minutes and major roles to Isaiah Thomas, Avery Bradley, Evan Turner, David Lee, and Amir Johnson.

A veritable parade of guys who are what they are and whose main value to the team is that they might fetch some value in a trade.

If this sounds familiar, it's basically the same spot the team was in heading into last season.  So we've gone through a full year of rebuild and the team is, if anything, more cluttered with "assets" and we can't even place our hopes on a top 10 picking coming our way.


The saving grace of a rebuilding team is typically that there are a handful of young guys who occasionally flash the potential to turn into something special, guys you can grow attached to and imagine as the future of the franchise. 

No such luck here.


Basically, refer to my "Revolving Door" post.

No way man our team is so good dude they're gonna be stars we just gotta let 'em develop why do you hate the Celtics you evil man you.

Lee averaged 18.2 points and 9.3 rebounds per game on 52.3-percent shooting in the 2013-14 season and then got hurt . Now all of a sudden he is suppose to suck? I don't get it.

His offense is mitigated by his defense, and his numbers are empty. He has consistently struggled to find playing time on a championship-caliber team, and he has never been the primary player on a winning team.

If you want more evidence of his greatness, look at his tenure with the Knicks. Contrast that with their win-loss ratio.

He struggled to get back into the rotation because he got hurt and Draymond Green took his place.
Throwing out that he isn't good at defense is just one of those blanket statements of the uninformed.
Because the Knicks were bad with him there means absolutely nothing. This is a very weak argument.  With that logic, Kevin Garnett stunk because Minnesota stunk, Pierce stunk because the pre "Big Three" Celtics stunk.  Ray Allen must of been bad because Seattle and Milwaukee stunk. 

This theory make no sense.
D. Lee isn't those players but he is a walking double double.  A very solid player

You can find a few well-researched articles on David Lee's defense in the first post of this thread:
http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=79651.0

I believe you will find that there is significantly more evidence for Lee being, at absolute best, a general nonfactor because of his defense and offensive contributions, than you will of your position.

But, of course, I shouldn't ask you for evidence of your claims, because you're the one throwing out phrases like "uninformed", right? You must know what you're talking about.

He probably is still an upgrade over Olynyk and Sullinger.

I would agree with that.

[mmmmm]

The team is pretty clearly heading down that treadmill of mediocrity that everyone swore Ainge wouldn't get caught on.

Not yet. He could always blow it up anytime a la the Sixers.

They will have enough cap space next year to sign 2 Max contracts.  Now people can complain that the free agents next year aren't good, and that nobody will want to sign here, whine, whine, whine, but the bottom line is that they will be in a position to do something big.

It's not just about free agents, though.

Lee represents an expiring contract that can match up to 20.5M in incoming salary in trade.

Amir and Jerebko represent expiring/non-guaranteed contracts that can match up to 22M in incoming salary in trade.

For whatever else he's done, Danny has very quickly set himself up to make massive trades, should the opportunity to be there.

[Rondo9]

The team is pretty clearly heading down that treadmill of mediocrity that everyone swore Ainge wouldn't get caught on.

+1


The only way this makes sense to me is that Ainge is wayyyyyyy more confident in his ability to spin gold out of wheat than any of us gave him credit for.

It's only mediorcity if you have long term contracts and limited flexibility.

[D.o.s.]

The team is pretty clearly heading down that treadmill of mediocrity that everyone swore Ainge wouldn't get caught on.

Not yet. He could always blow it up anytime a la the Sixers.

They will have enough cap space next year to sign 2 Max contracts.  Now people can complain that the free agents next year aren't good, and that nobody will want to sign here, whine, whine, whine, but the bottom line is that they will be in a position to do something big.

It's not just about free agents, though.

Lee represents an expiring contract that can match up to 20.5M in incoming salary in trade.

Amir and Jerebko represent expiring/non-guaranteed contracts that can match up to 22M in incoming salary in trade.

For whatever else he's done, Danny has very quickly set himself up to make massive trades, should the opportunity to be there.

This is a good point, but while flexibility is a great thing to have (see: the David West trade, which was scuttled over Jermaine's contract) it only matters if a deal presents itself.

To that end, while none of us are prescient, I asked about what kind of players we were in a position to go after with Lee that weren't there with Wallace. The lone response I got was hardly compelling, and I'd love to hear some more possibilities.

[dark_lord]

this was a great move for the celts.  take money/contracts out of the equations and just base it on play.....Lee is a major upgrade for our club. 

[D.o.s.]

this was a great move for the celts.  take money/contracts out of the equations and just base it on play.....Lee is a major upgrade for our club.

David Lee the basketball player makes me sad.

[dark_lord]

this was a great move for the celts.  take money/contracts out of the equations and just base it on play.....Lee is a major upgrade for our club.

David Lee the basketball player makes me sad.

but he is an upgrade to wallace.  and he is better than KO and/or zeller.  if you want to feel sad about that, then i feel your pain lol. i think lee is pretty good.  he isn't great, but he is solid