Author Topic: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics  (Read 6116 times)

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Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #15 on: December 12, 2018, 03:15:30 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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That article spells out some things about Jaylen that were surprising to read.  Not really fitting in on the court or in the locker room.  Getting some tough love from his teammates.  Hopefully he turns it around.  He's looked better his last few games.

I'm not sure those comments indicate he isn't fitting in. I read the article. I think everyone was frustrated by his lack of production. Smart wanted to talk it out. Brown was still working through it internally.

Let's not let our imaginations carry it further than it really was.

Yea, I agree. I’m not sure how you read that whole article and took away that Jaylen isn’t fitting in.

They’re all asking a lot of each other; A hallmark of greatness. Jaylen is clearly reflective and sensitive, to be able to acknowledge that and not victimize yourself shows class, respect, and maturity; all of these are metrics of success.
Also, he is very self aware. That's something most people never become and is a trait that can lead to greatness.

As for not fitting in, I didn't get that from the article. Seems his team mates know how great he can be and are just doing what team mates do, pick him up, give him tough love but support him.

Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #16 on: December 12, 2018, 03:26:46 PM »

Offline footey

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Jaylen is still my favorite Celtic.  I think the article was good, but maybe could have emphasized a bit more how he has turned things around, really starting with the game he got hurt, which was at least a couple of weeks ago. Look forward to listening to the podcast tonight after the game.

Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #17 on: December 12, 2018, 04:02:03 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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That article spells out some things about Jaylen that were surprising to read.  Not really fitting in on the court or in the locker room.  Getting some tough love from his teammates.  Hopefully he turns it around.  He's looked better his last few games.

I'm not sure those comments indicate he isn't fitting in. I read the article. I think everyone was frustrated by his lack of production. Smart wanted to talk it out. Brown was still working through it internally.

Let's not let our imaginations carry it further than it really was.

Yea, I agree. I’m not sure how you read that whole article and took away that Jaylen isn’t fitting in.

They’re all asking a lot of each other; A hallmark of greatness. Jaylen is clearly reflective and sensitive, to be able to acknowledge that and not victimize yourself shows class, respect, and maturity; all of these are metrics of success.
im not sure how you could read the whole thing and not come away realizing he has struggled finding a role.  The article is literally called “jaylens new reality”... he’s adjusting.

Also this from the podcast:

Quote
JM: “...a renaissance man, if you will. He’s probably not quite as much of that as he thinks he is- and I think sometimes that causes issues in their locker room. And I don’t think they dislike him Zach, but I think they’re like “what’s with this dude?”

ZL: On that last part, and I want to choose my words carefully here...there is some thought that he’s not that much of what he thinks he is. There’s some “there goes Jaylen again talking about whatever - yoga.” And there’s some smirking in the locker room”

Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #18 on: December 12, 2018, 04:20:14 PM »

Online DefenseWinsChamps

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That article spells out some things about Jaylen that were surprising to read.  Not really fitting in on the court or in the locker room.  Getting some tough love from his teammates.  Hopefully he turns it around.  He's looked better his last few games.

I'm not sure those comments indicate he isn't fitting in. I read the article. I think everyone was frustrated by his lack of production. Smart wanted to talk it out. Brown was still working through it internally.

Let's not let our imaginations carry it further than it really was.

Yea, I agree. I’m not sure how you read that whole article and took away that Jaylen isn’t fitting in.

They’re all asking a lot of each other; A hallmark of greatness. Jaylen is clearly reflective and sensitive, to be able to acknowledge that and not victimize yourself shows class, respect, and maturity; all of these are metrics of success.
im not sure how you could read the whole thing and not come away realizing he has struggled finding a role.  The article is literally called “jaylens new reality”... he’s adjusting.

Also this from the podcast:

Quote
JM: “...a renaissance man, if you will. He’s probably not quite as much of that as he thinks he is- and I think sometimes that causes issues in their locker room. And I don’t think they dislike him Zach, but I think they’re like “what’s with this dude?”

ZL: On that last part, and I want to choose my words carefully here...there is some thought that he’s not that much of what he thinks he is. There’s some “there goes Jaylen again talking about whatever - yoga.” And there’s some smirking in the locker room”

I agree he isn't fitting in with his role. You said he wasn't fitting in in the locker room. That's what I disagreed with.

Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #19 on: December 12, 2018, 04:24:35 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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As an introverted person prone to responding to other people challenging me face-to-face by silently thinking about what they said / internally figuring out how I feel, I think I can identify somewhat with Jaylen as he's described in the article.

People sometimes interpret that type of reaction as a lack of care, or arrogant dismissal or the like, but for me at least it's usually a case of not wanting to or being ready to respond until I've had a chance to think about it.
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Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #20 on: December 12, 2018, 04:25:41 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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That article spells out some things about Jaylen that were surprising to read.  Not really fitting in on the court or in the locker room.  Getting some tough love from his teammates.  Hopefully he turns it around.  He's looked better his last few games.

I'm not sure those comments indicate he isn't fitting in. I read the article. I think everyone was frustrated by his lack of production. Smart wanted to talk it out. Brown was still working through it internally.

Let's not let our imaginations carry it further than it really was.

Yea, I agree. I’m not sure how you read that whole article and took away that Jaylen isn’t fitting in.

They’re all asking a lot of each other; A hallmark of greatness. Jaylen is clearly reflective and sensitive, to be able to acknowledge that and not victimize yourself shows class, respect, and maturity; all of these are metrics of success.
im not sure how you could read the whole thing and not come away realizing he has struggled finding a role.  The article is literally called “jaylens new reality”... he’s adjusting.

Also this from the podcast:

Quote
JM: “...a renaissance man, if you will. He’s probably not quite as much of that as he thinks he is- and I think sometimes that causes issues in their locker room. And I don’t think they dislike him Zach, but I think they’re like “what’s with this dude?”

ZL: On that last part, and I want to choose my words carefully here...there is some thought that he’s not that much of what he thinks he is. There’s some “there goes Jaylen again talking about whatever - yoga.” And there’s some smirking in the locker room”

I agree he isn't fitting in with his role. You said he wasn't fitting in in the locker room. That's what I disagreed with.
sounds like they have tried to get through to him and he looks back at them in silence.  Doesn’t sound like they think much of his “I’m smarter than everyone” persona either.  This is not the first time I’ve heard of teammates saying “he’s not as smart as he thinks he is.” 

Side note:  I thought it was pretty funny when jaylen showed up on Bloomberg this summer pretending to know about investing. He sounded exactly like id expect a college freshman who hasn’t done his homework to sound.  They asked him about investing and he started talking about wanting to research online gambling. 

Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2018, 04:32:51 PM »

Online RJ87

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That article spells out some things about Jaylen that were surprising to read.  Not really fitting in on the court or in the locker room.  Getting some tough love from his teammates.  Hopefully he turns it around.  He's looked better his last few games.

I'm not sure those comments indicate he isn't fitting in. I read the article. I think everyone was frustrated by his lack of production. Smart wanted to talk it out. Brown was still working through it internally.

Let's not let our imaginations carry it further than it really was.

Yea, I agree. I’m not sure how you read that whole article and took away that Jaylen isn’t fitting in.

They’re all asking a lot of each other; A hallmark of greatness. Jaylen is clearly reflective and sensitive, to be able to acknowledge that and not victimize yourself shows class, respect, and maturity; all of these are metrics of success.
im not sure how you could read the whole thing and not come away realizing he has struggled finding a role.  The article is literally called “jaylens new reality”... he’s adjusting.

Also this from the podcast:

Quote
JM: “...a renaissance man, if you will. He’s probably not quite as much of that as he thinks he is- and I think sometimes that causes issues in their locker room. And I don’t think they dislike him Zach, but I think they’re like “what’s with this dude?”

ZL: On that last part, and I want to choose my words carefully here...there is some thought that he’s not that much of what he thinks he is. There’s some “there goes Jaylen again talking about whatever - yoga.” And there’s some smirking in the locker room”

I agree he isn't fitting in with his role. You said he wasn't fitting in in the locker room. That's what I disagreed with.
sounds like they have tried to get through to him and he looks back at them in silence.  Doesn’t sound like they think much of his “I’m smarter than everyone” persona either.  This is not the first time I’ve heard of teammates saying “he’s not as smart as he thinks he is.” 

Side note:  I thought it was pretty funny when jaylen showed up on Bloomberg this summer pretending to know about investing. He sounded exactly like id expect a college freshman who hasn’t done his homework to sound.  They asked him about investing and he started talking about wanting to research online gambling.

There was an SI article (I think it was SI, it was last year) that a scout said they had concerns about drafting Jaylen because "he considers himself a thinker and that may get him in trouble" or something to that effect. It was an odd quote at the time I read it, but it's starting to make a lot of sense now.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2018, 05:22:07 PM by RJ87 »
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Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2018, 05:13:50 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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That article spells out some things about Jaylen that were surprising to read.  Not really fitting in on the court or in the locker room.  Getting some tough love from his teammates.  Hopefully he turns it around.  He's looked better his last few games.

I'm not sure those comments indicate he isn't fitting in. I read the article. I think everyone was frustrated by his lack of production. Smart wanted to talk it out. Brown was still working through it internally.

Let's not let our imaginations carry it further than it really was.

Yea, I agree. I’m not sure how you read that whole article and took away that Jaylen isn’t fitting in.

They’re all asking a lot of each other; A hallmark of greatness. Jaylen is clearly reflective and sensitive, to be able to acknowledge that and not victimize yourself shows class, respect, and maturity; all of these are metrics of success.
im not sure how you could read the whole thing and not come away realizing he has struggled finding a role.  The article is literally called “jaylens new reality”... he’s adjusting.

Also this from the podcast:

Quote
JM: “...a renaissance man, if you will. He’s probably not quite as much of that as he thinks he is- and I think sometimes that causes issues in their locker room. And I don’t think they dislike him Zach, but I think they’re like “what’s with this dude?”

ZL: On that last part, and I want to choose my words carefully here...there is some thought that he’s not that much of what he thinks he is. There’s some “there goes Jaylen again talking about whatever - yoga.” And there’s some smirking in the locker room”
First off, Zach Lowe is purely speculating("there is some thought") and he isn't nearly connected as MacMullan and even she looks to be speculating because she says she thinks this and she thinks this. If she wasn't speculating also, she would have said "I heard" or something like that. What that tells me is they just don't know.

Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #23 on: December 12, 2018, 05:22:16 PM »

Offline kraidstar

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Soooooo..... cocky young kid comes into the season with sky-high expectations, has some early struggles and takes some lumps.

Not a big deal at all. This is all a learning experience. Brad Stevens knows it's a journey. Jaylen knows it's a journey. He is talented and driven. He will be fine.

Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #24 on: December 12, 2018, 05:55:16 PM »

Online bdm860

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That article spells out some things about Jaylen that were surprising to read.  Not really fitting in on the court or in the locker room.  Getting some tough love from his teammates.  Hopefully he turns it around.  He's looked better his last few games.

I'm not sure those comments indicate he isn't fitting in. I read the article. I think everyone was frustrated by his lack of production. Smart wanted to talk it out. Brown was still working through it internally.

Let's not let our imaginations carry it further than it really was.

Yea, I agree. I’m not sure how you read that whole article and took away that Jaylen isn’t fitting in.

They’re all asking a lot of each other; A hallmark of greatness. Jaylen is clearly reflective and sensitive, to be able to acknowledge that and not victimize yourself shows class, respect, and maturity; all of these are metrics of success.
im not sure how you could read the whole thing and not come away realizing he has struggled finding a role.  The article is literally called “jaylens new reality”... he’s adjusting.

Also this from the podcast:

Quote
JM: “...a renaissance man, if you will. He’s probably not quite as much of that as he thinks he is- and I think sometimes that causes issues in their locker room. And I don’t think they dislike him Zach, but I think they’re like “what’s with this dude?”

ZL: On that last part, and I want to choose my words carefully here...there is some thought that he’s not that much of what he thinks he is. There’s some “there goes Jaylen again talking about whatever - yoga.” And there’s some smirking in the locker room”

I agree he isn't fitting in with his role. You said he wasn't fitting in in the locker room. That's what I disagreed with.
sounds like they have tried to get through to him and he looks back at them in silence.  Doesn’t sound like they think much of his “I’m smarter than everyone” persona either.  This is not the first time I’ve heard of teammates saying “he’s not as smart as he thinks he is.” 

Side note:  I thought it was pretty funny when jaylen showed up on Bloomberg this summer pretending to know about investing. He sounded exactly like id expect a college freshman who hasn’t done his homework to sound.  They asked him about investing and he started talking about wanting to research online gambling.

There was an SI article (I think it was SI, it was last year) that a scout said they had concerns about Jaylen because "he considers himself a thinker and that may get him in trouble" or something to that effect. It was an odd quote at the time I read it, but it's starting to make a lot of sense now.

When the C's first drafted Jaylen and I kept hearing how much of an "intellectual" he was, I always wondered if that was from Jaylen viewing himself as an "intellectual" or the media just hyping it up some of Jaylen's non-stereotypical interests?

Because personally I was never impressed by how it was all portrayed.

Taking things straight from this article (which also has the "too smart" quote RJ87 may have been referring to) :

Quote
Here’s a snapshot: He learned Spanish during his freshman year at Cal and said that while improvement is still needed, he is confident he can conduct interviews in the language. He said being bilingual is good for personal growth and for business and he wants to learn three more languages by age 25. He took classes such at Cal on global poverty and practice, theoretical studies and student activism as a freshman, because he wanted to be able to debunk “a lot of misconceptions about people who are poor, homeless or etc.” He owns and can play an acoustic guitar (“I’m not going to toot my own horn. I’m all right.”). He interned two months at Base Ventures with Moore (“I was happy to find out that Jaylen was very keen to learn and take advantage of the tech eco system that thrives right in his backyard,” Moore said).

Brown keeps a journal instead of relying on his phone. He uses it to write down all the “great advice” he gets from mentors. He also enjoys vegetarian cuisine and doesn’t eat pork or red meat.

He’s a huge soccer fan who can speak as knowledgeably about FC Barcelona and Arsenal as he can about the Cleveland Cavaliers and the Golden State Warriors.

His favorite player is Messi. He’s an avid chess player who learned the game from his grandfather and was captain of the chess team at Marietta Wheeler High School in Georgia. He also took a chess class at Cal as an elective and says the game is “comparable to life.”

To me, you're not smart/intelligent because you take Spanish 101, play the guitar, play chess, and take non-cupcake courses. It's cool to be interested in those things, but it's nothing special.

Now if he was some nationally ranked chess player, become fluent in Spanish after learning only studying it for a week, etc.  Now I'm more impressed.

But it's get to the point where, have you ever met somebody who thinks they're smart because they read books while their friends would rather watch TV?  I'm sure we've all had to work or go to school with the "I'm so smart, I read Shakespeare and Nietzsche for fun in elementary school" people, and it turns out they're really idiots, but they think they're misunderstood geniuses?  Or that Freshman college student who thinks he knows more than the professor and can teach class on day 1?

I feel like I've heard more about Jaylen's intellect than Academic All-Americans like Emaka Okafor (graduated in 3 years), Tyler Zeller, Kelly Olynyk (also took Graduate level classes), or Andrew Nicholson (who got a degree in Physics, and said quantum mechanics was his favorite course), or Danny Granger who was accepted to Yale and got an engineering degree, or Brandon Knight who took college courses in high school, or Pau Gasol who speaks 5 languages and was enrolled in med school, etc.

So I've always wondered, is Jaylen really that smart/intelligent, and if so is he the one telling you that or is it coming other people?  Or does he just think he's smart?

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Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #25 on: December 12, 2018, 06:10:05 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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That article spells out some things about Jaylen that were surprising to read.  Not really fitting in on the court or in the locker room.  Getting some tough love from his teammates.  Hopefully he turns it around.  He's looked better his last few games.

I'm not sure those comments indicate he isn't fitting in. I read the article. I think everyone was frustrated by his lack of production. Smart wanted to talk it out. Brown was still working through it internally.

Let's not let our imaginations carry it further than it really was.

Yea, I agree. I’m not sure how you read that whole article and took away that Jaylen isn’t fitting in.

They’re all asking a lot of each other; A hallmark of greatness. Jaylen is clearly reflective and sensitive, to be able to acknowledge that and not victimize yourself shows class, respect, and maturity; all of these are metrics of success.
im not sure how you could read the whole thing and not come away realizing he has struggled finding a role.  The article is literally called “jaylens new reality”... he’s adjusting.

Also this from the podcast:

Quote
JM: “...a renaissance man, if you will. He’s probably not quite as much of that as he thinks he is- and I think sometimes that causes issues in their locker room. And I don’t think they dislike him Zach, but I think they’re like “what’s with this dude?”

ZL: On that last part, and I want to choose my words carefully here...there is some thought that he’s not that much of what he thinks he is. There’s some “there goes Jaylen again talking about whatever - yoga.” And there’s some smirking in the locker room”

I agree he isn't fitting in with his role. You said he wasn't fitting in in the locker room. That's what I disagreed with.
sounds like they have tried to get through to him and he looks back at them in silence.  Doesn’t sound like they think much of his “I’m smarter than everyone” persona either.  This is not the first time I’ve heard of teammates saying “he’s not as smart as he thinks he is.” 

Side note:  I thought it was pretty funny when jaylen showed up on Bloomberg this summer pretending to know about investing. He sounded exactly like id expect a college freshman who hasn’t done his homework to sound.  They asked him about investing and he started talking about wanting to research online gambling.

There was an SI article (I think it was SI, it was last year) that a scout said they had concerns about Jaylen because "he considers himself a thinker and that may get him in trouble" or something to that effect. It was an odd quote at the time I read it, but it's starting to make a lot of sense now.

When the C's first drafted Jaylen and I kept hearing how much of an "intellectual" he was, I always wondered if that was from Jaylen viewing himself as an "intellectual" or the media just hyping it up some of Jaylen's non-stereotypical interests?

Because personally I was never impressed by how it was all portrayed.

Taking things straight from this article (which also has the "too smart" quote RJ87 may have been referring to) :

Quote
Here’s a snapshot: He learned Spanish during his freshman year at Cal and said that while improvement is still needed, he is confident he can conduct interviews in the language. He said being bilingual is good for personal growth and for business and he wants to learn three more languages by age 25. He took classes such at Cal on global poverty and practice, theoretical studies and student activism as a freshman, because he wanted to be able to debunk “a lot of misconceptions about people who are poor, homeless or etc.” He owns and can play an acoustic guitar (“I’m not going to toot my own horn. I’m all right.”). He interned two months at Base Ventures with Moore (“I was happy to find out that Jaylen was very keen to learn and take advantage of the tech eco system that thrives right in his backyard,” Moore said).

Brown keeps a journal instead of relying on his phone. He uses it to write down all the “great advice” he gets from mentors. He also enjoys vegetarian cuisine and doesn’t eat pork or red meat.

He’s a huge soccer fan who can speak as knowledgeably about FC Barcelona and Arsenal as he can about the Cleveland Cavaliers and the Golden State Warriors.

His favorite player is Messi. He’s an avid chess player who learned the game from his grandfather and was captain of the chess team at Marietta Wheeler High School in Georgia. He also took a chess class at Cal as an elective and says the game is “comparable to life.”

To me, you're not smart/intelligent because you take Spanish 101, play the guitar, play chess, and take non-cupcake courses. It's cool to be interested in those things, but it's nothing special.

Now if he was some nationally ranked chess player, become fluent in Spanish after learning only studying it for a week, etc.  Now I'm more impressed.

But it's get to the point where, have you ever met somebody who thinks they're smart because they read books while their friends would rather watch TV?  I'm sure we've all had to work or go to school with the "I'm so smart, I read Shakespeare and Nietzsche for fun in elementary school" people, and it turns out they're really idiots, but they think they're misunderstood geniuses?  Or that Freshman college student who thinks he knows more than the professor and can teach class on day 1?

I feel like I've heard more about Jaylen's intellect than Academic All-Americans like Emaka Okafor (graduated in 3 years), Tyler Zeller, Kelly Olynyk (also took Graduate level classes), or Andrew Nicholson (who got a degree in Physics, and said quantum mechanics was his favorite course), or Danny Granger who was accepted to Yale and got an engineering degree, or Brandon Knight who took college courses in high school, or Pau Gasol who speaks 5 languages and was enrolled in med school, etc.

So I've always wondered, is Jaylen really that smart/intelligent, and if so is he the one telling you that or is it coming other people?  Or does he just think he's smart?
I think the narrative comes from a little of both.  Media writing about how smart he is, but also him perpetuating the idea by publicly saying things like he'd consider himself a failure if all hes remembered by is basketball.

I'm sure the guy has high expectations for himself.  He struggled in a huge way earlier in the season.  The article references how he looked detached.  I personally noticed he looked miserable out there.  Sounds like some of this stuff bled into the lockerroom as guys were frustrated about their new roles, but the good news is the team is on a little winning streak against creampuff opponents and Jaylen has performed well in his new bench role.  Hopefully it doesn't become a problem long-term.

Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #26 on: December 12, 2018, 06:13:29 PM »

Online RJ87

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That article spells out some things about Jaylen that were surprising to read.  Not really fitting in on the court or in the locker room.  Getting some tough love from his teammates.  Hopefully he turns it around.  He's looked better his last few games.

I'm not sure those comments indicate he isn't fitting in. I read the article. I think everyone was frustrated by his lack of production. Smart wanted to talk it out. Brown was still working through it internally.

Let's not let our imaginations carry it further than it really was.

Yea, I agree. I’m not sure how you read that whole article and took away that Jaylen isn’t fitting in.

They’re all asking a lot of each other; A hallmark of greatness. Jaylen is clearly reflective and sensitive, to be able to acknowledge that and not victimize yourself shows class, respect, and maturity; all of these are metrics of success.
im not sure how you could read the whole thing and not come away realizing he has struggled finding a role.  The article is literally called “jaylens new reality”... he’s adjusting.

Also this from the podcast:

Quote
JM: “...a renaissance man, if you will. He’s probably not quite as much of that as he thinks he is- and I think sometimes that causes issues in their locker room. And I don’t think they dislike him Zach, but I think they’re like “what’s with this dude?”

ZL: On that last part, and I want to choose my words carefully here...there is some thought that he’s not that much of what he thinks he is. There’s some “there goes Jaylen again talking about whatever - yoga.” And there’s some smirking in the locker room”

I agree he isn't fitting in with his role. You said he wasn't fitting in in the locker room. That's what I disagreed with.
sounds like they have tried to get through to him and he looks back at them in silence.  Doesn’t sound like they think much of his “I’m smarter than everyone” persona either.  This is not the first time I’ve heard of teammates saying “he’s not as smart as he thinks he is.” 

Side note:  I thought it was pretty funny when jaylen showed up on Bloomberg this summer pretending to know about investing. He sounded exactly like id expect a college freshman who hasn’t done his homework to sound.  They asked him about investing and he started talking about wanting to research online gambling.

There was an SI article (I think it was SI, it was last year) that a scout said they had concerns about Jaylen because "he considers himself a thinker and that may get him in trouble" or something to that effect. It was an odd quote at the time I read it, but it's starting to make a lot of sense now.

When the C's first drafted Jaylen and I kept hearing how much of an "intellectual" he was, I always wondered if that was from Jaylen viewing himself as an "intellectual" or the media just hyping it up some of Jaylen's non-stereotypical interests?

Because personally I was never impressed by how it was all portrayed.

Taking things straight from this article (which also has the "too smart" quote RJ87 may have been referring to) :

Quote
Here’s a snapshot: He learned Spanish during his freshman year at Cal and said that while improvement is still needed, he is confident he can conduct interviews in the language. He said being bilingual is good for personal growth and for business and he wants to learn three more languages by age 25. He took classes such at Cal on global poverty and practice, theoretical studies and student activism as a freshman, because he wanted to be able to debunk “a lot of misconceptions about people who are poor, homeless or etc.” He owns and can play an acoustic guitar (“I’m not going to toot my own horn. I’m all right.”). He interned two months at Base Ventures with Moore (“I was happy to find out that Jaylen was very keen to learn and take advantage of the tech eco system that thrives right in his backyard,” Moore said).

Brown keeps a journal instead of relying on his phone. He uses it to write down all the “great advice” he gets from mentors. He also enjoys vegetarian cuisine and doesn’t eat pork or red meat.

He’s a huge soccer fan who can speak as knowledgeably about FC Barcelona and Arsenal as he can about the Cleveland Cavaliers and the Golden State Warriors.

His favorite player is Messi. He’s an avid chess player who learned the game from his grandfather and was captain of the chess team at Marietta Wheeler High School in Georgia. He also took a chess class at Cal as an elective and says the game is “comparable to life.”

To me, you're not smart/intelligent because you take Spanish 101, play the guitar, play chess, and take non-cupcake courses. It's cool to be interested in those things, but it's nothing special.

Now if he was some nationally ranked chess player, become fluent in Spanish after learning only studying it for a week, etc.  Now I'm more impressed.

But it's get to the point where, have you ever met somebody who thinks they're smart because they read books while their friends would rather watch TV?  I'm sure we've all had to work or go to school with the "I'm so smart, I read Shakespeare and Nietzsche for fun in elementary school" people, and it turns out they're really idiots, but they think they're misunderstood geniuses?  Or that Freshman college student who thinks he knows more than the professor and can teach class on day 1?

I feel like I've heard more about Jaylen's intellect than Academic All-Americans like Emaka Okafor (graduated in 3 years), Tyler Zeller, Kelly Olynyk (also took Graduate level classes), or Andrew Nicholson (who got a degree in Physics, and said quantum mechanics was his favorite course), or Danny Granger who was accepted to Yale and got an engineering degree, or Brandon Knight who took college courses in high school, or Pau Gasol who speaks 5 languages and was enrolled in med school, etc.

So I've always wondered, is Jaylen really that smart/intelligent, and if so is he the one telling you that or is it coming other people?  Or does he just think he's smart?

Ah! Thanks for linking it. I really thought it was SI.com.
2021 Houston Rockets
PG: Kyrie Irving/Patty Mills/Jalen Brunson
SG: OG Anunoby/Norman Powell/Matisse Thybulle
SF: Gordon Hayward/Demar Derozan
PF: Giannis Antetokounmpo/Robert Covington
C: Kristaps Porzingis/Bobby Portis/James Wiseman

Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #27 on: December 12, 2018, 06:45:06 PM »

Offline The Oracle

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Jaylen had Smart, Rozier and Morris all angry with him against N.O. and deservedly so.   Everyone seemingly buying into their roles and making the right play consistently except for Brown.  He is forcing things and playing selfishly and that don't sit well especially with Smart.  Jaylen needs to put his supposed intelligence to work on the basketball floor, as of right now he is displaying far and away the lowest BBIQ on the team.

Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #28 on: December 12, 2018, 06:57:13 PM »

Online Neurotic Guy

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That article spells out some things about Jaylen that were surprising to read.  Not really fitting in on the court or in the locker room.  Getting some tough love from his teammates.  Hopefully he turns it around.  He's looked better his last few games.

I'm not sure those comments indicate he isn't fitting in. I read the article. I think everyone was frustrated by his lack of production. Smart wanted to talk it out. Brown was still working through it internally.

Let's not let our imaginations carry it further than it really was.

Yea, I agree. I’m not sure how you read that whole article and took away that Jaylen isn’t fitting in.

They’re all asking a lot of each other; A hallmark of greatness. Jaylen is clearly reflective and sensitive, to be able to acknowledge that and not victimize yourself shows class, respect, and maturity; all of these are metrics of success.
im not sure how you could read the whole thing and not come away realizing he has struggled finding a role.  The article is literally called “jaylens new reality”... he’s adjusting.

Also this from the podcast:

Quote
JM: “...a renaissance man, if you will. He’s probably not quite as much of that as he thinks he is- and I think sometimes that causes issues in their locker room. And I don’t think they dislike him Zach, but I think they’re like “what’s with this dude?”

ZL: On that last part, and I want to choose my words carefully here...there is some thought that he’s not that much of what he thinks he is. There’s some “there goes Jaylen again talking about whatever - yoga.” And there’s some smirking in the locker room”

I agree he isn't fitting in with his role. You said he wasn't fitting in in the locker room. That's what I disagreed with.
sounds like they have tried to get through to him and he looks back at them in silence.  Doesn’t sound like they think much of his “I’m smarter than everyone” persona either.  This is not the first time I’ve heard of teammates saying “he’s not as smart as he thinks he is.” 

Side note:  I thought it was pretty funny when jaylen showed up on Bloomberg this summer pretending to know about investing. He sounded exactly like id expect a college freshman who hasn’t done his homework to sound.  They asked him about investing and he started talking about wanting to research online gambling.

There was an SI article (I think it was SI, it was last year) that a scout said they had concerns about Jaylen because "he considers himself a thinker and that may get him in trouble" or something to that effect. It was an odd quote at the time I read it, but it's starting to make a lot of sense now.

When the C's first drafted Jaylen and I kept hearing how much of an "intellectual" he was, I always wondered if that was from Jaylen viewing himself as an "intellectual" or the media just hyping it up some of Jaylen's non-stereotypical interests?

Because personally I was never impressed by how it was all portrayed.

Taking things straight from this article (which also has the "too smart" quote RJ87 may have been referring to) :

Quote
Here’s a snapshot: He learned Spanish during his freshman year at Cal and said that while improvement is still needed, he is confident he can conduct interviews in the language. He said being bilingual is good for personal growth and for business and he wants to learn three more languages by age 25. He took classes such at Cal on global poverty and practice, theoretical studies and student activism as a freshman, because he wanted to be able to debunk “a lot of misconceptions about people who are poor, homeless or etc.” He owns and can play an acoustic guitar (“I’m not going to toot my own horn. I’m all right.”). He interned two months at Base Ventures with Moore (“I was happy to find out that Jaylen was very keen to learn and take advantage of the tech eco system that thrives right in his backyard,” Moore said).

Brown keeps a journal instead of relying on his phone. He uses it to write down all the “great advice” he gets from mentors. He also enjoys vegetarian cuisine and doesn’t eat pork or red meat.

He’s a huge soccer fan who can speak as knowledgeably about FC Barcelona and Arsenal as he can about the Cleveland Cavaliers and the Golden State Warriors.

His favorite player is Messi. He’s an avid chess player who learned the game from his grandfather and was captain of the chess team at Marietta Wheeler High School in Georgia. He also took a chess class at Cal as an elective and says the game is “comparable to life.”

To me, you're not smart/intelligent because you take Spanish 101, play the guitar, play chess, and take non-cupcake courses. It's cool to be interested in those things, but it's nothing special.

Now if he was some nationally ranked chess player, become fluent in Spanish after learning only studying it for a week, etc.  Now I'm more impressed.

But it's get to the point where, have you ever met somebody who thinks they're smart because they read books while their friends would rather watch TV?  I'm sure we've all had to work or go to school with the "I'm so smart, I read Shakespeare and Nietzsche for fun in elementary school" people, and it turns out they're really idiots, but they think they're misunderstood geniuses?  Or that Freshman college student who thinks he knows more than the professor and can teach class on day 1?

I feel like I've heard more about Jaylen's intellect than Academic All-Americans like Emaka Okafor (graduated in 3 years), Tyler Zeller, Kelly Olynyk (also took Graduate level classes), or Andrew Nicholson (who got a degree in Physics, and said quantum mechanics was his favorite course), or Danny Granger who was accepted to Yale and got an engineering degree, or Brandon Knight who took college courses in high school, or Pau Gasol who speaks 5 languages and was enrolled in med school, etc.

So I've always wondered, is Jaylen really that smart/intelligent, and if so is he the one telling you that or is it coming other people?  Or does he just think he's smart?

I think it's safe to say that we don't know how smart JB is, nor what he is particularly smart at.  A person certainly can have low BBIQ and be smart in other phases of life/mind (and vice versa). 

Would it be reasonable to say that he seems to be a very curious person with many interests who also seems to have a conscience about being a positive role model.  That's good enough for me with regard to his non-basketball intellect. I'm impressed by all of that.   

But I would like to see the BBIQ take a leap.

Re: Jackie Mac on Lowe Post, Talking Celtics
« Reply #29 on: December 12, 2018, 06:57:44 PM »

Offline gouki88

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Jaylen had Smart, Rozier and Morris all angry with him against N.O. and deservedly so.   Everyone seemingly buying into their roles and making the right play consistently except for Brown.  He is forcing things and playing selfishly and that don't sit well especially with Smart.  Jaylen needs to put his supposed intelligence to work on the basketball floor, as of right now he is displaying far and away the lowest BBIQ on the team.
Agree completely, but Terry Rozier has a strong argument for this spot I believe
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)